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Training - Wednesday 30th November, 2016


joeboy

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20 hours ago, demonoid said:

Even hearing him on the news last night was like listening to a different person. Perhaps a number of factors last year weighed heavily on him. Hope it bodes for a huge year

It is interesting on Hogan. From all I am reading on here you can't help but think that the whole "will i go, will i stay" affected his footy last year more and more as the year went on.

I guess it is different for each player as Dangerfield didn't seem to miss a beat in his last season at Adelaide having to make his season end decision (maybe he had no decision to make - his mind was made up).

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9 minutes ago, nutbean said:

It is interesting on Hogan. From all I am reading on here you can't help but think that the whole "will i go, will i stay" affected his footy last year more and more as the year went on.

I guess it is different for each player as Dangerfield didn't seem to miss a beat in his last season at Adelaide having to make his season end decision (maybe he had no decision to make - his mind was made up).

main difference was dangermouse was a seasoned, established and mature player on top of his game

i'm sure the pressure and decisions to be made affected hogan's performance adversely this year

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10 hours ago, olisik said:

I rate him, just disappointed he hasn't come back ready to join the main group when he wasn't coming off an injury at the end of last year 

You are basing this on nothing but the fact that he is in the rehab group.  Immediately you jumped to the conclusion that he let himself go over the break, and are unwilling to consider any other views, or even any other comments from those that actually attend training and talk to those within the club.

It's amazing that you are questioning and even assassinating Trengove's character, yet at the same time, you have made no comments about your love child (Oliver), who would appear to have had a far more "interesting" offseason than JT.

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23 minutes ago, nutbean said:

you do realise the amount of work that goes into the legs in preseason ?

It would surprise me with what Trengove has gone through over the last 2-3 seasons if he wasn't handled gently.

Different players are loaded differently and I sure that there is a special roadmap for Trengove.

Also  - for the record - Being in the rehab group, running laps, being in the gym only does not necessarily indicate injury. The sports scientists have individually mapped out programs for each player and being in the rehab group could mean nothing more than a light load session.

Perhaps we need to stop using the word "rehab" group and call it the "some might be recovering from injury and others are on individual programs group" or, more simply, "the other group".

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12 minutes ago, billy2803 said:

You are basing this on nothing but the fact that he is in the rehab group.  Immediately you jumped to the conclusion that he let himself go over the break, and are unwilling to consider any other views, or even any other comments from those that actually attend training and talk to those within the club.

It's amazing that you are questioning and even assassinating Trengove's character, yet at the same time, you have made no comments about your love child (Oliver), who would appear to have had a far more "interesting" offseason than JT.

Agree. You can never doubt Trenners effort and commitment.

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3 hours ago, billy2803 said:

You are basing this on nothing but the fact that he is in the rehab group.  Immediately you jumped to the conclusion that he let himself go over the break, and are unwilling to consider any other views, or even any other comments from those that actually attend training and talk to those within the club.

It's amazing that you are questioning and even assassinating Trengove's character, yet at the same time, you have made no comments about your love child (Oliver), who would appear to have had a far more "interesting" offseason than JT.

Completely unwarranted and over the top reaction. Just ridiculous.

He made no such conclusions, or at least he did not state in any way that Trenners let himself go.

I am also disappointed that Trenners is not back in a suitable condition to join the main group, but I suspect it is because the medical staff don't want to stress his foot too much early in the pre season. That's his foot's fault, not his character.

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1 hour ago, faultydet said:

Completely unwarranted and over the top reaction. Just ridiculous.

He made no such conclusions, or at least he did not state in any way that Trenners let himself go.

I am also disappointed that Trenners is not back in a suitable condition to join the main group, but I suspect it is because the medical staff don't want to stress his foot too much early in the pre season. That's his foot's fault, not his character.

I have already covered the Trenners situation by actually speaking to him, and it frustrates me that some seem to think, not you Faulty, that being in the "rehab" whilst not having an op in the pre season means you came back unfit.

It is because they want to increase the load on his foot gradually

Hibberd is now with main group because as I said, it takes a week or two to get his engine ticking over properly so he did a week or two of just running, already looks like he is toning down

On the leaning down I asked Pedo (everybody's body shape target) he is exactly the shape and weight they want him at, every single player is treated as an individual 

My observations on newbies

Hannan  - Howie shape and build nice clean goalkicking action

Johnstone - typical indigenous small forward, nippy and agile

Smith - the Bull, no explanation needed for the Casey watchers, will throw himself into everything

Filipovic - nice size and frame to build a decent ruckman, neat kick

Keilty - solid unit, could build him into a second ruck if needed

 

Edited by Satyriconhome
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1 hour ago, faultydet said:

Completely unwarranted and over the top reaction. Just ridiculous.

He made no such conclusions, or at least he did not state in any way that Trenners let himself go.

I am also disappointed that Trenners is not back in a suitable condition to join the main group, but I suspect it is because the medical staff don't want to stress his foot too much early in the pre season. That's his foot's fault, not his character.

This is what Olisik posted in Monday's training thread...

On 28 November 2016 at 7:51 PM, olisik said:

Am I the only one disappointed by Trenners being in the rehab group his second week back? 

As far as we know he had no injuries at the end of last season and was lucky to be given a 1 year contract.

 

would have thought he would have gotten himself conditioned enough like most the players to be ready to rock it with the main group from day 1. Extremely disappointed he still needs to be eased into it when he had highlighted that he wanted to use this pre season to get his explosiveness back 

He (Olisik) got questioned about his thoughts on Monday, and has carried it on to Wednesday's training report too.

So is my "unwarranted and over the top reaction" still "ridiculous"?

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15 minutes ago, billy2803 said:

This is what Olisik posted in Monday's training thread...

He (Olisik) got questioned about his thoughts on Monday, and has carried it on to Wednesday's training report too.

So is my "unwarranted and over the top reaction" still "ridiculous"?

Yes

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21 hours ago, TeamPlayedFine39 said:

Who's role does Smith play?

Are he and Weideman fighting for the same spot? (assuming Hogan and Watts are walk-ups to forward line).  

No, not at all. I would have Watts, Hogan, Weideman AND Smith in the same side aka

 

HF:     Watts.     Hogan     Petracca

FF:    Smith    Weideman   Garlett/GKH

 

That's an incredibly strong forward line, and very very difficult to match up on. 

Imputting it out there now - Smith 35 goals in his first season...

Having two really good kicks for goal (Smith/Watts) in the same side would be a huge bonus....

Edited by Dees2014
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1 hour ago, billy2803 said:

This is what Olisik posted in Monday's training thread...

He (Olisik) got questioned about his thoughts on Monday, and has carried it on to Wednesday's training report too.

So is my "unwarranted and over the top reaction" still "ridiculous"?

 

1 hour ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Yes

Lol

 

I only saw the post you quoted.

Does seem he jumped to a conclusion. I concede on that point, although  assassinating Trengove's character is still a ridiculous assertion.

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9 minutes ago, faultydet said:

 

Lol

 

I only saw the post you quoted.

Does seem he jumped to a conclusion. I concede on that point, although  assassinating Trengove's character is still a ridiculous assertion.

Here's a copy and paste from Wikipedia about "Character assassination"...

"Character assassination is a deliberate and sustained process that aims to destroy the credibility and reputation of a person, institution, social group, or nation.[1] Agents of character assassinations employ a mix of open and covert methods to achieve their goals, such as raising false accusations, planting and fostering rumours, and manipulating information.

Character assassination is an attempt to tarnish a person's reputation. It may involve exaggeration, misleading half-truths, or manipulation of facts to present an untrue picture of the targeted person. It is a form of defamation and can be a form of ad hominem argument."

 

Not much in the above that Olisik hasn't tried doing.  That said, I'm sure most of us on here, myself included, is guilty of it at some stage!!!

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26 minutes ago, billy2803 said:

Here's a copy and paste from Wikipedia about "Character assassination"...

"Character assassination is a deliberate and sustained process that aims to destroy the credibility and reputation of a person, institution, social group, or nation.[1] Agents of character assassinations employ a mix of open and covert methods to achieve their goals, such as raising false accusations, planting and fostering rumours, and manipulating information.

Character assassination is an attempt to tarnish a person's reputation. It may involve exaggeration, misleading half-truths, or manipulation of facts to present an untrue picture of the targeted person. It is a form of defamation and can be a form of ad hominem argument."

 

Not much in the above that Olisik hasn't tried doing.  That said, I'm sure most of us on here, myself included, is guilty of it at some stage!!!

I don't believe oli is attempting to assassinate Trengoves character.

He just doesn't rate him, and can't keep his trap shut about it.

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3 hours ago, faultydet said:

I am also disappointed that Trenners is not back in a suitable condition to join the main group, but I suspect it is because the medical staff don't want to stress his foot too much early in the pre season. That's his foot's fault, not his character.

I have been to training a few times and Trengove looks well and is running strongly.

It looks like he may be doing more sprint work, especially 200's. Last year it seemed to me he was doing more long grinding running.

You have to worry about self-doubt for a player like Trengove. Hopefully he doesn't accept that he isn't a top 22 player and start to drop off his intensity. A lot of us would now doubt his ability to make it back, it takes a strong personality to overcome all those perceptions and doubts.

He and ANB will be the two boys given top midfield roles at Casey with a lot of 2016's midfield now gone. I think they will both get another chance at the top level at some stage next year and even though ANB has come back in ripping form and is ahead of Trengove at the moment it's all about grabbing the slim chance they get, when it comes along next year. They are both inside mids with a few ahead of them, but who knows, Clarry might have a case of second year blues, injuries, etc. Trengove is no fool, he'll be pacing himself for that one chance. 

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4 minutes ago, deespicable me said:

I have been to training a few times and Trengove looks well and is running strongly.

It looks like he may be doing more sprint work, especially 200's. Last year it seemed to me he was doing more long grinding running.

You have to worry about self-doubt for a player like Trengove. Hopefully he doesn't accept that he isn't a top 22 player and start to drop off his intensity. A lot of us would now doubt his ability to make it back, it takes a strong personality to overcome all those perceptions and doubts.

He and ANB will be the two boys given top midfield roles at Casey with a lot of 2016's midfield now gone. I think they will both get another chance at the top level at some stage next year and even though ANB has come back in ripping form and is ahead of Trengove at the moment it's all about grabbing the slim chance they get, when it comes along next year. They are both inside mids with a few ahead of them, but who knows, Clarry might have a case of second year blues, injuries, etc. Trengove is no fool, he'll be pacing himself for that one chance. 

I have had quite a few conversations over the years with Trenners, the above will never happen. I am not one included in the second sentence

Clarry is also fine, he was crook, the way him and Jonesy were smashing into each other on Wednesday was proof he has recovered, Jonesy gave him a couple of fearsome whacks and got the same back

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11 hours ago, Devil is in the Detail said:

Think he means Lumumba

Yep, again true to your name DisinD! I was only trying to point out that at least the #8 jumper has been worn in anger at training this year. Probably for the last time.

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9 hours ago, small but forward said:

Yep, again true to your name DisinD! I was only trying to point out that at least the #8 jumper has been worn in anger at training this year. Probably for the last time.

Perhaps this is the vital clue in the Heritier conundrum?

Lumumba is a complex character who inhabits a different astral plane to the others. Could it be that his feelings were so upset that his number was usurped by someone else at training that he had to have a few week's break consulting his spiritual self and contemplating its effect on his own universe.

I'm tipping that he will return one day, even if only to collect his final pay out.

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