On 27/05/2021 at 01:28, Superunknown said:

All you over 40s in Vic, you can now get Pfizer, even if not 1a/1b. No excuses now, except if you don't want 5G New World Order chips in your blood*

https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/victoria-covid-live-updates-melbourne-braces-for-lockdown-as-health-officials-await-overnight-case-numbers-20210526-p57ve7.html?post=p528uq#p528uq

*I'm just kidding.**

 

** The chips come down in the chemtrails.

Unfortunately it is only the 40-49yo's now eligble for Phizer, we over 50's still second grade citizens.

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:27, Superunknown said:

Root Cause Analysis: quarantining in high density CBD hotels is the issue here.

This outbreak is linked back to SA. 

SA have said they don't want a Federal quarantine center and will keep using hotels.  The federal government has no constitutional powers to direct state governments on what they should do.

A change of geography won't stop this happening again.

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:20, Rusty Nails said:

Scomo could have waited for AZ like everyone else and lead by example LN.

I never assume anything about anyone's political persuasion.

This is the classic approach to criticising politicians. Blame him for having Pfizer or, if he had instead waited for AstraZeneca, blame him for not being vaccinated and setting a bad example.

It's the same gotcha mentatility used by asking politicians if they have private health insurance. If they do, they're criticised for not having confidence in the public health system; if they don't they're criticised for being a burden on the public health system.  

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:27, Superunknown said:

Root Cause Analysis: quarantining in high density CBD hotels is the issue here.

That is the ultimate root cause and we've had 12 months to build a dedicated facility here in Vic and the Fed Govt could have assisted / helped here surely?

Where's Christmas Island at these days?

Edited May 27, 20213 yr by Rusty Nails

Does anyone know who the MFC player is who attended one of the Tier 1 sites?

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:34, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

This is the classic approach to criticising politicians. Blame him for having Pfizer or, if he had instead waited for AstraZeneca, blame him for not being vaccinated and setting a bad example.

It's the same gotcha mentatility used by asking politicians if they have private health insurance. If they do, they're criticised for not having confidence in the public health system; if they don't they're criticised for being a burden on the public health system.  

I'm not the one threatening / bribing people in to getting them to vaccinate with AZ LDC.

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:30, Rusty Nails said:

I never suggested that at all BB.  Feel free to read what post i responded to originally.  That might help clarify.

I'm just fascinated that as people are in lockdown, business suffer, mental health increases and multiple other negative situations occur people can somehow focus on which vaccine the PM got.  It's not even garnish.

BTW, when senior pollies got the (wrong) vaccine, was AZ available, did we know of blood clots and what would the reaction have been if they'd refused to get the shot, got infected while parliment sat and the country was without government for weeks?

Some might say "good thing".  I could empathise with that!

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:35, bingers said:

Does anyone know who the MFC player is who attended one of the Tier 1 sites?

Scomo by the look of it.

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:35, bingers said:

Does anyone know who the MFC player is who attended one of the Tier 1 sites?

Someone on the long term injury list 

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:33, ManDee said:

Unfortunately it is only the 40-49yo's now eligble for Phizer, we over 50's still second grade citizens.

Yep, we're all victims MD, fancy in this covid decimated world only having one vaccine, that stop you dying if you get COVID, to choose from.  India must really feel for us.

Perspective.

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:33, Lucifer's Hero said:

This outbreak is linked back to SA. 

SA have said they don't want a Federal quarantine center and will keep using hotels.  The federal government has no constitutional powers to direct state governments on what they should do.

A change of geography won't stop this happening again.

Lucifer, who controls Australians borders and quarantine? Is it the Federal Government by any chance? The fact that the states are running the quarantine centres is because the Federal government have relinquished it to the states because the states offered and The Federal government could not handle it. If you doubt this, see what would happen if any state said refugees are welcome.

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:10, Lucifer's Hero said:

Just a small clarification.  It started with a man in his 40's who contracted covid while in quarantine in South Australia returning to Victoria.  Unfortunately, the Vic contact tracers identified the wrong Epping Woolworths as an exposure site for him.   It took two weeks (May 21) for them to realise the error by which time the virus had spread to others.   

Contract tracing really need to lift their game in this state.

 

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:28, Lucifer's Hero said:

Perhaps he didn't wait because our Prime Minister and Opposition Leader are classified as 'essential services' so were early receivers of Pfizer.

I prefer they both had Pfizer early than risk our government falling into disarray because they fell ill.

Anyway, I've said my piece so I'll move on.

Spot on Lucifer

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:28, Superunknown said:

All you over 40s in Vic, you can now get Pfizer, even if not 1a/1b. No excuses now, except if you don't want 5G New World Order chips in your blood*

https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/victoria-covid-live-updates-melbourne-braces-for-lockdown-as-health-officials-await-overnight-case-numbers-20210526-p57ve7.html?post=p528uq#p528uq

*I'm just kidding.**

 

** The chips come down in the chemtrails.

If you can get through on the hotline… 

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:33, Lucifer's Hero said:

This outbreak is linked back to SA. 

SA have said they don't want a Federal quarantine center and will keep using hotels.  The federal government has no constitutional powers to direct state governments on what they should do.

A change of geography won't stop this happening again.

The Federal government has direct responsibility for quarantine and border safety. Someone with a constitutional law background can fact check that.

The Federal Govt could - and should - establish Howard Springs like facilities and direct all inbound arrivals to be directed there. Again, fact check that w.r.t to Cth quarantine and border responsibility.

It really is that simple.

It is evident high density hotels without the requisite required ventilation is inadequate. I think your last point is partly correct - insofar as where a properly built facility sits.

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:39, Baghdad Bob said:

Yep, we're all victims MD, fancy in this covid decimated world only having one vaccine, that stop you dying if you get COVID, to choose from.  India must really feel for us.

Perspective.

And India leading the way  in donating Covid vaccines to other countries. Go figure?

 

Donations to other countries,

India 10,200,000 (Yes 10.2 million) 

New Zealand 1,600,000

Australia 8,000 (Yes 8 thousand)

 

https://www.kff.org/policy-watch/putting-u-s-global-covid-19-vaccine-donations-in-context/

Edited May 27, 20213 yr by ManDee
Link and data

Commonsense approach would be to stop the season now and the top 2 teams should play off in the grand final in September once the winter is over 

 

 

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:34, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

This is the classic approach to criticising politicians. Blame him for having Pfizer or, if he had instead waited for AstraZeneca, blame him for not being vaccinated and setting a bad example.

It's the same gotcha mentatility used by asking politicians if they have private health insurance. If they do, they're criticised for not having confidence in the public health system; if they don't they're criticised for being a burden on the public health system.  

Agreed. There are many more legitimate criticisms that can be levelled at him than this. 

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:42, Superunknown said:

The Federal government has direct responsibility for quarantine and border safety. Someone with a constitutional law background can fact check that.

The Federal Govt could - and should - establish Howard Springs like facilities and direct all inbound arrivals to be directed there. Again, fact check that w.r.t to Cth quarantine and border responsibility.

It really is that simple.

It is evident high density hotels without the requisite required ventilation is inadequate. I think your last point is partly correct - insofar as where a properly built facility sits.

I don't wish to become the 'defender of the federal government' here but context is important.

I believe you are correct in that they have direct responsibility for quarantine and border security.  I'm not so sure of their powers on how far that is identification of infectious diseases vs treatment and implementation of solutions.  It is a grey area where those quarantine obligations end and where state governments responsibility for Health administration start.

It is my understanding that is why States undertook to implement the hotel quarantine program - the fed gov has no health administration capability.  The States control all the health industry staff.  The feds supplied some defence staff for Howard Springs but that is being handed over to NT who are having serious difficulty in finding the right type and the quantity of staff needed. 

But lets assume the feds did build quarantine centers in each state where do they get the doctors, security, cleaners, drivers, chefs, check in/out staff etc etc.  The virus is getting out of hotels through staff or human error in administration.

I'm not saying we should not move quarantine out of hotels.  Simply saying that the feds taking over quarantine management or moving to purpose built quarantine centres will not stop the virus escaping from them.  Workers take it out and spread it to colleagues, families and friends.  Unless workers live in the quarantine centers it will still get out.  Even then there are the drivers etc to and from airports that can catch and spread it.

I just think there is no simple fix and fed managed remote centers isn't the panacea people (not saying yourself) suggest it is.

Isn't the simplest solution to pause the season for a week or two rather than have all this chaos?  

  On 27/05/2021 at 02:13, Lucifer's Hero said:

IThe virus is getting out of hotels through staff or human error in administration.

 

The SA report just released - as I understand it - pointed to the lack of adequate ventilation, as well as delivering food to + and - cases at the same time. In that case, someone with the virus opened the door to get their food, and due to l

In this case there is an logistics/admin issue - delivering food to +/- at the same time - and a facilities issue re: no negative pressure to prevent contaminated air escaping to another room.

It would appear impossible to control for the human error aspect here particular when considering the infectiousness of this and its variants.

In the absence of being able to properly manage the human risk, the question to be asked is - what is a better approach to manage this continued risk.

I still think high density CBD quarantine where as we have seen things keep breaking down is the wrong model and dedicated FIFO staff at places like Howard Springs is a more appropriate solution.

Take your last point but of course it is not possible to disprove it until we try it. Current system keeps failing. Try something else.

 

Edited May 27, 20213 yr by Superunknown

  On 27/05/2021 at 02:16, one_demon said:

Isn't the simplest solution to pause the season for a week or two rather than have all this chaos?  

The AFL is already feeling the strain from a shortened 2020 program.

They will do everything in their power to ensure games are maximized. I'd be expecting Hublife and games every 4 or 5 days after a few weeks break.

Victoria, the place to be leave.

The AFL should make it the best of 20, 21,22 or results for ladder position. So if a team plays all 23 rounds, 22 or 21 it s doesn’t matter. If one game gets cancelled then all other clubs can cancel their worst result to balance it out. 

Edited May 27, 20213 yr by John Crow Batty

  On 27/05/2021 at 01:25, Lucifer's Hero said:

The geonome testing has directly connected the current outbreak to tthe Wollert man. 

He went to the Epping North Woolworths.  Instead, the Epping Woolworths was listed as an exposure site so people who went there went for testing and were found to be negative.  Those that went to Epping North weren't required to be tested for the two weeks until the error was discovered.  Now we have many positive tests. 

All roads lead back to the Wollert man.

But none of tbe people who caught did so at one those supermarkets. At least not yeT