PRESEASON TRAINING: Wednesday 11 December 2024

[bing181 9,328]

19 minutes ago, demon3165 said:

This is going to take time as they are going from a completely different game plan that has been instilled into them for years to a skilled based running gameplan

I don't know that it'll be completely different. Time will tell, will probably have to wait for matches to start.

What I've taken from training reports is that there seems to be more clarity about the game plan, about what's expected, and what people's roles are. With that comes more intent and better application.

Feels like we lost our way a bit with all that last season - though equally, having key playmakers out/compromised through injury, plus paying a lot of kids, can't have helped.

[monoccular 17,573]

4 hours ago, DistrACTION Jackson said:

Have heard there was someone hiding in the bushes taking photos of Jefferson

 

3 hours ago, Rab D Nesbitt said:

Hopefully that's all he was doing. 😬

Maybe he was counting, encountering, or countering 🐍

[demon3165 2,801]

21 minutes ago, bing181 said:

I don't know that it'll be completely different. Time will tell, will probably have to wait for matches to start.

What I've taken from training reports is that there seems to be more clarity about the game plan, about what's expected, and what people's roles are. With that comes more intent and better application.

Feels like we lost our way a bit with all that last season - though equally, having key playmakers out/compromised through injury, plus paying a lot of kids, can't have helped.

If it's not different it's going to be a difficult season then, teams are now trying to be more attacking with dare and run, down the line football is past it's use by date.

[BAMF 4,385]

10 hours ago, Demonland said:

 

[bing181 9,328]

47 minutes ago, demon3165 said:

If it's not different it's going to be a difficult season then, teams are now trying to be more attacking with dare and run, down the line football is past it's use by date.

I don't question that it's going to be different. Just moving Windsor back will make it different by giving us more drive from the backline. No doubt there are other changes in the works.

What I question though is whether it's going to be some kind of scorched earth, start from zero different.

[58er 6,548]

4 hours ago, bing181 said:

I don't know that it'll be completely different. Time will tell, will probably have to wait for matches to start.

What I've taken from training reports is that there seems to be more clarity about the game plan, about what's expected, and what people's roles are. With that comes more intent and better application.

Feels like we lost our way a bit with all that last season - though equally, having key playmakers out/compromised through injury, plus paying a lot of kids, can't have helped.

The very fact that injuries and kids have been the cards we had to deal with last year are the same reason that I am so  bullish about 2025. 

After a tumultuous end of 2024 and pre off season with so much happening the “crisis” we had to have ( largely create d by journalistic sections of the AFL press, HeraldSun and Channel9 Footy Classified) the Club has emerged in a very fortuitous position.

Finishing 14th ( about a win and 2% away from 10th) has enabled a draft pick position of 5 plus a creative prior pick for no. 9 has gifted 2 elite young ball getters with style and skills for the big time to blend with the older refreshed champs and solid good supports plus a dozen 19 to 23 year old very promising youngsters all in early stages  of the years of their AFL careers help  the blend to my eye that is captivating and hopefully we now play a brand of footy that inspires this combination to scale the dizzy Flag heights of the 2021 heroes with fast fearless and brave standards to match. 

Off field changes in personnel in Board and Coaching, settlement of club matters, and the promise of a new Committee approach with new life and direction are enticing for our future.

Recent Progress in our Training and Administration development also has put a spring into Club steps after a long period of possibilities being dust binned for various reasons.

While results ultimately determine progress and success the ground work now being laid is a great response in 3 months lead by interim President Brad Green and the existing Board.

There is no doubt some AFL experts and even some of our own fans are writing us off the Top 4 and Premiership contenders list when you analyse  seriously there is no reason believe our window has ended. Fortune with injuries and a very comfortable looking fixture will play a part if our dreams are to be realised.

I get the feeling we are all reunited and that all feel that there is a great opportunity yo bounce back while we have an exciting and new list of unknown potential. Youth in the early 50’s led our revival and I can’t wait for 2025 to test our tyros and hardened elders in the season upcoming.

Check the current odds we are now at and if you are a betting person place a lazy $50 or $100 strategically on some success next year. 

Good Luck and Go Dees. 

[John Demonic 5,850]

If we can win another flag, while clubs like the Dogs, Lions, Suns & Pies have raided the last 5 years highest ranked draftees... Then it will be a monumental effort and would probably supercede  the drought breaking flag (Even leaving aside the venue topic)

Everything has been and is against us.

Probably a pretty uncontroversial  opinion 

Go Dees!!

Edited December 11 by John Demonic

[Ungarieboy 443]

Perhaps the turnovers at training  is a positive, reflecting our ability to generate turnovers!!!!!!

This too needs to be planned, trained and practiced.

[demon3165 2,801]

7 hours ago, bing181 said:

I don't question that it's going to be different. Just moving Windsor back will make it different by giving us more drive from the backline. No doubt there are other changes in the works.

What I question though is whether it's going to be some kind of scorched earth, start from zero different.

It won't be scorched earth as you say you will still have to win the ball but it's the mentally side of things that will change that will dictate the gameplan, tying Windsor off the backline is one thing at practice and maybe he's training with the backline to learn the defensive side of the game and learning how they are being set-up under Bassett guess we will have to wait and see.

[Webber 10,538]

The idea of Windsor off half-back seems totally logical to me. With a bigger tank, and more physical maturity and experience (to defend), why wouldn’t we (like Judd McVee) put him somewhere where he can generate attacking play earlier? Wing is essentially a link role, half back is a generator role, and we need that, with speed. I expect his kilometres covered to increase this season, and halfback will allow that - colour me excited.

[chook fowler 19,525]

14 hours ago, DistrACTION Jackson said:

Have heard there was someone hiding in the bushes taking photos of Jefferson

no he was hiding behind a picket fence.

[Roost it far 8,577]

Those expecting a new game plan are likely to be disappointed. I’d say we’ll tweak it but I can’t see wholesale changes. 

[DistrACTION Jackson 9,218]

11 minutes ago, Roost it far said:

Those expecting a new game plan are likely to be disappointed. I’d say we’ll tweak it but I can’t see wholesale changes. 

I think it’s more about using the personnel we have better. We need to be using Bowey, Windsor, McVee, Salem, Langford and Lindsay (when he plays) as much as we can linking up and delivering inside 50. Clarry, Vines, Sparrow and Trac are all great ball winners but not as great on the ball use. They need to be getting it into these guys hands.

[Slartibartfast 17,569]

11 hours ago, kev martin said:

I think Howes and Adam are on the edge of experiencing the blues. Expectations, uncertainty, knowledge of what it takes, living up to that, and the associated anxiety.

Adams (though hasn't had a game at AFL level) looks great at times, powerful and confident, expressing leadership qualities and then he has drops in confidence.

Howes has regularly been having errors of handling and disposal in sims and drills. He is moving very smoothly and getting opportunities with the ball. I wonder, what is going on?

Hope, as you say the coaches get around them and are clear in explaining roles and what they need to work on.

Interesting observations Kev, on Howes particularly I’ve not seen it that way. I’ve seen all players make disposal mistakes and Howes hasn’t stood out to me but I’ll keep an eye on it on Friday. Adam’s is a slow burn I reckon and is just starting to believe. IMO he’s much improved ( more involved) than last year, whether he can improve enough is yet to be seen but he’s taking steps in the right direction. 

[binman 43,723]

34 minutes ago, Roost it far said:

Those expecting a new game plan are likely to be disappointed. I’d say we’ll tweak it but I can’t see wholesale changes. 9

Totally agree.

I find the talk of a new game plan confusing.

To be fair, it's been kick started by Brad Green's email where he said we would be adopting a new game plan.

But what seems to have forgotten is we were trying to implement a new game last year, one that had elements of the pies 2023 method involving fast transition from the back half and a high defensive press.

Last season's method was completely different to previous years, which was all about predictability, long kicks down the line to Max or another tall, deep zone defence, control the tempo etc etc.

We just didn't have the cattle (too many of our best 22 missed too many games), right players (short a couple of elite kicks), or fitness, to effectively implement it.

And even if we did it was always going to take time to retool the very systems based games plan we had drilled into the team since tge 2019 season.

We got opened up by other teams in large part because we were trying to implement a more aggressive transition method but constantly turned the ball over.

And by doing so exposed what used to be our greatest strength - our zone defence. So often they were caught out of position after a turnover, which is understandable given the structures were different and they often pressed up higher than they used to.

And our poor fitness meant we were often exposed defensively by teams employing the pies transition method (basically all teams to a greater or lesser degree) because we couldn't 'defend the ground' on transition or turnover.

It's worth noting in that context that for much the same reasons, Collingwood struggled to effectively implement the transition game plan they developed. And missed the finals as a result.

So, I'm in total agreement - there'll be tweaks (eg Windsor to half back to generate transition) but not wholesale changes.

I see last season as very similar to 2019 where we took the opportunity of a likely down year as a result of injury and  sub optimal preseason to retool our method and reset (not to mention, bottom out and grab some high draft picks).

Edited December 11 by binman

[rpfc 28,758]

14 hours ago, kev martin said:

I think Howes and Adam are on the edge of experiencing the blues. Expectations, uncertainty, knowledge of what it takes, living up to that, and the associated anxiety.

Adams (though hasn't had a game at AFL level) looks great at times, powerful and confident, expressing leadership qualities and then he has drops in confidence.

Howes has regularly been having errors of handling and disposal in sims and drills. He is moving very smoothly and getting opportunities with the ball. I wonder, what is going on?

Hope, as you say the coaches get around them and are clear in explaining roles and what they need to work on.

They aren’t really candidates because they haven’t had good first years. Shame they are still struggling.
 

Caleb is different and was immense on the wing but will have a lot of attention paid to him and getting ahead of a possible form drop might be what the FD is thinking about putting him behind the footy.

[58er 6,548]

4 hours ago, demon3165 said:

It won't be scorched earth as you say you will still have to win the ball but it's the mentally side of things that will change that will dictate the gameplan, tying Windsor off the backline is one thing at practice and maybe he's training with the backline to learn the defensive side of the game and learning how they are being set-up under Bassett guess we will have to wait and see.

As I have posted numerous times I believe the Duke should be moved to the centre where he will have maximum effect on our footy in aggression and using the centre corridor.

He reminds me of Chad Warner the way he plays and I believe if at centre he could easily kick 15/20 goals next season. He would put the fear of all opponents from the circle and be more in play than on a flank of ring. 

I applaud Jim being tried on HBF hopefully only for defensive training and are hoping Goody reads us or one of the D/L ers suggests nicely to try him there in a practice game.

It’s  no brainer to me and I like it that Bowser may play on a wing also. Lindsay is another centre or winger of the future or early on in his career. 

[58er 6,548]

Just now, 58er said:

As I have posted numerous times I believe the Duke should be moved to the centre where he will have maximum effect on our footy in aggression and using the centre corridor.

He reminds me of Chad Warner the way he plays and I believe if at centre he could easily kick 15/20 goals next season. He would put the fear of all opponents from the circle and be more in play than on a flank of ring. 

I applaud Jim being tried on HBF hopefully only for defensive training and are hoping Goody reads us or one of the D/L ers suggests nicely to try him there in a practice game.

It’s  no brainer to me and I like it that Bowser may play on a wing also. Lindsay is another centre or winger of the future or early on in his career. 

Or wing sorry 

[binman 43,723]

9 minutes ago, 58er said:

As I have posted numerous times I believe the Duke should be moved to the centre where he will have maximum effect on our footy in aggression and using the centre corridor.

He reminds me of Chad Warner the way he plays and I believe if at centre he could easily kick 15/20 goals next season. He would put the fear of all opponents from the circle and be more in play than on a flank of ring. 

I applaud Jim being tried on HBF hopefully only for defensive training and are hoping Goody reads us or one of the D/L ers suggests nicely to try him there in a practice game.

It’s  no brainer to me and I like it that Bowser may play on a wing also. Lindsay is another centre or winger of the future or early on in his career. 

What position are referring to when you suggest Windsor should be 'moved to the centre'?

There hasn't been a specialist centre position, or ruck rover for that matter, since the late 70s, early 80s.

Since then, anyone starting in the middle at centre bounces are just midfielders.

Is that what you mean - Windsor should be a mid?

Edited December 12 by binman

[BKKBooga 21]

Off topic slightly, I was impressed by the videos that the club posted on pre season camp.  Thing that stood out for me was leadership of lesser knowns, our new backup Ruckman as an example. 

Trent Rivers also was a standout. 

[58er 6,548]

7 hours ago, binman said:

What position are referring to when you suggest Windsor should be 'moved to the centre'?

There hasn't been a specialist centre position, or ruck rover for that matter, since the late 70s, early 80s.

Since then, anyone starting in the middle at centre bounces are just midfielders.

Is that what you mean - Windsor should be a mid?

TheDuke should be our centre man and not on the ball but in the centre at bounces or if he changes it should be on the HFF and then go back into that position in the spine where we can more safely own the corridor.

seriously he will kick 20 goals next season and be a ball magnet in the middle. In time yes he would change on some occasions with an on baller but not so much in his first season. He will have the tank as he is a natural runner. 

Bowey or Lindsay could go on a wing and of course Lingers has his Warne Stand side all sorted.

 

[binman 43,723]

17 minutes ago, 58er said:

TheDuke should be our centre man and not on the ball but in the centre at bounces or if he changes it should be on the HFF and then go back into that position in the spine where we can more safely own the corridor.

seriously he will kick 20 goals next season and be a ball magnet in the middle. In time yes he would change on some occasions with an on baller but not so much in his first season. He will have the tank as he is a natural runner. 

Bowey or Lindsay could go on a wing and of course Lingers has his Warne Stand side all sorted.

 

Um, so you think he should be a mid that rotates through the midfield and HFF.

Why do I say that?

BECAUSE THERE'S NO SUCH THING AS A #@%%^&@!#####!%^ING CENTRE MAN!!!!!.

Apologies, I'll calm down now.

Carry on.

[dazzledavey36 55,316]

23 minutes ago, 58er said:

TheDuke should be our centre man and not on the ball but in the centre at bounces or if he changes it should be on the HFF and then go back into that position in the spine where we can more safely own the corridor.

seriously he will kick 20 goals next season and be a ball magnet in the middle. In time yes he would change on some occasions with an on baller but not so much in his first season. He will have the tank as he is a natural runner. 

Bowey or Lindsay could go on a wing and of course Lingers has his Warne Stand side all sorted.

 

[Roost it far 8,577]

52 minutes ago, 58er said:

TheDuke should be our centre man and not on the ball but in the centre at bounces or if he changes it should be on the HFF and then go back into that position in the spine where we can more safely own the corridor.

seriously he will kick 20 goals next season and be a ball magnet in the middle. In time yes he would change on some occasions with an on baller but not so much in his first season. He will have the tank as he is a natural runner. 

Bowey or Lindsay could go on a wing and of course Lingers has his Warne Stand side all sorted.

 

When I watch him play, look at his speed, size, solid kick, fierce competitor all I see is a HBF/wingman. I think the club knows this as well

[Ollie fan 3,468]

11 minutes ago, Roost it far said:

When I watch him play, look at his speed, size, solid kick, fierce competitor all I see is a HBF/wingman. I think the club knows this as well

Everyone says he is reminiscent of Robbie Flower. Robbie was never an "inside mid" (not that that term was used in those days).