FINALS: Week 02 2021 (NON MFC)

[napster 181]

43 minutes ago, loges said:

I'd like to see a commentator brave enough to call out the umpiring in Bulldogs games

You're asking a lot from the propaganda machine

[Brownie 5,446]

40 minutes ago, loges said:

I'd like to see a commentator brave enough to call out the umpiring in Bulldogs games

It seems it's the only way things change now is when the media do or don't make a big deal about things.

Stars thumping players head high...no big deal

Don't like the rules....complain about them enough and they get changed 

Fagan and the Lions probably need to go ballistic enough about the umpiring that the media will make it an issue for the AFL to have to deal with.

It's a blight on our game.

 

 

 

[The heart beats true 16,488]

2 minutes ago, DubDee said:

Lol. Crazy isn’t it

It’s called unconscious bias. I don’t believe the umpires are conspiring. I believe they have relationships with players and those often cloud their ability to make decisions. It’s not deliberate, but it doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen.

It’s ok to think it sounds a bit nuts. I agree. Unfortunately the numbers are the proof.

[radar 1,858]

Late,  Bont marked but clearly Big O on replay had first dibs. Media favourite, no comment, move on. 
 

Last week Ben Brown thought he marked  a touched ball, inside 50. Held the ball, to his surprise (never heard “touched, play on”)  tackled, dumped and Lions get a defensive free. 
Tonight it happens - ball up
 

[Happy Jack 195]

Wow, some really viscious stuff going on at Big Footy on the Brisbane page. As well as scorching the umps, lot of people jumping off the game (supposedly), fans from other clubs piling on, suggestions that Toby should habe fixed Matt Stevic up properly last week etc etc.

Funniest one though was the poster who couldn’t believe they lost to a team with Scache in it. Priceless.

 

Edited September 4, 2021 by Happy Jack

[Webber 10,181]

10 minutes ago, DubDee said:

you honestly think the umps get together and decide to pay more frees to the one team??

Nope, because that’s patently ridiculous. What is absolutely, objectively the case is that the free kick differential over the season (and the finals are merely reinforcing that fact) puts the Bulldogs way, way out beyond the normal spread of the bell curve. The Bulldogs simply have an established ability to gain a statistically irregular advantage from umpiring decisions. None of the other comparative stats that might explain this … contested possessions, tackles, etc, match this irregularity. Not even close. That the umpires ‘consciously’ make this happen is ludicrous. It is however highly anomalous and needs scrutiny because it gifts them an obvious advantage, and that’s not a game I really want to watch. 

[layzie 29,820]

8 minutes ago, Brownie said:

Don't like the rules....complain about them enough and they get changed 

 

Sure feels that way. The conversation always starts with no-one thinking a change is needed then after some complaining, snap decisions are made.

[The heart beats true 16,488]

🤣
 

[dazzledavey36 49,413]

4 minutes ago, Pates said:

Two years in a row the Lions have had an advantage that other teams would cry out for in finals (home ground/crowd) and it’s amounted to nothing. The dogs are getting their pressure game going again but really I think port will account for them purely because Port will have the week off and the Dogs just had a fierce encounter. 

They're building a bit if a reputation aren't they..

They certainly had plenty of chances tonight, but were so wasteful with their forward entries.

Reckon they'll drop a few spots next year. Guys like Birchall, Robinson, Zorko, Rich and Lyons will all be over 30 next year and are slowing down.

They have some good quality young players coming through, but I think they'll be around the bottom half of the 8.

[napster 181]

1 hour ago, SaberFang said:

Funny that, it was a free against Brisbane right before 3QT (which setup a shot at goal for the Dogs).

Bulldogs do it? Nothing to see here.

The holding the ball free against Brisbane right before 3QT was a Stevic decision, it was a really poor one. I think he's over-rated, helped by the non-stop promotion he gets from the commentators. Actually thought Ump 22 had a pretty good game overall. 

As to the freekick differential ladder, of the remaining 4 teams, we are the only team in negative territory. Prepare to be shafted.

[DubDee 21,374]

21 minutes ago, Webber said:

Nope, because that’s patently ridiculous. What is absolutely, objectively the case is that the free kick differential over the season (and the finals are merely reinforcing that fact) puts the Bulldogs way, way out beyond the normal spread of the bell curve. The Bulldogs simply have an established ability to gain a statistically irregular advantage from umpiring decisions. None of the other comparative stats that might explain this … contested possessions, tackles, etc, match this irregularity. Not even close. That the umpires ‘consciously’ make this happen is ludicrous. It is however highly anomalous and needs scrutiny because it gifts them an obvious advantage, and that’s not a game I really want to watch. 

That certainly is curious. So the umpires are not deliberately favouring the dogs but they get more free kicks so we should investigate it?

have you considered that the dogs won the contested ball tonight and play a manic game style that is contest heavy and get to the ball first a lot so they might be more likely to win free kicks?

or what other explanation do you think there is?

[Undeeterred 2,883]

37 minutes ago, The heart beats true said:

It’s called unconscious bias. I don’t believe the umpires are conspiring. I believe they have relationships with players and those often cloud their ability to make decisions. It’s not deliberate, but it doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen.

It’s ok to think it sounds a bit nuts. I agree. Unfortunately the numbers are the proof.

Fox showed footage of Razor and Danger laughing and joking and fist bumping before last night’s game, and I thought here we go

[jnrmac 19,329]

Bulldogs last 12 finals they've won the free kick count. 

 

Law of averages has failed

[jnrmac 19,329]

12 minutes ago, napster said:

As to the freekick differential ladder, of the remaining 4 teams, we are the only team in negative territory. Prepare to be shafted.

You know it

[Deestar9 1,427]

Well we made a Prelim & are 4th bottom on the free kick differential so we don’t rely on the goodwill of umpires ..

[Hellish Inferno 992]

With the 12 day rest for players with concussion, another reason the week off between the prelim and granny is good news. Can you imagine if one of our stars had to miss the granny with a head knock!

[Macca 16,174]

42 minutes ago, DubDee said:

That certainly is curious. So the umpires are not deliberately favouring the dogs but they get more free kicks so we should investigate it?

have you considered that the dogs won the contested ball tonight and play a manic game style that is contest heavy and get to the ball first a lot so they might be more likely to win free kicks?

or what other explanation do you think there is?

Umpires will nearly always favour the player in front or players who are first in for the ball (as a general rule) ... so the Bulldogs are the best at playing in front, they are very often first in for the ball and they know how to play for free kicks (which is a skill in itself)  

They are just smarter than the other teams.  A well coached and well drilled outfit.  The way they play, they are nearly always likely to win the free kick count

Play the rules and play to the umpires and the decisions that they are likely to make.  Play smart.  Beveridge exploits the rules to the max - as he should.  See's the loopholes and seizes the opportunity

And if supporters want the rules cleaned up, take it up with the AFL, not the umpires.  The umpires are just the people in between

They just make decisions in a sport with more grey areas than a bleak Melbourne day

Edited September 4, 2021 by Macca

[Undeeterred 2,883]

2 hours ago, ANG13 said:

This game has howling umpire mistake costs Brisbane the game in the final seconds vibe all over it. 

Prescient 

[The heart beats true 16,488]

39 minutes ago, DubDee said:

That certainly is curious. So the umpires are not deliberately favouring the dogs but they get more free kicks so we should investigate it?

have you considered that the dogs won the contested ball tonight and play a manic game style that is contest heavy and get to the ball first a lot so they might be more likely to win free kicks?

That argument holds up a lot more if Richmond also got a lot more free kicks. Their game a style is very similarly built on contested ball, and getting to the ball first.

Interestingly they had a differential 165 free kicks worse off than the Bulldogs at - 86 for the season.

[radar 1,858]

About one free kick a quarter each game all season

[Macca 16,174]

They (Richmond) have been caught flat-footed all season, often caught out playing from behind and they are happy to play an aggressive style and give away professional free kicks. 

They tackle with such intent that often leads to transgressions.  Unsociable footy from a team that had run out of steam

So they are at the other end of the spectrum to the bulldogs. 

There is a lot more to it that the numbers.  In fact, the numbers don't tell the true story.  They are just numbers

 

Edited September 4, 2021 by Macca

[Demon trucker 1,786]

Well the last time we played in a GF we won the Brownlow, history to repeat, with 1 big difference, dogs, always get the rub of the green with the umpires, they will not win the free kick count in Adelaide. 

[Demonland 66,603]

 

[Nairobi_Demon 317]

3 hours ago, radar said:

Late,  Bont marked but clearly Big O on replay had first dibs. Media favourite, no comment, move on. 
 

Last week Ben Brown thought he marked  a touched ball, inside 50. Held the ball, to his surprise (never heard “touched, play on”)  tackled, dumped and Lions get a defensive free. 
Tonight it happens - ball up
 

The other thing I noticed during our game last week, and went back to watch on BB’s vision to confirm, is that the umpire didn’t make an effort to inform the players it was touched.  Normally they yell out “touched” multiple times. From what I can hear, the umpire only said it once just after the ball was kicked (and thus furtherest from Brown). There was no effort to repeat it. Even after he marked it and started to walk back for his kick, there’s no repeat call from the umpire but only noise from players and the crowd that it was touched.  
 

You’d almost think the umpire was happy for him to get snagged for holding the ball

Edited September 4, 2021 by Nairobi_Demon

[MT64 1,128]

6 hours ago, loges said:

I'd like to see a commentator brave enough to call out the umpiring in Bulldogs games

Will never happen as they are all accredited by the AFL and they cannot go against the script.