Christian Petracca

[biggestred 5,015]

2 minutes ago, KozzyCan said:

Yes, I read it the first time it was posted.

I don't know, maybe they do, maybe they don't. It's not like the AFL haven't covered their [censored] in the past over stuff like this. Obviously there are still aggrieved parties who feel they have been wronged. We should be taking this very seriously.

Apologies, I didn't realise it had already been posted.

Agree we have to take it seriously. But the answer to the aflpa is this: None of them or us or anyone, including CP, knows better than the doctors.

[Demonsone 2,035]

1 hour ago, Grapeviney said:

From the Herald Sun's Jon Ralph: Melbourne Demons in the clear over handling of Petracca injury on King’s Birthday

Melbourne’s treatment of Christian Petracca’s MCG injury was given a tick of approval by multiple reviews conducted by the AFL and the AFL Doctors’ Association, despite his anger at the club’s treatment of his King’s Birthday accident. 

The reviews found that while it was regrettable Petracca had been put back on the ground, the actual processes put in place by Melbourne’s doctors had not been flawed.

The Demons used the AFL’s emergency clinician at the MCG for a second opinion, with the review finding even initial consultation in hospital was unable to diagnose his spleen concern.

It comes with confusion among AFL fans about whether players are able to return to the field while carrying rib injuries after the Petracca incident.

The Demons champion was so ill upon his return to the ground even Collingwood players asked him if he should be on the field, with the 28-year-old nearly dying with a lacerated spleen and four broken ribs.

AFL Doctors Association boss and Gold Coast club doctor Barry Rigby is also an intensive care doctor.

He runs the yearly briefing over rib and internal injuries for AFL and AFLW doctors so they can better diagnose broken ribs or internal trauma.

He said on Monday it was almost impossible for club doctors to diagnose whether ribs were bruised or broken without a complex CT scan, with even MRI scans or a simple chest X-ray often not detailed enough.

Rigby said the AFL was satisfied with the current procedures for caring with patients with rib damage.

“The priority is clinical assessment but it can be quite difficult with blunt force chest trauma. You can have significant pain, but you might not have fractured a rib,” he said.

“Chest X-rays are often not that good at picking up chest fractures, and they can miss a small pneumothorax, which is a contusion which causes air to escape from the lungs.

“To do a CT scan, which continues a significant amount of radiation, for every player who has a bump to the chest, isn’t a practical approach to the problem. It gets back to the clinical assessment for club doctors and it can be very difficult.

“We need to be careful we don’t change the whole landscape which is working pretty well for 99 per cent of the issues. Safety is always our top priority. There is good support from an emergency physician who sits behind the bench if we need assistance,” he said.

Rigby has run his emergency care course on assessing players with potential torso chest or abdominal trauma for over five seasons at AFL level.

He says the general rule is that if a doctor suspects a player has broken his rib he will not be allowed to return to the field

“We have looked at Christian’s circumstances closely and done a constructive critique on what did or didn’t happen. Hindsight is a wonderful gift in some respects. But there was an adequate assessment done. The decision in retrospect (for him to return to the ground) was the wrong one, but we don’t want to criticise the process,” he said.

“There was a review done by the AFL and (chief medical officer) Michael Makdissi. The doctors collectively reviewed the whole situation as well. In our professional life we are always reviewing for things we can do better. 

“All of those boxes were ticked, the process was followed. The emergency physician was involved. The club doctor and hospital were involved. Even in hospital the (damage) wasn’t clear and obvious in the early stages. So I don’t think changing processes would have got us a different outcome.”

“There are hundreds of games played every year and the number of people who end up in hospital with rib fractures, you could count on one hand.”

Caroline Wilson begs to differ and is obsessed in throwing the club under the bus at any occasion 

[KozzyCan 764]

4 minutes ago, biggestred said:

Apologies, I didn't realise it had already been posted.

Agree we have to take it seriously. But the answer to the aflpa is this: None of them or us or anyone, including CP, knows better than the doctors.

Doctors aren't a monolith though and they won't agree on everything. Doctors working in a high performance sport environment are going to approach injuries differently than a doctor in another environment might. I think the AFLPA are investigating it because they are concerned that either the correct processes weren't followed or the processes followed aren't correct.

[adonski 11,813]

Trac desperate to play with Houston one way or another!?

[waynewussell 5,337]

How emphatic does the medical data have to be before the puffed-up media pretenders draw a line through this concoction about the club & club personal being shoddy?

Edited September 9 by waynewussell

[Palace Dees 2,275]

Not the solution to this and similar scenarios that have occurred (albeit, less life threatening) but I would like to see 2 things happen.

1.  Just have 5 on the bench.  Don't put the pressure on medical staff and coaches to make a sub call.

2.  We have a HIA test that requires players to be assessed off ground and not returned for a defined period.   Why don't we have the same for suspected internal injuries?  Player safety has to be paramount.

Edited September 9 by Palace Dees
spelling

[Sir Windsor 219]

Still nothing on the Pies connecting all of the failed season, CEO allegations, Players wanting out, departing FD boss. [censored] the club do a number on the media. 

[Sir Windsor 219]

Footy Classified Segment 1. Trac AFLPA investigation, MFC failed Trac, segment 2. Butters soft by deciding to sub off with sore ribs. 
 

You cannot make this [censored] up. 

[waynewussell 5,337]

Just now, Sir Windsor said:

Footy Classified Segment 1. Trac AFLPA investigation, MFC failed Trac, segment 2. Butters soft by deciding to sub off with sore ribs. 
 

You cannot make this [censored] up. 

This highlights the hypocrisy and feigned outrage that shows like Footy Classified rely on to maintain the ratings! 

[DiscoStu17 724]

6 hours ago, daisycutter said:

when are you going to do the demonland numbers?

Hopefully mainly MFC on here, but sometimes I’m a little uncertain.

[Fat Tony 5,220]

The sooner Christian and his family realise that HE is responsible for going back onto the ground, the sooner he will be able to move on. It was obviously the wrong decision (and I thought he should been taken come off because he was not going in for the ball in the second quarter) but the blame game is ridiculous. These things happen when you play contact sports.

[Older demon 2,741]

Caro is on the wrong line here. She and the AFLPA think they know more than some of the most highly credentialled trauma doctors in the business. Never let the truth get in the way of a good story. Don't they believe the reports saying he got the best of care?

What are the terrible stories emerging and where did they come from? I read the report and have no reason to doubt it. The closest hospital to the MCG is Epworth a highly reputable hospital and an AFL footballer gets immediate service to a private hospital. He is cared for and only later when his Haemoglobin levels drop they suspect internal bleeding.

The Alfred Trauma centre and the Royal Melbourne are the only level 1 Trauma services in the state.  Once the Epworth have him in their care he is no longer under the care of the MFC medical team. Just as when he is transferred from Epworth to the Alfred because his condition deteriorates having suffered the same a blunt force trauma a car accident victim endures. Again just down the road and given the very best medical care available. 

I worked at the Alfred for a long time in a support area for the Trauma service I trust their medical opinion over Carolines horror stories whispered to her. Trauma management isn't for the faint-hearted.  A naive public may be shocked as they have no experience of what goes on behind the scenes. Everything that has been written publicly sounds textbook. Once the bleeding spleen was discovered it was acted on immediately and procedures to stem the bleeding were successful and his spleen saved. I wish journos would stick to writing facts and leave the innuendo and opinion to gossip columnists

Maybe it was a shock to Trac and his family and their expectation unrealistic with how it was handled. But he got the very best medical care available

[Sir Why You Little 36,971]

1 hour ago, Sir Windsor said:

Its actually not that simple. The Social media approach needs to be an extension of the marketing / brand strategy. 

Bottom line is our club, whilst thriving with history and tradition, doesn't appeal to the average working class Joe. We are still the Old Melbourne club, that loves to ski at Hotham / Buller with our cheese platters, driving our German 4WD. It is soo cliched, but we have done zilch to rid ourselves of this.  

We need a mastermind to turn the ship, one that can reinvent the club's image and bring in a new wave of supporters. Premierships help, but as we have all seen, they are but a blip on the membership radar and supporters can fall away just as quick as they can accumulate. 

 

If GW$ can sort it out, there’s no reason why we cannot. Just need some clever young kids to drive it 

[bing181 9,193]

10 minutes ago, KozzyCan said:

the AFLPA are investigating it because they are concerned that either the correct processes weren't followed or the processes followed aren't correct.

Suspect more the latter. Might lead to stricter rules around rib injuries, as much as anything because they can be so hard to diagnose on the spot.

[Older demon 2,741]

16 minutes ago, Palace Dees said:

Not the solution to this and similar scenarios that have occurred (albeit, less life threatening) but I would like to see 2 things happen.

1.  Just have 5 on the bench.  Don't put the pressure on medical staff and coaches to make a sub call.

2.  We have a HIA test that requires players to be assessed off ground and not returned for a defined period.   Why don't we have the same for suspected internal injuries?  Player safety has to be paramount.

The AFL report addresses the issue of suspected internal injuries

"

AFL Doctors Association boss and Gold Coast club doctor Barry Rigby is also an intensive care doctor.

He runs the yearly briefing over rib and internal injuries for AFL and AFLW doctors so they can better diagnose broken ribs or internal trauma.

He said on Monday it was almost impossible for club doctors to diagnose whether ribs were bruised or broken without a complex CT scan, with even MRI scans or a simple chest X-ray often not detailed enough.

Rigby said the AFL was satisfied with the current procedures for caring with patients with rib damage.

“The priority is clinical assessment but it can be quite difficult with blunt force chest trauma. You can have significant pain, but you might not have fractured a rib,” he said.

“Chest X-rays are often not that good at picking up chest fractures, and they can miss a small pneumothorax, which is a contusion which causes air to escape from the lungs.

“To do a CT scan, which continues a significant amount of radiation, for every player who has a bump to the chest, isn’t a practical approach to the problem. It gets back to the clinical assessment for club doctors and it can be very difficult.

Clinical assessment is still the best way. There is a duty of care not to bombard players with unnecessary X-rays, that could lead to another can of worms in later years in players developing cancers.

Not to mention having a CT scanner at every AFL venue with support staff just in case will come at a significant cost. As for pain relief in the photo with Trac heading off to the hospital I thought I saw him with the magic green stick which provides instant pain relief.

A fair comparison is with Steven May who broke ribs against the Dogs. He didn't come off immediately, eventually was subbed off and taken to hospital. Thankfully there was no internal damage.

[Docs Demons 1,785]

32 minutes ago, Demonsone said:

Caroline Wilson begs to differ and is obsessed in throwing the club under the bus at any occasion 

Well she should look at her own club. Think they finished last caro!

[Jaded No More 68,867]

30 minutes ago, KozzyCan said:

Doctors aren't a monolith though and they won't agree on everything. Doctors working in a high performance sport environment are going to approach injuries differently than a doctor in another environment might. I think the AFLPA are investigating it because they are concerned that either the correct processes weren't followed or the processes followed aren't correct.

The AFLPA can take it up with the AFL to change their procedures. 
It has nothing to do with the club. We followed the right protocols. End of story. 
And if Trac wants to continue to find ways to damage the club, he needs to think long and hard about what it’s going to do to his career. 

[YesitwasaWin4theAges 6,685]

Bring back Dee TV.

[Redleg 40,834]

4 minutes ago, Jaded No More said:

The AFLPA can take it up with the AFL to change their procedures. 
It has nothing to do with the club. We followed the right protocols. End of story. 
And if Trac wants to continue to find ways to damage the club, he needs to think long and hard about what it’s going to do to his career. 

In fact the AFL doctor at the ground was also involved and a later review has cleared both doctors and found they acted appropriately.

 

[KozzyCan 764]

10 minutes ago, bing181 said:

Suspect more the latter. Might lead to stricter rules around rib injuries, as much as anything because they can be so hard to diagnose on the spot.

This is my gut feel. Wilson's report felt a bit scattergun tbh. You have the initial misdiagnosis and the decision to go back on the ground but then you have stuff like the three ambulances and the paramedics taking him to the Epworth instead of the Alfred. Feels like a reach to put that on the club or the AFL.

[rpfc 28,262]

Even Caro was unsure where this would lead if anywhere and I think it was just another opportunity offered to CP to talk through his issues and the family to lodge their misgivings once again. 

The AFLPA should take a look as their prerogative but can Marsh have people with half an idea so when he goes on leave the world doesn’t stop at the AFLPA. Maybe Geoff should review that too.

[DemonWA 3,929]

Meh. Smacks of a slow news day for an outlet that was planning to run with 6 weeks of petracca headlines

[Jaded No More 68,867]

The amount of players who have returned to play following a HEAD KNOCK, goes completely unnoticed yet this is news? Because Kozzie got suspended for 3 weeks for apparently concussing Moore, who somehow played 10 whole minutes following said head knock without a single assessment. How curious this didn’t make any news at all. 

Either install MRI machines at all AFL venues, or rule all players with rib pain out of games. Do not come after us because we are an easy target. Multiple doctors misdiagnosed him. Including in a hospital setting. But somehow it’s a story because the MFC is the punching bag of the media, and apparently of the Petracca brand too. 

[Brownie 5,969]

4 hours ago, Jaded No More said:

Hamish Blake is another prominent Melbourne man who has a big profile, and two of the Sushi Mango trio who are massive on social media. 

Not to mention that our president’s partner is a news presenter for channel 10. 

If we can’t leverage some of these connections to build a platform then we’ve failed. 

What's "channel 10" ?

[John Crow Batty 8,861]

AFLPA trying to open up a pathway to get Petracca out of the club and to elsewhere?  I could see a grievance case coming on. Which will be settled out of court so to speak in Petracca’s favour. 

Edited September 9 by John Crow Batty