Financial Issues MFC

[Hellish Inferno 992]

Currently there are 18 teams and 22 games in the home and away season played over 23 weeks (based on 2019 season)

Compare this to Premier League where 20 teams play 38 games over about 40 weeks (also with other competitions in between)

If we stick with 18 teams, why not shorten games to approx. 90 minutes and play 36 games per season over a longer season with a bye round in the middle. That way all teams play each other twice and more opportunity to share the blockbusters etc. Push finals later into October and the cricket can wait!

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

2 minutes ago, Hellish Inferno said:

Currently there are 18 teams and 22 games in the home and away season played over 23 weeks (based on 2019 season)

Compare this to Premier League where 20 teams play 38 games over about 40 weeks (also with other competitions in between)

If we stick with 18 teams, why not shorten games to approx. 90 minutes and play 36 games per season over a longer season with a bye round in the middle. That way all teams play each other twice and more opportunity to share the blockbusters etc. Push finals later into October and the cricket can wait!

Longer season means each game has less meaning and importance.

The cost of hosting games at big grounds like the MCG is huge, so no point struggling to get 20,000 people to lots of games.

We are far better off having a shorter season where every game means more and trying to get more people to those games.

[jnrmac 19,226]

10 hours ago, poita said:

How many of the people whining and moaning about our draw and our perilous financial position:

a) are currently paid up members of the club; and

b) attended all three of our three end of season "blockbuster" games in 2019 when the club basically begged you all to do so?

There would have been lucky to have been 10K of Melbourne supporters at each of those games, so I am comfortable in saying that less than 20% of our members turned up to support the club at those games.

We lose all rights to demand prime time TV coverage and blockbuster fixtures when our own supporters don't even turn up. How can we expect the AFL and channel 7 to fight for us, when we won't fight for ourselves?

Blah blah blah

That's all on the head of the players and the Coach

[Ethan Tremblay 28,473]

31 minutes ago, Half forward flank said:

Not sure on what you base the first point on whats.

http://www.roymorgan.com/findings/8088-afl-supporter-ladder-june-2019-201908160718

 

[Rab D Nesbitt 7,324]

As for the ability to secure more marquee games our reputation of falling over on the big stage doesn't help our cause unfortunately. It hasn't seemed to hurt a club like Carlton however who for some reason have managed to keep their "big club" facade intact whilst crumbling from within. The phrase 'all fur coat and no knickers' immediately comes to mind whenever I hear them mentioned. 

[Kiss of Death 708]

15 minutes ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

http://www.roymorgan.com/findings/8088-afl-supporter-ladder-june-2019-201908160718

 

The drop of almost 30% of hawthorn ‘supporters’ in the last year is a thing of beauty. 
 

Long may it continue. 

[Leoncelli_36 2,264]

1 hour ago, ding said:

yeah nice post Clint.

I have attempted to purchase some Murch on the club website, but the voucher i chose to get with my membership isnt accepted when i go to the online shop to buy my Down jacket and a cap for my daughter. Im not asking for anything more than the voucher to work so i can get some club stuff to wear

I then, like every other member recieved an email from the club which i attach here.......

Then i sent an email stating i not only didnt want a refund, but wanted to make a (very modest) donation on top of my membership to help MFC out. the following reply came from the Club....

 I saw that i had a missed call on my mobile phone a few days later, but dont know who it was from.

We really do need to be more proactive if we are to come out of this bloody Virus lockdown in a survivable position.

 

Yep, I tried to call today, got same thing. I am wanting to buy another membership to support the club. I am already a long time member. I wanted to buy another, but can’t even get on to the club. This is why I pointed out that if the club needs help, they need to ask. I’ll make calls at night from a call centre or using my own phone as a volunteer. We can’t be this complacent 

[Lord Nev 13,511]

1 hour ago, ding said:

yeah nice post Clint.

I have attempted to purchase some Murch on the club website, but the voucher i chose to get with my membership isnt accepted when i go to the online shop to buy my Down jacket and a cap for my daughter. Im not asking for anything more than the voucher to work so i can get some club stuff to wear

I then, like every other member recieved an email from the club which i attach here.......

Then i sent an email stating i not only didnt want a refund, but wanted to make a (very modest) donation on top of my membership to help MFC out. the following reply came from the Club....

 I saw that i had a missed call on my mobile phone a few days later, but dont know who it was from.

We really do need to be more proactive if we are to come out of this bloody Virus lockdown in a survivable position.

 

 

19 minutes ago, Leoncelli_36 said:

Yep, I tried to call today, got same thing. I am wanting to buy another membership to support the club. I am already a long time member. I wanted to buy another, but can’t even get on to the club. This is why I pointed out that if the club needs help, they need to ask. I’ll make calls at night from a call centre or using my own phone as a volunteer. We can’t be this complacent 

Have been trying to contact the club for a month through various means and had no response as well.

Partly about using my member voucher as part payment to purchase a bunch of merch, partly about additional membership options.

Not complaining as such, understand staff have likely been laid off and/or stood down, but we surely need to find ways to actually accept money when people are trying to give it.

 

[cookieboc 669]

5 hours ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

It's a fair point you make.

Since 2018, we've been pathetic in the marquee blockbusters against Collingwood and Richmond and haven't done the events any justice.

The last two Anzac eve games have been a complete yawn fest for the general viewer after an exciting 2017 game.

The AFL has done their part in granting us the public holiday blockbusters but we haven't held our end of the bargain.

And yes, we showed the world what a power house we could possible become in 2018. We outnumbered Hawthorn supporters in a final and well out numbered Geelong supporters! 

yep, traveling to Melbourne to see us get pantsed in the big games is not fun. the last QB win i went to was when Grgic kicked a late winner. Loved the games where that Brad [censored] for the pies kicked a bag a couple of years in a row.

 

Edited June 1, 2020 by cookieboc

[whatwhat say what 19,327]

Thanks @Ethan Tremblay

[Leoncelli_36 2,264]

11 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

 

Have been trying to contact the club for a month through various means and had no response as well.

Partly about using my member voucher as part payment to purchase a bunch of merch, partly about additional membership options.

Not complaining as such, understand staff have likely been laid off and/or stood down, but we surely need to find ways to actually accept money when people are trying to give it.

 

Absolutely. And this was the point I was making earlier in this thread. We too often sit back and wait. People here say “but everyone is doing it tough, no one has money”. Go look at the shopping malls this weekend. Loads of people out buying pointless crap. Look at Bunnings. Packed with shoppers. Many people are receiving more money through government payments than they did when working full time. Yes, some are receiving less, but it’s time to set up some fundraising strategies. No one is suggesting we can make up the $6 million in lost revenue through donations alone, but I’d be looking at ways to minimise the damage. Let’s be frank, there are plenty..plenty ... of Dees fans with money. Those MCC majority aren’t unable to find 50 bucks to put towards a ‘charitable cause’. Asking people for a donation now may be easier than in 6-12 months when the game is running as normal. People will look at it and say, “ahh well, it’s all good, we got the loan from the AFL, crowds are coming back, business as usual again. They don’t need my help”. Again, people will say there are others in greater need of the money. We are ‘supporters’ of this club. It needs our support right now. People are free to pick and choose what organisations they support at this time. No issue with that. But as a fan and member of a struggling club, I’ll choose to support something that I care about to ensure its survival. 

End rant. 

[Lord Nev 13,511]

18 minutes ago, Leoncelli_36 said:

Absolutely. And this was the point I was making earlier in this thread. We too often sit back and wait. People here say “but everyone is doing it tough, no one has money”. Go look at the shopping malls this weekend. Loads of people out buying pointless crap. Look at Bunnings. Packed with shoppers. Many people are receiving more money through government payments than they did when working full time. Yes, some are receiving less, but it’s time to set up some fundraising strategies. No one is suggesting we can make up the $6 million in lost revenue through donations alone, but I’d be looking at ways to minimise the damage. Let’s be frank, there are plenty..plenty ... of Dees fans with money. Those MCC majority aren’t unable to find 50 bucks to put towards a ‘charitable cause’. Asking people for a donation now may be easier than in 6-12 months when the game is running as normal. People will look at it and say, “ahh well, it’s all good, we got the loan from the AFL, crowds are coming back, business as usual again. They don’t need my help”. Again, people will say there are others in greater need of the money. We are ‘supporters’ of this club. It needs our support right now. People are free to pick and choose what organisations they support at this time. No issue with that. But as a fan and member of a struggling club, I’ll choose to support something that I care about to ensure its survival. 

End rant. 

I work for a large business that has had a 99% downturn in business due to covid-19. We've done, and are doing, absolutely everything possible to keep up communication with our clients and customers and drive any kind of income we can.

As we've seen here from just a few examples, Dees supporters are wanting to help, wanting to buy a membership, wanting to buy some merch, why are we failing in such a simple part of the business? Is it worrying, or just 'one of those things'? I don't know, but come on MFC, we're here wanting to contribute to the club we love.

[Leoncelli_36 2,264]

1 minute ago, Lord Nev said:

I work for a large business that has had a 99% downturn in business due to covid-19. We've done, and are doing, absolutely everything possible to keep up communication with our clients and customers and drive any kind of income we can.

As we've seen here from just a few examples, Dees supporters are wanting to help, wanting to buy a membership, wanting to buy some merch, why are we failing in such a simple part of the business? Is it worrying, or just 'one of those things'? I don't know, but come on MFC, we're here wanting to contribute to the club we love.

I’d suggest trying to contact them

via social media. The Facebook team seem very responsive. That might be the best avenue. Would love to get a few members of this page to send them a Facebook message to tell them we are here to help.

[Demon Disciple 11,082]

1 hour ago, Kiss of Death said:

The drop of almost 30% of hawthorn ‘supporters’ in the last year is a thing of beauty. 
 

Long may it continue. 

pets don't live as long as humans KoD ?

[Dr. Gonzo 22,542]

8 hours ago, Hellish Inferno said:

Currently there are 18 teams and 22 games in the home and away season played over 23 weeks (based on 2019 season)

Compare this to Premier League where 20 teams play 38 games over about 40 weeks (also with other competitions in between)

If we stick with 18 teams, why not shorten games to approx. 90 minutes and play 36 games per season over a longer season with a bye round in the middle. That way all teams play each other twice and more opportunity to share the blockbusters etc. Push finals later into October and the cricket can wait!

 

Premier league has no finals series so requires a full home and away fixture.

[Ethan Tremblay 28,473]

10 hours ago, Hellish Inferno said:

Currently there are 18 teams and 22 games in the home and away season played over 23 weeks (based on 2019 season)

Compare this to Premier League where 20 teams play 38 games over about 40 weeks (also with other competitions in between)

If we stick with 18 teams, why not shorten games to approx. 90 minutes and play 36 games per season over a longer season with a bye round in the middle. That way all teams play each other twice and more opportunity to share the blockbusters etc. Push finals later into October and the cricket can wait!

Part of what makes our game great is the endurance it takes. 90 minute quarters? Might as well make it non-contact and call it Soccer. 

Edited June 1, 2020 by Ethan Tremblay

[whatwhat say what 19,327]

afl doesn't have the rights to use grounds between october and end of march

the fixture is ALWAYS going to be compromised...until they reduce it to a 17-round season 

[george_on_the_outer 7,042]

13 hours ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

http://www.roymorgan.com/findings/8088-afl-supporter-ladder-june-2019-201908160718

 

Unfortunately this "argument" comes up every time someone "discovers" it. 

Roy Morgan do surveys...So when they survey anyone in NSW about what club they support in the AFL, the answer is the first NSW based club they can think of.  The fact that they have zero interest in AFL is irrelevant to the question.

So the Sydney Swans is the most supported club in the land?  Complete rubbish.  It is a measure of the number of responses RM got in NSW in their sample.  How many supporters do they think Sydney have in W.A. or S.A for example? 

According to RM 1 in 25 people in the whole country support the Swans, simply because they extrapolate the NSW survey numbers to the whole country. 

 

It looks good for the AFL when negotiating broadcast deals but the only true measure is the number of memberships taken out. 

[Sir Why You Little 34,717]

1 hour ago, george_on_the_outer said:

Unfortunately this "argument" comes up every time someone "discovers" it. 

Roy Morgan do surveys...So when they survey anyone in NSW about what club they support in the AFL, the answer is the first NSW based club they can think of.  The fact that they have zero interest in AFL is irrelevant to the question.

So the Sydney Swans is the most supported club in the land?  Complete rubbish.  It is a measure of the number of responses RM got in NSW in their sample.  How many supporters do they think Sydney have in W.A. or S.A for example? 

According to RM 1 in 25 people in the whole country support the Swans, simply because they extrapolate the NSW survey numbers to the whole country. 

 

It looks good for the AFL when negotiating broadcast deals but the only true measure is the number of memberships taken out. 

I have always thought the MFC have far more supporters than the numbers suggest. 
they are just “silent” because we have been so poor for so long

2018 gave me a glimpse of that

[daisycutter 28,641]

3 hours ago, george_on_the_outer said:

Unfortunately this "argument" comes up every time someone "discovers" it. 

Roy Morgan do surveys...So when they survey anyone in NSW about what club they support in the AFL, the answer is the first NSW based club they can think of.  The fact that they have zero interest in AFL is irrelevant to the question.

So the Sydney Swans is the most supported club in the land?  Complete rubbish.  It is a measure of the number of responses RM got in NSW in their sample.  How many supporters do they think Sydney have in W.A. or S.A for example? 

According to RM 1 in 25 people in the whole country support the Swans, simply because they extrapolate the NSW survey numbers to the whole country. 

 

It looks good for the AFL when negotiating broadcast deals but the only true measure is the number of memberships taken out. 

and to add to that i've had a bit to do with RM (albeit a few years ago) and i wouldn't trust them as far as i could kick them 

[Grr-owl 1,079]

17 hours ago, jnrmac said:

Blah blah blah

That's all on the head of the players and the Coach

Damn right. Win and they will come.

[titan_uranus 22,673]

Quite a few interesting arguments/debates in this thread.

I agree with those who say the club's communication to the members during COVID-19 has been poor. IMO it is a continuation of the downward trend in the club's communications over the past 1-3 years.

On the topic of taking out memberships, my position has always been that if you have the money but you choose to withhold it as some sort of "protest", you're doing the club a disservice and you arguably call into question the use of the term "supporter" to describe you: what sort of "supporting" is that? 

As to attendances, there's no doubt that when any team plays poorly in a season its attendances drop. The interesting thing seems to be that this phenomenon affects some clubs more than others: in particular, it affects us more than clubs like Richmond, Collingwood or Essendon. When we play poorly, we stop going. When they play poorly, they still draw crowds. That helps the AFL keep scheduling them for blockbuster fixture slots even when they're coming off a poor year. 

It's very hard to criticise people for not going to games because there can be so many reasons why attending may not be possible for all of us at all of our games. My general view remains that if you can afford it (both as to time and money), you should go, whether we're playing well or not.

Certainly, regardless, my view is that if you make a deliberate decision to not go to games or not buy a membership out of "protest", you shouldn't then complain about a subsequent poor fixture or poor sponsorship results given both those things are impacted on our attendances/memberships.

On 6/1/2020 at 3:59 PM, Bring-Back-Powell said:

And yes, we showed the world what a power house we could possible become in 2018. We outnumbered Hawthorn supporters in a final and well out numbered Geelong supporters! 

This reads as sarcasm, which I don't understand. 

The crowd at those two finals was incredible, akin to any loud finals/ANZAC Day crowd I've ever been to, and MFC-dominant both times. 

[Sir Why You Little 34,717]

5 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

Quite a few interesting arguments/debates in this thread.

I agree with those who say the club's communication to the members during COVID-19 has been poor. IMO it is a continuation of the downward trend in the club's communications over the past 1-3 years.

On the topic of taking out memberships, my position has always been that if you have the money but you choose to withhold it as some sort of "protest", you're doing the club a disservice and you arguably call into question the use of the term "supporter" to describe you: what sort of "supporting" is that? 

As to attendances, there's no doubt that when any team plays poorly in a season its attendances drop. The interesting thing seems to be that this phenomenon affects some clubs more than others: in particular, it affects us more than clubs like Richmond, Collingwood or Essendon. When we play poorly, we stop going. When they play poorly, they still draw crowds. That helps the AFL keep scheduling them for blockbuster fixture slots even when they're coming off a poor year. 

It's very hard to criticise people for not going to games because there can be so many reasons why attending may not be possible for all of us at all of our games. My general view remains that if you can afford it (both as to time and money), you should go, whether we're playing well or not.

Certainly, regardless, my view is that if you make a deliberate decision to not go to games or not buy a membership out of "protest", you shouldn't then complain about a subsequent poor fixture or poor sponsorship results given both those things are impacted on our attendances/memberships.

This reads as sarcasm, which I don't understand. 

The crowd at those two finals was incredible, akin to any loud finals/ANZAC Day crowd I've ever been to, and MFC-dominant both times. 

If Collingwood, Essendon or Richmond played poorly for 50+ years their attendance figures would be poor just like ours can be

[Scoop Junior 3,021]

2 hours ago, titan_uranus said:

As to attendances, there's no doubt that when any team plays poorly in a season its attendances drop. The interesting thing seems to be that this phenomenon affects some clubs more than others: in particular, it affects us more than clubs like Richmond, Collingwood or Essendon. When we play poorly, we stop going. When they play poorly, they still draw crowds. That helps the AFL keep scheduling them for blockbuster fixture slots even when they're coming off a poor year. 

I'm not sure that's correct. It's just that those clubs have more fans so the crowd figures still look good even with the drop off. As a %, which is the key stat, I reckon it's about the same if not worse for those clubs.

For instance, our 20,000 vs an interstate team when we are struggling might look poor as an absolute number, but it would be similar to the % decrease in a Carlton-Collingwood crowd when they are struggling. It's just that they'd still get 45,000 which appears better (however they would've normally got 80,000).

[whatwhat say what 19,327]

this helps...

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/early-christmas-present-mcg-tenant-clubs-get-multi-million-dollar-windfall-20200603-p54z7j.html

Collingwood, Melbourne, Richmond, Hawthorn, Carlton and Essendon will each receive home game payments estimated at between $150,000 and $200,000 per match for the remainder of the shortened season.

Edited June 3, 2020 by whatwhatsaywhat