The Kreuzer Cup - 2007: 2 clubs on different trajectories

[frankie_d 1,471]

Just watching the game tonight - Carlton / Collingwood... I was at the Kreuzer Cup and they were worse than us. The subsequent trajectory of the two clubs is a terrible indictment on us. I don't know if it's the recruiting, the players, the management, the coaching, the board, the supporters, our culture (or just plain bad luck). But res ipsa loquitur it speaks for itself. Carlton are a serious premiership threat - we're nowhere.

I have a feeling that Neeld will fix "it", in the same way the Northey did. Let's get behind him 100% - see you all tomorrow at the G. I'll be outside gate 2 with a roll of navy duct tape to cover EW logos, if anyone wants some!

Go Dees

[Jaded No More 68,974]

Carlton make me sick. Can't even talk about them. Hope they rot in hell.

[pantaloons 2,019]

It is a bit sad. They were worse than us on the day, but it was one of the most comical and least competitive matches of all-time, and they had shelved the Fev months earlier so they'd be able to get the top pick. They were about to land their third straight #1 pick, nailing them all, and one C Judd was already in the (brown recycled paper) bag.

[Jordie_tackles 354]

They had already tanked there way to Murphy and Gibbs, then Kreuzer they were at teh end of the bottoming out cycling.

We were just beginning it, probably unintentionally

[Arrow 1,257]

Carlton make me sick. Can't even talk about them. Hope they rot in hell.

Really? So many other clubs I hate more than Carlton. If anything I respect them. They know what they want and they go and get it. No passengers. Did whatever they had to do to get Judd and are gaining the genius from it. Given the bad name they have they really have no crooks in their team either. Other than the nobody Levi Casboult being tied up on a booze cruise noone gives Ratten and co. enough respect for keeping them in line. Even more so when they had Fevola around.

If someone said you'll mirror everything about them in 3 years I'd take it in a heartbeat.

[Bitter but optimistic 22,249]

Carlton make me sick. Can't even talk about them. Hope they rot in hell.

Yes, I agree. It's a sad thing when you find yourself barracking for the filth. However, it's even sadder to watch the pressure and the way these two sides handle it while still exhibiting high level skills.

Bottom end sides (like us unfortunately) are miles off the pace.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

We started rebuilding at least 2 years after them. They were able to secure (dishonestly via Visy) a cast iron proven star in Judd to bulid a top team around. And we did not have a Dick Pratt to bankroll us off the ground either.

[Redleg 41,497]

Carlton make me sick. Can't even talk about them. Hope they rot in hell.

Best post in ages.

[Sir Why You Little 37,151]

Round 22 2007 made me really angry. Carlton spanked this club so hard. I knew they would be back after that game.

We fell straight into there corrupt web. Trapper left to dominate quite happily. Our coach from that night left within weeks to join carlscum.

Did he know already? Had the paperbags already started to arrive??

It was so predictable it made me sick.

[That's a Stretch 18]

After winning that game and didn't get Kruezer, who did we get again?

[Range Rover 1,935]

They had already tanked there way to Murphy and Gibbs, then Kreuzer they were at teh end of the bottoming out cycling.

We were just beginning it, probably unintentionally

But it's so much more than bottoming out and gaining two or three guns. It takes more than that to become a premiership threat.

Despite being down and out for a few years, Carlton as an organization, from those than run it to the supporters (who must surely be the most annoying lot out there) never lost their swagger.

They have a winning mentality deep in their psyche that club. It's something we lack and I think secretly many of us envy in them.

[monoccular 17,577]

Tanking plus development plus leadership = success.

We are only two steps away from the solution.

[Jordie_tackles 354]

But it's so much more than bottoming out and gaining two or three guns. It takes more than that to become a premiership threat.

Despite being down and out for a few years, Carlton as an organization, from those than run it to the supporters (who must surely be the most annoying lot out there) never lost their swagger.

They have a winning mentality deep in their psyche that club. It's something we lack and I think secretly many of us envy in them.

the point was that we are in different places atm because they had started their rebuild at that stage, Kreuxer was the last piece of the puzzle.

Then the climb back up

[dee-luded 2,959]

Tanks for da memories

http://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/afl-premiership/tanks-for-not-winning/story-e6frf35u-1111114282657

[Tricky 341]

After winning that game and didn't get Kruezer, who did we get again?

Assume your being facetious...but that would be Cale.

Let's hope we see a big one from him tomorrow.

[Tricky 341]

But it's so much more than bottoming out and gaining two or three guns. It takes more than that to become a premiership threat.

Despite being down and out for a few years, Carlton as an organization, from those than run it to the supporters (who must surely be the most annoying lot out there) never lost their swagger.

They have a winning mentality deep in their psyche that club. It's something we lack and I think secretly many of us envy in them.

This describes the Bummers for me.

I'm always happy enough to see Joffa having sulk.

[That's a Stretch 18]

I look at it from the point of view that we have finally got the right structures and personnel in place and is going to take time? from now...

[Guest Dr Who]

We started rebuilding at least 2 years after them. They were able to secure (dishonestly via Visy) a cast iron proven star in Judd to bulid a top team around. And we did not have a Dick Pratt to bankroll us off the ground either.

$$$$$ the life blood of modern day AFL football clubs

But it's so much more than bottoming out and gaining two or three guns. It takes more than that to become a premiership threat.

Despite being down and out for a few years, Carlton as an organization, from those than run it to the supporters (who must surely be the most annoying lot out there) never lost their swagger.

They have a winning mentality deep in their psyche that club. It's something we lack and I think secretly many of us envy in them.

100% correct they never lost it. Many around here could learn from them.

[dee-luded 2,959]

Just watching the game tonight - Carlton / Collingwood... I was at the Kreuzer Cup and they were worse than us. The subsequent trajectory of the two clubs is a terrible indictment on us. I don't know if it's the recruiting, the players, the management, the coaching, the board, the supporters, our culture (or just plain bad luck). But res ipsa loquitur it speaks for itself. Carlton are a serious premiership threat - we're nowhere.

I have a feeling that Neeld will fix "it", in the same way the Northey did. Let's get behind him 100% - see you all tomorrow at the G. I'll be outside gate 2 with a roll of navy duct tape to cover EW logos, if anyone wants some!

Go Dees

Frankie, maybe you've forgotten where they were, & where we were???

Heres a review of the game stats, that shows how far down the rebuild, they in fact were,,, ahead of our rebuild... we hadn't started ours until the next year. 2008...

http://www.finalsiren.com/MatchDetails.asp?GameID=4635&Code=83a2caacb6c6a5d4a8a2e9607ea68b57

Heres the teams (names), & the stats for the game. > & I'll throw in a breakdown graph of the years ladder.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_AFL_season#Ladder_progression

[dee-luded 2,959]

They had already tanked there way to Murphy and Gibbs, then Kreuzer they were at teh end of the bottoming out cycling.

We were just beginning it, probably unintentionally

And they went after Judd,,, AFTER they had Murphy, Gibbs, Kreuzer, they're stars of the future.

Then they chased a legend to teach them a good work ethic.

.

[RalphiusMaximus 6,092]

Carlton started their tanking run at least three years ahead of us. They have more top picks than us and they got special dispensation from the AFL to offer money outside the salary cap to lure top players to their club. There is no realistic comparison between us at this stage. Our team in 2015 should be getting close to what they are producing now. If we still can't compete at that point, start making these comparisons.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

Just watching the game tonight - Carlton / Collingwood... I was at the Kreuzer Cup and they were worse than us. The subsequent trajectory of the two clubs is a terrible indictment on us. I don't know if it's the recruiting, the players, the management, the coaching, the board, the supporters, our culture (or just plain bad luck). But res ipsa loquitur it speaks for itself. Carlton are a serious premiership threat - we're nowhere.

I have a feeling that Neeld will fix "it", in the same way the Northey did. Let's get behind him 100% - see you all tomorrow at the G. I'll be outside gate 2 with a roll of navy duct tape to cover EW logos, if anyone wants some!

Go Dees

well yeah that's what I said a week ago

well if we were playing Carlton tomorrow I would be expecting an almighty flogging, put it that way. The mind boggles thinking how Judd and Murphy will destroy us, they are the champion midfielders you are supposed to draft and develop with picks in the top 3. They have a number of other stars all over the park as a result of their years in the doldrums, and are genuine flag contenders this year. Then there's us. With similar drafting gifts, albeit a couple of years behind, we have not been able to take advantage like they have. They got Kruezer in 2007 and we got Cale Morton who in his fifth year cannot even get a game in a truly ordinary side. There is no excuse for that, of course many simpletons here want to believe we picked the wrong bloke, even though it was widely recognised that he may have even been a no.1 pick that year as the top 5 was very strong - but Morton is at the wrong club, he would probably be running around dominating if the Blues had picked him instead of Kruezer. That is why we do not have one champion player on the list, it's because there is something wrong with our culture, our methods, our staff, I don't know what, it probably has a lot to do with money. The fact that Judd is their captain when he friggin barracked for us and could have gone anywhere is a fact that tells you everything you need to know about the big fish and little fish of modern footy. If anything exposes what a failure we are as a club it is the success of Carlton .

and yes they started 2 years before us, but in 2009 they finished 7th and lost a final at the GABBA by 7 points. How far off that are we? Pretty blooody far

[Ned 156]

But it's so much more than bottoming out and gaining two or three guns. It takes more than that to become a premiership threat.

Despite being down and out for a few years, Carlton as an organization, from those than run it to the supporters (who must surely be the most annoying lot out there) never lost their swagger.

They have a winning mentality deep in their psyche that club. It's something we lack and I think secretly many of us envy in them.

Yep, exactly right. We bottomed out and are back at the bottom. There's more to them than tanking.

[Sir Why You Little 37,151]

well yeah that's what I said a week ago

well if we were playing Carlton tomorrow I would be expecting an almighty flogging, put it that way. The mind boggles thinking how Judd and Murphy will destroy us, they are the champion midfielders you are supposed to draft and develop with picks in the top 3. They have a number of other stars all over the park as a result of their years in the doldrums, and are genuine flag contenders this year. Then there's us. With similar drafting gifts, albeit a couple of years behind, we have not been able to take advantage like they have. They got Kruezer in 2007 and we got Cale Morton who in his fifth year cannot even get a game in a truly ordinary side. There is no excuse for that, of course many simpletons here want to believe we picked the wrong bloke, even though it was widely recognised that he may have even been a no.1 pick that year as the top 5 was very strong - but Morton is at the wrong club, he would probably be running around dominating if the Blues had picked him instead of Kruezer. That is why we do not have one champion player on the list, it's because there is something wrong with our culture, our methods, our staff, I don't know what, it probably has a lot to do with money. The fact that Judd is their captain when he friggin barracked for us and could have gone anywhere is a fact that tells you everything you need to know about the big fish and little fish of modern footy. If anything exposes what a failure we are as a club it is the success of Carlton .

and yes they started 2 years before us, but in 2009 they finished 7th and lost a final at the GABBA by 7 points. How far off that are we? Pretty blooody far

Nailed it there C & B....To much sitting around waiting for it to all happen at the MFC which is exactly the reason i wish the FD revamp had occurred at the end of the 2009 season..But it didn't.

All is not lost, but we make it so much harder on ourselves...

[Vanilla Gorilla 204]

Carlton make me sick. Can't even talk about them. Hope they rot in hell.

+1

Absolutely cannot stand Carlton. Dislike them in every way, shape and form.