POSTGAME: QF vs Sydney

[von 1,559]

2 hours ago, Graeme Yeats' Mullet said:

Is that confirmed 

From where I was sitting there was a long hold by Petty of the jumper, plenty of appealing for 50m and I thought one of the other umpires called that and the controlling umpire paid the 50m after getting told over radio

If that’s the case buddy should have been done three or four times for holding someone up like that.

[von 1,559]

With the injury news coming out this morning it makes a bit more sense why we didn’t have the drive/energy you expect in a big game. Not surprised that injuries could finally put an end to this season. It’s just been a bit like that this year. Haven’t been able to get going because of it. List health is the most important stat in football after all. 

[Mr Steve 3,820]

Gee life can be tough.

https://twitter.com/flagdees/status/1565883418369732608?s=20&t=qthaqVOlcu7XJ8tiZvJuKQ

[Gawndy the Great 9,011]

48 minutes ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

 

If this isn’t cited for staging, NOTHING ever should be. 
The rule shouldn’t even exist. 

And funnily enough not being talked about at all. Coz you can’t have a buddy less finals. 

[John Crow Batty 8,861]

28 minutes ago, Bombay Airconditioning said:

Forward 50 tackles.

Melbourne : 13

Sydney : 25

14 of those for the Swans in last quarter.

[waynewussell 5,268]

2 minutes ago, John Crow Batty said:

14 of those for the Swans in last quarter.

So, before the last quarter we were ahead?

[Pennant St Dee 13,113]

3 hours ago, 1964_2 said:

Agree.

Maybe I don’t know enough about footy. But can’t get my head around the strategy of having Jackson/Gawn (or Gawn/Brown etc) Jackson was poor that’s why it didn’t work. Hickey beat them both but Jackson gave nothing around the ground 

I place little blame on Brown / Koz / Melk for their lack of impact last night, and most of it on our game style. Melk nullified Paddy Mcartins aerial influence but hurt by not impacting the scoreboard, Kozzie was really poor not enough ground ball pressure and not getting front and centre enough

Why did we abort what worked so well against the Lions??  Because the Lions didn’t apply the same pressure that Sydney did and we weren’t allowed clean entries, when the ball went to ground in the Brisbane forward 50 they had nothing at ground level which allowed us to transition and rebound easily. Sydney applied fierce pressure and locked it in or made transition panicked. Teams match up differently and if the Lions learn anything it will be how much better their forward line functioned when Mcstay had to go in the ruck and they were less top heavy
 

 

[leave it to deever 17,511]

50 minutes ago, Bombay Airconditioning said:

Forward 50 tackles.

Melbourne : 13

Sydney : 25

Not surprising. I only used the shocked emoji because it seemed the most appropriate. 

Their forward line locked the ball up inside their fwd 50 constantly.

Edited September 3, 2022 by leave it to deever

[The Corridor 119]

The disappointing:

- The corridor kicks from D50 which we seem to be looking to more lately are a dangerous field position to implement this. We should also not have field kicks like Gawn centering the ball with a floater leading to direct turnover goals.

- I was confused that we allowed Tracc to play out the game when he was clearly hampered from the injury in the first quarter. Good on him for battling to play out the game, and you want your players putting their hand up to play on. But we really needed to make the sub to give ourselves a chance and not be one down due to how hobbled he was while battling through bravely. 

- The Dees crowd in my area was embarrassing (I was not near the cheer squad, which sounded like they were doing a great job fwiw). Felt very odd for making noise in my area. May as well have been at an Enya concert, you would hardly know it was a final. Yes, there was often not a lot to cheer for, but we really do not get the home ground advantage other teams do. I would have no qualms playing against Melbourne at the G as an opposition player, which is not what you want. Of course we celebrate goals, who doesn't? There needs to be some noise and atmosphere outside of that. This was the first final in Melbourne after missing out on a premiership, but there was a nervous energy rather than one of excitement

- You cannot blame May for getting sucked in and in the same breath acknowledge that the 50m penalty was an absolutely embarrassing call by the umpire and in no way a free kick. Cannot fault May for the incident at all. Can certainly fault the umpire and Buddy for that tone-changing momentum swing. May continued to torch him for the rest of the game. Only a couple of errors, albeit costly with the corridor kick. 

- Brayshaw in the middle continues to make our midfield worse in my view. He adds nothing that others do not already do better, he turns it over at a high rate, and him being there makes us worse in other positions ie HBF or wing where he is much better suited. Unfortunately depending on how Tracc goes with his injuries he may stay there, but if we have any option to move him back to positions that help the team as a whole then I hope we make the change. 

- While Hickey does tend to do well against Gawn historically, going into the game it looked like ruck was an area that we should have a big advantage in and needed to capitalise on that with Dogga and Gawn. Instead we got torched in that area all night. Even when winning taps they were usually to Sydney's advantage and often damaging against us. Ruck work in defensive 50 was problematic too with the areas we hit it to and let it be hit to

- Lack of direct quick kicks from centre clearances with 6-6-6 on a dewy night and handballing it around five times only to get swamped was costly all night. Their pressure game was excellent and we played right into it

 

The positives:

- Proud of the team for earning the double chance in a difficult season, and we now get to play a team we match up much better against. Still have an excellent chance at earning our way through to the prelim 

- May and Clarry the two best players on the ground and really stood up as we have come to expect. How fortunate are we to have Clarry?? Will be a joy to watch him for many years to come

- Sydney is a good team and we match up poorly with them, and regardless of who wins the games are always tightly contest pressure affairs. We struggled to play on our terms and struggled with pressure and allowed too much spread, but the game was not the total debacle it seems and the frustration of losing an automatic prelim appearance is understandably frustrating and probably feeding into the negativity going around. Only really Collingwood do we match up similarly poorly against of teams in the 8. Match ups are hugely important especially at this time of year. We should look better the next couple of weeks if we can progress through, and hopefully will get another shot at Sydney and be able to make some adjustments before that

- We won the premiership last year and for that I am forever thankful and whatever happens next week will cheer the team off as thanks for that now that we have an opportunity to attend finals in Melbourne

[leave it to deever 17,511]

Well I guess we know we can  beat the lions.

But after last night it will be a miracle turnaround to go further than that.

Its practically the same team that one a flag last year but not the same mentally.

Tracca carrying an injury as well probably more than we ever know about.

I guess it serves no more purpose naming players. Just put it down to that omnibus bug.....premiership hangover. Even if we did finish 2nd.

I don't want to take away hope as there is a slim chance we can still win.

But realistically,  I guess most of us know how slim that is.

Bit I suppose it's called the double chance because some teams make it.

[praha 11,234]

14 minutes ago, waynewussell said:

So, before the last quarter we were ahead?

It was pretty even across the board even in that stat. When I saw it at 3 qtr time I thought that eventually our pressure would overcome Sydney and we'd win. Their pressure in the last quarter wins flags. We turned to butter.

[dees189227 12,371]

Ok it's time we started Max in the centre square at the beginning of the matches. He is an AA ruckman & needs to start there. He will never be an AA ff.

Rotate him to the forward line after awhile but just start him where he should be 

[old dee 23,778]

4 hours ago, 1964_2 said:

Agree.

Maybe I don’t know enough about footy. But can’t get my head around the strategy of having Jackson/Gawn (or Gawn/Brown etc) together in a pack and bombing it to them from the wing or half back flank. Sure it’s predictable for us, and we can try and win a contest when the ball hits the ground (and get repeat entries) But it’s also incredibly predictable for the opposition, who can setup both defensive cover, and outlet players ahead of the ball (because they don’t have to defend the whole ground - just the area where our talls are standing together), for the times they do win the ground ball contest. 

I place little blame on Brown / Koz / Melk for their lack of impact last night, and most of it on our game style. 

Why did we abort what worked so well against the Lions?? 
 

As I see it we are way too predictable. E.G. every single kick in goes to the left flank. We never vary, ever what the hell is that about. 

[loges 6,767]

3 hours ago, KysaiahMessiah said:

Nobody said that.  Its on record that even a star player wants us to make more noise, and last night a member of the coaching staff tried to gee the crowd up.  Like it or not, it does make a difference.  And we are not good at it, thats all.

Don't have any trouble winning interstate

[YesitwasaWin4theAges 6,685]

Tommy (T-Shirt) McDonald he will feed off of this scenario nothing to lose and to reclaim his mantle as the big dog of our Forward line. A massive attitude adjustment is what is required.

Tempted to call for JVR to be included but i have nothing but clips to go on and this would be unfair on him to perform in such a high pressure situation.

Plus i know match committee will not even go there.

Gawn to play his usual kick behind play role not working with him in the forward line. Gus back back in his Wing/ Half back role reads the play well. 

I just hope the happenings of last night are a massive wake up call for the whole footy club in general.

Edited September 3, 2022 by YesitwasaWin4theAges

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

Not our year.

Anyone know Salem’s winning record this year?

[JJR 681]

16 hours ago, Dave1711 said:

We’ll get flogged by Brisbane, it will be straight sets

Brisbane can not beat us, and they wont this week, we can't play as bad as we did and make the mistakes we did against Sydney.
I'm hoping Collingwood beat Geelong so we play the filth in a prelim. Don't stress.

[YesitwasaWin4theAges 6,685]

If we are as a club are trying to appease Jacko by playing him more in the ruck to tempt him from going to Freo well then we are fkd.

Gawny has to ruck at the start of quarters to maintain our dominance, in order to do this he needs to be in there 60 per cent of the time.

Jacko has to earn his stripes, not for it to be handed to him on a silver platter. 

You give us performances and you earn the right.

Time to wake up and get back on track Dees.

 

[Sir Why You Little 36,963]

Longmire is the best Coach in the Game. He has been around the mark since he took over from Roos. 
i hate Sydney but they are a good side. Their list is just below Top Shelf, but they have a brilliant structure that every player knows. 
Goodwin got given a lesson last night, it happens 

We have to get better. Opponents want to kill us

[chook fowler 19,444]

We played dumb last night. Got sucked in to give away undisciplined frees and 50s. Melksham must feel deflated - you can’t miss easy goals the way he did. Not good enough. Hard to see us progressing from here. What a waste.

[The heart beats true 18,109]

3 hours ago, Bombay Airconditioning said:

If you hadn’t watched the game and didn’t know the score, having read this thread you’d be right in thinking we had lost by over 80. We arguably only had a couple of players win their position on the night, yet only lost by 22, less than 4 goals. As frustrating as last night was, we’re still in it. 

I like the optimism.

The issue for mine is that our games are trending painfully similarly. If we are matched for contest work and teams can stick with us until half way through the 3rd the pattern suggests we will be over run.

[Guest]

Harmesy has avoided suspension! Can accept a $2000 fine. ❤️💙

[titan_uranus 24,971]

16 hours ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

Highest placed QF gets the Friday night prelim.

If Collingwood somehow beat Geelong, Sydney get the Friday night prelim and we’d potentially play Collingwood on the Saturday twilight or night slot.

Source?

Won't they just put the Geel/Coll prelim on the Friday for a 7-day break for our semi winner, and the Sydney prelim on the Saturday for a 7-day break for the other semi winner?

16 hours ago, 1964_2 said:

Dermott Brereton said we are missing the “un-sociable” elements to make us a dynasty team. At the moment, unfortunately he is correct and we are wrong. 
 

Last night we gave up frees and 50s for trying to be "tough".

Brereton's often wrong, and I reckon he is here again.

16 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

Our backline is seriously overrated.

May is a gun. But he took chances with his disposal early before going to his shell. Petty is a very solid number 2 defender but he isn't encouraged to use his attacking game. Lever is a good interceptor but Sydney know to put speed on to him and get him when the ball gets to ground, another who does nothing in attack and has surely been carrying injuries all year.

Salem's half fit. Hibberd half retired. Rivers really just finding his way and he has great moments in congestion and in the contest but can be sloppy defensively and doesn't quick kick it well enough, isn't encouraged to run either. Hunt is Hunt.

2 great rucks is nice but Gawn really hasn't been great this year and Jackson is a kid and not at full fitness IMO.

Oliver, Petracca and Viney when on are sensational, but Oliver can't do it himself, Petracca is having to play forward and isn't right. Langdon is a great outside runner but one dimensional. Harmes had a few Harmes moments but was good on the wing I thought but he'll always be a bit limited in that role. He should be on ball but Brayshaw is back on ball because we wanted his run and uncontested disposals. The problem with wanting Brayshaw's uncontested disposals is you're asking for a bunch of ordinary ball use. Sparrow's a useful worker but nothing special.

It's only a great midfield when you take kicking out of the game and go with bludgeon ball all the time. We caught teams out with that in 2021 but eventually they catch on.

Sydney has us easily covered with flankers and outside mids. The class of Florent, Blakey, Lloyd, Papley, Heeney, Hayward, Gulden, McInenery, even Stephens at times is more than we can match. When the game shifted from our style of tussle to a more open moving style the Swans superior depth of talent was always going to shine.

Of all your awful takes this year, arguing our backline isn't actually that good somehow takes the cake.

6 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

This was one of the most bizarre coaching of the night.

We've had the best ruckman in the game just gather his 6th AA as a ruckman and bloody Goody finds it fit to start him at FF.

Goody and the coaches were incredibly sloe to react to this. You can tell Jackson was getting overwhelmed by Hickey but yet we stuck with this same plan going into the last quarter.

Knew then and there we were gone when Gawn started FF in the last quarter.

Demonland: Goodwin never makes any changes

Also Demonalnd: how dare Goodwin change our ruck set up.

There have been plenty of games in the last two years where Jackson's flourished with more time in the ruck and Gawn has been a terror for our opponent up forward. It's not surprising at all that he tried that last night. The fact that we lost doesn't mean it was the wrong tactic.

[titan_uranus 24,971]

9 hours ago, rufus said:

Having had a chance to calm down and really think about, there's just no escaping the feeling that this has been a pathetic premiership defence from us. A few months ago you had multiple respected football people (including David Parkin) saying they may have never before seen a team so good and committed to each and to winning the contest.

Honestly, only at the MFC could the wheels fall off so completely so quickly. Despite our 'changed culture', we're getting beaten every time an opponent brings high pressure on us. And we seem to have no will to dial up the pressure in response. Just like 'old Melbourne', this season is going to return a result that is less than what it should have been. Although our opponents are stronger this year than last, this is still a weak period in terms of really high quality dominant teams. A massive  opportunity wasted by these guys.

So grateful for the flag in 2021. Had we not got over the line last year, this capitulation would be soul crushing. It's looking like 2021 was an absolute heist where everything went our way. We are looking like real flat track bullies right now.

And now we have massive pressure on us next week, against a side to whom we've given huge ammo to want to roll us. Brisbane are ordinary and we should beat them, but a win of any magnitude now tells us nothing about who Melb are. All it would do is again confirm that we are quite ok when playing on our terms (against a side that lacks physicality at a ground they don't play well).

I cannot begin to explain how much I detest this post.

Honestly, there's little more "pathetic" than bagging out our club for their efforts this year.

You write as if defending a premiership is both easy and supposed to happen. Neither is true. We had just one fewer win this year than last year and finished 2nd after the H&A season in a year that has produced high quality football from a number of sides and has produced as even a top 6 as we've seen. All that with 11 of our 22 games against the eventual top 8.

Arguing that the wheels have fallen off because we lost a close game to a good side is ridiculous.

And I will never let anyone get away with trying to reduce our 2021 achievement into a "heist", or a fluke, or anything like that. Our 2021 season was one of the great seasons of recent memory. If you want to hold every future Melbourne season to the 2021 standard, that's on you, and you're going to get disappointed because you're being unreasonable.

[dazzledavey36 54,251]

9 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

Source?

Won't they just put the Geel/Coll prelim on the Friday for a 7-day break for our semi winner, and the Sydney prelim on the Saturday for a 7-day break for the other semi winner?

Last night we gave up frees and 50s for trying to be "tough".

Brereton's often wrong, and I reckon he is here again.

Of all your awful takes this year, arguing our backline isn't actually that good somehow takes the cake.

Demonland: Goodwin never makes any changes

Also Demonalnd: how dare Goodwin change our ruck set up.

There have been plenty of games in the last two years where Jackson's flourished with more time in the ruck and Gawn has been a terror for our opponent up forward. It's not surprising at all that he tried that last night. The fact that we lost doesn't mean it was the wrong tactic.

We're talking last night, not what's happened the last 2 years.

It was very evident early that Jackson was struggling against Hickey. He was man handled physically and was overwhelmed. 

We looked more dangerous when Gawn rucked because he know, he's a 6x All Australian ruckman..

Gawn should have rucked 90% of the time after half time. Goodwin and the coaching staff were simply slow to react to this.

Starting Gawn at FF in the last quarter when we were 12 points down is simply poor coaching. Get your best players right into the action at all costs.