4 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

Until they come out and say more and you want them to get their heads out of the media.  Can't have your cake and eat it too.

As far as I'm concerned I just want them to run the club well - keep the finances in check, keep the memberships and sponsorships up and keep the problems to a minimum.  Outside of on field performance I think they're doing pretty well.

I don't share your enthusiasm Wiseblood, Finances are falling ( before this year ) and on field performance is terrible.

They are two main requirements as far as I am concerned Looking like major failures to me.

Just now, old dee said:

I don't share your enthusiasm Wiseblood, Finances are falling ( before this year ) and on field performance is terrible.

They are two main requirements as far as I am concerned Looking like major failures to me.

Okay - but what does this have to do with any tension or cliques or whatever?

I think the club isn't doing too bad re: finances considering the current climate, and while I agree about on field performance, I hardly see how that is down to Pert.  I'd lay that at the feet of Goodwin more than anyone else.  He's the man in charge there who has been given the players he wants and he hasn't put it into place enough for our liking at this point.,

10 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

And how do you know that?  Got any hard evidence?

This is not directed at you OD, so please don't think it is, but all these insinuations and assumptions that get thrown around on here are disappointing.  This site deserves better.  People come on here with the 'well I heard this' or the 'I heard that' and then when enough people get hold of them supporters end up believing it.  It just shouldn't happen.  Too many people can't back anything up, other than they 'heard' something.  Well, you know what?  Great.  They should keep the [censored] measuring to themselves.

From where I sit, there is no evidence whatsoever of cliques or factions or whatever else.  It's just hearsay and unless someone can back it up with evidence it should be deleted.

Now, if you want to talk about our on field efforts then fine - it's been well below par and things need to change drastically.  We have the evidence of that right now.  Our on field results and output for the last 18 months has been terrible and we know we are capable of better.

However, claiming that there are issues off field when there is no evidence at all of this occurring is poor form.  As far as we can see, Bartlett and Pert are actually doing a decent job through all of this to keep the sponsorship coming in and finding ways to raise the cash to ensure that we don't have to go to the AFL for handouts, and thus we are able to continue to invest in a variety of off field things that we need to.  

As I said, this is not meant to be directed at you OD, but pedalling off field problems without any evidence is not something this site should be condoning, as Andy has pointed out a few times already.

I believe I have so you can keep believing everything is rosy  then Good I don't and believe I have evidence.

 

11 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

And how do you know that?  Got any hard evidence?

This is not directed at you OD, so please don't think it is, but all these insinuations and assumptions that get thrown around on here are disappointing.  This site deserves better.  People come on here with the 'well I heard this' or the 'I heard that' and then when enough people get hold of them supporters end up believing it.  It just shouldn't happen.  Too many people can't back anything up, other than they 'heard' something.  Well, you know what?  Great.  They should keep the [censored] measuring to themselves.

From where I sit, there is no evidence whatsoever of cliques or factions or whatever else.  It's just hearsay and unless someone can back it up with evidence it should be deleted.

Now, if you want to talk about our on field efforts then fine - it's been well below par and things need to change drastically.  We have the evidence of that right now.  Our on field results and output for the last 18 months has been terrible and we know we are capable of better.

However, claiming that there are issues off field when there is no evidence at all of this occurring is poor form.  As far as we can see, Bartlett and Pert are actually doing a decent job through all of this to keep the sponsorship coming in and finding ways to raise the cash to ensure that we don't have to go to the AFL for handouts, and thus we are able to continue to invest in a variety of off field things that we need to.  

As I said, this is not meant to be directed at you OD, but pedalling off field problems without any evidence is not something this site should be condoning, as Andy has pointed out a few times already.

Haha ? 

Post of the Year

”nothing to see here...Please go home...Everything is well under Control”

A Nuclear Bomb could explode in the next street and Wise would be “It’s all good”....

2 minutes ago, old dee said:

I believe I have so you can keep believing everything is rosy  then Good I don't and believe I have evidence.

 

And the evidence is... ?

10 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

And the evidence is... ?

I have made my comment earlier in the thread Wise I will leave it at that.

Edited July 9, 20204 yr by old dee

6 hours ago, ManDee said:

teh?

haha.. yeah i seem to have a problem with my " the's" or my "teh's"

37 minutes ago, old dee said:

I don't share your enthusiasm Wiseblood, Finances are falling ( before this year ) and on field performance is terrible.

They are two main requirements as far as I am concerned Looking like major failures to me.

Nevertheless, the President has said he believes we might be able to survive independently without becoming beholden to the AFL. That's a positive sign. I assume Pert should be given some credit for us being in this situation.

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2020/06/30/demons-may-not-need-afl-assistance-after-all-but-they-need-supporters-to-dig/

49 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

So basically, everyone should just shut up because people other than you may be privy to information, and because 'from where you sit' there's no problem then that means there must be no problem.

Got it.

We live in a relatively small city, the same city where our team is based. If you find it so staggeringly unbelievable that people who barrack for the same footy team and people who are involved in that team don't talk to each other about that team then that's up to you.

This thinly veiled swipe at me is easily solved with the ignore function, but I can absolutely say I don't make things up and my track record now is decent enough to not cop you asking for things to be deleted because you don't like them.

 

Imagine if the WB rule had been applied at  inner Suburban pubs and Social Clubs over the past century and a bit. Gee, in the day you could get a smack in the chops for just standing in the wrong spot at a local, imagine saying to a bloke. You are out of order for criticising the Tigers or Pies?  Pow, Wham, Zap, Lights Out.

All this talk about the players having their own groups which stick together and don’t let others in sounds like cliquebait to me. 

39 minutes ago, old dee said:

I have made my comment earlier in the thread Wise I will leave it at that.

Are we talking the third party information?  As I said, that's not evidence.

And who are these players who are being 'played out of position'?  Outside of someone like Brayshaw, I don't think I've seen anyone being played out of their main position.  You could go as far as saying players like Trac got their wish - he put in more effort over pre-season to build his fitness and he has been rewarded with the midfield minutes he craved.

Strikes me as a bit far fetched.  But hey, that's just me, as you said in your post we can take out of what we wish.

The unhappy player playing out of position-Salem?

4 minutes ago, Half forward flank said:

The unhappy player playing out of position-Salem?

Harmes?

Mentioned in an interview before the game last week his best position is mid resting forward.

10 minutes ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

All this talk about the players having their own groups which stick together and don’t let others in sounds like cliquebait to me. 

I've got video evidence of a dance clique at the MFC, and it's not pretty.

44 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Nevertheless, the President has said he believes we might be able to survive independently without becoming beholden to the AFL. That's a positive sign. I assume Pert should be given some credit for us being in this situation.

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2020/06/30/demons-may-not-need-afl-assistance-after-all-but-they-need-supporters-to-dig/

I will wait and see LDC without supporters digging deep it won't happen as he said. Once again the supporters have to dig out management. I made my contribution the first day. Most days I think I am stupid to be following the Dees. If only my father had barracked for Hawthorn! 

2 hours ago, old dee said:

Rusty you can take this as rumour if you like and it is admittedly third hand but I spoke to someone yesterday who tells me he has it from very good authority that a not insignificant part of the  playing group are far from happy with the FD this year. The main gripe is that they are being played out of position and it is killing their careers. A number are being encouraged by their families and managers to look at their options by years end. One good player is of the opinion he wont be at the Dees in 2021 if Goodwin is still there.

This business that the players love Goodwin is hogwash. Now I am not saying it is all the group but a sizable number by all accounts.

This source has never given me a bum steer in the past and does not come up with a constant stream but they have been correct a lot in the past. I cannot say who the players are as I was not told. Take it or leave it for whatever you think.

 

Tail waging the dog. Said player/s can leave if thats how they feel and we wont miss them. Nothing [censored] me more than players complaining about playing out of position and whats best for them. The quicker they leave the better TEAM we will be.

3 hours ago, old dee said:

Rusty you can take this as rumour if you like and it is admittedly third hand but I spoke to someone yesterday who tells me he has it from very good authority that a not insignificant part of the  playing group are far from happy with the FD this year. The main gripe is that they are being played out of position and it is killing their careers. A number are being encouraged by their families and managers to look at their options by years end. One good player is of the opinion he wont be at the Dees in 2021 if Goodwin is still there.

This business that the players love Goodwin is hogwash. Now I am not saying it is all the group but a sizable number by all accounts.

This source has never given me a bum steer in the past and does not come up with a constant stream but they have been correct a lot in the past. I cannot say who the players are as I was not told. Take it or leave it for whatever you think.

 

He has a history of playing players out of their positions. Fritsch, Brayshaw, Harmes are three. He seems incredibly stubborn to me. Infuriatingly monotonous - I couldn't imagine going to work every day and having to listen to him drone on.  

9 minutes ago, Grimes Times said:

Tail waging the dog. Said player/s can leave if thats how they feel and we wont miss them. Nothing [censored] me more than players complaining about playing out of position and whats best for them. The quicker they leave the better TEAM we will be.

Hmm I remember people saying that under Neeld and that worked well.

8 hours ago, whatwhatsaywhat said:

people really hate pert

both from the demons side and the filth side

i personally have no issues with him and can't quite understand the hate, although some of the stories re his times at the pies are...interesting

He had a falling out with McChins at the filth on particular beliefs.

The way they are going under his 'leadership' at the moment leads me to believe that we have a half decent fella in the CEO position at present.

Listen to the Demonland podcast where Peter Jackson was asked about Pert coming in.

His response was damning and I miss Jackson a lot.

12 minutes ago, Demon Disciple said:

He had a falling out with McChins at the filth on particular beliefs.

The way they are going under his 'leadership' at the moment leads me to believe that we have a half decent fella in the CEO position at present.

I think he sounds like a good fella as well. However everyone knew PJ tenure was too short which then nleads me to believe we needed a similiar type to continue what he started.

7 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

The thing that worries me about Pert is his vision for Melbourne doesn’t really sit in reality. He wants us to be a big club and a big commercial business.

Jackson seemed to be focussed on making us a well run boutique club.

There seems to be a rise of wearing different jumpers. The social media has shifted towards gimmicks. Everything possible is sold to a sponsor, including the extra Zurich logo on the back of the jumper. Some of that is the commercial reality of covid and preferable to job losses, but I’m still concerned. 
 

Otherwise he was bought on to build a facility which now seems unlikely and instead has to get involved in footy decisions - it is the core business. 
 

So he has a mess to sort then has to come up with a new plan to improve the club. 

Running as a boutique organisation is fine in an environment where your direct competitors are also boutique. A boutique firm goes after boutique clients for a personable service. They don't go after big clients because they're suited for the big corporates. Our competitors are your Eagles and Pies and Hawks. We would thrive in the short term but once the pressure is on we would continue to be trounced. At the time when Jackson came on board, a boutique approach was probably needed, because we couldn't afford a quick, erratic transition into a big club, which dictates big spending and big visions. Five years into Jackson's plan, with sponsorship and crowds on the up, alongside vastly improved onfield performance, is was completely reasonable in 2018 for the next phase to be introduced. We either come to the table to bet big or we can sit at the $5 a hand table for eternity, and get whiped out whenever a big time player joins the fold. Pert's vision is non-negotiable imo: either we start playing and acting and doing business like a big club or we will forever be irrelevant. Getting 75k supporters to our first and second finals in a decade I think is a reflection of what's possible. The ceiling is higher than what many can see. 

Edited July 9, 20204 yr by praha

Well for me if you take out the fact we lost 1.5m last year on the back of a Prelim final and record membership, he was in charge when we gave Goodwin a three year contract extension and he didn’t get anybody from outside the club to review our footy department last year. I would say he is doing a great job.

6 hours ago, Wiseblood said:

And how do you know that?  Got any hard evidence?

This is not directed at you OD, so please don't think it is, but all these insinuations and assumptions that get thrown around on here are disappointing.  This site deserves better.  People come on here with the 'well I heard this' or the 'I heard that' and then when enough people get hold of them supporters end up believing it.  It just shouldn't happen.  Too many people can't back anything up, other than they 'heard' something.  Well, you know what?  Great.  They should keep the [censored] measuring to themselves.

From where I sit, there is no evidence whatsoever of cliques or factions or whatever else.  It's just hearsay and unless someone can back it up with evidence it should be deleted.

Now, if you want to talk about our on field efforts then fine - it's been well below par and things need to change drastically.  We have the evidence of that right now.  Our on field results and output for the last 18 months has been terrible and we know we are capable of better.

However, claiming that there are issues off field when there is no evidence at all of this occurring is poor form.  As far as we can see, Bartlett and Pert are actually doing a decent job through all of this to keep the sponsorship coming in and finding ways to raise the cash to ensure that we don't have to go to the AFL for handouts, and thus we are able to continue to invest in a variety of off field things that we need to.  

As I said, this is not meant to be directed at you OD, but pedalling off field problems without any evidence is not something this site should be condoning, as Andy has pointed out a few times already.

I disagree, either there are problems and the supporters have a right to know or there aren't and it doesn't matter anyway. I don't really see the harm with people posting things they've heard - no-one will name names as it will betray confidences and everyone should take anything they read with a grain of salt if they're smart enough.

Most of the time these things have an element of truth though, I remember when the message from the club was everything is rosy and Schwab accused people of taking pot shots from the cheap seats. Well it turns out it was worse than insinuated and the place was rotten to the core.

It is frustrating when we don't see the CEO or President have some kind of media presence when supporters are on the verge of insurrection. You can't have it both ways, asking supporters to dig deep with one hand then treating them with contempt with the other. The communication from the club needs to be both direct and broad, they always ask questions in surveys about communication from the club, how connected you feel to the club as a supporter etc. Well personally when I fail to hear from either of the clubs leaders to give me some confidence they have things under control it makes me feel disconnected.

Edited July 9, 20204 yr by Dr. Gonzo

4 hours ago, Wiseblood said:

Are we talking the third party information?  As I said, that's not evidence.

And who are these players who are being 'played out of position'?  Outside of someone like Brayshaw, I don't think I've seen anyone being played out of their main position.  You could go as far as saying players like Trac got their wish - he put in more effort over pre-season to build his fitness and he has been rewarded with the midfield minutes he craved.

Strikes me as a bit far fetched.  But hey, that's just me, as you said in your post we can take out of what we wish.

Off the top of my head Brayshaw TMac Hunt Salem