THE DRIVE-BY SHOOTING

[pitmaster 3,589]

Seriously, much of this discussion is off the point.

Take Goldstein (Jamar), Petrie (Clark), Bastinac (Watts), Harvey (Jurrah), Number 34 - forget who he was but they went through him a bit - (Davey) and a couple of others and see how Norf goes.

Thaipants says they toyed with us. That is just hyperbole. They could not score for 10 minutes into the second quarter. They did us with terrific running and linking over the course of 25-30 minutes from the first and third quarters but for lengthy passages our work ethic and occasional efficiency kept us in it.

At the moment Norf has one injured player - McIntosh - who is easily replaced with their wealth of talls. So far as it says anything about the coach, last year this would have been a 90 point thrashing. He has improved the group even if he unravelled them to begin with.

Edited July 29, 2012 by pitmaster

[Miles from Nowhere 199]

This is a democracy correct?

I am saying, if neeld is not sacked by the board, there may be a challenge to the board. A new ticket if you will.

Why?

Because the board members gave g.Lyon to much authority and power of influence that resulted in a 5 year rebuild that has left us worse than we started.

Nb: Financially we are doing well because of stynes and wealthy supporters.

Ok, challenge the board. Talk is cheap.

Package up all your whinges and run for the board. What is stopping you? Which director are you an improvement on? McLardy, Jelland, Spargo, Trotter, Healy? Name names - or is that too hard. probably easier to have a snipe at players.

Or is your whole point just empty words and threats. Impress me; you have some sort of vision. Only sack the coach, what else? Spell it out. Make a candidacy. Stand up for something. Launch a bid now on this site, surely there are a number of posters who are also members. Not too hard to imagine the support you'd get, or is it?

Be the man. Use your courage and put up.

[Range Rover 1,935]

Ok, challenge the board. Talk is cheap.

Package up all your whinges and run for the board. What is stopping you? Which director are you an improvement on? McLardy, Jelland, Spargo, Trotter, Healy? Name names - or is that too hard. probably easier to have a snipe at players.

Or is your whole point just empty words and threats. Impress me; you have some sort of vision. Only sack the coach, what else? Spell it out. Make a candidacy. Stand up for something. Launch a bid now on this site, surely there are a number of posters who are also members. Not too hard to imagine the support you'd get, or is it?

Be the man. Use your courage and put up.

I wouldn't take too much notice of Tonatopia. In his seminal "King for a Day' thread he appointed arch enemy Mark Neeld as his assistant coach.

[Devo 104]

Melbourne were ordinary yesterday against North. Can't skirt that issue. They were beaten routinely out of the centre, they were exposed by North's pace and spread from the contest, they were generally poor with their skill execution and had no functioning forward line.

They would've been a better side had Clark, Watts, Jamar, Jurrah etc been playing and they might've been a bit more competitive. Would they have won yesterday with their best 22 on deck? Probably not. North are bound for the top 8 this year and Melbourne is a poor side that's having a horrible year trying to learn how to play the game again. Melbourne was not finals-bound last year and was never going to be this year, and probably won't be next year either. As frustrating as that is for members, sponsors and supporters, it is reality and we have to face up to that.

None of this means that the club is not on the right track. They are debt-free, they have decent resources in the footy department, they have a good coaching panel (it's not just Neeld, there's 10 other blokes under him who have a role to play) and the players are being equipped with a game plan that will be sustainable in the future.

The style of play is not very exciting at the moment and it's a stark contrast to the fun attacking style that Bailey's team implemented, but it is a work in progress. Some on Demonland are still failing to see that. Some elements of the plan need time to come together, particularly the players having a defence-first mentality (which takes time to develop if all you know as a footballer is the Bailey way) and elite fitness (which takes several pre-seasons to develop and we all know how far behind they are in this regard). Other elements you would hope that the players already possess, like solid foot skills, but it seems that some are not demonstrating those skills at the moment.

The message is that Neeld and co can't turn it around in a couple of months over one preseason and it is completely unreasonable to expect a magic reversal of fortunes. They need time. I'm not necessarily backing the current regime in all the way (it's too early to tell), but time is needed to implement the new plan and the benefit of the doubt should be given to the Neeld camp for a bit longer.

People will respond to that in different ways. Some will vent their spleens and microwave their memberships like they do over at Punt Road. That's ok, it's their prerogative as a paying member to do that and if that's how they want to express themselves about the current state of affairs, then fine. It's a free country. Others will keep the faith and sign up again next year in the faint hope that better times lie ahead. I'll be doing the latter.

[Dr. Gonzo 24,446]

Hey gonzo, ok, we can't change the past.

However we can make serious decisions that influence the future.

If we can snag malthouse, Roos, sheedy or choco for 2013, I think it would be irresponsible not to do so.

Remember, we have already lost 5 years, and that results in losing thousands of young supporters who are entering primary school and being teased because they go for Melbourne.

We have no chance of snagging any of those coaches so what is your plan B?

[Norm Smith's Curse 2,602]

Thaipantsman - Hi Jumbo,

First one to clear up is I am neutral with Neeld. Was disappointed yet another untried coach. Kept turning up. Same result. Insiders believe Neeld is endeavouring to clone Collingwood's game plan and apply it to Melbourne.

Thaipantsman - you have pretty much every month posted comments suggesting we should sack the coach or that Neeld is the problem and isnt inspiring the players. So that doesnt sound overly neutral

[The Reverend 1,736]

Maybe because you like being a bee-atch and being walked all over .

No, I just don't see the point of having the few remaining fit players suspended under the AFL's super stringent MRP. If Trengrove got three for a sling tackle what are we going to cop for actually whacking someone? Better to address the real problems and start playing some decent football.

[tonatopia 278]

In response to miles from nowhere.

My vision:

-Strengthen ties with mcc to an extent where we can use the mcg as our training base and guarantee our financial future and increase our influence over the afl.

-Create an MFC creed or constitution.

-Aggressively target a proven premiership coach for 2013 which will boost morale, membership and sponsorship.

I would love to implement this vision, if I had the support.

Edited July 29, 2012 by tonatopia

[bandicoot 1,395]

Sorry Range Rover! Meekest M performance I've seen this year(Believe this is saying something!!!).

Kangaroos did precisely whatever they wanted to and turned it on at the flick of a switch.. Melbourne only scored when Kangas rested. How long is MN contract? Surely we don't have to endure 2 more years of this. Neeld has shown bad judgement from the time he started at Melbourne. Who on earth would want to come to Melbourne under Neeld? Players simply are not playing for him. He's not a motivator. Players are not passionate. Final score did not reflect the vast gap between the two teams. Sad SAD.

Spot on. The coach is a dud. The captaincy decision was just a howler of a mistake - and to add insult to injury, the top two in the 2011 B&F were ditched from the leadership group. Go figure. Neeld's handling of Watts, Martin (our no laughing policy), Nicholson (how long did it take him to play this bloke?), Moloney, and Petterd has been awful, and the pressure he's put on Trengove and Grimes' shoulders has surely added to their disappointing seasons. Neeld's media performances are all over the place - and whilst a poor media profile is not necessarily a hanging offence - his erratic media performances certainly suggest that that he's just not a great communicator. And then we've got this awful game plan that's been xeroxed from the Lexus/Westpac/whatever it's called right now Centre's front office and applied with no thought or modification to our list. Put it all together and what have you got? The rubbish served up today - today and for almost the entire season.

Totally agree with above.

Was also speaking to a friend that works at Melbourne membership.

The club is worried about the potential collapse of memberships next year.

Their latest numbers suggest a 20% drop in numbers.

Isn't anyone else worried about this?

[Bring Back Barassi 552]

It has been reported that Demon coach Mark Neeld said in the lead-up to this clash he felt the his team was "two years behind several of their rivals". That's a fair assessment and reflects on his team's current list

also conveniently reflects the two years left on his contract

[Dr. Gonzo 24,446]

In response to miles from nowhere.

My vision:

-Strengthen ties with mcc to an extent where we can use the mcg as our training base and guarantee our financial future and increase our influence over the afl.

-Create an MFC creed or constitution.

-Aggressively target a proven premiership coach for 2013 which will boost morale, membership and sponsorship.

I would love to implement this vision, if I had the support.

How would you strengthen ties with MCC? How would you get them to let you use the ground as a training base considering they are so tight they barely even let the GF teams on the day before?

Whi premiership coach would you aggressively target? What would you do when Roos, Malthouse, Sheedy & Williams all knock you back? Maybe go after Tommy Hafey?

Edited July 29, 2012 by Dr. Gonzo

[beelzebub 23,390]

My vision:

I think its a bit blurred

-Strengthen ties with mcc to an extent where we can use the mcg as our training base and guarantee our financial future and increase our influence over the afl.

You do actually realise our ties are actuallystrong. We are PART of the MCC once again ? Cant get much stronger than that.There simply isnt room to facilitate all of what an AFL club requires to have at the G for the MFC. part of the reason we moved out was to have FULL facilities. The actual pitch will never be allocated to an individual team ever again. Get over it.

-Create an MFC creed or constitution.

We have a constituion and its falls under the MCC Charter also. Your really have no idea do you

--Aggressively target a proven premiership coach for 2013 which will boost morale, membership and sponsorship.

What will do that, boost morale, membership and sponsorships ( though not too shabby currently ) is success on the field. That comes from building a winning team from the ground up. We are currently doing this. Just not in a way youd comprehend. You obviously think the list is fine. Hard to know what your first mistake is really.

I would love to implement this vision, if I had the support.

Hows that 'ticket' of yours going. Edited July 29, 2012 by belzebub59

[monoccular 17,642]

Nothing has changes this week vs most other weeks this year.

Those who say Neeld can't coach - they don't know

Those who say he can - they don't know.

What we do know is that under any coach, we have a whole lot of spuds. That we do know. Terrible to say, and a lot of it is list management as much as anything, but it is the case. And it means more losses to better sides.

I really wonder just who all those who want to sack Neeld think would get any more out of this motley crew than he does......maybe a few short term fixes but no long term view.

[tonatopia 278]

Hey BB.

A constitution which allows us to deliberately lose games need to be re-written.

As for our close relationship with the MCC, you would think we could train for 2-3 hrs a week on our own home ground.

maybe its you who has the blurry vision.

[Deers 202]

The club is worried about the potential collapse of memberships next year.

Their latest numbers suggest a 20% drop in numbers.

Isn't anyone else worried about this?

Not really.

They will all hop back on board when we turn the corner, sorry, if we turn the corner.

And we're trying to do that, albeit from a very low base.

If it tanks again, we're dead anyway. Why not take the risk, put the fear among the conservatives, and aim for a flag?

[thaipantsman 180]

In response to miles from nowhere.

My vision:

-Strengthen ties with mcc to an extent where we can use the mcg as our training base and guarantee our financial future and increase our influence over the afl.

-Create an MFC creed or constitution.

-Aggressively target a proven premiership coach for 2013 which will boost morale, membership and sponsorship.

I would love to implement this vision, if I had the support.

T,

Decision is made and got to live with it. First it's the Bailey mistake and now this. Frightful at best. Buckle down for 2 years and then another game plan and clean out. Neeld will see out his years at Ocean Grove and perhaps a new dynamic force will appear to take over at Melbourne. Perhaps similar to the ideas you suggest

Edited July 30, 2012 by thaipantsman

[Miles from Nowhere 199]

My vision:

-Strengthen ties with mcc to an extent where we can use the mcg as our training base and guarantee our financial future and increase our influence over the afl.

-Create an MFC creed or constitution.

-Aggressively target a proven premiership coach for 2013 which will boost morale, membership and sponsorship.

I would love to implement this vision, if I had the support.

Sadly, this site like a lot of on-line chat breeds a culture of shoot the messenger. Toni, there is a lot of merit in your suggestions.

As another suggestion to Nasher/Demonland, how about a board addressed Dear Don or Dear Cameron or To whom it may concern? To maintain the writer's bona fides he/she would need to append their MFC membership number. On a devoted board you could imagine that someone at the MFC might take time to respond? Certainly trolling through all the de-list him, sack him dreck that proliferates at times like now is not something that is beneficial - to other than a venting poster.

For example two of Tonatopia's suggestions, I ignore sack the coach, are worth a response. I imagine the MCC and their deal with the AFL preclude access to the MCG, but I don't know. Let someone in the know reply.

Ditto, the creed. As distinct from the formal constitution. I have seen Don McLardy take the Red and Blueprint from his pocket at lunch, but not unreasonably, he declined to allow it to be read. But there is a creed - from the football department or at least the coach it is to make the MFC the hardest to play against. That usually invites derision, but it exists.

My point is that like all stakeholders in the club, this forum merits consultation, subject to an active/financial interest. The most recent letter to the Foundation Heroes Chris Connolly stated: -

Always remember that the MFC has made myself exclusively available to all Foundation Heroes, should you have any concerns about any aspect of our Club.

Maybe if we were able to keep posts away from, "drop Bennell, don't draft Viney, sack Neeld" we could enjoy some feedback that would give posters a feeling of inclusion. I'd be happy to give up the internet anonymity by appending MFC number 123456, if there was a likelihood that there would be some response.

Edit:Spelling

Edited July 30, 2012 by Miles from Nowhere

[tonatopia 278]

thankyou for your response, Miles.

[Dee Fan 3,247]

Sadly, this site like a lot of on-line chat breeds a culture of shoot the messenger. Toni, there is a lot of merit in your suggestions.

As another suggestion to Nasher/Demonland, how about a board addressed Dear Don or Dear Cameron or To whom it may concern? To maintain the writer's bona fides he/she would need to append their MFC membership number. On a devoted board you could imagine that someone at the MFC might take time to respond? Certainly trolling through all the de-list him, sack him dreck that proliferates at times like now is not something that is beneficial - to other than a venting poster.

For example two of Tonatopia's suggestions, I ignore sack the coach, are worth a response. I imagine the MCC and their deal with the AFL preclude access to the MCG, but I don't know. Let someone in the know reply.

Ditto, the creed. As distinct from the formal constitution. I have seen Don McLardy take the Red and Blueprint from his pocket at lunch, but not unreasonably, he declined to allow it to be read. But there is a creed - from the football department or at least the coach it is to make the MFC the hardest to play against. That usually invites derision, but it exists.

My point is that like all stakeholders in the club, this forum merits consultation, subject to an active/financial interest. The most recent letter to the Foundation Heroes Chris Connolly stated: -

Always remember that the MFC has made myself exclusively available to all Foundation Heroes, should you have any concerns about any aspect of our Club.

Maybe if we were able to keep posts away from, "drop Bennell, don't draft Viney, sack Neeld" we could enjoy some feedback that would give posters a feeling of inclusion. I'd be happy to give up the internet anonymity by appending MFC number 123456, if there was a likelihood that there would be some response.

Edit:Spelling

I think it's a well known and accepted fact that no side is allowed to train on the MCG, so apart from the club officially telling the members that's the case I can't see much merit in that.

By Creed, are you suggestion a Mission Statement of some kind, if so I would imagine they already have one and I would imagine it's already available upon request.

We have a coach that has a very ordinary list and he told the board that when they hired him. What he does with the list over the next 2 years will determine whether he can coach or not but to suggest he be sacked after 17 games is just idiotic. tona whatever is carrying on like a child that didn't get what he wanted for Christmas and is coming up with hair brained schemes that will never be implemented or work.

If anyone has some suggestions that have some merit then good, let us all know what they are, but to just get on here and say you want the impossible without thinking it through then the credibility levels are zero.

If you have concerns then ring Chris and speak to him, he is accessible.

[thaipantsman 180]

I think its a bit blurred

You do actually realise our ties are actuallystrong. We are PART of the MCC once again ? Cant get much stronger than that.There simply isnt room to facilitate all of what an AFL club requires to have at the G for the MFC. part of the reason we moved out was to have FULL facilities. The actual pitch will never be allocated to an individual team ever again. Get over it.

We have a constituion and its falls under the MCC Charter also. Your really have no idea do you

What will do that, boost morale, membership and sponsorships ( though not too shabby currently ) is success on the field. That comes from building a winning team from the ground up. We are currently doing this. Just not in a way youd comprehend. You obviously think the list is fine. Hard to know what your first mistake is really.

Hows that 'ticket' of yours going.

Belzbub!!!

what's your story? settle yourself down a little. just a little chip on your shoulder perhaps ??

[thaipantsman 180]

Totally agree with above.

Was also speaking to a friend that works at Melbourne membership.

The club is worried about the potential collapse of memberships next year.

Their latest numbers suggest a 20% drop in numbers.

Isn't anyone else worried about this?

Refreshing to at last see some semblance of realism on the site. All the above is TRUE no matter what spin anyone wants to put on it. Can only hope Neeld learns from his mistakes and applies a totally different philosophy in his second year. RR is correct that Neeld is Safe right now but if it's a similar scenario this time next year then Neels will not Coach into his 3rd season. IMO he hasn't got it. Could be wrong but! Lets hope for some improvement starting this Saturday with a no excuse policy going into the game. A loss V GC and Melbourne are in severe turmoil if not already.

[Dee Fan 3,247]

Refreshing to at last see some semblance of realism on the site. All the above is TRUE no matter what spin anyone wants to put on it. Can only hope Neeld learns from his mistakes and applies a totally different philosophy in his second year. RR is correct that Neeld is Safe right now but if it's a similar scenario this time next year then Neels will not Coach into his 3rd season. IMO he hasn't got it. Could be wrong but! Lets hope for some improvement starting this Saturday with a no excuse policy going into the game. A loss V GC and Melbourne are in severe turmoil if not already.

Are you serious; do you think that anyone on this site thinks the current events aren't hurting the club?

You have heaps of questions and lots of speculation but I haven't seen you come up with a credible alternative as yet.

You and your mate can suggest that we get Malthouse or Roos or JC himself, but if they don't want to come or want more than we can afford then it ain't going to happen.

Neeld didn't build this crap list he has to suffer it and I'd ask you the same question I asked jnrmac, who didn't bother to answer, which of our current players would get a game with any other club, in particular one that has a chance at the finals and how many do you think are not worth keeping on the list?

What are your alternatives?

[tonatopia 278]

.

By Creed, are you suggestion a Mission Statement of some kind, if so I would imagine they already have one and I would imagine it's already available upon request.

Not a weekly mission statement, but a kind of list of virtues or creeds that will last for the existence of our club.

If we do have them, where is it, where can i see it, where can I read it. I doubt it even exists?

Example.

MFC Creed

1. The MCG is our home

2. MFC only play in the Red and Blue and the Grand Old Flag is our song

3. Alway play to win

4. Loyalty to Club Captains and Club Champions

5. Always put the club before the individual

and so on.

Carve these 'rules' in stone and mount it on the walls of the MCG. A monument to the MFC ideology.

And dont give me, 'we will be the hardest team to play against', because it is not true.

[Biffen 12,949]

What happens when 4 and 5 conflict like they so often do .

The rest go without saying.

[Range Rover 1,935]

Not a weekly mission statement, but a kind of list of virtues or creeds that will last for the existence of our club.

If we do have them, where is it, where can i see it, where can I read it. I doubt it even exists?

Example.

MFC Creed

1. The MCG is our home

2. MFC only play in the Red and Blue and the Grand Old Flag is our song

3. Alway play to win

4. Loyalty to Club Captains and Club Champions

5. Always put the club before the individual

and so on.

Carve these 'rules' in stone and mount it on the walls of the MCG. A monument to the MFC ideology.

And dont give me, 'we will be the hardest team to play against', because it is not true.

6. Coaches must have us challenging for finals regardless of the list they have to work with, or they will face the sack.

You forgot to add that one.