If the players cannot kick    or handball  or mark the ball,   then they need to practice. Otherwise why bother doing any training at all.

If using such a ball helps,    fantastic,   they might achieve 5% improvement, as long as it does not send them backward in skills, its good. The more you practice the luckier you get, (and better you get) in golf,  football, relationships, any sport or endeavour you like

Should they be proficient in these skill areas is another question.   Like kicking for goal from a set shot. No AFL player should miss    but they do,  and its all clubs.

Should foot and hand skills be an item that helps a player to be  recruited    probably   but  no point in having these skills   if you are where the ball aint ! 

I did like old Jack !  talked to all the young cheer squad kids, did not matter your club or who your dad was. A bastard as a player perhaps but that was 35 years before.

Go hard or go home,  Merry Christmas,   2020   I might see a few more wins this year, like the number.

Go Dees !!

11 hours ago, Demonland said:

That was when the three rookies were doing the "intensive exercises" together during match sim. When the breakaway groups were doing them they mostly paired off with players of similar builds. Luke probably should have paired off with Rivers. 

On Rivers he's probably taller than the specs I've seen quoted. He's a big kid. Doesn't look small standing next to Jackson. Has huge mitts. Will be a big unit with a few Preseasons under his belt. Have been told he can play midfield as well averaging 27 possessions and a goal a game as a mid. 

Pleased about Rivers being picked-up by the MFC ... he is an exciting prospect ripe for the bigtime. He will get a larger frame and I suspect, quickly, too. Could develop into a key backman, for mine; has that Gary Hardeman look about him and related movements, yet taller. If he turns  out to be half as good a footballer as GH, then he will star after a decent. complete orientation.

1 hour ago, drdrake said:

We are the worst kicking side in the AFL, great on the club for using a junior training tool but my point is they shouldn't need to, the fact they are in concerning

I think it’s just reality - I agree that ideally all players would have their kicking technique down pat by AFL, but in practice plenty of them have ingrained bad habits, and it’s not isolated to the MFC.

I also doubt they’re using the ball to teach them how to kick from scratch. They would all know the theory. It’s more that it gives the immediate feedback and it comes cheaply, or possibly for free. A 1%er, if you will. I think in terms of concerns, this ranks a solid 0 out of 10

For what it's worth I think they may only be using those precision balls for certain drills and goal kicking. Not all the balls at training are that type.

I get that it's difficult to change techniques at this stage but that doesn't mean you can't try. I also get that in the heat of a game players might revert back under pressure but again it doesn't mean you can't attempt to change it particularly when doing nothing won't fix it either.

You also can't just draft a team of elite kicks. Not every player in the pool is an elite kick. Sure we all want elite kicks but there are other skills sets we need too.

Most professional sportsmen use training to make there skills better no matter what their level of skill they have, Lionel Messi and other stars of soccer practice for hours to hone and improve their ball control and kicking.

Why should AFL be any different when coaches spend time on improving their kicking and handball under pressure the player will only improve these skills.

If the player has no idea what they are doing wrong then they cannot fix it, the ball will give them an idea of what to fix.

When confidence is down your kicking will be the first thing to suffer.
I don’t think Hibbard for example needs to be the most accurate kick. He gets the ball takes off quickly, up the ground Melksham for example, puts body on his opponent enough to take off and give him a break, he heads to open space, Hibbard who has just gained 10m from a quick break kicks a low fast 60m pass into that open space. It doesn’t need to be a laser kick, Melksham has the time to gather if he doesn’t mark and our elite runners Tmac, ANB (next year Tomlinson and Langdon included) are there to provide support. A couple of goals in this way “chaos apparently” and the oppo defensive zone pushing up the ground is broken. Backs are made accountable, then Oliver, Viney, Brayshaw, Harmes have a little more space to waltz the ball through the centre in a series of quick handballs like we seen in 2018.

We have a lot to work on but confidence will see the team improve out of site.

1 hour ago, Deemania since 56 said:

Pleased about Rivers being picked-up by the MFC ... he is an exciting prospect ripe for the bigtime. He will get a larger frame and I suspect, quickly, too. Could develop into a key backman, for mine; has that Gary Hardeman look about him and related movements, yet taller. If he turns  out to be half as good a footballer as GH, then he will star after a decent. complete orientation.

Funny to watch him in the continuous hand ball drill, threw himself in with gusto and spent his petrol tickets early, suddenly realised the drill lasted longer than he thought

Fought through it tthough

6 minutes ago, Satyriconhome said:

Funny to watch him in the continuous hand ball drill, threw himself in with gusto and spent his petrol tickets early, suddenly realised the drill lasted longer than he thought

Fought through it tthough

If he treats every drill like that he'll be a future AA player. I hope he was commended for it. Well done young man.

I hate the old school, fixed mindset talk about players being unable to fix skill execution once they are in the AFL system, it is complete rubbish. Skills can be learned and improved at any age and at virtually any level of skill. If we perceive our players to have skill deficiencies then it is absolutely the right thing to develop drills and training aids to assist players to improve. Doing anything but this would be crazy.

18 minutes ago, FlashInThePan said:

I hate the old school, fixed mindset talk about players being unable to fix skill execution once they are in the AFL system, it is complete rubbish. Skills can be learned and improved at any age and at virtually any level of skill. If we perceive our players to have skill deficiencies then it is absolutely the right thing to develop drills and training aids to assist players to improve. Doing anything but this would be crazy.

Absolutely spot on!! well said. 

7 hours ago, drdrake said:

I'm not getting worked up about it, more highlighting that the club need to revert to an U9/10 training tool due to the fact the players we have drafted don't have the ability to execute the most important skill in todays game.  So it isn't nothing, it is concerning we have to revert to this tool 

Swans did OK in 2012 winning a Premiership. They went out straight after it and got a biomechanics specialist purely to work on the squads kicking skills. He was using all sorts of far out methods. He was filming everything they did and each part of their kicking techniques and working on improving them.

They recruited a bloke a year later who was going OK. He'd won a couple of premierships. He had a weird kicking action when he arrived where he went right out on an arc. They retrained his kicking style after he arrived. He's going OK. He's now 7th on the all time goals list and about to pass 1000. His name is Lance Franklin. 

In theory you're right that you might expect 18 year olds to arrive with perfect kicking skills. But that's a fantasy. At least they have finally appointed a resource to focus on kicking technique. It's awesome he's gone out there to find whatever it takes to get the improvement. Instead of being upset about it you should be wrapped the Club's doing something about it. 

In 2018 we were the best converters inside 50. We're not miles away. Cheer up. Look on the bright side of life. Things are being done.

Edited December 5, 20195 yr by It's Time

54 minutes ago, FlashInThePan said:

I hate the old school, fixed mindset talk about players being unable to fix skill execution once they are in the AFL system, it is complete rubbish. Skills can be learned and improved at any age and at virtually any level of skill. If we perceive our players to have skill deficiencies then it is absolutely the right thing to develop drills and training aids to assist players to improve. Doing anything but this would be crazy.

Absolutely agree Flash cannot readily think of a Demons example, but Stewart Loewe who played forward for the Saints, improved his goal kicking tremendously. From a very rudimentary beginning where he struggled to "kick over a jam tin" to a powerful and accurate kick from the 50 metre arc. As his goal kicking record attests to with nearly 600 goals kicked. Do not recall who he worked with, but he did have a set goal kicking routine. Which combined with considerable training practice and skill development (one assumes) made him a formidable opponent.

7 hours ago, Demonland said:

Mark Williams Precision Balls

https://www.sherrin.com.au/training/skill/precision.html

Recognising that kicking in AFL is one of the most challenging skills to learn, Sherrin has partnered exclusively with AFL Premiership Coach and PE Teacher Mark Williams, to launch Sherrin Precision. The brainchild of Mark Williams, the Precision concept features a larger sweet spot on each end of the Sherrin (red dots) which provides a greater area for the foot to connect with and a visual aid for the player to understand the ideal impact zone on their foot.The product also features a yellow spin line designed to provide immediate feedback to the player. When a player connects successfully with these sweet spots, the Sherrin will continue in the designated flight path and spinning pattern to hit the desired target.

Get exclusive access of a unique online training module that features skills content, videos and tips to improve AFL kicking here. This exclusive content has been produced to assist coaches, parents and teachers to become more comfortable and confident with their instruction and feedback, which in turn improves their players' kicking efficiency. These insights will help you notice common kicking faults and provide suggestions on how to correct them.

Sherrin Precision is designed for players and coaches at all levels, as well as teachers and parents that are instructing the game.

I reckon I'll check if they also make a golf ball that does this!

8 minutes ago, Tarax Club said:

Absolutely agree Flash cannot readily think of a Demons example, but Stewart Loewe who played forward for the Saints, improved his goal kicking tremendously. From a very rudimentary beginning where he struggled to "kick over a jam tin" to a powerful and accurate kick from the 50 metre arc. As his goal kicking record attests to with nearly 600 goals kicked. Do not recall who he worked with, but he did have a set goal kicking routine. Which combined with considerable training practice and skill development (one assumes) made him a formidable opponent.

Thanks for the memory Tarax.  I really liked Loewe - he had hands approximately the size of Tasmania and could mark anything.

14 minutes ago, Tarax Club said:

Absolutely agree Flash cannot readily think of a Demons example

Russell Robertson is one big example.

2 minutes ago, Bitter but optimistic said:

Thanks for the memory Tarax.  I really liked Loewe - he had hands approximately the size of Tasmania and could mark anything.

Went by the epithet 'Buckets' for good reason BBO!

24 minutes ago, Bitter but optimistic said:

Thanks for the memory Tarax.  I really liked Loewe - he had hands approximately the size of Tasmania and could mark anything.

 

18 minutes ago, Tarax Club said:

Went by the epithet 'Buckets' for good reason BBO!

56 minutes ago, Tarax Club said:

Went by the epithet 'Buckets' for good reason BBO!

How did Horse Longmire get his nickname?

1 hour ago, Tarax Club said:

Absolutely agree Flash cannot readily think of a Demons example, but Stewart Loewe who played forward for the Saints, improved his goal kicking tremendously. From a very rudimentary beginning where he struggled to "kick over a jam tin" to a powerful and accurate kick from the 50 metre arc. As his goal kicking record attests to with nearly 600 goals kicked. Do not recall who he worked with, but he did have a set goal kicking routine. Which combined with considerable training practice and skill development (one assumes) made him a formidable opponent.

Great, freely-available example there, Tarax. It used to be called practising 'til it's right ... not mundane Tues/Thurs night time wasters.

13 minutes ago, Cards13 said:

How did Horse Longmire get his nickname?

Because of his ENORMOUS appetite.

1 hour ago, Bitter but optimistic said:

I reckon I'll check if they also make a golf ball that does this!

Easy. Get a marker pen and draw a line around the circumference of the golf ball and then when you place your ball on the green you line that marking up on the line you want to putt. The rotation of the ball will also show how accurately you have stroked the putt 

Edited December 5, 20195 yr by CHF

1 hour ago, Bitter but optimistic said:

I reckon I'll check if they also make a golf ball that does this!

Uncle I used to use a textor to draw a circle on my golf ball as an aid when putting. Set the line on the ball vertical so you could check you were putting the ball cleanly and consistently toward the hole. Same idea with these footies I guess. Oh by the way I haven’t played golf for almost 10 years now. I gave up in the end, I couldn’t putt! 

Stewart Loewe was coached by Peter Hudson

On 12/4/2019 at 2:30 PM, Demonland said:

Not mine

For me, the more interesting thing re: kicking is highlighted in the photos above. The good kicks (Salem, May) have their weight forward over the ball. The less reliable kicks (Langdon and Brayshaw) are leaning back on their kicks.

Gawn is an example of a guy who has changed his kicking style and is now a good kick. Leaning forward.

Trac is a great field kick, but terrible set shot. In the photo above, he's in play and his weight is... going forward. 

It's a fairly simple mechanical adjustment. Hopefully it's something that gets picked up on and fixed (like it did with Max).

3 hours ago, FlashInThePan said:

I hate the old school, fixed mindset talk about players being unable to fix skill execution once they are in the AFL system, it is complete rubbish. Skills can be learned and improved at any age and at virtually any level of skill. If we perceive our players to have skill deficiencies then it is absolutely the right thing to develop drills and training aids to assist players to improve. Doing anything but this would be crazy.

Me too, I'm 63 and railed against this most of my life. I've been a trainer / educator in various fields for 40 yrs. It is interesting to note that my qualifications are no longer recognised.

Edited December 5, 20195 yr by dworship
It's supposed to make sense