POST MATCH DISCUSSION

[dee_star 63]

I thought it was interesting to watch Dawes and Watts in the same forward line. Watts is that much smarter as a footballer, he leads to the right spots to get used, he was just let down by disposal up the field at times. Dawes is more a straight line lead up player, which over the next few years with Clark, Hogan, Watts and then Howe pinch hitting down there at times I'm not sure we'll have much use for.

Unfortunate a legacy of the Neeld era that can't be undone overnight is the $500k Dawes is on and the 3 year deal for Pederson. Neither are going to help us much in the long term I fear - that said at least Dawes shows some leadership out on the field and as a bigger body he may offer something to take the heat off the other tall forwards.

I thought game plan wise there was a clear change both with and without the ball. Less long kicking down the line and more trying to run and create and take the game on, looking to use shorter options. At times the decision making looked as though they'd only been practicing it this week (which is true). Defensively there was a bit more pressure around the ball and a bit more working together, not just blindly locking in to your man and burning your teammate if his man got free. Still a very long way to go but a much improved performance compared to every other game this year

[Bossdog 2,002]

I could have been at another game.....but I thought that when Howe went to the deep forward position he improved remarkably ....I don't think he is a wing but should stay deep forward.......I don't drink at the footy so I have no excuse if I am totally wrong about this.....

[titan_uranus 24,868]

Unfortunate a legacy of the Neeld era that can't be undone overnight is the $500k Dawes is on and the 3 year deal for Pederson. Neither are going to help us much in the long term I fear - that said at least Dawes shows some leadership out on the field and as a bigger body he may offer something to take the heat off the other tall forwards.

Rubbish call on Dawes. He was either unfit or unwell, from varying reports, yesterday. His first half against Collingwood, pre-injury, was outstanding, and he was one of our best against Hawthorn the week before.

He's one of our best players, and when he has a full forward line (i.e. Dawes, Clark, Hogan, Watts) he'll be even better.

[M14 F16 6]

Watching Trengove yesterday was the same as the last 2 years, he looks like he is running but he gets nowhere. The kid has OP for sure, has had since the 1st Neeld preseason, need to stick him on the long term injury list and get him right. Garland and Jones can lead the side, the new coach will appoint a new captain next year anyway

[bandicoot 1,395]

Game over but am I the only one that already see's a massive difference With Neeld compared to Craig?

And I refuse to say we have no talent. There is some glimpse there. A fit Viney and Grimes would have made a difference aswell.

Finally some possession football.

We played keepings off for most if the second qtr and were able to string together successive possessions without a turnover.

This to me is a massive difference and will only improve the club.

We also played the ball through the middle a lot more. The players seemed lost on the centre pitch as they haven't been there for the last year and a half.

[PJ_12345 1,098]

Really please with Blease's pace but please please can he stop turning it over... please

[P-man 13,366]

Watching Trengove yesterday was the same as the last 2 years, he looks like he is running but he gets nowhere. The kid has OP for sure, has had since the 1st Neeld preseason, need to stick him on the long term injury list and get him right. Garland and Jones can lead the side, the new coach will appoint a new captain next year anyway

It might be time to accept that maybe he's just slow. How long is he going to have this mysterious injury that no-one can or will confirm?

It seriously looks like he's running on the spot compared to every other player out there. So frustrating cause he's got skills with ball in hand. He's just too slow to ever get near it.

[P-man 13,366]

Really please with Blease's pace but please please can he stop turning it over... please

That will improve. I have faith that he's going to be a very, very good player.

[Bossdog 2,002]

I think that trenners is just so focussed on defence that he has forgotten how to attack........Unfortunately he bought in too much to the Neeld game plan.......

[Bang Bang Bang 5,779]

Trengove's chase on Farren Ray in the third quarter (right before a Ray goal from 55m) was a big concern. He was clearly giving the chase his all but it looked like he was on a treadmill.

The injury excuses are wearing thin. I agree that he is just slow. Time to re-invent himself.

[The Yarra 83]

Trenners as a permenant half forward? Can mark, can present and can tackle.

[P-man 13,366]

Trenners as a permenant half forward? Can mark, can present and can tackle.

And most importantly, can convert.

[Kenny Powers 90]

Trenners as a permenant half forward? Can mark, can present and can tackle.

I had the same thought yesterday, may struggle when (if?) Clark comes back and Hogan is up forward in 2014. Worth a shot this season though

[DeeSpencer 24,903]

That will improve. I have faith that he's going to be a very, very good player.

I have absolutely no faith.

If he ever was why haven't we seen it at least once or twice a game. I don't count the times where he takes the game on with nothing forward and little options they don't concern me. What bothers me is when he gets it in space runs a short distance and just has to pick out a target and kicks it (9 times out of 10) clear over a team mates head. Good players don't do that. Look at the way Toumpas isn't perfect but at least every now and then he kicks a lovely kick.

[P-man 13,366]

I have absolutely no faith.

If he ever was why haven't we seen it at least once or twice a game. I don't count the times where he takes the game on with nothing forward and little options they don't concern me. What bothers me is when he gets it in space runs a short distance and just has to pick out a target and kicks it (9 times out of 10) clear over a team mates head. Good players don't do that. Look at the way Toumpas isn't perfect but at least every now and then he kicks a lovely kick.

He does do that a fair but, but let's be honest, he's in good company. We have made looping kicks and generally missing targets a speciality. Collectively there is alot of improvement to be made with our disposal.

He is extremely dangerous on the run in front of goal. He's proven that. I think his field kicking will improve the more he plays.

At the moment I am just enjoying watching players who are willing to take the game on, and he's one of them.

[Lil_red_fire_engine 10,885]

In his first two years Trengove moved like Dal Santo now he doesn't its either he is injured or too heavy in the legs. You don't just suddenly become treacle for no reason. Had been much improved the last couple of weeks but was poor yesterday.

Edited June 23, 2013 by big_red_fire_engine

[PJ_12345 1,098]

That will improve. I have faith that he's going to be a very, very good player.

He has gone from an average effective disposal rate of 76% in 2011, to 59% in 2012 and 52% so far this year.

To put that into perspective Nicholson has an average effective disposal rate of 64% this year.

Ones was a rookie and the other a priority pick...

Sure he has pace, but Jetta also has pace and he has an average effective disposal rate of 85% this year.

I want him to be great but seriously needs to lift his game... the turnovers is killing us. Doesn't help when they put so much effort to get it forward for him to turn it over because he cant hit a target 5m away.

Just frustrating. Will be good to see what a pre-season can do to him.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

I have absolutely no faith.

If he ever was why haven't we seen it at least once or twice a game. I don't count the times where he takes the game on with nothing forward and little options they don't concern me. What bothers me is when he gets it in space runs a short distance and just has to pick out a target and kicks it (9 times out of 10) clear over a team mates head. Good players don't do that. Look at the way Toumpas isn't perfect but at least every now and then he kicks a lovely kick.

22 years old and 26 games is too early to be so certain

[P-man 13,366]

He has gone from an average effective disposal rate of 76% in 2011, to 59% in 2012 and 52% so far this year.

To put that into perspective Nicholson has an average effective disposal rate of 64% this year.

Ones was a rookie and the other a priority pick...

Sure he has pace, but Jetta also has pace and he has an average effective disposal rate of 85% this year.

I want him to be great but seriously needs to lift his game... the turnovers is killing us. Doesn't help when they put so much effort to get it forward for him to turn it over because he cant hit a target 5m away.

Just frustrating. Will be good to see what a pre-season can do to him.

Fair call. That's a bad drop no doubt, but the fact he was high as 76% means it is within him to improve, and improve significantly.

[titan_uranus 24,868]

He has gone from an average effective disposal rate of 76% in 2011, to 59% in 2012 and 52% so far this year.

To put that into perspective Nicholson has an average effective disposal rate of 64% this year.

Ones was a rookie and the other a priority pick...

Sure he has pace, but Jetta also has pace and he has an average effective disposal rate of 85% this year.

I want him to be great but seriously needs to lift his game... the turnovers is killing us. Doesn't help when they put so much effort to get it forward for him to turn it over because he cant hit a target 5m away.

Just frustrating. Will be good to see what a pre-season can do to him.

The disposal efficiency statistic is a waste of space - Nicholson rating at 64% is proof.

Nonetheless, I think the point on Blease is valid - he's missing field kicks, often simple ones. I think it comes down to decision making for him; often he's running too far and stuffing his kick up, or playing on without a plan first.

But his pace and his liveliness are attributes we need to keep in the side, IMO. He's not playing badly enough to be dropped.

Also, comparing his pace to Jetta is ridiculous.

[rjay 24,677]

the fox commentary was woeful.

at one stage midway through the first term, eddie, alistair lynch and gerard healy were calling for dawes to go into the ruck. this for a bloke barely about to work up to a jog.

then, their next brilliant thought was for him to go to full back!

It was rather strange considering one of the reasons he was pushed out by Collingwood was his inability to play that forward/ruck role.

The full back one was when I knew they weren't serious, surely...

[rjay 24,677]

He has gone from an average effective disposal rate of 76% in 2011, to 59% in 2012 and 52% so far this year.

To put that into perspective Nicholson has an average effective disposal rate of 64% this year.

Ones was a rookie and the other a priority pick...

Sure he has pace, but Jetta also has pace and he has an average effective disposal rate of 85% this year.

I want him to be great but seriously needs to lift his game... the turnovers is killing us. Doesn't help when they put so much effort to get it forward for him to turn it over because he cant hit a target 5m away.

Just frustrating. Will be good to see what a pre-season can do to him.

Jetta at Sydney has pace, Jetta at Melbourne doesn't.

Blease is technically a good kick both feet, problem to me is he has brain fades with the ball in hand. He still plays footy like a kid and needs to grow up, take the right option and consistently hit it up. That's experience at this level, games under the belt for Sam and he will be a real weapon.

[PJ_12345 1,098]

Fair call. That's a bad drop no doubt, but the fact he was high as 76% means it is within him to improve, and improve significantly.

Very true, and I think he was averaging 15 disposals then as well and even got 2 Brownlow votes!

Needs to train with Davey. The two could learn something off eachother:

Davey; to get back his old confidence and back himself for a run

Blease; to hit short targets consistently

[PJ_12345 1,098]

The disposal efficiency statistic is a waste of space - Nicholson rating at 64% is proof.

Nonetheless, I think the point on Blease is valid - he's missing field kicks, often simple ones. I think it comes down to decision making for him; often he's running too far and stuffing his kick up, or playing on without a plan first.

But his pace and his liveliness are attributes we need to keep in the side, IMO. He's not playing badly enough to be dropped.

Also, comparing his pace to Jetta is ridiculous.

Jetta at Sydney has pace, Jetta at Melbourne doesn't.

Blease is technically a good kick both feet, problem to me is he has brain fades with the ball in hand. He still plays footy like a kid and needs to grow up, take the right option and consistently hit it up. That's experience at this level, games under the belt for Sam and he will be a real weapon.

Blease offers something which we have in very short supply - speed. But he also offers something we have in abundance - turnovers.

Collingwood had 24 shots on goal from our turnovers and Blease's effective disposal rate was a large part of that (mind you so was Silvia's under 50%).

You guys sum him up pretty well. Blease can keep on playing to get experience, I'll just stay in the bar!

[mrtwister 652]

Jetta at Sydney has pace, Jetta at Melbourne doesn't.

Blease is technically a good kick both feet, problem to me is he has brain fades with the ball in hand. He still plays footy like a kid and needs to grow up, take the right option and consistently hit it up. That's experience at this level, games under the belt for Sam and he will be a real weapon.

The difference between Blease and Davey is that Davey uses his pace to gain some space so he can then take his time to pinpoint his kick. Blease uses his pace to run as far as be can until be gets pinned so be has to kick the ball at full pace. Extremely difficult to do at the end of a long run. Edited June 23, 2013 by mrtwister