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COVID & AFL 2021

Demonland
in Melbourne Demons

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6 minutes ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

I would never in a million years barrack for more cases to pop up in SA over the coming days but if they do, our game against Port will surely be moved.

However, it sounds like further community transmission was unlikely with the existing cases and we’ll be playing over there next week.

Moving the Adelaide squad to VIC was a probably a bit over the top by the AFL considering further transmission is unlikely.

It’s less about further cases and more whether Victoria thinks SA are a risk and closes the border. 

    • Like 2
     
    1 hour ago, Colin B. Flaubert said:

    FMI

    https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Gish_Gallop

    That is brilliant. I have never heard the term  but know tactic very well.

    Its funny, because the tactic is pretty much the organising principle of the Murdoch mafia's business model -  millions of spurious arguments designed to create furious arguments and division.

    And Murdoch's genius is the model is not based on ideology. He'll leave that to the suckers.

    It is about monetising conflict. And power of course. Theirs, that is. 

    Trump, and his acolytes, has taken the core of the gush gallop model and put their own spin on it - flood the zone with so much [censored], so often that rebuttal becomes futile.

    And the very act of rebuttal confers some level of credibility to complete and utter nonsense. Imagine having to rebutt a claim like the Jan 6th insurrection was a false flag event. Or that trump won the election.

     

     

     

    Edited by binman

    • Like 6

    Can this subject be moved off the footy threads ?

    I have enough divisive political claptrap from left and right in the real media

    This really has now nothing to do with AFL its becoming a political thread and we all know nobody ever changes their view in a political dicussion

    • Like 4
    • Thanks 1
     
    11 hours ago, Little Goffy said:

    Your tactics are odious. This information is all readily available in the public domain from numerous sources.

    Why the aggression Little g? I said you may be correct even if it was supposition. I think your supposition may be a stretch based on recent available data particularly current lower death rates from COVID. That is why I wanted to know the source of your data. 

    19 hours ago, rjay said:

    A friend of mine does some work with a minor celebrity (maybe underselling him, he's quite well known) who believes the earth is flat.

    When my friend was asked what it would take to get him to change his mind and believe the earth was flat he said,  'evidence'...

    200 Proofs Earth is Not a Spinning Ball, by Flat Earther Eric Dubay[14]

    What more really needs be said? It's 2 hours long. At best, every proof would get 1.67 minutes of screentime. As a PDF, it's 35 pages long[15] — too long to debunk easily, too short to present conclusive evidence. Nevertheless, rebuttals have still been made
     
    From here:
    https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Gish_Gallop

    Edited by binman

    • Thanks 1

    On 5/26/2021 at 3:30 PM, Webber said:

    Current evidence (worldwide) of clots with AZ vax is 4-6 clots per million doses. That would be < 150 clots if the entire Aust. pop vaccinated with AZ. Readily available info. 

    Ok Im over 60 with a history of DVT. I applied via my Haemotologist to get Phizer from VIC Health authority ,The result.... No way Hosea. I have ZERO faith in Govt specialists giving advice! I will not risk taking Astra Zenica, would you??

    Edited by picket fence

    • Like 1
    4 hours ago, rjay said:

     

    Yep, that's what I call solid evidence...

    I would have been more convinced if the list included Miranda devine 

    • Like 1
    • Haha 1
    12 hours ago, faultydet said:

    The ABC has a full roster of pastisan zealots and yet you happily swallow every gulp of the tripe they feed you.

    Paul Murray is brilliant, as is Credlin. Kevin 07 must have palpitations every time they are on air.

    Defund the ABC and put the money into mental health treatment. At least the cash will find its way back to the newly unemployed activists.

    And Qanon is embarrassing garbage. Why bring that into an adult discussion?

    The Murdoch media is also full of zealots - it depends on your perspective, don't you think?

    Me, I'm an by-the-issues person,. so I see zealotry on both sides, including in the ABC.

    Defunding the ABC is not going to solve the problem, and usually is a good marker for IPA-aligned thinking.

    Quote

    Murrays hospital figures are from the State Governments themselves because he asks,

    This point serves as a useful strawman for Murray's ideology, but it's not useful until such time as most of the population is vaccinated and the borders are open. Posters here have made that point, as have health experts, so if one chooses to ignore this point, so be it.

    • Like 1
     
    39 minutes ago, picket fence said:

    Ok Im over 60 with a history of DVT. I applied via my Haemotologist to get Phizer from VIC Health authority ,The result.... No way Hosea. I have ZERO faith in Govt specialists giving advice! I will not risk taking Astra Zenica, would you??

    Thrombocytopenia, which is the very rare AZ issue, has no relationship, as far as I’m aware, to other clotting issues like your DVT history. I’d discuss this specifically with your GP, though, picket. If there’s no increased associated risk, get the AZ. Everybody who can should, cos who knows when we’ll get the supply our Government insisted we were ‘first in the queue’ for, which they now admit actually means LAST. FMD!

    • Like 3
    10 hours ago, A F said:

    You realise Fairfax is Channel 9, ie Peter Costello? They ran a multi million dollar Liberal Party fund-raiser in 2019. Are you trying to tell me Fairfax/Nine is 'leftie'?  I suppose Andrew Bolt is a raging leftie too?

    Murray is a professional provocateur, just like Bolt and Credlin. They've no interest in facts, they just go on feelings. It's about stirring the pot and getting people riled up. 

    Who are the 'leftie' provocateurs? And don't give me that egocentric centrist Waleed.

    The Overton Window has Malcolm Turnbull as a 'raging leftie'.

    Quality post.

    Murray gets paid to get eyeballs and to do that he stirs the pot of the angry right. It's that simple.

    Quote

    1. Paul Murray is the best political media figure in Australia. Peta Credlin is a very close second.

    Fancy a leftist bemoaning the politicization of Covid 19. 2. The left, with their media sycophant activist allies have used this new Chinese virus as a wedge in elections all around the world.

    3. People around the western world are tiring of lockdowns. Business killing, mortgage defaulting, wife losing, ineffective political cudgels.

    1. Paul and Peter are not the best political media figures in Australia. Maybe if you're a "rightist" - since you seem fond of lashing out with binary labels.

    2. Because the Murdoch mafia and their IPA allies (along with the Innes Willox's of the world) aren't media sycophantic allies to the right?

    3. Citation required on:

    - lockdown fatigue, by country

    - business closure, in AU (ProfitKeeper says hi)

    - mortgage defaults in AU (hint - little to no change thanks to JK and super withdrawals and bank mortgage holidays)

    - divorce rates (it's telling that you have positioned divorce as "wife losing")

     

    • Like 2

    4 minutes ago, Webber said:

    Thrombocytopenia, which is the very rare AZ issue, has no relationship, as far as I’m aware, to other clotting issues like your DVT history. I’d discuss this specifically with your GP, though, picket. If there’s no increased associated risk, get the AZ. Everybody who can should, cos who knows when we’ll get the supply our Government insisted we were ‘first in the queue’ for, which they now admit actually means LAST. FMD!

    Yep, that's right. The clots are not the same. I heard a doctor on Radio National yesterday saying an ordinary general anaesthetic is much (I think he actually said a hundred times) more dangerous.  Until we all get vaccinated, lockdowns will continue. 

     

    • Like 3
    3 minutes ago, Jara said:

    Yep, that's right. The clots are not the same. I heard a doctor on Radio National yesterday saying an ordinary general anaesthetic is much (I think he actually said a hundred times) more dangerous.  Until we all get vaccinated, lockdowns will continue. 

     

    Contraceptive pill also something like 5 times more likely to cause clots, but that’s just women, so much less important. Obviously. ?

    Think a separate politics thread is required. Sadly everything political is more tribal than following football teams these days. I hate it. Where are the sensible centre types in the media?

    Got my first Pfizer jab on July 17. Happy days.

    • Like 2
    15 minutes ago, Clintosaurus said:

    Think a separate politics thread is required. Sadly everything political is more tribal than following football teams these days. I hate it. Where are the sensible centre types in the media?

    Got my first Pfizer jab on July 17. Happy days.

    I think you'll find most of the people in the media from the left think they're sensible centre types. As do most of the people on the right. That's why they all claim they speak for the so-called "silent majority".

     

    • Like 1

    2 hours ago, Kent said:

    Can this subject be moved off the footy threads ?

    I have enough divisive political claptrap from left and right in the real media

    This really has now nothing to do with AFL its becoming a political thread and we all know nobody ever changes their view in a political dicussion

    Sadly nobody is listening but I'm with ya Kent !

    Any chance we can keep this thread to what it was intended for?? 

    • Like 4
    12 minutes ago, Clintosaurus said:

    Think a separate politics thread is required.

    Sadly everything political is more tribal than following football teams these days. I hate it. Where are the sensible centre types in the media?

    Got my first Pfizer jab on July 17. Happy days.

    Fair calls.

    I'll make one last non football related comment then desist from posting non footy related covid stuff here.

    I think there is plenty of sensible center people in the media, but like politics the media model is devolving into a very dangerous binary divide that places all opinion and information on an completely made up, abstract notion of a left right continuum of beliefs. 

    Ideas do not fit neatly on left right divide. And nor do all policy decisions

    What is important to understand is why this model has gained such traction. The key driver is that this model is easily monetized. Conflict rates. Division is lucrative. 

    The price we pay for the model is hyper partnership, poor policy, over simplification of complex issues and misinformation. 

    Australia has long political history of sensible center politics and bipartisanship. That model has served us well. But is at grave risk

    One of the great ironies of the left right nonsense is that on both ends of that spectrum people share concerns about government overreach and the loss of personal freedoms. But the way things are heading fascism and authoritarianism are the likely end point. Surely everyone, no matter their political beliefs would hope to avoid this. 

    This article provides some fascinating insight into the drift towards, and support for authoritarianism by Republicans in the states (with reference to voters on the right other western democracies)

    https://morningconsult.com/2021/06/28/global-right-wing-authoritarian-test/

    • Like 2
    13 minutes ago, binman said:

    Fair calls.

    I'll make one last non football related comment then desist from posting non footy related covid stuff here.

    I think there is plenty of sensible center people in the media, but like politics the media model is devolving into a very dangerous binary divide that places all opinion and information on an completely made up, abstract notion of a left right continuum of beliefs. 

    Ideas do not fit neatly on left right divide. And nor do all policy decisions

    What is important to understand is why this model has gained such traction. The key driver is that this model is easily monetized. Conflict rates. Division is lucrative. 

    The price we pay for the model is hyper partnership, poor policy, over simplification of complex issues and misinformation. 

    Australia has long political history of sensible center politics and bipartisanship. That model has served us well. But is at grave risk

    One of the great ironies of the left right nonsense is that on both ends of that spectrum people share concerns about government overreach and the loss of personal freedoms. But the way things are heading fascism and authoritarianism are the likely end point. Surely everyone, no matter their political beliefs would hope to avoid this. 

    This article provides some fascinating insight into the drift towards, and support for authoritarianism by Republicans in the states (with reference to voters on the right other western democracies)

    https://morningconsult.com/2021/06/28/global-right-wing-authoritarian-test/

    Thank you Binman!


    15 minutes ago, drysdale demon said:

    I heard a rumor that there were games of football on this weekend starting with one tonight, could someone please verify this.

    Not true. Where did you get that from?

    • Like 1

    In dramatic breaking news Fremantle V Carlton now at the MCG on Saturday night.

    For those sticking around for the double header, you'll have leave the ground after the Dees game and then organise tickets for the night cap.

    https://www.afl.com.au/news/639760/double-header-is-go-freo-blues-venue-locked-in-as-afl-finalises-r16-puzzle

    First double header at the MCG since 1986. We beat Geelong by 7 points in the arvo game and North flogged the Bulldogs in the 5pm game according to AFL tables. 

     

     

     

     

    Edited by Bring-Back-Powell

    • Like 1
    • Shocked 1
     

     

     

    Risky strategy, if we lose, there me one less chair in front of me ?

     

    11 hours ago, faultydet said:

    Paul Murray is the best political media figure in Australia. Peta Credlin is a very close second.

     

     

     

    Fancy a leftist bemoaning the politicization of Covid 19. The left, with their media sycophant activist allies have used this new Chinese virus as a wedge in elections all around the world.

    People around the western world are tiring of lockdowns. Business killing, mortgage defaulting, wife losing, ineffective political cudgels.

    We really do have a majority of super woke lefties on 'Land don't we? Shouldn't be surprised considering most of you live in Danistan.

     

    Can we keep the conversation more on footy and less on which [censored] sky news commentator you want to [censored]?


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