Training Ground?

[Redleg 41,942]

16 minutes ago, Red and Bluebeard said:

I hear Bob Dylan is in favour of it too

"How many years must the Dees supporters wait, before they can have a home ground?

The answer my friend, is blowin' in the wind, ..."

But wait! "Cos the times, they are a-changin' ..."

Perhaps we can have the Hurricane Carter boxing room.

[Red and Bluebeard 2,101]

3 minutes ago, Redleg said:

Perhaps we can have the Hurricane Carter boxing room.

And a "Knockin on Heaven's door " trophy room for demons.

[Redleg 41,942]

Just now, Red and Bluebeard said:

And a "Knockin on Heaven's door " trophy room for demons.

Maybe even the Puff the Magic Dragon medical supplies room.

[Red and Bluebeard 2,101]

3 minutes ago, Redleg said:

Maybe even the Puff the Magic Dragon medical supplies room.

Not to mention the Red and Blue Wiggles children's playground.

[Mazer Rackham 14,971]

5 hours ago, Red and Bluebeard said:

I hear Bob Dylan is in favour of it too

"How many years must the Dees supporters wait, before they can have a home ground?

The answer my friend, is blowin' in the wind, ..."

But wait! "Cos the times, they are a-changin' ..."

leave your paddock field behind, the horse track calls for you ♪
forget the far flung fields, they will not follow you
the black and whites who recently were crowned
will soon be training on your cricket ground ♫
strike another match, go start anew
coz it's all over now, red and blue

[Kick_It_To_Pickett 3,293]

On 21/12/2023 at 19:37, whatwhat say what said:

As the MELBOURNE Football Club I’d be very happy for us to have a training / administration base at Caulfield, with a satellite base at Casey, and afl games played at the MCG, aflw at princes park and Casey, and vfl and vflw at Casey

Representation all over the city!

If we are going to go to Caulfield, I’d hope like hell that AFLW games were being played there. They are currently completely inaccessible for those who live in inner Melbourne. Casey is not convenient for anyone, save for those that live in the region, which is a tiny proportion of our members 

[Harvey Wallbanger 1,260]

I don't think that AFLW games will be allowed at Caulfield as it is unlikely any structures (like grandstands) will be allowed inside the track, i.e. where the grounds would be. 

[Macca 17,113]

32 minutes ago, Hawk the Demon said:

I don't think that AFLW games will be allowed at Caulfield as it is unlikely any structures (like grandstands) will be allowed inside the track, i.e. where the grounds would be. 

Couldn't the patrons watch the AFLW games held within the racecourse from the existing grandstands?  Seems like a no-brainer

Also, for those wanting access to bars and eateries, well Caulfield racecourse has all that and more and if we bring the numbers, they'd no doubt open things up on non race days.  There's your socialising taken care of by default

And the talk is for our buildings to house gyms, swimming pools and indoor training facility/another grandstand to be built on the back straight

So there may well be 2 vantage points to view practice/games.  With 1000's of free seating

We'd be moving into a structure that already exists whilst adding what we need

It's like we just stumbled upon exactly what we're looking for and need and it may not exceed our budget and we still may get government funding anyway

 

 

[picket fence 17,973]

On 21/12/2023 at 22:52, Diamond_Jim said:

No

Tigers are

Punt Road is limited in so many ways. Take a trip down there and you'll understand

Collingwood will move to Fairfield within ten years

Fairfield Infectious diseases Hospital?😱 lets hope so

[Demonsone 2,050]

Worth listening to Pert @ the AGM as discussed in detail as what is needed now & in years decades to come, the issues with AAMi park and shared facilities plus access  due to concerts etc, not just 1 oval and went on to say that the his team & the board explored all opportunities & Caulfield represents the best. 

[george_on_the_outer 7,843]

4 hours ago, picket fence said:

Fairfield Infectious diseases Hospital?😱 lets hope so

That is long gone…..Now repurposed as Thomas Embling hospital. Houses those in the criminal justice system with psychiatric- mental problems….probably more appropriate for Collingwood.

Edited December 28, 2023 by george_on_the_outer

[Redleg 41,942]

16 hours ago, Macca said:

Couldn't the patrons watch the AFLW games held within the racecourse from the existing grandstands?  Seems like a no-brainer

Also, for those wanting access to bars and eateries, well Caulfield racecourse has all that and more and if we bring the numbers, they'd no doubt open things up on non race days.  There's your socialising taken care of by default

And the talk is for our buildings to house gyms, swimming pools and indoor training facility/another grandstand to be built on the back straight

So there may well be 2 vantage points to view practice/games.  With 1000's of free seating

We'd be moving into a structure that already exists whilst adding what we need

It's like we just stumbled upon exactly what we're looking for and need and it may not exceed our budget and we still may get government funding anyway

 

 

You couldn't watch games from the existing stands, unless the oval was built at the northern edge of the midfield and even then there would be viewing difficulties, with one reason being the huge screen in the way and it would be too far away from the game

However, you could build a grandstand outside the track, if one oval was near enough. 

You also build a longer, lower grandstand, that would not impede the view from the existing stands, of the back of the race track.

Another factor against the current stands, is the cost of opening and securing them them on footy days. It would be prohibitive.

There would be no problem with food and drink catering at the other end of the midfield car park and there would probably be a permanent cafe in addition, near or in the new facilities.

Architects will sort out all these issues, in a state of the art development.

We have waited a long time, but with the opportunities available within this site, it will be worth the wait.

We are really talking about a magnificent opportunity to have the best facilities in the AFL and be the envy of every other AFL club.

It will also help to some degree with luring players from other clubs, if they are weighing up competing options.

As the original Big Kev and also the one on DL would say, " Get Excited".

Edited December 28, 2023 by Redleg

[Macca 17,113]

3 hours ago, Redleg said:

You couldn't watch games from the existing stands, unless the oval was built at the northern edge of the midfield and even then there would be viewing difficulties, with one reason being the huge screen in the way and it would be too far away from the game

However, you could build a grandstand outside the track, if one oval was near enough. 

You also build a longer, lower grandstand, that would not impede the view from the existing stands, of the back of the race track.

My comments were more pertinant to practice or intraclub games in a general sense not high-drawing games per say

The existing stands could act the same way as being high up in the bleachers at the MCG (bring your Swarovski's!)

As for AFLW games, if our would-be buildings incorporated a large grandstand on the back straight, then the viewing would be ideal if one of the ovals was situated in front of that stand (might have to run North to South though because of the setting sun) Alternatively, just play the AFLW games at Princes Park

A lot depends on the configuration of the 2 ovals situated within the race track 

Another alternative is for the buildings required (with a grandstand?) to be built on the Western end of the racecourse (where the horses currently are once they pass the winning post)

Edited December 28, 2023 by Macca

[No. 31 1,382]

How the set up at Caulfield might look and function will most definitely depend upon where the MFC ovals & facilities are located inside the racecourse precinct. If you want a mini stadium for AFLW/VFL then I would say Glen Huntly Oval on the southern side would be the best option as you could have stands and light towers (which do not impeed views from the existing racecourse stands) and then have a second practice oval inside the race track. Any cricket or football clubs displaced could get a new oval inside the track area. This would require some additional negotiations with City of Glen Eira because Glen Huntly Oval is separate to the race course trust AFAIK.

Additionally, allowing access to Glen Eira Secondary College could probably trigger governmental funding if done the right way ... 🤔

[whatwhat say what 23,428]

games won't ever be played at caulfield - it's a training / administration campus to accompany our training / game campus at casey

princes park should be the home of nearly all aflw games played by melbourne clubs if the afl are so determined not to use docklands, the stadium they own but have determined is too big / expensive to run for aflw

Edited December 28, 2023 by whatwhat say what

[picket fence 17,973]

2 hours ago, george_on_the_outer said:

That is long gone…..Now repurposed as Thomas Embling hospital. Houses those in the criminal justice system with psychiatric- mental problems….probably more appropriate for Collingwood.

Then thats definately the place they should relocate to!🤪

[Grr-owl 1,257]

3 hours ago, No. 31 said:

How the set up at Caulfield might look and function will most definitely depend upon where the MFC ovals & facilities are located inside the racecourse precinct. If you want a mini stadium for AFLW/VFL then I would say Glen Huntly Oval on the southern side would be the best option as you could have stands and light towers (which do not impeed views from the existing racecourse stands) and then have a second practice oval inside the race track. Any cricket or football clubs displaced could get a new oval inside the track area. This would require some additional negotiations with City of Glen Eira because Glen Huntly Oval is separate to the race course trust AFAIK.

Additionally, allowing access to Glen Eira Secondary College could probably trigger governmental funding if done the right way ... 🤔

Oh, let it be so. My kids go to that school and it is sadly lacking in facilities. 

[ElDiablo14 5,036]

On 28/12/2023 at 08:33, picket fence said:

Fairfield Infectious diseases Hospital?😱 lets hope so

How I wish that club could be shipped out of Australia.

[beelzebub 23,390]

to save derailing the "training' thread any more ....I shall revert to discussion here

 

@dpositive  just by way of interest  have you been to Caulfield and visited within...i.e  the "commons' area ?   It's vast....fn huge really ..you could lose two ovals there..    My own thoughts are this will and possibly should only be viewed as a training facility and not a playing location..as such.  But....  Cursory investigation shows that the water table there is around at LEAST 50-60 M.  So ??     You could feasibly DROP the playing surface of at least one oval and construct  viewing stands which would not impose upose the surrounding areas. Capacity would not need to be huge.

Much is made by yourself and others about Greenfield locales..    I stuggle to see much being accomodated at FB/PM...  Instigating facilites at Caulfield would not mean upending anyone and 'turfing' them out   ( couldnt help myself there..lol ).  I can't see how that is accomplished at PM...Someone would be miffed surely... There just ISNT the availability of acreage to develop currently.. At Fishermans ....Real Estate will be at a premium.. Again...To obtain TWO ovals that you if not quite use exclusively can 'hog' and limit attendances etc...   just can't see it.

Going to FB/PM is akin to driving down a congested court...  it's a pain in the proverbial getting there.  It may look central on a map...but access wise....it's the pits...     But it will be fine for LOCALS... and good luck to them if thats their choice of residence...they won't be travelling to use facilites.

[Diamond_Jim 12,687]

15 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

My own thoughts are this will and possibly should only be viewed as a training facility and not a playing location..

I think you are right on this score. Casey will continue as our main match playing venue outside the MCG.

Having been to Casey many times (other than distance) it's a good ground for viewing football for crowds up to say 2k.

The wildcard is the Womens team. Princes Park is a good location but it's soulless IMO. Dare I say I'd prefer Victoria Park

[Macca 17,113]

Posted the following on the training thread but this thread is more appropriate

I reckon the MRC will welcome us with open arms.  We'll be seen as a partner in a win/win situation

Just an opinion mind you and a gut feeling but I reckon the MRC will see us coming in as a way of growing their own membership and a chance to make $$$'s on non race days

For the MFC, we'll get exactly what we want in terms of training grounds & indoor facilities for the players.  As well as buildings for the admin 

The supporters would get a great view of training and/or practice games from the existing stands and any new stands (Western end of the course?) 

*See image below*

So the building near the winning post (white roof) is the main grandstand.  If you were at the races, the back straight is a fair way away but the 2 training grounds would be a lot closer than that

As for the 2 ovals, one might run alongside the home straight (n.b. the home straight isn't pointed directly West (so no Sun issues) The other oval more towards the back straight (?)

A lot of the existing buildings and stables from about the 2000m mark to the 1400m mark were formerly used for training horse but Caulfield is no longer a training facility.  The horses are brought in on race days and there are heaps of stables behind the main grandstand for use on racedays

So our building requirements could be put up anywhere from the 2000m mark to the 1400m mark ... incorporating a grandstand (?)

The oval at the top (Glen Huntly Park) will give you an idea of the space available elsewhere (specifically inside the actual racecourse) ... you could fit 3 or 4 ovals inside the actual racecourse

Again, the above is just a personal opinion not based on any data or info.  I certainly don't have any inside knowledge.  Others may see things way differently

Here's the image of the course ...

 

 

[dpositive 1,818]

9 hours ago, beelzebub said:

to save derailing the "training' thread any more ....I shall revert to discussion here

 

@dpositive  just by way of interest  have you been to Caulfield and visited within...i.e  the "commons' area ?   It's vast....fn huge really ..you could lose two ovals there..    My own thoughts are this will and possibly should only be viewed as a training facility and not a playing location..as such.  But....  Cursory investigation shows that the water table there is around at LEAST 50-60 M.  So ??     You could feasibly DROP the playing surface of at least one oval and construct  viewing stands which would not impose upose the surrounding areas. Capacity would not need to be huge.

Much is made by yourself and others about Greenfield locales..    I stuggle to see much being accomodated at FB/PM...  Instigating facilites at Caulfield would not mean upending anyone and 'turfing' them out   ( couldnt help myself there..lol ).  I can't see how that is accomplished at PM...Someone would be miffed surely... There just ISNT the availability of acreage to develop currently.. At Fishermans ....Real Estate will be at a premium.. Again...To obtain TWO ovals that you if not quite use exclusively can 'hog' and limit attendances etc...   just can't see it.

Going to FB/PM is akin to driving down a congested court...  it's a pain in the proverbial getting there.  It may look central on a map...but access wise....it's the pits...     But it will be fine for LOCALS... and good luck to them if thats their choice of residence...they won't be travelling to use facilites.

Thanks for your considered comments.

Haven't been to Caulfield for years and yes understand there is plenty of room. I am aware of the racing industry involvement and how this may compromise any club interes.

I agree that we should not be looking at a game facility which would require more seating but more a training admin area. Corporate and retail for the proposed local community has greater potential in a greenfield site which is why I m looking at FB. No One needs to be compromised at FB or turfed out. Have you been to FB it is huge. It is true that real estate there is perhaps compromised by hungry developers but ther is also potential for joint development. It is part of the reason I have sought dlandr and MFC member knowledge.

It is true that it may be a pain to get to at the moment but the development board and the demands of 80,00 population may remedy that. an appropriate entertainment facility may even help the board achieve some transport reforms.  

Happy to discuss on 0448110212.

[dpositive 1,818]

8 hours ago, Macca said:

Posted the following on the training thread but this thread is more appropriate

I reckon the MRC will welcome us with open arms.  We'll be seen as a partner in a win/win situation

Just an opinion mind you and a gut feeling but I reckon the MRC will see us coming in as a way of growing their own membership and a chance to make $$$'s on non race days

For the MFC, we'll get exactly what we want in terms of training grounds & indoor facilities for the players.  As well as buildings for the admin 

The supporters would get a great view of training and/or practice games from the existing stands and any new stands (Western end of the course?) 

*See image below*

So the building near the winning post (white roof) is the main grandstand.  If you were at the races, the back straight is a fair way away but the 2 training grounds would be a lot closer than that

As for the 2 ovals, one might run alongside the home straight (n.b. the home straight isn't pointed directly West (so no Sun issues) The other oval more towards the back straight (?)

A lot of the existing buildings and stables from about the 2000m mark to the 1400m mark were formerly used for training horse but Caulfield is no longer a training facility.  The horses are brought in on race days and there are heaps of stables behind the main grandstand for use on racedays

So our building requirements could be put up anywhere from the 2000m mark to the 1400m mark ... incorporating a grandstand (?)

The oval at the top (Glen Huntly Park) will give you an idea of the space available elsewhere (specifically inside the actual racecourse) ... you could fit 3 or 4 ovals inside the actual racecourse

Again, the above is just a personal opinion not based on any data or info.  I certainly don't have any inside knowledge.  Others may see things way differently

Here's the image of the course ...

 

 

Yeh it looks like a good space and only needs the racing industry to be happy. and you have a good set of binoculars like they do.

Seriously not opposed just like to see the detail.

[dpositive 1,818]

I suppose I should declare I do not have any financial or any other interest in FB or PM or Caulfield.

Havent got enough room here for two ovals either.

[Macca 17,113]

38 minutes ago, dpositive said:

Yeh it looks like a good space and only needs the racing industry to be happy. and you have a good set of binoculars like they do.

Seriously not opposed just like to see the detail.

Might be a while before we see any of the details dp (unless they get leaked haha) 

But what stands out to me is how much space there is inside the racecourse itself.  I've been to the Caulfield races a stack of times but to be honest, never looked inside the actual course very often as I was too busy trying to back a winner! 

And it's important to know the MRC's stance with all this too.  They are sitting on a goldmine at Sandown as they own that course outright and the land is worth a fortune

I read recently that selling part of Sandown is a bit costly so it's all or nothing. 

And it won't be nothing

So if or when they sell it completely they'll be cashed up to improve the Caulfield & Mornington courses (but mainly Caulfield initially) 

Further to that they want to build a proper 2nd course inside the existing course and that might be an all-weather course

Why? So as to pick up the slack for all the Sandown midweek racing that Sandown holds now.  Lights could be constructed as well so they can hold a host of night meetings

So they've got some plans of their own

There are now a lot of unused buildings and stables now that Caulfield is no longer a training facility so I suppose that's where we come into the picture (in that previously posted image, the area from the 2000m mark to the 1600m mark)

So it could be a nice, cosy relationship where both clubs win

The MRC does need bigger crowds and a larger membership as Flemington is still ultra popular and Moonee Valley will be hot competition once they finish the do-over there

If we end up there I've got no doubt the MRC will be eyeing off our 70,000 members (might be 90,000 or more by the time we take up residence!)

Edited January 12, 2024 by Macca