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I'm with those who are of the view that we shouldn't allow players and their management to stand over us in regard to recruiting. If we want the player and believe he fits into our plans, by all means go for him. By the same token BRFE makes the point that Caddy isn't all that good. He finished 17th in the B & F of a club that finished 17th in the competition. He didn't set the world on fire in the few games I watched him play and even if the reason was because he wasn't happy in that environment after wanting to go back home, I don't look upon that sort of attitude very favourably. Let the other clubs fight for him. I think there would be no shortage of available midfielders of equal or better ability at pick 13 or alternatively other trades possible for that pick which seems to be the approximate cost of a trade for him if there are as many as five other suitors. Good luck to him and to them.

Believe it or not he was the star of the show. The others will be disappointed. Lloyd is the replacement, he will have a go, but not like Thomas, who didn't give a rat's about the AFL and therefore wasn't another of their lackeys. Must have a good business opportunity, to turn down an easy gig that involved very little time for him. I will be sorry to see him go. He was good TV.

What a devastating loss to the community .

That kick in '87 is discussed on page 63 of the little paper. Can't believe it was 25 years ago. I still remember it vividly. Same feeling as a death to someone close. '88 just kicked my guts even harder. Hawthorn are still "up" F$&@K...

Not gonna bother discussing this with you cos you obviously have no idea about this player. You think he's a skinny wussy basketballer who'll take years to develop... Pretty much the EXACT opposite of what every single expert is saying.

That may be hard given our present plight, but it also isn't necessary. Robert Walls loves telling a story about Craig Lambert. He told Lambert that they'd be taking him as they had first access to him. Lambert said I won't play for you. Brisbane took him anyway. Walls rang Lambert after the draft and Lambert told him to go and ... Lambert cooled down and decided he had no choice, but to go, as standing out of footy for 2 years wasn't much of an option. He stayed 18 years in Queensland. He stayed on as a coach after he retired and loves the club. You've just got to get players onto your list. If you become a good club the rest takes care of itself.

Care factor ...

I don't see the merit in assessing his worth based on this game. Almost every Collingwood player played poorly. Dale Thomas did nothing either, but he's clearly an A grade player. As it stands, despite tonight, he's still better than pretty much our entire midfield, and is worth a decent sum. There is obviously a limit as to what we'd pay, and I'll back our new administration in to know that, but given what's on offer on the market, he's worth us chasing.

Smells of Brent Prismall and Robbie Warnock all over again.

See your first Crows game of the year? Good on you champ. I love it when the armchair experts hit the forums to let us know how little people like Neil Craig know about the game of football. Looking forward to similar insightful contributions such as this in the future MO. Perhaps you could start by letting us know who should have received the offer instead.

I hope everyone got on. Easy money.

Do some research mate.

here's a good idea instead of the white lets use banana yellow....... red, blue, banana...............solved

Two words: Brodie Grundy

How bad? 3AW last night BT: "Caro, why write an article about Mick Malthouse's book?" Caro: "It's fascinating that Mick was on this station saying that the book tour was set in stone and now the West Australian component where Mick is greatly loved has been cancelled" BT: "Well I think it's a nothing story" Caro: "I think it's an interesting story and so do the The Age readers" BT: "Well I haven't read the article, I don't read much." Caro: "Hang on a minute how can you criticise it when you haven't read it" BT: "I didn't say that Caro, I said I don't read much, don't play that game and put words into my mouth". Hard to choose when switching channels between 3AW's Brian "dung sandwich" Taylor and SEN's Mark "cup of cold sick" Robinson.

Ch 9 are replacing Grant Thomas with Matthew Lloyd? Haha that's funny...Lloyd is so dull on camera. Thomas was anything but. TV is dying...

I was there and plan to be there again too...

Wellingham is a premiership player, knows the work ethic and game-plan compliance to play in a team that has made the prelim/grand final in every season he has played with them. He would be well known to our coach and has all the skills we currently need for our midfield balance. He is quick, a good overhead mark, has great skills, gets outside possessions, breaks lines and can get his own ball. If Jones, Grimes, Trengove, Magner, Mckensie all have years like this one or improve Wellingham would be the ideal component to make up for the deficiencies of this group. For those discussing his low possession average it is very difficult to get high posessions in a midfield with 3 or 4 other guys getting 30+ possies. Often Wellingham plays roles, on a half forward flank, or on occasion has tagged, these skills make him a more balanced player, but in our midfield I have no doubt he would be getting more possies than our current midfield. Also, in games where Pendelbury, Swan and Ball have been absent Wellingham has stepped up his possession and relished the new role. Anyone remember QB 2011? "He put himself in the spotlight with a career-best 37 possessions in the 2011 Queen's Birthday game against Melbourne, where he stood up in the absence of a number of star team-mates to lead Collingwood to a dominant 88 point win". He hasn't had many chances to be the main man, but this was one and he killed it. Wellingham is a street ahead of our current mids and fills the deficiencies our mid balance currently has, get him!

I would like to get Kennedy early and macrae at 13. I'm also a fan of nick Graham. Not sure where he is ranked though. IMO Kennedy is much better than people give him credit for. His height is the only issue but some of the really good players are his height.(Kerr, Harvey, jack). He kicks goals too.

Next you will tell us that you want to win a flag and don't care what we look like.

I'm happy to overpay a gun, but not a front runner from a top team, because they may be ordinary in a poor team. I wanted Clark, because big aggressive and talented 200cm players don't grow on trees, but Wellingham has never had a year as good as 3 of Sylvia's. For example, giving Beams a silly amount of money would have made far more sense. Or Gaff, Fyfe, Shuey, Rockliff, etc, because you can see the type of players they'll become. But not the Wellingham's of this world. Look at the following link and see how they already supersede a player like Wellingham and the gap will only continue to grow. You need to identify a player like the ones in the link and make them a priority. I don't know David Swallow's contract status at the Suns, but he's the type I'd throw a heap at. He had an ordinary year, but will be a star. http://finalsiren.co...rageRating Desc

I actually feel sorry for the umpires. Kevin Bartlett ond the other fools on the rules of the game commitee are 100% to blame. I travel a bit and have taught hundreds of foreigners to appreciate our game over the years. 20 years ago it was a simple task. There were only a handful of rules and they were simple to interpret. Now when I try to explain the game it is ridiculously complex. The rules around tackling and incorrect disposal have me completely stumped. They may as well toss a coin to decide whose free it is.

OH PLEASE not the away jumper thread again. Please let there be some other news we can discuss on Demonland We have done this to death. Win games in any strip is my desire

I heard one of the commentators say there were only 4 members of the 2005 premiership team playing tonight. They've managed to completely rebuild their side and have only missed the finals once in the process. Incredible.

Underbelly

Smart punters take note - get ya hard earned on the team I pick against . Easy money ....

always been a loudmouth tossbag

Like him loathe him, agree, disagree. he had one asset that I did like. He wasn't bound to any master. He said what he thought, right or wrong. That's rare.

I can't see how Mifsud can claim breach of confidence with any integrity. He should have been sacked for such a fundamental breach of Aaron Davey's privacy that was staggering and making appalling racist claims on Neeld.

The club is 150 years years worth of stories of thousands of peoples, the last six years (and my childhood in the 70's) is not enough to even remotely make me think of giving up. With my family connections to the club it is basically my tribe, a group I identify with and thankfully because its a sporting club stupid things like religion and race don't come into it. That said if the club became a plaything of some Russian ogliarch or Clive Palmer type [censored] then I would think the club had died. As much as I thank JoeG for his input I was glad when he withdrew from the club because I did not want to see my club used as a vehicle for a political agenda. I also see Free Agency as a serious threat to clubs like ours and remain very nervous about it. My two children have no choice and I have/will blackmail them at every turn - I was very proud when my six year old daughter (at the time), called a Penrith player a 'bumsniffer' after he ridiculed her for supporting the Dee's (she was living in the hostile territory of the Blue Mountains) and he had been canvassing the school room asking each child who they supported in the NRL. My son was signed up even before he was born and that was 2010 when we truly stank as a team.

Imagine the reaction on Demonland if Neeld got us to a prelim...

You'd offer a $350K player $750K because we can? To me that's madness. I want the club to get better too, but at what cost? Wellingham isn't an A grader, he's B. There comes a point where you have to manage your list with a semblance of logic and responsibility.

My fondest memory of Travis was when Matty Whelan polaxed James Hird and Trapper swooped on a loose ball then banged it from the Boundry 55m out Ponsford end. The roar from the crowd was spine tingling.

Any relation to Paul? It'll be a long hot summer for the Dees...

New expectations ? The only thing I'm interested in is a flag. If I knew I wouldn't see a flag I'd be gone today. It's all that matters. There's only ever been one Melbourne player I've loved and that was Flower. He was a beacon of light during dark times. I've liked plenty, but I'm only interested in lauding premiership players. Obviously they're hard to win and not everyone can reach that goal, but it's a non-negotiable standard. Without a flag they're nothing more than bit players. And they know it.

Thommo always said what he thought. His hatred of the AFL and Vlad were a bonus.

Those foot skills ohhhh my,

This coming from a team that has only had 2 top 10 draft picks since 2000. And we continue salivating at our next crop of top draft picks and still flounder at the bottom. Not just culture but organisation. We have been run by a bunch of F%$&wits for too long.

special time.

We are only looking for role players here jacey. And while I disagree that a 'Stiller-type' would be the 12th player on the list I have zero problem with the idea of replacing skinny kids who don't work hard enough with seasoned pros that will contribute to the professionalism of the club and not detract from it. I would say, considering the large role that a 24 year old 'deck chair' in Magner played this season - we will look again to older players ready to contribute.

I'm still struggling to find some decent nu-jazz. But Here's a couple of good jazz tracks I stumbled across. Jack Jack's Jazz 3.2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opqzFBs97wA&feature=plcp

I swear to Dog i wont call him any names.

I sometimes feel that things can't possibly be any worse for the club but then I read Bluey's posts and realise that apparently I'm wrong.

I don't think were a basket case at all, our finances are good, our coaching set up seems to be good, we have some good people there, we have several picks in the first 20 coming up in the next draft and we are clearing out the deadwood that has hung around our neck for years. Our supporter base is holding, despite our poor performance and we seem to have some resolve amongst the players to improve performance and win a flag. There will be natural improvement in the players we have and a few of our newer players have shown some good signs. If you can't see it then I guess all I can say is wait and see.

I started a Josh Walker Thread after watching some TAC games a couple of years ago, was surprised to see him go as a rookie. He was exactly what we needed but what do I know about footy.

I wasn't sold from highlight reels I had seen, but went on Sunday and saw him in the flesh and liked in fact no loved what I saw, the kid knows how to play, worked hard hit every contest hard and had a nice bit of mongrel & arrogance which was not over the Top

Like that time we tanked?

I can't support a player called Sharrod However we'll have to pay him at least 450 and I'm not sure he's worth that We'd lose pick 13 which would be fair. Why do people mention Martin, not even Sydney could turn him into a serviceable player

Goldsack and wellingham - pick 13 and martin, might be paying overs I think but 2 finals experienced young players!!

Ive had it passed also that Neeld is very keen on getting this Engine room up and firing in a major way from here on in. Dont know anyone that knwos Neeld per se..but 2nd hand via the FD. No real news in this other than he ( MN ) doesnt want to muck around or wait years and years for some noobie to come on . ( Thats not the thinking re Viney btw...Hes a Day1 guy )I suuppose it make sense that Neeld would go to the well he knows well, and that knows him, Jones, Viney and Wellingham + and + ..Suddenly weve gone up a few gears. Would change the dynamics of our play overnight And thats exactly what my whisper suggests is the goal. Not just to make it work....to make it fire !! Im not sure how many view our prosepcts for 2013, but if the FD can get even 50% of whom theyre targetting we will be a very very VERY different outfit in 2013. Not finalists perhaps, but very competitve if raw. ( until they get the hang of things ) Id be happy, and quite inpressed ( as was with the getting of Clark ) should we land Sharrod. This scenario ahs some semblance of reality , not for it coming from Ralph, but simply it makes sense.Its quite plausible