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Frost should have been included as a defender.

I'm really uneasy about this draft. all of them seem pretty underwhelming in my opinion . i hope we haven't mortgaged the farm for 2 shots at a pool of weak talent. It feels like some on here are trying to talk themselves in to wanting some of these guys. I hope im wrong

It wouldn't surprise me if we take Weideman at P3 and who's left out of Parish and Oliver at P7. I think the key in all of this is getting the key forward we want. I appreciate some here want the mid first, but if we set that aside for one moment... Let's assume for the sake of this debate that outside of Weitering or Schache they think the 196 cm Weideman is the best foil for Hogan. How do they get him ? Quality key forwards are very hard to come by and when you get a chance you've got to pull the trigger early. We know the club has him in their sights with Curnow being the other option. Do they rate the two talls equally ? Is Weideman the preferred choice by some margin ? As much as I'm warming to Oliver and like Parish, mids are far easier to come by. If the club is bullish on Weideman I reckon they have to take him with P3. P3 Weideman P4 Parish/Oliver P5 Francis P6 Milera P7 Oliver/Parish P8 Curnow (Not taking into account academy picks)

Still betting we take Parish at 3 Goodwin and Macca have had a bit to do with the falcons Jason taylor was on a panel that selected him AA 2 weeks ago Oliver wasn't even in the mix for pick 3, he hasn't played a game since then. we were desperate to get our hands on pick 3 knowing Essendon would take Parish

Maybe we will take Oliver with our first pick and he does look a good prospect, but I simply find it hard to believe that he is player we traded up from pick 6 to get. This part of it doesn't make sense to me.

We don't have a lot of mids - its a myth. This perception is much like my wife's recollection of child birth - like the footy season as time moves on from the event, her recollection of the pain dims more an more to the point we start believing it wasn't bad. Of course this is just my opinion, but I challenge everyone to talk to their non MFC supporting friends and see who they would want to take from our team. The list is pretty small, most won't even be aware of the names that keep being bandied about as filling our great midfield. Conversations I have had reveal everyone wants Hogan, most would be happy Jones, Vince, Brayshaw and T Mcac. My SA and Hawk supporting friends all rate Viney. Then there is a small smattering of interest based more on supercoach results than anything else. To up the ante, I ask who they would trade a first round pick for and the list shrinks even further (Jones, Brayshaw and Hogan); if we talk top 10 then you can drop Jones out. So other teams look out our great midfield as Jones and Brayshaw; with support from the 2V's; Even St Kilda can beat this!!!! If we are honest the only other player that has even performed consistently (more than 10 games) in the midfield at an above average level is Tyson. Drafting is actually a simple concept: You take the best player available regardless of position or type - you then trade for positions/types preferably identifying the need before it is urgent (reducing other teams position of strength which they gain when they know your filling a weakness).

We had a deal ready to go with GC for ND3 for weeks before trade week. The desire to invest Howe into moving up 3 spots? We had and have someone in mind and the last month of pure speculation - and no footy - isn't changing that. As much as they may deny it - they will pick the kid they saw a long a way out.

We didn't "trade up" to take Oliver. A month out from the draft nothing was set in concrete. We traded up to improve our position in the draft. We traded up to get the highest position we could and ultimately secure the best talent, as deemed by us, on draft day. No-one is leaking, but my educated guess from a couple of private things is that we'll take Oliver.

Parish was in the U15, U17 and U18 All Australian teams. He's been on our club's radar for too long to be jettisoned in favour of a bolter. My opinion.

Friday, November 20, 0945 hours Pretty big day for this individual. First of all, my one and only exam was completed yesterday, and secondly, today I find out whether I’ve been nominated for AFL Victoria’s Community Media Awards for the second year in succession, which at the age of 22 I see as a massive achievement. Anyway, I get here missing part of the warmups, as is almost customary for me nowadays, I couldn’t explain properly why that is the case. Anyway as I get here the boys are doing the same drill that they normally do when they start off with their drills for the morning, the handball drill where there’s a defender putting pressure on. In the middle there’s a different drill, where the boys are asked to kick to players in the same team until called to kick to the other team. I’ll probably try to better explain – there’s two teams of about four or five players, one wearing vests and one not wearing vests, plus a couple of players wearing orange for that matter as well, and the coach calls out which colour kicks to whom. If that makes sense. In the meantime, as I walk through to Gosch’s, Terlich finishes up early and walks by me; Smith and ANB are doing some running and I can’t really explain why, and Trengove makes a very welcome appearance. Not entirely sure what he is doing at this point. Vandenberg is having a run around the joint as well. Meantime checking out the personalities around the place Mahoney is hearing watching, as well as King Jackson who’s made himself a dead set legend yesterday by signing on for a couple more years. Top bloke. Next drill is a full grounder drill, two full teams, boys are going hard at it. Brayshaw is crashing into blokes and in one case manages to bring down Maxy Gawn. It’s not quite the full monty yet until everybody else joins the party anyway. In the meantime Kenty is still moving very well considering he hasn’t played for a few months, and Tommy Mc is still showing his versatility whenever the ball goes nearby. Having said that there’s quite a few slip and sliding around due to the wet conditions experienced after last night’s awesome storm. Speaking of storms, an early look at a possible game plan sees the boys storming forward whenever they get the chance to do that. The ball movement at this early stage is noticeably faster and there’s more of an emphasis on players moving positively whenever the chance is there to do so. There is still a bit of an emphasis on switching play – as most coaches probably would. Having said that despite all the positivity, there are still a few disappointing errors by foot. Some of these errors come about as a result of risky kicks, but there are also errors which come about due to poor kicks. Another bloke who’s moving around really well is Dom Tyson. This bloke’s going to be an interesting case in 2016. I think all Melbourne supporters agree that 2015 was disappointing for him but I think we also all agree that we knew he was somewhat affected by injury. Anyway, on the track at the moment, he’s moving around like he’s finding the 2014 silky-smooth movement again, even though that there is still a bit of tape around his knee, which is really good to see. I’m therefore looking forward to seeing what he does when he’s fully fit. More on the drill – the skills have improved markedly since I commented that they left a lot to be desired. Also it seems that there is a lot more confidence about with many players. Probably none more so than Jayden Hunt. He seems to be backing his speed a lot more and he’s also getting the chance to find a lot more space, which is really encouraging. I think 2016 is the year we’ll finally see him get games, and we’ll finally get to see the great #29 grace the field for the first time since the great days of Michael “Juice” Newton. Drill stops and the move to the other side of the ground to do some form of a defensive drill. On the near side of the ground where I am it’s good to see Dunny here a bit early like he normally is, having a bit of fun and having set shots… hold on, he’s a defender isn’t he? On the other side of the ground, it’s really good to see JKH all over this defensive drill, and intercepting a couple of kicks, which is exactly what I want to see. Just hoping that this year was just the classic case of second year blues. The drill stops for a period before the roles are reversed – the team with the vests are attacking and the team without them are defending… but that’s a loose term. Good moment comes when a kick opens up big Maxy 15 metres in the clear, Maxy gets there… but only just. One quintessentially classic panic handball later, the vest team are able to kick a goal having broken open the defensive structure that the plain team tried to implement too easily in the end. This is the same deal when the defensive structure is tried again, with a kick down the corridor breaking open the play way too easily, which is either good or bad depending on which team you want to focus on. After a short micro-break the boys go at it again… and again it’s basically the same deal without the result this time around. I’m looking around trying to work out whether it’s just that the team with the vests have more numbers or that there is a weak link which is hurting the plain structure. At the moment, it appears to be a case of the former. On closer inspection, there’s the same amount of numbers on both sides. Bit of a break, Frost is running laps around the oval, Hogan has seemingly appeared out of nowhere given I hadn’t seen him during the drills (not sure if I haven’t paid enough attention for that one TBH) and is having a few sprints just over a patch of the oval with Viney. There’s clearly a bit of friendly rivalry when they run around – think it’s almost like they have to start line astern with an alternate leader and then they have to make sure that they stay in front. Bit of a similar drill to what’s been going on basically all morning after a short break which is another pressure-based drill with game simulation. Again JKH is performing well when applying pressure, laying another couple of tackles. Really been impressed with his application this morning. As they have another chat all you can hear is the solid BEEP BEEP BEEP noise that the Storm are doing. It’s not entirely a beep test, but (BEEP) it’s (BEEP)in annoying. Thankfully the boys get back into it, coupled with the beeping noise stopping, so that I can focus entirely on the drill at hand and see who’s doing what. With Hogan, Viney and a few others sitting out of main group training for the time being it’s two groups of nine on nine… ahem, AFL 9s. The drill restarts and immediately there is an orgy of players all over the footy. Again, JKH doesn’t give an inch whenever anyone gets the footy, laying yet another tackle, this time on Harmes. Mind you there was about 15 or 16 players within two metres of the footy this time round so laying a tackle was straightforward. There was a bit of solid banter during the drill when Tom McDonald gets the footy and tries kicking it to King… only to have his brother intercept it! During the same passage of play, Hogan (who’s running on the oval) cracks the shits when he has players interrupt his run (as I said before, it’s a friendly rivalry with Viney that he has and he’s trying to better Jack’s efforts). The next time they go about it Harmes gathers from half back and goes for an electrifying run that last until about 20m from goal before he gives out a Joe the Goose to a teammate. I am a bit disappointed he didn’t take the initiative and kick the goal himself because that was every bit as good a run as Phil Manassa’s (albeit this is in training and not in a Grand Final with the game on the line). After that there’s more of a handball drill this time around. It’s similar to the kicking drill except it covers a much smaller patch of ground than the kicking drill which was basically a full grounder. It’s more of a five on five drill than the nine on nine we’ve become accustomed to, with all players basically starting side on. The boys then stop for a bit, have a casual kick to kick and then change into their running shoes. As ever they come with instructions – Press B to run like the wind! (points if you get the reference). Okey-dokes. The running. There’s two groups and one quasi-group which I’m not sure just starts slowly or is part of the other group, I don’t have a clue. First bit of running sees the boys go from the back pocket to the goal posts. Either side. Pleasingly for those who likes seeing epic running battles, Tom and Oscar McDonald are in the same group, which will make for good viewing when everybody else invariably slows down. Pleasingly, for the time being, Dom is up the front. Kennedy, by the looks of things, is up the front of the other group. Mind you, that group has Gawn, Frost, Kent and King in it, so it’s the same running group as when I was last here last Friday. For the time being though I’m really pleased that Dom looks back to his injury-free best, staying up the front the whole time. After a leisurely walk around the oval the boys head off for a spot of lunch, which is what I also do. ​

Very brave of you to announce it online.Good for you Dazzle.

Oliver reminds me a fair bit of Moloney, with how he gets possession then generally kicks long. In his highlights video I would have liked to see more of a balance between going long and picking out targets. Parish is much better at finding a target. I reckon Bummers supporters must be doing their heads in with who we are going to take at 3. We have enough inside bulls already - time for some polish and class.

I am partial to McKay at 7 so I would make sure we got the mid we want and if Weideman is off the board then McKay it is. Talls aren't the only ones hard to find - good mids are too - investing in top 5 picks has to get us good players, just pick who you think is the best one, Jason.

Am I the only one who's worried about Weideman? Injuries?

So, headed in today to get around to building that Ikea shelving (see above ...). Walked past the Bataclan (just round the corner from where we were going). Found it impossible to imagine the reality of the horror of it all. Seems unreal, to be standing there on a beautiful Parisian autumn morning, looking at a scene of a massacre. The sign out the front still displays: "Coming: Eagles of Death Metal". Even looking at the laneway down the side, and seeing the second floor window where the woman was hanging by her fingertips until someone managed to pull her in ... like rewatching a dream. Hard to grasp. What brought it home was this: across the road, is a small park. Completely surrounded now by flowers, candles, dedications, photos, flags, you-name-it, lots of people there standing round silently, laying flowers etc., along with others with little stalls handing out hot drinks and sandwiches, the whole street still lined with TV crews and camera trucks. And at one point amongst it all - a woman's bike, a run of the mill, thrash around Paris bike, locked to the fence: but covered in flowers. Someone's bike that the owner, for whatever reason, hasn't been able to come back and collect. They were real people, with real lives, real families, senselessly cut down. Difficult. (took a photo, but can't work out how to post it ...)

Happy for us to draft him on his name alone.

that's what i thought too then i realised that they probably lost half their financial records too

Oliver's a bolter who could easily be available at 7 if Essendon take Francis & Curnow/Weideman and the Suns take Milera/Ah Chee. There's a far greater chance of Oliver slipping to 7 than Parish. Essendon will not let him past 5; they'll be struggling to select their 2 from Curnow, Francis, Weideman and Oliver which makes our choice at 7 all the easier. I've a feeling Dodoro, seeing so many deficiencies across their list, will want a midfielder and a tall. Francis almost seems a lock considering how much he wants to play for the Bombers; so would they really take two midfielders with two premium picks? Highly unlikely IMHO.

Weideman was just featured on Channel 9 news - grandpa and dad interviewed too. Grandpa: 'Oh, he'll go in, he goes in, he don't care. He's got that guts about him.....' 'I'd love him to play at Melbourne - Barassi would be rapt with that...' Like.

I couldn't give a brass wazoo abou the IRS.

I will say that I prefer McKay to Weideman based on the (very) little I have seen. But I will say that - despite my 'crusade' not to assume our midfield is in any way set - that these two excite me the most out of the players probably available at 7. Possible exception of Mathieson. I do think the club came into trade week with a plan to get Parish and a tall and one of these two would be a good result. I prefer Mckay because he seems more comfortable up the ground and he can help Gawn in the ruck. Weideman looks like he could be Taylor Walker but doesn't scream out talent like Hogan did before he was drafted (although not many do...).

We have that player. His name is Jeff Gartlett.

If you've seen Frost play you know he's not a forward. It's one of those things you don't need to be told.

It's funny...I thought that Oliver was one name that Demonland would be unable to screw up. It seems as though the misspelling of his name in the thread title has gone undetected for nearly a month and a half.

Pedersen is a much better contested mark than Frost. Frost is a line breaking tall. He's a spoiler, who can then mop up and take the game on or dish off. He's not a smart key forward, who dictates play.

If we are going to take Oliver at 3 ahead of Parish the recruiters must have seen something amazing in Oliver, from what i've seen he's been pumped up way more than his actual ability as a player.

Looking at the list, I was alarmed at our lack of tall defenders. (yeah I know I shouldn't have been, but wow, it stands out) Any chance of Collins coming to us? Big, strong, brutish. Follows the Roos path. Whichever way it goes, I'm going to suffer a letdown, as we have been talking about so many names, it just seems like we will get them all.

I think you're probably spot on, ultimately a lot of it is luck is Parish going to be a Gaff or a Toumpas? is Oliver going to be a Wines or a Riley

Some random notes from Thursday night:-Jason Taylor and Todd Viney covered most aspects of their roles in recruiting and list management respectively and shed some light on the decision-making behind the list changes to date and discussed the players in the mix for picks 3 & 7 for next Tuesday night including the rationale behind their thinking when weighing up who to select, what type of player and the attributes they look for - in the end it's always the best player available but we know that remains very much a subjective concept. The list management/recruiting is a job that never really starts or finishes. Next week, there's the National Draft on Tuesday and the PSD & Rookie Draft on Friday and soon after you're already immersed in what's going to happen next year with player contracts, with the next lot of young players about to come into the system and who you can possibly acquire from other AFL clubs or the senior competitions below. There was discussion on the list of players who retired and were delisted/traded. Viney was quite blunt about Howe. The club offered a contract, his manager wanted more. The situation became one where the decision was deferred till later in the season to show the club he was capable of performing to higher levels and in the end, he produced the same thing as he had done for four years. His ultimate contract with Collingwood reflected that the club's view wasn't far off the mark. Someone asked Todd if he'd like to revisit the selection of Jimmy Toumpas ahead of Ollie Wines and in return received the stare of a smiling assassin. Another word from him would surely have seen him turn into chopped liver. Obviously, the club would like to be perceived of as being a destination club for the elite types in the competition and we did try (and in some cases came close) to get the name players but we're not there yet and were not helped by some poor late season efforts. Instead, we did well to identify players like Melksham, Bugg and Kennedy who, although highly regarded when coming into the system, were not happy where they were or looking for better opportunities to develop into regular senior players. I made an interesting observation to Redleg when we first came into the room about how times had changed. Back in the old days, there would have been plenty of beer on tap for the punters whereas all we got on the night was plain water. There might have been an element of prescience there because the first potential draftee who's vision they showed us on the screen was at that very moment probably having his first drink for the evening and it should also have been water and not beer. I mean, I like Charlie Curnow but how stupid is the kid given that he's played in the TAC Cup competition for two years? Did he not take the time to learn a single thing about the message of the sponsoring organisation? I never thought Curnow would or should be the #3 pick even though we were told about his leadership potential compared with say, Darcy Parish who's "a bit of a lad" and "plays up from time to time" but it's 2015 so I still am prepared to forgive him (as the Hawks generously did with their skipper before winning the grand final) if we get him at #7. I've made my thoughts clear about who we should take first and since the club has no control over the selections in between, I'm prepared for and satisfied with the array that was put up for us to view - Curnow, Francis, Milera, Parish, Oliver and Weideman. Any two will do. Each has his own individual attribute or set of attributes that, if nurtured and developed properly will make our team a better side. One thing which I did think they let slip was that we were going to bid early for a Sydney player which means Callum Mills will be taken at #3 and our own first pick will become 4. We're also going to try to rookie list Viv Michie. Some of those back in great shape are AVB and JT (along with Petracca). Separately, I was told that Billy Stretch is in great shape and bulking up a bit and Dean Terlich has also worked hard on getting his body in shape for what must surely be his last tilt. My own view is that his contract has probably stood in the way of the club claiming Jake Lovett as a father/son prospect. Viney spoke of the difficulty of having to go to see him and the family to deliver the news that they wouldn't be drafting him under the f/s rule. There aren't many others in the category in the wings at present (an Obst maybe?). At the equivalent meeting twelve months ago, I left pretty well assured that we were going to draft Paddy McCartin and Angus Brayshaw - at that stage most of the football world was convinced that St. Kilda was going to go for Christian Petracca. I think we lucked out when they changed their mind. It seems that notwithstanding the Truck's year off, Simon Goodwin regards him in the same class as a former teammate called McLeod so to have him, Brayshaw, The Hulk and two more top 10 picks in the wings is a salvating thought irrespective of who we take in the end (geez, even Milera who nobody thinks we'll take would be enough for Bruce McAvaney to describe as "delicious"). Now 20 or so years ago, we could have capped off that salivating thought by wolfing down more party pies and sausage rolls than you could eat in a week but on this night, it was sushi and quiches (Redleg worked them over quite well anyway). Twenty years ago there would have been stories leaking from every corner of the room. I remember the day when I was told on the eve of a draft that we badly wanted a South Australian named Camporeale. Carlton took him with the selection before ours. On this night there were no leaks about who we are going to pick on Tuesday night. How times have changed?

The sad case is that the 03 draft was a stinker.If you look at the players in the top 40 taken after them the only players better were David Mundy at 19 and Jed Adcock at 33. Hell, better players were taken in the rookie draft. Our own Aaron Davey at 3, Andrew Carrazzo at 2, Nathan Foley at 4 and Paul Duffield at 10.

That's why we should be using pick 3 on a KPP like Weideman and the best mid left at 7. This could be the last time we get a chance to get a quality KPP draft to help build our forward line with Hogan. We got the best 2 mids in last years draft and considering the best 2 mids in this year draft are academy players does it really matter if we wait till pick 7 to get the 4th or 5th best midfielder in this year draft?

Just been watching Mckay's and Weideman's highlights for a comparison - much prefer Harry's. Not having seen these guys live it's hard to judge well. however this kid is clean at ground level, seems to like more body contact and being in traffic than Weed (Weed seems on his own a he'll of a lot in his vids - won't get that grace in the big league). Will take the 2nd ruck spot once he gets in as well. Looks a better frame to add bulk, yet bottom ager, scrapes in to this draft by a handful of days only - would probably go #1 next year if he was born a week later. May not be ready next year but gee a year of development and getting what should be next years best kid smells pretty good to me Unless he doesn't fit the no DH rule - I want this kid at 7.

I think we will go 3.Oliver 7. McKay

I can't see Curnow being any better as a midfielder than Tom Bell. Both tall with huge tanks, awful haircuts, abhorrent disposal and poor attitudes. I will be very disappointed if we draft Curnow.

Maybe Oliver is a late bolter only to the media and football watchers!! In a recent interview Taylor said we have a scout (whose name I have forgotten) who watches players from under12 onwards!!! Taylor would also have the benefit of scouts for underage players from his days at Collingwood. So Taylor has been watching him (and other draftees) for a very long time. If Taylor takes Oliver @ 3 he will have a damn good reason. And, it won't be because Oliver is suddenly making the headlines! I for one won't be doubting Taylor's choice.

True. I remember many clubs baulking at Jake Stringer due to his injuries... But....what a gun. Hindsight...wonderful thing.

Not based on knowledge but I reckon that's what it is but in the reverse order.

Talented as all of Parish, Oliver and Milera seem to be, it would be pretty disappointing to not come out of this draft with a key fwd.

You may be right, but I "continue to make this assertion", because he's not a forwards you know what. He's a much better defender. I agree that there's every chance he plays forward due to a somewhat settled backline.

i don't see your logic if you played one unregistered player you lose the points if you played with one extra player for one minute you lose the points one player, many players doesn't matter, the team that played was tainted

Fair point. I do wonder about our lack of pace in there as you wouldn't consider any of those guys as 'quick', but they will certainly win plenty of the footy for us.

If we take Oliver, then it is a near certainty that one or both of Weideman and Curnow are there for pick 7.

I can't see Francis not going in the first 6.

Hey I have thought of a great idea How about a thread devoted to and restricted to our happiness that PJ has re-signed

One day just by pure chance we'll come across some anniversary that actually breaks the Curse. Hopefully this is it.

Why would we use pick 3 on Oliver when it's likely he will be available at pick 7?

Nearly 1/3 of road accident fatalities involve an alcohol impaired driver. Yeah, heaps of "fun".

This really is a fascinating draft for us. I can't recall a draft, where we had a high draft pick, actually probably the first live pick and it could be any of about 6 players, without shocking me. We probably all agree that Parish, Curnow, Francis, Oliver , Milera and Weideman could be pick 3, without any Demon jumping off the MCG roof in disgust. Our club has not leaked at all and the experts are all guessing and coming up with different selections for 3. I attended the MFC draft talk on thursday and came away completely none the wiser. It is a draft that has therefore now generated a fair bit of excitement to see who we get at 3 and 7. Players seem to be going up or down by the day. Curnow probably down a bit since his incident. For me, Francis up a bit since I saw another highlights package. Added to the excitement is the fact that we don't really know who the Bombers and GC really want either. I have heard that GC would love Milera or Francis. Clearly the Bombers will take at least one mid with picks 4 and 5. The combinations are many and 7 could well be a key forward we need, or a mid we need if we go taller with 3. Crazy as it sounds we could pass on Parish at 3 and still get him at 7. I am excited for draft night for the first time in a while and I now for the last couple of drafts, have confidence in our recruiting team. Good luck Dees and I hope we pick up a couple of champs early and a couple of very good footballers later. No bugger that, pick up 4 champs.

Agreed. I don't know why people choose to hold grudges anyway. It happened, they're gone now and have no power over us anymore, so why waste emotional energy on maintaining the rage?

Please stop making outlandish comments about who we 'must' take based on YouTube videos. I beg you.