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Game plans, tactics and all that jazz

binman
binman
in Melbourne Demons

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3 minutes ago, layzie said:

I would REALLY like to see a game with at least 4 of these 5 in the team.

Not only is it coming it’s going to be the heart of our future.

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    Just now, Roost it far said:

    Not only is it coming it’s going to be the heart of our future.

    Just depressingly from a short term POV, we could be 0-5 by the time they're all back in the team. (Also could be 2-3 etc but I am scared and sad etc)

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    11 minutes ago, layzie said:

    I would REALLY like to see a game with at least 4 of these 5 in the team.

    All 5 for mine ... in a heartbeat

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    1 hour ago, Macca said:

    All 5 for mine ... in a heartbeat

    I want all 5 for sure, but near enough would be better than anything right now.

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    51 minutes ago, layzie said:

    I want all 5 for sure, but near enough would be better than anything right now.

    We're always going to have injuries but our best team with everyone available looks really good.

    But that best team has to be able to play with the new game plan (to at least a B+ level)

    That's the issue, not the raw talent

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    2 hours ago, Macca said:

    We're always going to have injuries but our best team with everyone available looks really good.

    But that best team has to be able to play with the new game plan (to at least a B+ level)

    That's the issue, not the raw talent

    With those guys in and a bit more confidence than we're currently displaying and I'm pretty sure the gameplan would start to bear fruit. Wouldn't be perfect but I think we'd generate a lot more scoring chances.

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    7 minutes ago, layzie said:

    With those guys in and a bit more confidence than we're currently displaying and I'm pretty sure the gameplan would start to bear fruit. Wouldn't be perfect but I think we'd generate a lot more scoring chances.

    If we don't start winning soon the media will rip right into us ... the various shows these days like to highlight high profile players not doing the team things

    They ripped into already Oliver & Petracca and they won't stop there

    For the time being, I reckon they will leave Goodwin alone

    But in Geelong game if any of our players look like they aren't putting in, they will go after them

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    2 hours ago, Macca said:

    We're always going to have injuries but our best team with everyone available looks really good.

    But that best team has to be able to play with the new game plan (to at least a B+ level)

    That's the issue, not the raw talent

    Which history suggests takes time for things to click.

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    3 hours ago, Macca said:

    We're always going to have injuries but our best team with everyone available looks really good.

    But that best team has to be able to play with the new game plan (to at least a B+ level)

    That's the issue, not the raw talent

    We had 15 Premiership players last week v Gold Coast

    Talent doesn't appear to be the issue

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    I have a maths riddle I need some help with.

    If teams are dropping a spare man back in defence against us (and doing it very well) and we take one fewer player to stoppage, how many players do we actually have one the ground at any point in time?

    If it is in fact 16, goes some way to explaining our poor start to the season

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    4 hours ago, Adam The God said:

    Which history suggests takes time for things to click.

    Where by β€œtime” we means seasons. And more than one.

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    55 minutes ago, bing181 said:

    Where by β€œtime” we means seasons. And more than one.

    Sometimes.

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    On 30/03/2025 at 13:58, Spargonicus said:

    I hear you re: patience and building trust and confidence in the system, but this mediocrity has been going on for quite a while now, so the time is rapidly running out. And the appalling skills is not helping. It shows a team completely bereft of confidence.

    I heard that we have won 5 of our last 18 games. Surely that isn’t all about change in tactics?

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    When we were playing well it was the opposite and we all should have enjoyed that winning feeling

    Now with the boot on the other foot it’s no wonder we are so negative.

    I much prefer the winning feelings and learnings.

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    Simpson continuing to school me on how much i don't know about the modern game πŸ˜„ ...

    Screenshot_20250403_095856_Samsung Internet.jpg

    https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/www.foxsports.com.au/afl/afl-2025-adam-simpson-breaks-down-brisbanes-ball-movement-importance-of-spare-defender-afl-360-new-segment-comments-latest-news/news-story/2f317d7a100993f78718e6bdf4f3a6de

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    I'm so fed up with arm chair experts and ex-players saying we don't play the modern game.

    The modern game is a myth and always evolving based on who wins the premiership.

    The fact is we won a premiership based on our strengths and recruited around that. If we follow what the Hawks or others do now we will never be as good.

    We need to build our style that suits us and let others follow again. Pagans paddock, Clarko's cluster barassi's handball handball handball were not copying what other successful teams were doing but finding a way to win

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    1 hour ago, Wrecker45 said:

    I'm so fed up with arm chair experts and ex-players saying we don't play the modern game.

    The modern game is a myth and always evolving based on who wins the premiership.

    The fact is we won a premiership based on our strengths and recruited around that. If we follow what the Hawks or others do now we will never be as good.

    We need to build our style that suits us and let others follow again. Pagans paddock, Clarko's cluster barassi's handball handball handball were not copying what other successful teams were doing but finding a way to win

    I can't say how much I agree with this. We have completely gone down the wrong track, trying to emulate what other teams do when we don't have the correct players. Even if we could get it working, we would never be the best in the league at that game and to win the flag, you have to be the best. We should go back to strangling the life out of teams with contest, defence and power.

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    1 minute ago, Ollie fan said:

    I can't say how much I agree with this. We have completely gone down the wrong track, trying to emulate what other teams do when we don't have the correct players. Even if we could get it working, we would never be the best in the league at that game and to win the flag, you have to be the best. We should go back to strangling the life out of teams with contest, defence and power.

    Even if this is true isn't it still on the coaches for going down that path? Goodwin went back to the old contest/defence well in the second half of last year and admitted it was a mistake to do so.

    Personally I believe that we did need to change but find the gamestyle we've gone with incredibly strange. We still play incredibly defensively but just try to play keepings off with chip kicking rather than actually trying to attack and cause damage. Friday night was one of the more cowardly coaching performances I've seen. Reminded me of Brendan Bolton parking the bus towards the end of his time at Carlton.

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    Agree with the comment that last week we saw a cowardly coaching style

    3 clear boring defensive tactics v Cats

    1. GOODY. Zone defence - guard the grass.

      THAT didn’t work as the Cats controlled the play with uncontested marks and working the ball easily, with zero pressure. Man up and apply pressure should be a non negotiable.

    2. GOODY. Stand back the 5-8 metre after they take a mark or a free kick.

      THAT backpedaling style allowed the cats to compose or run or mark decisions with again zero pressure. It was so evident that when I watched other games, it stood out that the Dees used this non pressing style.

    3. GOODY. Use Sparrow on Holmes and also get an extra to the contest. Allow the Cats two players behind the ball.

      THAT created no room in our forward50 as the cats sat back and waited for our errors and turnovers. Zac Guthrie 17 marks. O’Sullivan 13 marks. Often uncontested.

      50 inside50s for 6 goals.

      12% conversion from an inept game plan.

    It’s frustrating as we are

    Watching other teams run and create and move the footy with positive clean handling and decision making.

    Watching other teams pressure and stick tackles and man up to squeeze their opposition.

    Goody. Less love. Move smart tactics. Get the excitement back. We lose. We are boring. Give us run and run and quick movement and give us pressure and tackling to stop movement. FFS this week if possible.

    Edited by spirit of norm smith
    Ffs

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    On 01/04/2025 at 12:26, Bombay Airconditioning said:

    We haven’t done anything yet to be fatigued. We were witches hats against North, and flat footed against the Suns.

    Physically.. done little

    Mentally.. wtf wtf wtf wtf wtf wtf what the actual wtf wtf

    Poor lads are exhausted

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    6 hours ago, Wrecker45 said:

    I'm so fed up with arm chair experts and ex-players saying we don't play the modern game.

    The modern game is a myth and always evolving based on who wins the premiership.

    The fact is we won a premiership based on our strengths and recruited around that. If we follow what the Hawks or others do now we will never be as good.

    We need to build our style that suits us and let others follow again. Pagans paddock, Clarko's cluster barassi's handball handball handball were not copying what other successful teams were doing but finding a way to win

    Yeah the sensationalist comments need to be taken with salt. It's easy to say the game has passed us by, the more important issue is what are the other teams doing when they come up against us and how does our style stack up over a season.

    Follow the leader doesn't guarantee success and you can go back through time to see how often teams have tried to emulate others. It does have some merit but these people aren't asking the right questions I think.

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    5 hours ago, KozzyCan said:

    Even if this is true isn't it still on the coaches for going down that path? Goodwin went back to the old contest/defence well in the second half of last year and admitted it was a mistake to do so.

    Personally I believe that we did need to change but find the gamestyle we've gone with incredibly strange. We still play incredibly defensively but just try to play keepings off with chip kicking rather than actually trying to attack and cause damage. Friday night was one of the more cowardly coaching performances I've seen. Reminded me of Brendan Bolton parking the bus towards the end of his time at Carlton.

    Keepings off will never work for us with Gawn, Oliver, Petracca and Viney. It might in the future with X, mcphee, Langford and kolt. But I think we are playing catchup with our recruiting rather than leading.

    When old man Viney was at the club we only recruited players who were competitive. Look at the players we have taken outside the national draft and besides Aiden Johnson we haven't continued down that path.

    Hard at it competitive footy will always win football finals regardless of what the game plan is. Game plan is over rated winning the footy isn't

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    On 02/04/2025 at 22:08, dazzledavey36 said:

    Well worth the read is this article.

    Good article and some handy perspective on where we’ve been. I’m guilty of underrating how good we were despite the finals losses given how much they hurt, but it’s much worse being where we are now than 2021-2023.

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    2 hours ago, Wrecker45 said:

    Keepings off will never work for us with Gawn, Oliver, Petracca and Viney. It might in the future with X, mcphee, Langford and kolt. But I think we are playing catchup with our recruiting rather than leading.

    When old man Viney was at the club we only recruited players who were competitive. Look at the players we have taken outside the national draft and besides Aiden Johnson we haven't continued down that path.

    Hard at it competitive footy will always win football finals regardless of what the game plan is. Game plan is over rated winning the footy isn't

    I think there are ways to play competitive football and be attacking. We've played far too defensively for years, putting no trust in our forwards to take a mark on a lead and never willing to give up anything from the backline to put something on the scoreboard. Whatever it is we're doing now is not the answer. We've traded one defensive gameplan for another and we're not even good at the one we're trying to do.

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