Melbourne vs Collingwood

[The Oracle 145]

One of my wishes for the Demons for season 2025, apart from the usual pot of gold at the end of the rainbow (ie the premiership flag) , is that we rub Collingwood’s noses in the dirt. 

Even though we’ve been an improved outfit in recent years, they’ve still managed to have the wood on us. They’ve beaten us in 10 of the last 12 outings including keeping us out of the final eight in 2017, beating us in our only meeting in our premiership year, knocking the stuffing out us (and ending Gus’ career) in their flag season  and humiliating us twice this year. On Kings Birthday they fixed up Tracc and in Round 25 we capitulated and lost Kozzy for next year’s opening three matches.

Overall, we’ve beaten them 85 times and lost 156 games to them with 5 drawn. We owe them more than one.

Both teams missed the finals in 2024 after finishing in the top four in the regular season, so both need to lift their performance in 2025.

The way I’m reading it, Collingwood is going for age and experience with an old list, their key recruit being a class player in Dan Houston but he’s in his late 20s. The Pies have the oldest list in the business and they had slim pickings in the draft.

Melbourne went more for youth and will go into 2025 with four solid first round picks from the past two years and a good sized cohort of Under 22 talent who were exposed to senior footy this year.

The question is whether their aging squad is better than our youngish group and can we bridge the gap we’ve seen and overtake them next year!

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,939]

Collingwood’s high octane, transition it from one end to the other with ease, is too much for us to counter.

Same applies against Fremantle and also would’ve applied against Hawthorn late last year had we run into them.

Not sure how we solve that, and Houston delivering the pill from defensive 50 isn’t going to make things any easier next year.

I also don’t think we handle the pro Collingwood crowd all that well, particularly away King Bday games as well as that 2023 final. They seem to handle the occasion far better.

Edited December 14 by Bring-Back-Powell

[Sir Why You Little 37,125]

85-156 is an appalling record 

We must inflict pain upon this obhorrent organisation for decades….

[640MD 3,429]

This thread at least has a good starting point,  some very relevant points,  quite apart from I hate the baaastards, 

Or how I want players X, Yand Z to thump said piece of pie excrement,

Does not need thumping (well not much). But no respect please.

A decent plan will allow us to finish over them.  

[Whispering_Jack 30,640]

Sure, that record doesn’t look good but we usually do them over in grand finals.

I look forward to us repeating the dose as soon as possible.

[Cranky Franky 2,091]

Goodwin is pretty clueless against the pies. They look like they know we will roll over. Its embarrassing.

[MT64 1,144]

12 hours ago, 640MD said:

This thread at least has a good starting point,  some very relevant points,  quite apart from I hate the baaastards, 

Or how I want players X, Yand Z to thump said piece of pie excrement,

Does not need thumping (well not much). But no respect please.

A decent plan will allow us to finish over them.  

Welcome back.

[John Demonic 5,850]

1 hour ago, Cranky Franky said:

Goodwin is pretty clueless against the pies. They look like they know we will roll over. Its embarrassing.

The Nathan Buckley farewell game was embarassing in 2021 but so what?? , iIt doesn't have to be the Dees that inflicts the fatal wounds on them to end their season. We won the flag and lost to them in the same season. No shame in that.

Would the Lions have won the flag if they ended up playing the red hot Hawks in the finals at the G last year with everything going right for them? Every bounce of the ball? The Lions have been the Hawks Tassie bunny's for a decade now. (Embarassing right?)

One matchup could be all it takes to ruin your flag hopes. And avoiding that matchup can help you go all the way!

 

Best not to think about the Pies too much. Let others sort them out. And if it comes to a final again. We'll be better prepared stylistically this year hopefully.

The way our fans make them the be all and end all is just as embarassing. It's an 18 club league. And to put it into perspective: we don't even rate in their top 5 rivalries by fan survey. From memory it was Carl, Ess, Geel, Richmond and Port

So QB are bigger blockbusters mainly to us Dees fans, but as the cliche goes, it's only worth 4 points at the end of the day. 

PS. Wish they'd stop giving us a double up in r23 though!!! Haha

Edited December 14 by John Demonic

[John Demonic 5,850]

13 hours ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

Collingwood’s high octane, transition it from one end to the other with ease, is too much for us to counter.

Same applies against Fremantle and also would’ve applied against Hawthorn late last year had we run into them.

Not sure how we solve that, and Houston delivering the pill from defensive 50 isn’t going to make things any easier next year.

I also don’t think we handle the pro Collingwood crowd all that well, particularly away King Bday games as well as that 2023 final. They seem to handle the occasion far better.

Those two words: 'Dan Houston' should be [Censored] on this board 

[640MD 3,429]

19 minutes ago, MT64 said:

Welcome back.

No no, Stil away, MT, hoping to see a couple of football games live, just not great, it will be second division ? Cheltenham town , Looking after a cat for 3 weeks, no I am not cheap but it's an experience,   back for the practice matches,

Reading "Land" is keeping me insane, and my feet on the ground,

Edited December 14 by 640MD

[Gator 17,449]

1 hour ago, Whispering_Jack said:

Sure, that record doesn’t look good but we usually do them over in grand finals.

I look forward to us repeating the dose as soon as possible.

Yep, 6 premierships from 7 grand finals is a sound record when it matters most.

[D4Life 2,517]

What rankles for me is the cheap shots the Pies take and we do nothing about it!

Look at the final in 2023, Cox tried to take out Max at first ruck contest, Maynard tried to take out someone on back flank missed them, five mins later finished Brayshaws career! Cox tried to roll over another players leg, could have broken it!

They are the filth for a reason, I want to see our players bury them as a 23, smash them in tackles, if they take a cheap shot, pay it back double. At some point enough is enough!

Aside from being tougher/harder against the Pies, when you reflect on 2021, May, Salem, Hibberd tackled/bumped fiercely and the Demons need to find that fierceness again!

Edited December 15 by D4Life
Extra point

[Jibroni 5,009]

20 hours ago, The Oracle said:

Overall, we’ve beaten them 85 times and lost 156 games to them with 5 drawn. We owe them more than one.

 

30 years of mediocrity does not help.

Edited December 15 by Jibroni

[Cranky Franky 2,091]

The last few years against Collingwood have been so humiliating that I now refuse to go until something changes.

[bush demon 2,062]

6 hours ago, Gator said:

Yep, 6 premierships from 7 grand finals is a sound record when it matters most.

Have we won abt 14 from 16 in finals since the war?

[Dr. Gonzo 24,289]

On 14/12/2024 at 19:13, Bring-Back-Powell said:

Collingwood’s high octane, transition it from one end to the other with ease, is too much for us to counter.

Same applies against Fremantle and also would’ve applied against Hawthorn late last year had we run into them.

Not sure how we solve that, and Houston delivering the pill from defensive 50 isn’t going to make things any easier next year.

I also don’t think we handle the pro Collingwood crowd all that well, particularly away King Bday games as well as that 2023 final. They seem to handle the occasion far better.

We stifled them in the KB game in 2023. They had nothing all day and we really should have been well up despite then almost running over us at the end, the issue is we never take our opportunities against them. Hit them hard and put the scoreboard pressure on and we'll be fine.

[layzie 33,991]

Would be nice to get a win over them for a change. 

[Roost it far 8,581]

On 15/12/2024 at 08:25, John Demonic said:

The Nathan Buckley farewell game was embarassing in 2021 but so what?? , iIt doesn't have to be the Dees that inflicts the fatal wounds on them to end their season. We won the flag and lost to them in the same season. No shame in that.

Would the Lions have won the flag if they ended up playing the red hot Hawks in the finals at the G last year with everything going right for them? Every bounce of the ball? The Lions have been the Hawks Tassie bunny's for a decade now. (Embarassing right?)

One matchup could be all it takes to ruin your flag hopes. And avoiding that matchup can help you go all the way!

 

Best not to think about the Pies too much. Let others sort them out. And if it comes to a final again. We'll be better prepared stylistically this year hopefully.

The way our fans make them the be all and end all is just as embarassing. It's an 18 club league. And to put it into perspective: we don't even rate in their top 5 rivalries by fan survey. From memory it was Carl, Ess, Geel, Richmond and Port

So QB are bigger blockbusters mainly to us Dees fans, but as the cliche goes, it's only worth 4 points at the end of the day. 

PS. Wish they'd stop giving us a double up in r23 though!!! Haha

Rubbish, the Pies are to be despised and beaten. We are currently unable to do that although the 23 QF was very unlucky

[Whispering_Jack 30,640]

I'd be keen to turn the tables on the Dockers when we play them this year. Our performances against them were abysmal this year including the Alice Springs game when we had most of our team intact.

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,939]

12 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

We stifled them in the KB game in 2023. They had nothing all day and we really should have been well up despite then almost running over us at the end, the issue is we never take our opportunities against them. Hit them hard and put the scoreboard pressure on and we'll be fine.

That was definitely one of our more exciting wins of recent years and Nick Daicos putting them 5 points down with 20 seconds left was a complete false economy when factoring in our dominance of the second half. Exactly what you said - "not taking our opportunities"

Our crowd was really up for that one and it felt as though we made just as much noise as them. In fact it felt as the whole club set themselves for that one after losing to the Pies 3 times in 2021 and 2022.

I also thought the Pies were a bit flat for that game and didn't come out with the zest they usually show against us (2023 Qual final as exhibit A). The Daicos boys had or were recovering from the flu, De Goey just got rubbed out, no McStay and they also looked lacklustre the week before against West Coast in Perth.

 

 

[John Demonic 5,850]

11 hours ago, Roost it far said:

Rubbish, the Pies are to be despised and beaten. We are currently unable to do that although the 23 QF was very unlucky

How we play against Collingwood is only important in relation to the 8 points that make up how we finish on the ladder. Spend any more time than the 2 weeks of opposition analysis on them, then we will simply be beaten by other clubs instead. They're one of 16 other clubs we have to worry about. They didn't win the flag, they're not the team to beat.

 

Edited December 16 by John Demonic

[Ethan Tremblay 30,966]

The only thing I know for certain is that Nick Daicos will get the three Brownlow votes (even if he doesn’t play). 

[Dr. Gonzo 24,289]

50 minutes ago, John Demonic said:

How we play against Collingwood is only important in relation to the 8 points that make up how we finish on the ladder. Spend any more time than the 2 weeks of opposition analysis on them, then we will simply be beaten by other clubs instead. They're one of 16 other clubs we have to worry about. They didn't win the flag, they're not the team to beat.

 

Nah sometimes you have to make a stand as a club and say "we won't be bullied anymore". Like Hawks did in the line in the sand match - not saying we need to go knocking people out but just playing with physicality and ruthlessness.

[John Demonic 5,850]

36 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Nah sometimes you have to make a stand as a club and say "we won't be bullied anymore". Like Hawks did in the line in the sand match - not saying we need to go knocking people out but just playing with physicality and ruthlessness.

Shouldn't we be doing that every game?  You team mate is physical and ruthless and you pat him on the back after every stoppage for that effort.

The ship has sailed. The players from both clubs are all mates, hell our potential captain in waiting last year wanted to join them, even after their captain put him in hospital. I can understand our fans frustrations and anger and lust for blood, but I just don't see it in the players having a particular hunger for that with Collingwood, it will be a distraction if we make it one.

I'm reiterating it, let's have the same physicality and ruthlessness against every club. Particularly in the FIRST QTR/HALF of every round, so we can demoralize our opponents and have them playing catchup/junktime for the rest. The rest will work itself out against any club, not just the Pies.

The Lions are the real enemies this year. The plan to beat them is the one we should be putting a smidgen more tactical emphasis on in training, if anything.

Edited Monday at 11:55 by John Demonic

[Dr. Gonzo 24,289]

50 minutes ago, John Demonic said:

Shouldn't we be doing that every game?  You team mate is physical and ruthless and you pat him on the back after every stoppage for that effort.

The ship has sailed. The players from both clubs are all mates, hell our potential captain in waiting last year wanted to join them, even after their captain put him in hospital. I can understand our fans frustrations and anger and lust for blood, but I just don't see it in the players having a particular hunger for that with Collingwood, it will be a distraction if we make it one.

I'm reiterating it, let's have the same physicality and ruthlessness against every club. Particularly in the FIRST QTR/HALF of every round, so we can demoralize our opponents and have them playing catchup/junktime for the rest. The rest will work itself out against any club, not just the Pies.

The Lions are the real enemies this year. The plan to beat them is the one we should be putting a smidgen more tactical emphasis on in training, if anything.

On one hand you are right but when you have been one clubs bunnies for 25 years you need to make a point of making a stand against that club in particular. The rest will flow, you can't be physical and ruthless in every game if you can't do it in one game.