Just now, stuie said:

The problems I see with this are the whole "resting forward" is a bit of a myth these days I think. Players need do just as much in the forward line as anywhere else, it's not really a "rest", so Gawn would need to go to the bench. Then the other problem is we have our best set shot at goal and goal assist player down the other end of the ground. I do think Frost could be a good option as the backup ruck as, similar to Watts, he can rove his own work and use his speed, I'm just not sold on the whole Gawn forward/Watts back bit.

 

It doesn't have to be Watts, Hogan is quite good at that role as well, and if Gawns forward it does mean we need the contested beast a bit less, for me Frost is the best option for this role currently on our list, but he's a FAR better defender than he is a forward. 

i agree with your point about the resting forward being a bit of a myth these days

2 hours ago, Satyriconhome said:

Agreed Watts shouldn't be in the ruck, but he can do it.

200cm ruck/fwd are not the norm although there are some, Gawn or Spencer  need the occasional chop out and naybe taking the ruck up forward so you just need a guy who can compete and kick a goal now and again, doesn't have to be a star, just play a role, hence my suggestion on Hulett

Boyd - 200cm
Tippett - 203cm
Stanley - 200cm
Lobb -  205cm
Ceglar/McEvoy/Fitz/Vickery - all 200cm+
Jenkins 199cm
Lycett - 203cm
Daw - 195cm with a huge leap

So the majority of the top sides have 200cm players and there's various levels of talent/output there but I can't see Hulett doing it. 

For 5 minutes a quarter it isn't an important position but for the long term durability and versatility of Gawn it would be better to have a guy who can hold his own in the ruck so Gawn can go forward more often. Teams with 2 guys who can perform in the ruck continue to win the flag with Collingwood the only exception I can think of. 
 

35 minutes ago, stuie said:

Where did I say he was better than him? I said he'll now be ahead of Pedersen in selection talks.

Nothing to do with any kind of "anti Pedersen stance". Weideman played the last 2 games of the year, and it would have been more than that barring injury. He's already ahead of Pedersen in the pecking order, not necessarily because he's going to do more every week stats-wise, but because that's the stage of his development now. Pedersen scraped through for another year, does that tell you the coaches think he's easily best 22? He's handy, but he's there for depth when we need him, not for a start in the forward line.

I don't believe in stats ratings, but if you want to bring them up then you should note Pedersen was rated last in the last game he played for the year.

 

Here " Weed will be played ahead of Pedersen next year. He was already ahead of him at the end of this year. "

Not sure what you meant but those are your words.

1 hour ago, DeeSpencer said:

Boyd - 200cm
Tippett - 203cm
Stanley - 200cm
Lobb -  205cm
Ceglar/McEvoy/Fitz/Vickery - all 200cm+
Jenkins 199cm
Lycett - 203cm
Daw - 195cm with a huge leap

So the majority of the top sides have 200cm players and there's various levels of talent/output there but I can't see Hulett doing it. 

For 5 minutes a quarter it isn't an important position but for the long term durability and versatility of Gawn it would be better to have a guy who can hold his own in the ruck so Gawn can go forward more often. Teams with 2 guys who can perform in the ruck continue to win the flag with Collingwood the only exception I can think of. 
 

McEVoy is a pure ruckman, Vickery is a disaster in the ruck, you forgot 2 metre Peter but still less than 50% of the teams have 2 'large' ruckmen, would assume the game will go up another level again next year so you will also need to be an aerobic beast as well

17 minutes ago, Satyriconhome said:

McEVoy is a pure ruckman, Vickery is a disaster in the ruck, you forgot 2 metre Peter but still less than 50% of the teams have 2 'large' ruckmen, would assume the game will go up another level again next year so you will also need to be an aerobic beast as well

The two expansion teams have the most formidable forward lines in the league.

I think Wright will become a very serious player next year.

Trade Radio News

• Hamish Hartlett has stunningly backflipped on a move to have him traded from Port Adelaide. After meeting with several clubs in Melbourne this week, Hartlett's manager Michael Doughty today told NAB AFL Trade Radio his client wished to remain at the Power. Doughty said a trade would now be "highly unlikely" despite the Power's initial interest in moving him on.

• Port Adelaide ruckman Matthew Lobbe is a 50-50 chance of leaving the Power, according to his manager. Michael Doughty (who also manages Hamish Hartlett) told NAB AFL Trade Radio that Lobbe was exploring his options to move to a new club, with a desire to be the number one ruckman at a club.

• The future of out-of-contract Western Bulldogs midfielder Koby Stevens remains up in the air, with the 25-year-old considering a move to a third AFL club. Stevens' manager Ned Guy told NAB AFL Trade Radio today that discussions were continuing with the Bulldogs, but Stevens would also be searching for potential opportunities elsewhere.

• Don't expect the Dion Prestia and Jaeger O'Meara trades to be done anytime soon, with Gold Coast Suns footy boss Marcus Ashcroft today telling NAB AFL Trade Radio they were still a long way from being finalised. Ashcroft said Richmond had not yet offered its first round pick for Prestia, while Hawthorn had not discussed any players they were willing to trade for O'Meara.

• St Kilda says it won't be trading ruckman Billy Longer this NAB AFL Trade Period. Chief operating officer Ameet Bains telling NAB AFL Trade Radio today that Longer had a two-year contract with the club and that he was a required player.

• Essendon has been contacted by at least four clubs regarding trading for its prized number one draft pick this year. List manager Adrian Dodoro this morning told NAB AFL Trade Radio that they were unlikely to do a deal for the pick, unless something extremely attractive was put on the table.

• Western Bulldogs ruckman Will Minson has confirmed he will be leaving the club at the end of the season. Minson is an unrestricted free agent, but is yet to decide whether he will play football at all in 2017.

• Adelaide's Ricky Henderson appears likely to leave the Crows, with Adelaide yet to offer him a new deal. Henderson's manager Ned Guy telling NAB AFL Trade Radio there had been significant interest in Henderson for 2017.

2 hours ago, old dee said:

Here " Weed will be played ahead of Pedersen next year. He was already ahead of him at the end of this year. "

Not sure what you meant but those are your words.

I'm talking as far as selection goes.

 

2 hours ago, Abe said:

It doesn't have to be Watts, Hogan is quite good at that role as well, and if Gawns forward it does mean we need the contested beast a bit less, for me Frost is the best option for this role currently on our list, but he's a FAR better defender than he is a forward. 

i agree with your point about the resting forward being a bit of a myth these days

Yeah don't mind the Hogan idea I guess, but would only really use it as a tactic change rather than a regular structural thing. I agree Frost would be a good option, he has the hardness and speed to do some damage, but just not sure how we make the rest of it work. The Hogan/Watts combo is such a good mix of strengths, and taking one away really effects our forward line during that time.

 

3 hours ago, Satyriconhome said:

McEVoy is a pure ruckman, Vickery is a disaster in the ruck, you forgot 2 metre Peter but still less than 50% of the teams have 2 'large' ruckmen, would assume the game will go up another level again next year so you will also need to be an aerobic beast as well

So teams with either a 200cm or similar player in the forward/ruck spot:

Do: The entire top 8 - Sydney, Bulldogs, GWS, Geel, Adel (Jenkins 199), Haw (multiple options), WCE, North (Daw 195cm + leap)
Outside the 8: GC (2m Peter), Freo (Clarke or Apeness 201cm), Carlton (Kreuzer 200cm)

Could: Brisbane (often use Walker but have Hipwood 200cm), Ess (use a variety of players but could use Daniher 200cm), Coll (use Jesse White but can use Cox or Moore)

Don't: St Kilda (Bruce 197cm), Port (Westhoff 198cm or Trengove 197cm), Richmond (Griffiths 198cm)

I really think we are dead last in terms of options. I'd trade Pedersen for any of the above best choice options.

 

Spencer - 203cm Gawn - 208 cm

So we have 2.

I must have missed something...  

25 minutes ago, PaulRB said:

Spencer - 203cm Gawn - 208 cm

So we have 2.

I must have missed something...  

I'm talking back up rucks. Most are 200cm+ these days. Spencer and Gawn worked together once and they haven't tried it again because Spencer up forward is about as useful as picking someone out of the crowd.

Liked the earlier call of Gawn as the Ruck/forward. But we need a better option than Spencer as the main ruckman. Can we clone Gawny?

Well we've just signed Pederson for one more year so I'm guessing they'll persevere with him til the Weed is ready

18 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

I'm talking back up rucks. Most are 200cm+ these days. Spencer and Gawn worked together once and they haven't tried it again because Spencer up forward is about as useful as picking someone out of the crowd.

I'd take my chance with the bloke from the crowd

3 hours ago, stuie said:

I'm talking as far as selection goes.

 

I'm with the dissenters....Weed, I think, was just given a taste to keep him focussed.  I think Pedo is considerably better at this point and can relieve Max in the ruck.  Weed is very much a work in progress and needs at least another season or two of development.  My guess is that he and Pedo will be in and out of the team according to form, needs and the opposition.

1 hour ago, leucopogon said:

Liked the earlier call of Gawn as the Ruck/forward. But we need a better option than Spencer as the main ruckman. Can we clone Gawny?

So Gawn makes AA ruckman and we want to change his role? He can't be moved from being the main ruckman, his tap work in the centre is brilliant, especially the synergy between himself and Viney. 

Tom Basso– ‏@TheTomBasso

 

@AFLTradeWhisper any news on Karl Amon? Rumour is he wants to leave. Thanks.

13h

AFL Trade Whisperer ‏@AFLTradeWhisper

He's on the table. Saints and Dees have inquired.

https://
atus/783799362723848192

What are our thoughts on Amon as a cheap pick up for some outside run?

4 minutes ago, AngryAtCasey said:

What are our thoughts on Amon as a cheap pick up for some outside run?

That trade whisperer bloke is full of it, mate. Don't believe a word he says. This is the same 12 year old who said Hogan would return early to 'travel'. 

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/out_of_contract_players?year=2017

early I know, but the players coming out of contract at the end of next season are insane. I know a lot of these players will re-sign by then but wow. Surely we go hard for a big fish?

15 hours ago, GCDee said:

Dodoro Essendons list manager said on trade radio that Hibberd for 26 seems like a fair trade. Hopefully it gets done day 1 of trade week

P26, a bit of payback to the AFL, for they're help over the past 3 season.  Now they're focus will be on the bummers to make sure they aren't sent into a smokin' spiral dive. 

IMO this is why so many players have not escaped the clutches at bummerland.

8 hours ago, Wiseblood said:

That trade whisperer bloke is full of it, mate. Don't believe a word he says. This is the same 12 year old who said Hogan would return early to 'travel'. 

I thought this was the guy:

 

Pedo as a back up ruckman is a bit small at 193 cm and he doesn't have a great leap. Weid,O'Mac are around 196 cm mark why not use one of them as the 2nd ruck/forward.Ruck work can be beneficial for some players as it improves confidence and add versatility. Otherwise we need to recruit a young who we don't need to beef up.

3 minutes ago, ENYAW said:

Pedo as a back up ruckman is a bit small at 193 cm and he doesn't have a great leap. Weid,O'Mac are around 196 cm mark why not use one of them as the 2nd ruck/forward.Ruck work can be beneficial for some players as it improves confidence and add versatility. Otherwise we need to recruit a young who we don't need to beef up.

I think the main problem is that we can't go into next season with Gawn (daylight)  Spencer, Mitch King (ACL recovery) and then Max King (likely to be delisted).

If we can't find a decent ruck/fwd I think we need to recruit a decent back up ruck such as Zac Clarke as he would add a lot more than Spencer.

11 hours ago, jimcor said:

I'm with the dissenters....Weed, I think, was just given a taste to keep him focussed.  I think Pedo is considerably better at this point and can relieve Max in the ruck.  Weed is very much a work in progress and needs at least another season or two of development.  My guess is that he and Pedo will be in and out of the team according to form, needs and the opposition.

Weed is like a lot of young players. They give them a taste to get them experience with the speed and physicality of the game. Its a natural part of the learning period. Clearly he is the future but younever know how long these guys take. 

Pedo is insurance. A real swing man if ever there was one. Has a great highlights reel but has never been able to put it together for a consistent period.

He was overlooked many times in the last 2 years but we need him as back up.