Clayton Oliver Contract negotiations

[Billy 609]

Oliver’s first 100 games is the best I’ve seen by any Melbourne player, to think the next 200 could be for Carlton or Essendon is stuff made of nightmares 

 

[Dee Zephyr 8,909]

Yeah...he’s ok, I believe I heard during the replay only 3 other players in the history of the game have had more possessions than Oliver in their first 100 games.I think one of the Crouch brothers, Greg Williams and the other escapes me. 

A couple of times he ran past us on the Northern wing and kicked the ball so beautifully and thought I would like him to kick a little more in a game. Just feel there’s so much more upside that I’d hate to see it elsewhere.

[58er 1,737]

33 minutes ago, Dee Zephyr said:

Yeah...he’s ok, I believe I heard during the replay only 3 other players in the history of the game have had more possessions than Oliver in their first 100 games.I think one of the Crouch brothers, Greg Williams and the other escapes me. 

A couple of times he ran past us on the Northern wing and kicked the ball so beautifully and thought I would like him to kick a little more in a game. Just feel there’s so much more upside that I’d hate to see it elsewhere.

Dee you are so right thought his kicking was super and whoever said Clarry can't kick is on some other grub.

[Better days ahead 4,068]

I think the consensus is we all want him to stay. Pay him what he wants.

Not sure there’s much point torturing ourselves for the season, will he won’t he.

Finally get our act together, win games, play finals and Oliver’s contract takes care of itself. More mediocrity and failure, Oliver won’t stick around.

The coaching team really have to deliver this year.

[Jaded 20,526]

35 touches at 80% and 7 clearances and Melbourne supporters still think he had just an average game. 
Name one other player on our list who would have these post game stats and not be considered to have had a phenomenal game? 
We are so spoilt by the quality of Oliver we don’t even get excited by these stats anymore. And he’s just starting to reach his peak at 100 games. 
Worth whatever he wants. 

[Roger Mellie 1,976]

29 minutes ago, Jaded said:

35 touches at 80% and 7 clearances and Melbourne supporters still think he had just an average game. 
Name one other player on our list who would have these post game stats and not be considered to have had a phenomenal game? 
We are so spoilt by the quality of Oliver we don’t even get excited by these stats anymore. And he’s just starting to reach his peak at 100 games. 
Worth whatever he wants. 

I don't think there will be too much of an issue over dollars or contract length, it'll be more if he thinks he'll have any success with us versus another club. If we bomb out again he'd be off

[BW511 689]

1 hour ago, Jaded said:

35 touches at 80% and 7 clearances and Melbourne supporters still think he had just an average game. 
 

301 Metres Gained over that 35 touches, I think the disposal efficiency is a little misleading when you're averaging less than 10m per touch.

 

 

[Ollie fan 153]

Some people in this thread think he’s not in our top five players. He’s actually come in the top 10 in the coaches award twice. By my reckoning, that puts him in at least the top 20 players in the league. IMH0 he is the best inside mid we’ve had since Barassi. We have to keep him.

[Jaded 20,526]

1 hour ago, BW511 said:

301 Metres Gained over that 35 touches, I think the disposal efficiency is a little misleading when you're averaging less than 10m per touch.

 

 

That’s unfair. He is an inside mid. His primary role is to release the runners once he gains possession. He does that better than nearly all players in the league. He also had some nice kicks inside 50 that set us up. 
His hands in close are elite. Can he improve his outside game? Sure. But that is not and will never be his primary role. 
 

He is highly rated by all league coaches. There is a reason for that. 

[Roost it far 420]

It’d be a tragedy if he left 

give him and Petracca the opportunity to play finals again and watch them tear it apart. To talk him down is simply ridiculous. It’s like the numpties calling for us to trade Jackson because he’s no good

[Pickett2Jackson 3,890]

3 hours ago, Jaded said:

That’s unfair. He is an inside mid. His primary role is to release the runners once he gains possession. He does that better than nearly all players in the league. He also had some nice kicks inside 50 that set us up. 
His hands in close are elite. Can he improve his outside game? Sure. But that is not and will never be his primary role. 
 

He is highly rated by all league coaches. There is a reason for that. 

Cant believe some people are complaining about his game on the weekend.  He got the 4 and 3 votes from the coaches but some still think he had little influence.

Maybe they prefer we'd have drafted Darcy Parish or Aaron Francis and left Oliver for the Bombers at pick 5 or 6.

[DeeSpencer 14,632]

5 hours ago, BW511 said:

301 Metres Gained over that 35 touches, I think the disposal efficiency is a little misleading when you're averaging less than 10m per touch.

 

 

He had 15 contested possessions though. So 80% efficiency on 43% of touches contested is great. Similar 301 MG on 10 kicks 25 handballs is completely fine. 
 

Should he have kicked more? Maybe once or twice, I’d like to see him get towards a 1:1 ratio and also see him get more handball receives from team mates rather than the other way around.
 

But it was a treat to watch him live, he does some special things.

[DeeSpencer 14,632]

12 minutes ago, Pickett2Jackson said:

Cant believe some people are complaining about his game on the weekend.  He got the 4 and 3 votes from the coaches but some still think he had little influence.

Maybe they prefer we'd have drafted Darcy Parish or Aaron Francis and left Oliver for the Bombers at pick 5 or 6.

In fairness to BW it’s fine to be critical of certain stats. That doesn’t mean it’s being critical of his game.

There’s more people complaining about Oliver getting criticised in this thread than there is actual criticism. 

[In Harmes Way 3,901]

Give him the Bentleigh Club and move on....

[BW511 689]

10 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

In fairness to BW it’s fine to be critical of certain stats. That doesn’t mean it’s being critical of his game.

There’s more people complaining about Oliver getting criticised in this thread than there is actual criticism. 

Thanks mate, it's nice to see someone actually read what I was saying, rather than just be offended because I was not bowing down to Oliver (I actually do though, he's a gun)

@Pickett2Jackson I know he won lots of the footy and plenty of contests. My whole point throughout this thread is if we were to lose him, I don't think it would effect our ability to win matches that significantly. He is certainly elite at winning the ball from a contest and giving a quick handball, but his influence on the game is almost zero from then on. He is not a Bont/Dusty/Danger/Fyfe/Cripps who can win a game off his own boot with a big pack mark and goal or by taking the game on and kicking multiple goals.

Forgetting what people think of him versus Oliver, Parish could be used as an example.

Parish had 18 touches with 7 kicks and 11 handballs (411m gained) - I didn't watch the bombers game, so no idea how he played.

If Clayton leaving netted us a Darcy Parish for his role and a real quality outside mid who had 18 kick-favoured possessions, would we be better or worse off?

 

[JimmyGadson 549]

Christ supporters are silly. 

Oliver is obviously a special player. Hard, unbelievable at getting his hands on the ball at a contest, evasive, generally a really good kick to advantage. 

But there is absolutely no question that a large number of his handballs are simply not only not damaging, but put his team mate under immediate pressure. It doesn't matter if he goes at 80% efficiency if his handball is straight to a team mate under heat. 

How do supporter not see that? It's part of why there's so much commentary surrounding his use. 

If he gets that out of his game and looks to players like Pendles and the bont as far as releasing to the right team mate, then he could be the best midfielder in the comp. 

Too often Oliver is going at a million miles in his mind and gives a completely unnecessary handball too close to a team mate under pressure. 

I would rather Oliver get caught holding the ball looking for a better option than give it to early to the wrong option. 

He is the kind of player who has the ability to hold onto the pill longer and off-load to a team mate in a better position, preferably one outside the contest. 

Go back and look at how many times our players gave unnecessary handballs to a team mate who was less than a metre from them. It's the fault of the players calling for it as well as the giver. 

Can't do that against the saints. 

Edited March 23 by JimmyGadson

[Altona-demon 175]

7 minutes ago, BW511 said:

Thanks mate, it's nice to see someone actually read what I was saying, rather than just be offended because I was not bowing down to Oliver (I actually do though, he's a gun)

@Pickett2Jackson I know he won lots of the footy and plenty of contests. My whole point throughout this thread is if we were to lose him, I don't think it would effect our ability to win matches that significantly. He is certainly elite at winning the ball from a contest and giving a quick handball, but his influence on the game is almost zero from then on. He is not a Bont/Dusty/Danger/Fyfe/Cripps who can win a game off his own boot with a big pack mark and goal or by taking the game on and kicking multiple goals.

Forgetting what people think of him versus Oliver, Parish could be used as an example.

Parish had 18 touches with 7 kicks and 11 handballs (411m gained) - I didn't watch the bombers game, so no idea how he played.

If Clayton leaving netted us a Darcy Parish for his role and a real quality outside mid who had 18 kick-favoured possessions, would we be better or worse off?

 

This is a fantastic point - I think the thing that makes Clayton so divisive among the fans is the fact that he is a "statistically heavy" player. 

On paper he looks very, very good. But there seems to be something which irks certain fans who seem to watch his involvements and don't believe his +/- score would be that great. 

 

[DeeSpencer 14,632]

15 minutes ago, BW511 said:

Parish had 18 touches with 7 kicks and 11 handballs (411m gained) - I didn't watch the bombers game, so no idea how he played.

If Clayton leaving netted us a Darcy Parish for his role and a real quality outside mid who had 18 kick-favoured possessions, would we be better or worse off?

Worse unless we got an A grade outside player. 
 

Oliver’s not a match winner yet but he is an A grader. His last season was B+. His 2018 was close to A+. 
 

He doesn’t have to be Petracca but he can be more Lachie Neale and find more kicks, goals and forward handballs. 

[Garbo 467]

5 hours ago, Jaded said:

That’s unfair. He is an inside mid. His primary role is to release the runners once he gains possession. He does that better than nearly all players in the league. He also had some nice kicks inside 50 that set us up. 
His hands in close are elite. Can he improve his outside game? Sure. But that is not and will never be his primary role. 
 

He is highly rated by all league coaches. There is a reason for that. 

Exactly without him someone like Petracca isn’t going to be half as effective 

[The end is nigh 46]

The gripe I have with a few of the naysayers in this thread is the way Clayton is painted as less than loyal. That if we aren’t getting him to finals he’d walk. He is, from all the reports/stories I’ve read, a much loved clubman who cares for the jumper. I hope we sign him soon. IMO worthy of star money because that’s what he is. Stay a dee forever Clarry, hope you make flags happen. 

[willmoy 1,936]

On 3/22/2021 at 7:38 AM, Doug Reemer said:

Oliver plays his 100th game. Has 34 touches at 80% efficiency and Tim Watson not only doesn't acknowledge it but then proceeds to bang on about how he doesn't do enough???

Tim Watson has lost the plot.. Who's the nobody Essendon went with after Oliver? Francis.. Gee I bet they would swap them in a heart beat now!

And i bet i know who they are after now

[willmoy 1,936]

If it costs us to lose Viney to hang on to Oliver and (i've noticed the games when one or the other are not in), then i'm for it, but not the other way round.

[BW511 689]

4 minutes ago, willmoy said:

If it costs us to lose Viney to hang on to Oliver and (i've noticed the games when one or the other are not in), then i'm for it, but not the other way round.

We are stuck with Viney for 5 years

[willmoy 1,936]

Put him in a f/p with a license to kill.

[Jaded 20,526]

2 hours ago, BW511 said:

Thanks mate, it's nice to see someone actually read what I was saying, rather than just be offended because I was not bowing down to Oliver (I actually do though, he's a gun)

@Pickett2Jackson I know he won lots of the footy and plenty of contests. My whole point throughout this thread is if we were to lose him, I don't think it would effect our ability to win matches that significantly. He is certainly elite at winning the ball from a contest and giving a quick handball, but his influence on the game is almost zero from then on. He is not a Bont/Dusty/Danger/Fyfe/Cripps who can win a game off his own boot with a big pack mark and goal or by taking the game on and kicking multiple goals.

Forgetting what people think of him versus Oliver, Parish could be used as an example.

Parish had 18 touches with 7 kicks and 11 handballs (411m gained) - I didn't watch the bombers game, so no idea how he played.

If Clayton leaving netted us a Darcy Parish for his role and a real quality outside mid who had 18 kick-favoured possessions, would we be better or worse off?

 

This post could not be more wrong. There I said it.