Present list and future needs.....(long post)

[CHF 2,738]

I have been having a detailed look at our list and, as we all know, the structure and depth is very good.

A few seasons ago I noted that the way the drafting and trading was going we were looking to bolster the defence with a view to restricting the opposition scoring and then launching from the back half/defensive 50. This coupled with great levels of fitness and stressing of the importance of hard running both ways has built a list of players that work in the team system that has been developed to understand how to cover any weaknesses that may develop as the play unfolds.

I have decided to look at the list with an eye to the future rather than just accepting we are the Premiers at the moment and therefore should perform better than the rest of the teams.

Besides, we are top of the heap, it is off-season and there are not a lot of training reports or much to complain about and we need something to talk about….so, why not?

DEFENCE:

As I stated above this area of the ground is the cornerstone of our structure. We have an excellent mix of not only key position players and running, skilful link players but also a great mix of experience and developing players. Established key position players include the likes of May, Lever, Tomlinson and Petty with the first three of those traded for and brought in from other clubs. Between these four there is a good deal of variety and flexibility in the way they play their positions. They all have the ability to intercept in the air and I have been amazed when watching the games to note in a few of them the key defenders had all taken intercept marks by the end of the first quarter. Developing/Support key position defenders I have as Turner and J. Smith. Smith is a very good depth player and I think he could more than fill in if required for longer periods if there is injury to others. Turner has the opportunity to develop as required through a very well-established system.

When looking at the runners out of defence we have a really exciting group of proven performers with Salem, Rivers, Hunt and Bowey. Within this group there is also a good mix of experience and youth with Salem and Hunt both in their peak years turning 27 this year and Rivers and Bowey 21 and 20 this year. A good mix of skills there as well with Salem and Bowey elite ball users and Hunt, while I do not put him the same ball using club as those two, has speed and a willingness to run and carry that gives the team a lot. Rivers is a mix of the two, with good ball distribution as well as good run.

D. Smith at 20yo is waiting for his opportunity and I look forward to seeing him slot in at some stage. Hibberd at 32yo might find himself in a similar position to Nev last year. We also have a few versatile players that can drop back there for cover. Gawn has done it a few times when the backs are under pressure, and I was very impressed last season in the way that midfielders and even forwards flooded back as needed to assist. It was not just that they got back there at times, but the fact that when they did, they were effective and did not look to get in the way of the defensive structure.

Next year I could see us looking to add to our key position defensive stocks with a draft pick to develop. You never know JVR might end up back there for a time.

MIDFIELD:

It is in this area of the round that we look to be scary good. Mature, strong players just entering their prime with good solid young players developing well as support/depth. Petracca, Oliver, Viney, ANB and Harmes are all in the prime years of their playing days with experience, strength and hardness. Their strengths complement each other as they play through the middle. Any combination of those players in the middle at Gawn or Jackson’s feet will give you confidence. Additionally, we have added another mature body in Dunstan, I have not watched a lot of him and will be interested to see what he brings.

Sparrow and Jordon are players that can rotate through there. Both are good young solid players that have enjoyed development over the last season. When they step into the team there are no questions about their ability to perform. I expect both of them to be better again this year.

Langdon and Brayshaw on the wings own their positions and I get the feeling that Gus might have a bit more to offer there with the experience he has now gathered over the last season. Langdon is a freak and if he continues to play at his present level for a few more years, I will be well satisfied. Baker as depth is adequate but I think we need to find and develop at least one other player along with Rosman to cover this position. It might be one of the young guys already on the list. Laurie? Moniz-Wakefield? Both of these kids along with draftees Woewodin and McVee are presently classed and ‘midfielders’. We shall see.

Leading the midfield is Captain Max and Luke in the ruck. The Master and his apprentice …. Best ruck in the comp and a 20yo that has incredible natural talent and could be anything. Backing them up in the ruck depth is Daw. He is able to hold his own in that position on a good day and is versatile as he can also fill in in other parts of the ground. I would say that next season we need to look for another young ruck to develop. A good time to do it as they usually take time to grown into their bodies and learn the task. We have some excellent examples for them to follow.

FORWARDS:

We have got some opportunities and potential here with a group that was successful last season almost in spite of itself. I find this group the most difficult to analyse. For a large part of last season they chopped and changed and managed to get winning scores on the board most weeks. At times they suffered from inaccuracy that was troubling, but, having said that, they did a great job when they had to.

B. Brown, Mc Donald and Fritsch were the key forwards at the end of the season with Brown and Fristch the main goal kickers. Mc Donald held up his end and always presented a running option. To me it was a strange mix but it worked. Weideman, Daw and Mitch Brown are there as support. Brown will be used in emergencies and Weid will get a few opportunities to show if he has developed or not. I will not be holding my breath but will be hoping. Daw looks to be emergency cover to my mind. Draftees Van Rooyen and Howes are being developed as forwards (I hope). I think in the next year or two we will need talls ready to go.

Melksham is a medium forward that might be running out of legs and opportunity, but I can see him a excellent cover if required. Pickett and Spargo are our present first choice small forwards and they work very well together in both attack and defence. If they stay fit and their form hold up it will be hard for others to get a look in. The others are Chandler and Bedford, both very capable players to have in support. Moniz-Wakefield might get developed as a small forward as well. From reports he has pace, agility and a presence on the field.

ANB is a player that roams into the forward 50 very effectively along with our resting ruck duo.

Overall, as we know, a good well-structured list that should be competing at the pointy end of the competition for the next few years. For me the fascinating thing will be to see how we work to bring in and develop new players. In the next couple of years we need to get key defenders and a or two forward in to develop so they can slot in a players get older. They are the positions that take time to fill and I do not think we will be in the draft position to trade for quality players for those positions. We might be able to pick up a player or two through free agency, but I do not see that as a durable solution.

 I will be interested in comments.

[#11-TonyAnderson 786]

Great post - I thought Howes was regarded as a Wing option?

[leave it to deever 17,511]

Top post as per usual CHF. 

Glad to see Langdon get the praise he so richly deserves. Has dominated many games and one of the best recruits from another club for ages.

My goodness things look exciting for this club and us proud supporters.

Edited January 20, 2022 by leave it to deever

[buck_nekkid 5,876]

I think this year depth may be a key success factor, with ‘health and safety protocols’.  Running deep on all lines may be vital to winning games this year.  Hopefully we have a squad deep system, and even if we lose several front liners, the next group can step up and deliver high class efforts.

[Deeoldfart 8,033]

Excellent summary CHF.  
As you say, we have good depth across the ground, and it needs to be, because we won’t always have the charmed run with injuries that we had in 2021, and who knows what impact Covid will have on team selections in 2022?  
Further, our depth should ensure that form is rewarded, and pressure is maintained on the ‘best 22’ to perform consistently at the top level.
For me, the key intangibles for next season are the extent to which the influence of Burgo might be missed, and whether our culture will continue to hold up now that we have #13 in the bank.  However, my last lingering symptoms of MFCSS were extinguished in September 2021, and I’m very confident that we are the team to beat in 2022, at least!

[DeeZone 9,856]

Thanks CHF that is a great summation of our current list, I agree that a young backup ruckman has to be a priority for us and as mentioned we have Howes, Rosman, JVR and Turner who have a mix of height, pace, skills and footy IQ to develop as needed. Have we ever had a better list.!!!!!!

[tiers 2,840]

No obvious gaps or weaknesses for others to exploit. As good a start to a season as could be imagined.

GO DEES

[Gawndy the Great 9,011]

Great analysis CHF. We have great stocks across all lines as you have astutely pointed out, which makes up for a solid foundation. Reality is most teams (that are not in rebuild) will stack up quite similar. The attribute that distinguishes great teams from good teams will still be star talent. No matter how much you try to remove that dependency (football strategy / playing style etc), it will always be there and mostly in the form of a midfielder or two. And the way the draft has been designed, teams will have a window and then come back to the pack, so we have to make use of the current opportunity and win another premiership or three.

[DeeSpencer 25,717]

Key back: May, Lever, Petty, Tomlinson, J. Smith*, Turner
Medium back: Hibberd, J. Smith*, Hunt, Rivers*
Small back: Salem, Rivers*, Bowey, Hunt, D. Smith, McVee, AMW?

On ball: Oliver, Petracca, Viney, Harmes, Sparrow, JJ*, Dunstan, Woey?
Wing: Langdon, Brayshaw, JJ*, Baker, Howes, Rosman
Ruck: Gawn, Jackson, Daw

Key forward: Brown, McDonald, Weideman, M. Brown, JVR
Medium forward: Fritsch, Petracca*, Melksham
Small forward: ANB, Pickett, Spargo, Chandler, Bedford, Laurie

1. Tall depth. A ruck, a ruck/forward, and another key defender would all be ideal.

2. A specialist speed machine winger. We've added Rosman and kept Baker but we might have to go again. Howes is probably more as cover for Gus than for Langdon. James Jordon probably doesn't get enough credit as being a very serviceable wing option as well but he's more in between.

3. Half forwards with some size. One of the trickiest spots to fill on the ground. Need to run like an elite mid and chase and tackle like a small. But our small forwards are exactly that - small. Ideally we'd have another 185cm+ forward with some aerial ability to provide a match up concern to the opposition.

4. A mid sized stopping defender. We do have options but a gun defender with the right mix of size, speed, athleticism would be a nice addition to take over from Hibbo.

 

[mo64 5,875]

Great post CHF.

I think the term "depth" is often misconstrued. My definition of a depth player is someone who has shown that they can perform a role at AFL level. Just because a player at Casey is playing in a particular position, he may not be adequate AFL depth. An example would be Baker, who from what we've seen at AFL level, isn't currently adequate AFL standard depth.

Outside of the premiership 23, this would be my depth chart:

Proven depth: Dunstan, Tomlinson, Hunt, J.Smith

Adequate depth: M.Brown, Daw, Melksham

Questionable depth: Weidemann, Chandler, Bedford, Baker

Unproven depth: Laurie, Turner, D.Smith, JVR, Woey, Howes, Rosman, McVee, AMW

Jason Taylor said prior to the draft that we would be drafting for needs in areas where we need backup. He's gone with a KPF in JVR, a wingman in Howes, and picked up FA Dunstan as a mature aged inside mid. Dunstan provides cover for the loss of Jones and Vandenburg. JVR is backup for the aging Brown, T Mac and questionable Weid. Howes is backup with question marks over Baker and Rosman. I haven't included Woey, McVee and AMW, who as late picks, I'd consider best available development players.

 

[dee-tox 4,835]

I think draft time provides a fascinating insight into where clubs perceive their lists to be.

Last year, we had our sights set on Mac Andrew until the AFL changed the rules. He may have been a great replacement in three years for Max who is now 30. Our current back up for Gawn and Jackson is Majak Daw who is also 30 +. We delisted Bradke. We don't have anyone else capable of playing ruck.

One of the other targets appeared to be Gibcus who we were prepared to trade up for, but couldn't get any takers/get a deal done. I think we ended up settling for JvR as the next best tall. This was identified because May, Brown, Brown and TMac are all 30 +.

The other guy we had our sights on was Howes who we snapped up late (thankfully). Wing depth seemed to be a priority and reading between the lines there must be queries over whether they think Baker will make it.

 

[tiers 2,840]

Dunstan, Tomlinson, Hunt, J.Smith, Melksham

What would any other team give for one of these proven AFL players, not for depth but as top 22.

And we are fortunate to have a list that is so deep that they are classed as depth. If there was a gap due to injury or loss of form they could slide in seamlessly.

That is the result of top quality drafting and top quality development.

GO DEES

[Wrecker46 2,985]

2 minutes ago, tiers said:

Dunstan, Tomlinson, Hunt, J.Smith, Melksham

What would any other team give for one of these proven AFL players, not for depth but as top 22.

And we are fortunate to have a list that is so deep that they are classed as depth. If there was a gap due to injury or loss of form they could slide in seamlessly.

That is the result of top quality drafting and top quality development.

GO DEES

Hunt played all 22 games for the team that finished top of the ladder before getting injured. Would start in any other side round 1 and maybe even ours.

[Diamond_Jim 12,592]

6 minutes ago, tiers said:

Melksham

What would any other team give for one of these proven AFL players, not for depth but as top 22.

IIRC he was told to look elsewhere at the end of last season and no one picked him up.

He'll most likely be delisted at the end of 2022

[58er 6,456]

2 hours ago, DeeZone said:

Thanks CHF that is a great summation of our current list, I agree that a young backup ruckman has to be a priority for us and as mentioned we have Howes, Rosman, JVR and Turner who have a mix of height, pace, skills and footy IQ to develop as needed. Have we ever had a better list.!!!!!!

No never DZ  This  is a potential Mile Long category A list with multiple options for all positions which we must be extremely grateful to JT and his team over the last 5/7 years. 

CHF has not missed much in his excellent summary but I think the following is also possible with the current and developing footballers.!

Tmac can also be used in defence on a given match day period or moved into as more permanent if required due to injury or form issues.

Petty can be a KP Forward on the same exchange basis as Tmac as a back. JVR is a great prospect also for KPF or KPB. 

Blake Howes has been recruited as a winger as has Fraser Rosman but both as CHF indicated can play up forwardalso if need be.

ANB I still regard as a forward but by gee his GF best ever game showed how good he can be as an outside mid. He also (as Spargo does ) marked in defence in Q3 when we were under surge from constant Bulldog attacks.

Any of our small mediums and new recruits could be versatile as HB or HF or if they develop wheels and  tank on ballers. Riv is one and Kossie is another of our established stars. Salo can play on wing and on ball I reckon but why move him when he is elite !  Same with Bowser. Laurie may have unlimited potential also got great versatility I suspect.

Also I believe Maxy is a genuine back or forward resting Ruck  now who had the Dogs defenders attracted like a moth to a flame from the 3rd quarter halfway snd all our attackers just cashed in as a result. Down back is not much different.

Dogga is a star wherever  he plays on the field and no one minds him!! 

Such  are our moving parts we have many options to utilise in the next half decade and beyond .

[Rod Grinter Riot Squad 5,654]

8 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

IIRC he was told to look elsewhere at the end of last season and no one picked him up.

He'll most likely be delisted at the end of 2022

First time I have seen this.

 

Yes, have seen it for ANB and TMac, not Melksham

[Diamond_Jim 12,592]

40 minutes ago, Rod Grinter Riot Squad said:

First time I have seen this.

 

Yes, have seen it for ANB and TMac, not Melksham

Here's the thread. Not sure if it was officially confirmed

 

[BAMF 4,353]

Depth will be key this season. Very happy we still have Melksham on the list. Hopefully he has something to prove and is busting his backside to get back to that 2018 form.

As for list depth, I think others have covered it already but I will add... We need young tall depth. I don't want Jackson forced to take the number one ruck role next year. I'm not sure I want him to ever take it really. He could be an absolute nightmare matchup as that 2nd ruck/ Tall forward/ Mid /Xfactor/Freak that I don't want locked down as number 1 ruck.

I'm a little disappointed we didn't pick up another promising Ruck at the draft, but it's barely worth thinking about.

[Rod Grinter Riot Squad 5,654]

34 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

Here's the thread. Not sure if it was officially confirmed

 

No wonder I haven’t seen it, I have the poster on ignore 😂

[durango 2,008]

Maybe Jake Melksham might do revival like Tom McDonald or Alex Neal-Bullen in 2022?

[Red and Blue realist 2,051]

12 hours ago, CHF said:

DEFENCE:

As I stated above this area of the ground is the cornerstone of our structure. We have an excellent mix of not only key position players and running, skilful link players but also a great mix of experience and developing players.

Next year I could see us looking to add to our key position defensive stocks with a draft pick to develop. 

 

Great all round post CHF, I think there's one area that wasn't addressed and that's small lock-down defenders. You've covered off on the running backs and some of them play a hybrid role in that regard, but we've have Nev retire and moved on Lockhart.

I know our style of play means we haven't had to rely on a small defender but this was one area that I thought we were struggling with - being vulnerable when the ball hit the ground in our defensive 50, especially in a 'chaos ball' way - this was until Bowey came into team, which gave us much quicker ground coverage. However, I don't think he's a lock-down defender and I'm not certain we'll need one all the time, but I'm wonder if this is one area teams might try and exploit us, of course that's easier said than done, but Collingwoods win over us was mainly due to a 'chaos ball' type approach into their Fwd50, low and hard in rather than deliberate and direct.  

[Sir Why You Little 37,046]

4 hours ago, Rod Grinter Riot Squad said:

No wonder I haven’t seen it, I have the poster on ignore 😂

Hilarious :)

[CHF 2,738]

13 hours ago, #11-TonyAnderson said:

Great post - I thought Howes was regarded as a Wing option?

Yep. Howes could end up on a wing but I tend to discount the new draftees as to what position they may play because these days once they get to a club the club develops them and then looks at where they might best play. Howes could play  forward, wing or half back. JVR forward or back. 

[DeeSpencer 25,717]

The coaches and us as fans should also be open to players getting moved around. Not many would’ve picked Brayshaw to play a vital role on the wing in the grand final for instance.

Im not a huge believer in him so far but Rosman might end up a half forward in the Tom McDonald role or how Isaac Smith played at Geelong this year. But I’d say it’s just about awful coaching if he plays anywhere but half back for Casey for the first half of the year until he develops his contested game with the ball coming at him. He needs the structure to learn the feel of the game.

I think Chandler could really benefit from playing on the wing if the on ball spots at Casey are crowded and rather than being stuck forward. He’s a smart player who uses the ball well.

Howes could end up back, forward or Wing. JVR back or forward. 

There’s plenty of guys on the list who should be given opportunities  in a variety of roles. 

[CHF 2,738]

1 hour ago, DeeSpencer said:

The coaches and us as fans should also be open to players getting moved around. Not many would’ve picked Brayshaw to play a vital role on the wing in the grand final for instance.

Im not a huge believer in him so far but Rosman might end up a half forward in the Tom McDonald role or how Isaac Smith played at Geelong this year. But I’d say it’s just about awful coaching if he plays anywhere but half back for Casey for the first half of the year until he develops his contested game with the ball coming at him. He needs the structure to learn the feel of the game.

I think Chandler could really benefit from playing on the wing if the on ball spots at Casey are crowded and rather than being stuck forward. He’s a smart player who uses the ball well.

Howes could end up back, forward or Wing. JVR back or forward. 

There’s plenty of guys on the list who should be given opportunities  in a variety of roles. 

That is one of the things that the coaches have been vey open to, trying plyers in different positions on the ground. I heard mention on one of the podcasts that each players has a primary position that they train for as well as a secondary position that they also cover. I would imagine a few of them would have three positions that they could cover. 

Rosman has been a bit unlucky with Covid as there have not been many Casey games for him to show what he can bring. It will be interesting to see how the younger players that have not had a lot of game play have developed. it might be the begining of a new development method. Get them on board and keep them training and working on their skills for a season or two before they get to play..... just kidding.

Agree with you re Chandler.