Post Match Discussion - Round 5

[beelzebub 23,364]

Einstein defined insanity as doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. Why does that seem familiar ?

Many observers note we dont have quite the experience in some areas and some age groups yet we seem to persist in asking them to deliver as though they have...refer para 1

It is entirely normal practice as you evolve in any learning to work to a level, perfect it, then step up...work/perfect....repeat..repeat.

To have participants repeatedly fail highlights a number of concerns:

That those attempting are ill suited or incapable ? We've been told we have 'talented' players. However many are arguably underachieving.

That which is being attempted is ill suited or impossible to do? This is the Brand, the Style....the Gameplan. In this regard consideration is given to results as this seems the most logical of metrics to assess. Results suggest there is much wrong. Great periods of ineffectual play can only offer up one outcome. A loss. 

One group is in effect the engine of the boat, the players. Another the course and quality of the journey, the Coaches. You can have a good engine but if piloted poorly... you'll founder.  You can have a missfiring engine but still navigate with some effect.

If engine stuffed and the Bridge asleep or unattended you'll be praying for no icebergs.

A game of footy is essentially a course set through persistent bad weather, icebergs, sandbars and the potential for collateral damage.

Everyone needs to be on their game and a passage thats navigable charted. No sense attempting what you cant achieve ( and haven't previously ) refer para 1.

 The FD has to address THEIR insanity.

[Redleg 40,907]

13 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Einstein defined insanity as doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. Why does that seem familiar ?

Many observers note we dont have quite the experience in some areas and some age groups yet we seem to persist in asking them to deliver as though they have...refer para 1

It is entirely normal practice as you evolve in any learning to work to a level, perfect it, then step up...work/perfect....repeat..repeat.

To have participants repeatedly fail highlights a number of concerns:

That those attempting are ill suited or incapable ? We've been told we have 'talented' players. However many are arguably underachieving.

That which is being attempted is ill suited or impossible to do? This is the Brand, the Style....the Gameplan. In this regard consideration is given to results as this seems the most logical of metrics to assess. Results suggest there is much wrong. Great periods of ineffectual play can only offer up one outcome. A loss. 

One group is in effect the engine of the boat, the players. Another the course and quality of the journey, the Coaches. You can have a good engine but if piloted poorly... you'll founder.  You can have a missfiring engine but still navigate with some effect.

If engine stuffed and the Bridge asleep or unattended you'll be praying for no icebergs.

A game of footy is essentially a course set through persistent bad weather, icebergs, sandbars and the potential for collateral damage.

Everyone needs to be on their game and a passage thats navigable charted. No sense attempting what you cant achieve ( and haven't previously ) refer para 1.

 The FD has to address THEIR insanity.

I can give them a revolutionary but simple start, tell the players not to kick to packs.

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,175]

1 hour ago, Redleg said:

That actually bears examination. 

Early last year they were considered ordinary. 

They have 3 stars in Dusty, Rance and the Captain, the rest are no names and I include Jack R in that. 

We have some very good players in Gawn, Clarry, Perracca, Hogan etc and also the no names. 

So what is the difference. 

All their players seem to have ball skills and pace. We don't.

They know their game plan and it is effective. Ours isn't.

We both have effort.

So for me  it comes down to skill, pace and game plan ( coaching).

And yes as a kicker but not the sole reason they won, their bottom 6 are better than ours and in fact their three ins last night kicked 6-7 of their goals I think. 

I don't think any of this helps your argument. Their stars are experienced and on field leaders. Viney aside (who you have not mentioned due to not being on the park) our potential stars are not, Gawn has only played 78 games. I would suggest dig up some Punt Rd End threads from this time last year or even after StKilda dispatched them late in the year by 67 and you will get a very different view on Grimes, Short, Grigg, Ellis, Castagna et al.... They have confidence in each other and their game style validated by it winning them finals and games so far this year. We need to make some calls on some players and back in some games in the untried that may bring some attributes we lack in speed and skill. We need to tweak our style to build confidence in our list and to cover our flaws until they can  be better addressed. The query for me is whether Goodwin is willing to adjust selection and style or will stubbornly stick with the current approach.

[Dr. Gonzo 24,214]

1 hour ago, Redleg said:

That actually bears examination. 

Early last year they were considered ordinary. 

They have 3 stars in Dusty, Rance and the Captain, the rest are no names and I include Jack R in that. 

We have some very good players in Gawn, Clarry, Perracca, Hogan etc and also the no names. 

So what is the difference. 

All their players seem to have ball skills and pace. We don't.

They know their game plan and it is effective. Ours isn't.

We both have effort.

So for me  it comes down to skill, pace and game plan ( coaching).

And yes as a kicker but not the sole reason they won, their bottom 6 are better than ours and in fact their three ins last night kicked 6-7 of their goals I think. 

The main difference for me is confidence. Our players seem bereft of it at the moment and so are playing it safe, panicking and second guessing. The tigers have confidence in their teammates and structures and so have more flow to their game.

I don't think we're that far off. We have to tweak a few things and play a bit "tighter" for lack of a better word, we're a bit sloppy going forward at the moment relying on frenetic attack when it needs to be a bit more measured. Our effort was there last night, out pressure was there. Those bemoaning our skills must've only watched one team because the Tigers players were equally as poor with the footy for a lot of the game and equally as under the pump due to our pressure. They were better drilled than us which caused us to play down the members wing for the whole game, as soon as we'd get the ball on the back flank they'd have 3 or 4 players zones off through the centre square cutting off our ability to switch. They also got 3 goals from the goal square due to our ridiculous all up defence.

Weideman was good that gave me some confidence in him. OMac was very good, Hibberd, Jetta and Lever were a lot better. Hogan was good even if his touch was a little off and he should've kicked that goal in the 3rd with a drop punt, not attempt that around the corner kick.

ANB, Harmes, Hunt, Stretch, Kent, Wagner and even Garlett were all poor. Garlett has runs on the board but the rest who knows if they'll make it.

Salem, Petracca and Brayshaw all need to be getting more of the footy, <20 touches isn't good enough.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

4 minutes ago, big_red_fire_engine said:

I don't think any of this helps your argument. Their stars are experienced and on field leaders. Viney aside (who you have not mentioned due to not being on the park) our potential stars are not, Gawn has only played 78 games. I would suggest dig up some Punt Rd End threads from this time last year or even after StKilda dispatched them late in the year by 67 and you will get a very different view on Grimes, Short, Grigg, Ellis, Castagna et al.... They have confidence in each other and their game style validated by it winning them finals and games so far this year. We need to make some calls on some players and back in some games in the untried that may bring some attributes we lack in speed and skill. We need to tweak our style to build confidence in our list and to cover our flaws until they can  be better addressed. The query for me is whether Goodwin is willing to adjust selection and style or will stubbornly stick with the current approach.

Great post big red, and the last part is the crucial point for all of us.  Is Goodwin going to recognise that our current approach isn't working and do something about it, or will he stick with what we're doing and hope it turns around at some point in the coming weeks?  We have some very winnable games coming up that would get our season well and truly back on track and that rests on what we do in terms of tweaking our gameplan in the coming weeks.

[nosoupforme 3,085]

10 hours ago, Bobby McKenzie said:

Felt pretty good in 1955,56,57,59,60 and 64. Used to be branded a 'premiership barracker' Lucky guy wasn't I? I am starting to feel that our window of opportunity has flown by. Well, mine anyway.

Well, you are following a decent team and we will improve. Who doesn't feel gutted after a loss. We weren't good enough on the day. They were by far the best side we played this year, However they can't play any better.

 I believe it takes 1  or 2  experience players who know their  craft to bolster the side and it starts with TMAC this week and maybe Viney the following ,  who knows. The window of opportunity is always there we just have to open it.

[Redleg 40,907]

3 minutes ago, big_red_fire_engine said:

 The query for me is whether Goodwin is willing to adjust selection and style or will stubbornly stick with the current approach.

There is the big question.

I would rather play a kid with skills and give him time to gain experience, than persist with ball butchers.

BTW how old is Higgins, same age I think as Spargo and younger than Baker. Not saying they should get games yet, but we need an alternative to the turnover merchants.

Wonder if you gave the ball to a Baker who can run, would be better than giving it to ANB and Vince who are mistake riddled.

[Dee Zephyr 19,267]

We are constantly pointing out to each other where to stand at stoppages. It happened all game, there clearly is a game plan, I’m just having trouble figuring it out.

Richmond have one general and it’s Rance. He was quick to point out when one of his teammates was out of position and they quickly adhered. 

Pavlich made a special comment in one of our pre season games a while back that you are more susceptible to leaking goals if you constantly go down the line. You run the risk of being opened up through the middle if you lose the contest down the line. Kudos to Tyson for attempting just about the only switch in the game albeit with a shite kick. 

The simple stuff are the most annoying. @Clint Bizkit has been harping on it all week and rightly so. Where’s our “ Goalkeeper” so to speak? 2-3 Tigers sitting in the goal square alone. 

Yes annoyed, giving up, no!

[loges 6,767]

Problem with Garlett is his last few games of last season were quite poor and the first few this season apart from the Brisbane game have been poor also. Thats about 1 good game in the past 8. Have always liked him but if he's not in the game early he drops his bundle, very much a confidence player and must be getting close to being dropped.

[Willmoy1947 4,085]

Gotta love the warmth between The Tigers and the Umpires ( all smiles and maybe even mouthed thank you's) during and after the Game. No more pesky upsets were going to happen in this Round. We are going to fix that, and they did. No severe punch to the Rib area, with such ferocity, it would or could have killed a lesser mortal but Jones,  was going to prevent  Umpire number two from letting the game flow. No illegal disposals by Richmond, including hundreds of non handballs and droppings were going to interfere with this game's atmosphere where seventy thousand were against thirty thousand.

[buck_nekkid 5,858]

I saw the footage where Jones was crunched.  Max tapped it perfectly to Jones, who looked like the best free option.  The Richmond player let it be so, and as the ball touched Jones’ fingertips, he was smashed by the Richmond [censored] approaching him at full speed.  Excellent setup by the Tigers, and at the same time Maxy did nothing wrong.  The ball spilled and Nate was crunched.

i wonder if we play better against teams where the ruck outcome is not so predictable? 

We have to turn Max’s dominance into clearance dominance, and at the moment we are getting thrashed in clearances.

(note:  this one of many issues, not the only one)

[Hellaintabadplacetobe 4,294]

58 minutes ago, leave it to deever said:

Spot on....except for Hogan.

Although Trac isnt a star.

Jones Vince Jetta Lewis have expired.

Garlett doesnt seem to care.

Its pretty sad.

Fool me once mfc

Twice shame on me.

Will not renew my membership after having one for 36 years. Done my bit.

 

You`ll be back...we`ll win 3 of the next 4

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,175]

3 minutes ago, Redleg said:

There is the big question.

I would rather play a kid with skills and give him time to gain experience, than persist with ball butchers.

BTW how old is Higgins, same age I think as Spargo and younger than Baker. Not saying they should get games yet, but we need an alternative to the turnover merchants.

Wonder if you gave the ball to a Baker who can run, would be better than giving it to ANB and Vince who are mistake riddled.

With the short turn around and playing at Etihad offers the perfect opportunity to try some of these even for the week. I would suggest ANB is the one NQR I would stick with. His work rate is massive and I think his skill will come granted it hurts at times.

Would happily see Stretch, Harmes, Tyson, Kent, Vince dispatched this week for Hannan and Hunt on the wings, Spargo, Balic and Fritsch forward and Baker back. 

[loges 6,767]

4 minutes ago, Hell Bent said:

You`ll be back...we`ll win 3 of the next 4

4

[Red But Mostly Blue 4,547]

10 hours ago, Surfer Dee said:

Of all the over the top melt downs on here tonight, I have no idea why Weideman is in the firing line. Great game from a young key forward. Crashed packs, took a few grabs, showed some aggression. What's he played? 10-15 games? sheesh. He'll kick a bag if we stick with him this year. Some seem to make a decision on players and then ignore what they see in front of their eyes. 

Gutted with the loss. But the pressure we applied with some improved skills and efficiency inside 50 will be good enough to take care of most teams in the comp. The blowout was completely understandable for me. It wasn't that we couldn't keep up anymore, it was how much effort we'd put into getting back into the game for no reward. It's completely demoralising. My brain was ready to melt and I was exerting no physical energy. A few cleaner chains of possessions, Hogan kicks that goal and we're in front midway through the last. That makes all the difference to the mindset of our players when it comes to the effort at the end of the game. 

Our defence was very good. Oscar, Lever, Hibberd, Jetta finally clicked and you can see what the plan is here. More of this please.

It's also worth noting that Richmond are very, very good. In particular their finishing around goal. They have about 5 players who barely touch the ball except for when they get a crumb in the forward 50. One step and they goal. So clean. They make half chances into goals. So many of their goals were from contests that we did well to even up only for a wet and slippery ball to somehow pop out to their advantage. The score at the end flattered them. The game was closer than that. In terms of the closeness of the game, it felt like a 20 point loss. Which I think is about right. 

The game plan has merit and issues. We dominate the ground balls so we play chaos footy. When the ball is on the deck we look intense and control the game. It's a strength of ours so we're wise to play this way. But the result is that our disposals are constantly rushed and we're completely stuffed by the end. We just need to grab say 20% of North Melbourne's game plan where they move the ball with a bit more control and take their time. There were moments in the game where we tried to do this, but Richmond just doesn't allow uncontested marks and we fumbled too much to execute it. The backline finally worked, but Richmond shut down our ball movement. The game plan will be OK I think. 

Our biggest issue is our players. We have  some seriously out of form players who are failing to execute the game plan, or even footy fundamentals. We don't have obvious replacements for them in the twos either. Our small forwards were horrible. Players we expected to step up have gone backwards. ANB, Harmes, Jeff, Hunt, Stretch, Tyson, Vince, Wagner are all not performing to the level we expect. 

Positives are Hogan, Clarry, Gawn, Hibberd (huge tonight), Lever, Omac, Salem, Brayshaw, Petracca. I think Salem, who has only played maybe 8 games as a mid, is really growing into the role. 

Add in Viney & Tmac. Maybe Balic comes in for one of Harmes and ANB. Play a few games in dry conditions. We have winnable games the next 4 rounds. Let's see where we are then. I think a few wins and a bit of confidence will make a difference. 

2018 is not going as well as we'd hoped, but it's not as bad as it feels yet. 

 

Still gutted by last night's game (the fumbles, the inability to capitalise in our forward 50, the passengers in our team), but this is one of the best counter posts I've read so far. Keeping positive, despite the burning in my gut that I've seen this show before...

[Satyriconhome 10,872]

32 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

The main difference for me is confidence. Our players seem bereft of it at the moment and so are playing it safe, panicking and second guessing. The tigers have confidence in their teammates and structures and so have more flow to their game.

I don't think we're that far off. We have to tweak a few things and play a bit "tighter" for lack of a better word, we're a bit sloppy going forward at the moment relying on frenetic attack when it needs to be a bit more measured. Our effort was there last night, out pressure was there. Those bemoaning our skills must've only watched one team because the Tigers players were equally as poor with the footy for a lot of the game and equally as under the pump due to our pressure. They were better drilled than us which caused us to play down the members wing for the whole game, as soon as we'd get the ball on the back flank they'd have 3 or 4 players zones off through the centre square cutting off our ability to switch. They also got 3 goals from the goal square due to our ridiculous all up defence.

Weideman was good that gave me some confidence in him. OMac was very good, Hibberd, Jetta and Lever were a lot better. Hogan was good even if his touch was a little off and he should've kicked that goal in the 3rd with a drop punt, not attempt that around the corner kick.

ANB, Harmes, Hunt, Stretch, Kent, Wagner and even Garlett were all poor. Garlett has runs on the board but the rest who knows if they'll make it.

Salem, Petracca and Brayshaw all need to be getting more of the footy, <20 touches isn't good enough.

That is a near perfect summation

Edited April 25, 2018 by Satyriconhome

[Wolfgang219 73]

12 hours ago, Forest Demon said:

Anyone who thinks effort was the problem tonight is missing the point.

The game plan, and make up of players on the list, and in the 22, is broken and unsustainable.

Goodwin needs to re-evaluate the way we play, and come the end of the year, we desperately need to recruit some outside run and class, because our list is devoid of it.

I think you are correct in the problem but incorrect in the solution. 

 

A coach needs to design a game plan around the players at his disposal. He need to use their strengths and design plans that avoid their weaknesses. 

 

Goodwin has come in and talked about a style that will hold up in finals football. He then has implemented a plan regardless of the players and jettisons players that he doesn’t believe fit his mould, both Dunn and Watts being prime examples. The issue with this is you never get the perfect players and injuries require you adapt etc etc 

 

[jnrmac 20,060]

Gutted after last night.

Some say the effort was there. It was but it was the wrong effort.

Most notably, in a contest we would have 3 or 4 players crowding around while Richmond had players scattered on the outside. When they won the pill the ball was flicked to the outside and they ran the ball very well with general precision. Sitting up high I could see Tiger players streaming fwd and our players bunched up back at where the contest was - not running and looking flat footed. That explained the massive outnumbering that occurred in their fwd line.

When we won the pill in a contest we were immediately under pressure from the Richmond players stationed around the outside. And more often than not we would turn it over.

When the game broke open in the last it was Richmond that was full of running and Melbourne that was stationary. I don't believe they gave up but after a game of chasing Richmond players streaming into their fwd line we were overwhelmed.

This is fixable.

Flying for the mark. As has been said here repeatedly we stupidly send 3 or 4 players up for the mark or spoil leaving no-one down. Again from viewing up high it is so obvious and amateurish it is hard to believe. This couple with spoils that go to the middle of the goal square (Lever) and fumbles within 10m of goal (OMac) mean that we are constantly against it because we are a poor contested marking side and we don't have any crumbers on the ground.

This is fixable.

Centre clearances. Gawn winning most of the taps is next to useless if our mids can't win his taps. We were smashed in the clearances. 5 to 0 in the second quarter. In the last it was 7 to 1 late in the quarter. Our set ups are atrocious and the number of times Richmond had players running from the back of the centre square to receive a handball and pump the ball into their fwd 50 was frustrating in the extreme. When we got the ball from a centre stoppage we often handballed to a stationary target, a man under pressure or we simply turned it over. Tyson has severe disposal flaws and decision making skills that will never be fixed. He gets the ball but if he turns it over every 2nd time what use is he? Not so easy to fix.

Defence. We lack the ability to defend one on one and kill the ball when it close to goal. Basic stuff. We fumble badly and as said above we gave away several goals through bad errors. While Lever had a reasonable game, we are sadly lacking in quality backmen. I am on record as saying I don't think OMac will make it. To me he is like Zac Dawson. Yes he is improving and his disposal is OK but we give away at least 2 goals a week from his weak attack on the ball or his inability to withstand physical pressure. Jetta hasn't played to his usual standard this year, Hibberd similar but is slowly improving. Wagner is starting to do some good things but overall he is just a player and does no damage to the opposition and doesn't get the ball enough. Last year we were 18th in defending one on one contests. This year we will likely win that title again.

Forward line. What has happened to Garlett? Has had one terrific game and 4 terrible games. We put up with his weak efforts because he is mercurial and can turn it one when you least expect it but overall he is now a liability and deserves time in the twos. Melksham had a pretty good game last night but needed to as his previous 4 were hopeless. Hogan is a quality player and I was impressed with Weideman last night, finally seeing something that makes me think he will make it as a player. A much better second ruck option than Harmes.

Harmes, ANB, Hunt, Stretch, Salem, Brayshaw, Kent are all in that category that can do some good things but have not improved and have severe flaws. Brayshaw was probably the pick last night but still he was unsighted for much of the night.

The coach. I don't rate him and he seems incapable of fixing basic problems like flying for the mark or crowding a contest or defending. We have no choice but to persevere with him but I see nothing from our coaching panel that makes me think we will get through this quickly.

We are in a world of pain and many of us are furious that our club cannot resolve some of these basic football issues after so fricking long. It is demoralising to have three members of your family in the car on the way home from the footy crying and saying 'Why do we have to follow such a crap football team?' I can't answer that.

The club is trashing its supporters resolve and doing long lasting and perhaps fatal damage to its future support base.

I am almost over caring.

[Demon_JB 1,385]

ANB, Stretch, Jetta, Hibberd, Hunt, Garlett, Jones, Vince, Lewis, Tyson, Harmes, Melksham (except last night) have all gone backwards this year..Other blokes have stagnated.

Our midfield aren’t sharking our massive advantage of us winning the hit outs. Hence, getting dominated in the clearances and around the ball, when last year that was one of our greatest strengths. 

Hogan being pushed up the ground means our forward line structure breaks down. We only kick goals when the opposition screws up, or we kick a chaos ball bouncing every which way and hope it lands in our lap. 

Hibberd and Hunt seem to have lost confidence in running it out of defence. Meaning we just play it so slow and allow the opposition to easily set up and run back to zone and man up.

None of our players have confidence or instructions to want to kick dangerously and hit a target in the center. Instead we play it safe down the wing, allowing them to easily predict what we are doing. 

Trash all around. Confidence needs to be instilled. Respect needs to be earned again. We’re the most predictable and one dimensional team in the side. We simply need to take more risks. 

[jnrmac 20,060]

44 minutes ago, Redleg said:

I can give them a revolutionary but simple start, tell the players not to kick to packs.

In the pre-season and PS games we spent most of the time chip kicking to players space to maintain possession of the ball. It worked well. But this has completely disappeared from our game and this year we have been cut up by teams doing the same to us..Now we predictably kick it long to packs along the line.

[leave it to deever 17,511]

30 minutes ago, Hell Bent said:

You`ll be back...we`ll win 3 of the next 4

Havent given up just not supporting financially anymore.

[3183 Dee 2,853]

13 hours ago, big_red_fire_engine said:

A great balanced post. Aside from skill execution we were well in the game until the last with the team touted to be the best around. The last was a major disappointment but the wrist slashing is over the top. We are not as good as pundits predicted so far this year. Nor were Richmond in 2017 but they made some tough decisions at selection and in style and got momentum in the back half with a run of no injuries. 

Our current state with our lack of mature leadership and the gap with Viney and T-Mac this is not surprising. We need to fix our forward structure (which was much better second half) including maintaining Hogan closer to goal with short grabs up the ground not vice versa. We need to trust that one person can get the ball in the stoppage and retain people on the outside for the first ball out. We need to stop having three up in a contest forward and back. We need to realise that spread is needed for 4 quarters. We need to remove most of those players who cant execute basic skills like Tyson, Harmes, Stretch, Hunt and ANB. We need to maximise our major advantage in Gawn and he needs to realise that every tap is important. We need to have a plan to get the ball out of 50 from a kick in that is not a bail out near the boundary to Hogan/Gawn.

Once again nothing is as good or as bad as it seems. Left disappointed but can see it may start to come together if we make some adjustments and that is the most frustrating bit.

 

A well-balanced post. For a lot of that game we were equal to or slightly shading the Tigers. At 3/4 time, we led all the key stats which tells you something.

To my mind, the return of TMac and Viney will help things considerably - they are amongst our best 10 players and both leaders on the field. At the moment, we have too many of the Harmes/Bugg/ANB/Stretch and, dare I say, Tyson brigade in our best 22. To my mind, only 2 out of those players should be making the team each week once TMac and Viney return.

Also, our disposal and conversion is killing us! A few more of those inside 50s converted and the momentum swings our way. 

On the positive: it was great to see Brayshaw bash and crash again; OMac was a tower down back as was Lever; Oliver is an absolute gun - so tough and sublimely skilled.

We’re still a way off, but I hope that we’ll settle into what will be a very even season and start to chalk up some wins before long.

[beelzebub 23,364]

Its probably hard for Pig or Hunt to get too excited about running it out off of half back....who do they spot up ?

Richmond were spreading....we were having book club meetings.

We've regressed years in our ability to create opportunities/options. 

By contrast the Tiges looked to have paddocks to run in.

Its the same bloody oval. Two very contrasting 'styles'

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,175]

46 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

The main difference for me is confidence. Our players seem bereft of it at the moment and so are playing it safe, panicking and second guessing. The tigers have confidence in their teammates and structures and so have more flow to their game.

I don't think we're that far off. We have to tweak a few things and play a bit "tighter" for lack of a better word, we're a bit sloppy going forward at the moment relying on frenetic attack when it needs to be a bit more measured. Our effort was there last night, out pressure was there. Those bemoaning our skills must've only watched one team because the Tigers players were equally as poor with the footy for a lot of the game and equally as under the pump due to our pressure. They were better drilled than us which caused us to play down the members wing for the whole game, as soon as we'd get the ball on the back flank they'd have 3 or 4 players zones off through the centre square cutting off our ability to switch. They also got 3 goals from the goal square due to our ridiculous all up defence.

Weideman was good that gave me some confidence in him. OMac was very good, Hibberd, Jetta and Lever were a lot better. Hogan was good even if his touch was a little off and he should've kicked that goal in the 3rd with a drop punt, not attempt that around the corner kick.

ANB, Harmes, Hunt, Stretch, Kent, Wagner and even Garlett were all poor. Garlett has runs on the board but the rest who knows if they'll make it.

Salem, Petracca and Brayshaw all need to be getting more of the footy, <20 touches isn't good enough.

Excellent post. This is one of the biggest things holding us back. Salem is playing midfield but only played 68% game time. Trac is playing almost solely midfield but 74% TOG. They need to be in a role on the field 80% where they can have a strong impact. Even Oliver seems inconsistent in his output regularly with half of his disposals coming in one quarter (last night the third). 

[Surfer Dee 210]

One thing I'll add is that I want to see some of our players with X factor back themselves a bit more. 

I loved Clarry's shot from the boundary line from outside 50. Nearly nailed it. Trac needs to take some shots from 50 when he gets even a bit of space. Hunt tried to bring his speed but was well shut down. Salem can hit a dime at 50 metres so should be looking to hit the goals more often. And Bernie used to to kick a 50m bomb goal every game. 

I'd rather these guys were backing themselves and missing than hesitating. When someone does something like what these guys are capable of, it lifts the whole team.