We've supposedly got the worst midfield in the league, stats wise, yet we still won 10 games.

Just imagine when our midfield grows and matures to go with the rest of the list.  The 17 other clubs would be scared shitless.

This analysis is ridiculous.

we got 10th last year

We have the number 1 ruck.

I rate our forwards higher than our mids.

I also rate our defenders higher than our mids ( through this is closer)

I would have guessed our mids would have been bottom 5/6 last year

Situation was even worse in 2015 and I would have rated our mids bottom 2.   With two years folding into the analysis I would say champion data is reasonable

what it does not capture is age profile.  Anyone under 25 will probable improve anyone over 30 has a 25% chance of the wheels falling off.  Our age profile in the midfield is pretty good and that will drive improvement.

for those concerned about Vineys rating his 2015 was pretty average and that is 50% of his ranking

 

 

3 hours ago, Kiss of Death said:

Hun article designed solely to sell newspapers to toothless readers, nothing to see here, move along 

Yeah, time to burn a couple of turkey legs in the Weber washed down with several Monteith's Pale.

McQ, out.

As soon as they saw Jack Viney finished outside the top 50, and below Crisp and others, surely they would have gone back to the drawing board and re-did the formula.

I've  seen and heard a lot of BS in my 50 odd years in this planet.....this frog poo by Champion Data is a Perfect example of wankernomics by the current generation of let's make it up as we go! and let's get plenty of suckers in to pay us for this poo.

The way Champion Data are going ......all supporters will soon need a degree in Astrophysics to understand the BS they get paid to write about.

Don't mind the article- it is retrospective after all . Strangest thing about it is that Lewis isn't ranked higher.

It does two things

1. Puts more pressure on Collingwood/ McGuire/ Buckley

2. Reinforces the message to us : we have to improve - which means we have to work harder!!

Two excellent outcomes!!

Edited December 10, 20168 yr by hoopla

5 hours ago, Night Crawler said:

 

9 minutes ago, monoccular said:

5 hours ago, Night Crawler said:

 

I agree! 

Champion Data  brought to you by Dreamworld Australia!!

Quite reliable most of the time!!

5 hours ago, Night Crawler said:

The corresponding article last year had Freo ranked 2nd and Bulldogs 10th

?

Champion Data.

They've done studies you know. 60% of the time it works every time.

(Apologies to Ron Burgundy)

Jesuse, If we are last and can still beat the top two midfield team Collingwood and Richmend then images when Viney, Bradshaw, Patracka, Oliver and Tyson become better players.

 

I couldn't care less, I just want us to make finals and win a flag.

Edited December 10, 20168 yr by Redleg

On 12/9/2016 at 11:35 PM, ThreeOneSix said:

Who cares. We have Viney, Petracca, Oliver and Brayshaw coming through. That is a quality list of young talent. Not to mention the potential of Jayden Hunt - who looks like he could be anything - to roll through that midfield. I would expect we would've had a bottom 3 midfield this year - excluding Gawn. But its not as though we don't have players coming through. We have a great batch coming through.

We were top 5 for clearances for the majority of the year. Our midfield this year was pretty solid. Not top 4 material, but inconsistently top 8 worthy.

This was written for the Herald Sun. Whatever sells the most papers. Collingwood stories will sell more. If they've worked out an incredibly ridiculous statistical anomaly that suggests Collingwood are in any way, shape or size the best midfield in the game, is it any surprise Jay Clark has gone for it?

3 minutes ago, A F said:

We were top 5 for clearances for the majority of the year. Our midfield this year was pretty solid. Not top 4 material, but inconsistently top 8 worthy.

This was written for the Herald Sun. Whatever sells the most papers. Collingwood stories will sell more. If they've worked out an incredibly ridiculous statistical anomaly that suggests Collingwood are in any way, shape or size the best midfield in the game, is it any surprise Jay Clark has gone for it?

Corrrrrrrrrect. With so much AFL devoted media still needing to earn a pay check to get them through Christmas and January it's no surprise that they start pumping up Collingwood and Richmond - they do it EVERY YEAR - Why? Because their crazed fans (no different to us) click onto the articles on the Newspaper websites, on the AFL website, facebok posts through FOX and SEN, as well as picking up the paper (all of which sells advertising space).

Same can be said for Freo and WC over there in the West. The media will try and make a news story out of nothing to sell some space and attract attention their way - even when there isn't really a story to tell.

With regards to the article itself (I haven't read it) - I know where we stand and who we are better than in the league. We have a bloody tough, honest and hardworking midfield now with some spark and flair developing on the edges, probably lacking a bit of pace but we're easily the most competitive (and 'potentially' talented) bunch of players I've seen in my time (30+ years). Next year will tell us a lot about where we're at and our prospects for the next few years. Fingers crossed all goes to plan.

6 hours ago, Eyes on Red & Blue said:

Corrrrrrrrrect. With so much AFL devoted media still needing to earn a pay check to get them through Christmas and January it's no surprise that they start pumping up Collingwood and Richmond - they do it EVERY YEAR - Why? Because their crazed fans (no different to us) click onto the articles on the Newspaper websites, on the AFL website, facebok posts through FOX and SEN, as well as picking up the paper (all of which sells advertising space).

Same can be said for Freo and WC over there in the West. The media will try and make a news story out of nothing to sell some space and attract attention their way - even when there isn't really a story to tell.

With regards to the article itself (I haven't read it) - I know where we stand and who we are better than in the league. We have a bloody tough, honest and hardworking midfield now with some spark and flair developing on the edges, probably lacking a bit of pace but we're easily the most competitive (and 'potentially' talented) bunch of players I've seen in my time (30+ years). Next year will tell us a lot about where we're at and our prospects for the next few years. Fingers crossed all goes to plan.

It does not matter that collingwood and Richmond have a better midfield, collingwood have no defenders at all, dunn is now their best defender, and they only have one forward moore, and Richmond only have jack revolt, also they are judging from last two season's take away season 15 that's irelvant, also good luck if wells plays 10 games, if u have a resent history of injuries and u are over 32, u don't get better and he will be 33 next year, caddy I don't rate prestia is over rated, our midfield smashed gold coast with prestia and ablett playing, so Richmond and collingwood might have a better midfield but both are very weak every else on the field, our midfield has greater growth then them both

Bring back Jimmy Magner and Shane Valenti - that should sort out any issues Champion Data has with our midfield.

If I had designed the algorithm for this ranking system I probably would have tweaked it before letting it go public.

The only thing this algorithm tells me is that it is a load of horse manure.

We have a top 8 team on our hands which includes a top 8 midfield which is on the rise.

There is a good reason the stats come up as they do, and perfectly demonstrates the limitations of such analysis. 

Firstly the analysis looks at the last two years. In 2015 we had Brayshaw in his first year and an injured Tyson running around, in 2016 we had no Brayshaw, a better Tyson, Oliver in his first year along with Trac. In short you could hardly say we have had a consistent midfield or one where most of the players are showing what they can do with any consistency. This will lower the ratings. 

Secondly the ratings take into account the effectiveness of disposals, we arent great at this as we were learning a new game, with many new players, that is based on contested possessions, this isn't conducive to effectiveness and will favour the good outside teams over good inside teams. 

All in all the way the stats are done seems flawed, but that is always the case with every stat you take. 

19 hours ago, doug williams said:

Try ad be objective and not so defensive.

Seriously, we do not have an A-grader in our midfield. I love Jonesy and young Viney and there is loads of potential which I am Salivating at the prospect of seeing develop but at least Treloar and Pendlebury have the stats to back up Champion Data

Here is objective:

We have beated the Pies the last 3 times we have played them

We were no 3 for centre clearances in 2016

I believe  Champion Data are graduates from the Dave Allen school of logistics !! 

Obviously the stats were gathered during Rounds 22-23 of this year when the team had decided it was all too much

19 hours ago, Wiseblood said:

We've supposedly got the worst midfield in the league, stats wise, yet we still won 10 games.

Just imagine when our midfield grows and matures to go with the rest of the list.  The 17 other clubs would be scared shitless.

Very valid.

looking forward to seeing who steps it up with Viney and seeing the focus off Jones every week. 

Can salem get on the park consistenantly this year? Petrraca/brayshwaw's/Oliver/hunt/ so many more -development... it's going to be a long summer

Edited December 11, 20168 yr by Demons2riseagain

21 hours ago, P-man said:

Great first post, doug. Nothing suss there. Go Pies.

Melbourne's midfield was ranked 5th for clearances and 6th for contested possession. There's two of the key functions of any midfield where Melbourne was objectively in the top third. Only the most self hating supporter would think we're dead last.

Any system that rates Mitch Wallis as 'elite' and V.iney as 'average' is a broken system that clearly doesn't place sufficient weight on a player's last 12 months.

 

And i'll put the boot into wobbles a bit more, Pendles over the hill and missed games last year and the other bloke receives a lot of stats.

We've got Pies best player for next ten years.The smokey.....

31 minutes ago, willmoy said:

And i'll put the boot into wobbles a bit more, Pendles over the hill and missed games last year and the other bloke receives a lot of stats.

We've got Pies best player for next ten years.The smokey.....

???