TRAINING: Friday 22nd November 2019

[Earl Hood 6,086]

18 minutes ago, kev martin said:

He said he was older than 70 years. I assumed that made his point old school. Also the way of his hardness. Had one of those home reset broken noses. Probably his attitude alone and 15 years in the game.

I'm the same when thinking back. Junior training was much the same as you described.

Congratulations on the memories of 3 flags.

Got one flag myself 1974 (U17's) and a best and fairest to go with it.

Well done, what league was the flag and b&f?

I won a seniors flag in 73 as a junior, then in 76 and again in 79. What I remember now is how much of an improved player I was by 79, in my mid 20’s just by being more mature and having more confidence in what I did. So many young AFL recruits at 18 don’t get that chance to mature and improve. Today you show it all in your first 2 years or you are under the pump. 

Edited November 22, 2019 by Earl Hood

[Deemania since 56 6,636]

8 hours ago, kev martin said:

often blocking and helping each other create separation and overlaps.

Some forward line methodology - it's only taken ten years! 

[dworship 3,342]

39 minutes ago, kev martin said:

Do you think Richmond had a no tackling program.

They won't do the back off thing easily, sometimes players are coming in in numbers and they are competitive beast. Win at all cost and all believe they will win the ball.

Contact can be done in a safe way I think. That is bracing for it and taking the hit. Halfway and you will be hurt.

We also want a players to get front and center balls from the pack, if the defender pulls out, then how do they develop that part which is very instinctual and one of the higher skill sets. 

It is a tough game and durability is one of the criteria that sorts the good players from the others.

What would they do if they couldn't practice getting tackled. Pettraca standing up in them, Viney getting taken out but always able to get his arm free, Harmes fending off, (did a beauty today), Oliver with the ball gone before they get him. 

The concussion stuff should be a duty of care across all contact codes. In a perfect world they shouldn't hurt the brain.Tackling and getting tackled with correct technique should reduce harm. I have seen many concussion from poor technique. Tackling needs to be practice in a game senario.

With full tackling the ball can come free and this unpredictable ball movement needs to be practiced with. Loose ball gets are an asset and often instinctual.

Oliver slightly rehurt his shoulder in a drill.

Kade Kolodjasni collision today was in the body.

Kade Chandler tweaked his knee innocously. 

They have to tackle to reduce the harm from it.

I understand where you are coming from, reducing injuries and protecting those with niggles. 

They play AFL a very hard game.

Technical development then repetitions in real situations. 

 

I've highlighted the word "durability" in your post because that is a word Burgess used at the forum. Everyone needs to understand that Burgess is the one behind everything that is different and being done this preseason. None of this is by chance it is all by design. Burgess has been consistent that training will replicate game day. That doesn't mean reckless attack on the man. I saw a great example on Wed during the handball only drill where they use the "goal" posts (about 2m apart) at each point of the compass played within the centre square.  Pig had received the ball and was steaming in to score when Petracca mowed him down and put him to ground. The initial contact was loud and forceful like you would hear at a game. However, instead of continuing and driving Hibbo into the ground Petracca took him to ground but eased off the last bit ie; not reckless on a teammate. The learning (god I hate new age speak, what's wrong with lesson?) was; why did none of Pigs teammates not warn him he was about to "wear" one.

For Dee Spencer: If your about to be seriously tackled (when it's you that has the ball) wouldn't you like your teammates  to shepherd, warn or block for you. It's difficult to train/ instill this behavior, if the threat is not "real"

[kev martin 9,891]

34 minutes ago, Earl Hood said:

Well done, what league was the flag and b&f?

I won a seniors flag in 73 as a junior, then in 76 and again in 79. What I remember now is how much of an improved player I was by 79, in my mid 20’s just by being more mature and having more confidence in what I did. So many young AFL recruits at 18 don’t get that chance to mature and improve. Today you show it all in your first 2 years or you are under the pump. 

East Malvern FC, south east suburban football league, did some combined reprentative games for the league. Also played in the seniors matches after the morning game.a few times. I think the club disbanded in 1984.

The coach was Blair Cambell. Played for MFC in 1969. Knee injuries cut his career short.

 

Edited November 22, 2019 by kev martin

[Sir Why You Little 37,035]

4 hours ago, Stretch Johnson said:

It's November, there is a solid case for not training at all

We are coming from a long way back. It takes time to  toughen up. I am sure everything  has been meticulously mapped out, unlike last Summer. 

[Jimcor2 125]

5 hours ago, Duke said:

This is a first time post.  I visited from Adelaide today.  I don’t read Demonland a lot other than at this time of the season, and really appreciate those who do training reports. But knowing people involved in the club, this is not the place to spend too much time in season! I thought I would add my bit to preseason, although it’s 3 hours later so I have probably already forgotten half of it and Kev above covered some of it.

I arrived at 9.15 and the players were already warming up.  I stayed till the very end, which was just after 1pm with the last 3 off the track being Steven May, Jack Viney, and Marty Hore. They finished with goal to goal repeat sprints, which at the end of a 4 hour session was impressive. Even more impressive is May was side by side with Viney doing 22-25 second 170m sprints after 4 hours of training.

It was about 80% ball work and 20% running at training. They started in 2 groups at each end doing non contact match sim inside the 50 arcs.  The emphasis was on kicking skills.  Every turnover was called out loud and clear by the coaching staff, even if was a poor that bounced.  While this was going on AVB, Petty, and Bradke were doing repeat 200-300m sprints around the outside. AVB was setting the pace and looked in great nick.  When he was leaving training he was saying that if 2019 was different he would have played in the back half of the year like 2018, and he feels he is 100%. From what I can tell he is doing lots of running but perhaps they don’t want to risk a Spargo like step on foot incident yet.

After the skills match sim it changed to full oval match sim with the non contact players standing out. Lever, Weideman, Jetta etc we’re not standing around, but doing a lot of explosive agility type work in the unused forward pocket.  The match sim was interesting.  It would start with a congested activity somewhere upfield with an emphasis on ground balls.  The players would repeatable roll the ball into a scrimmage, and then try and pick up and get a clearance and when they did just roll the ball back in. It kept going until the coaches blew a whistle which signalled it was real, and from a clearance they’d try and get it inside 50 to a lead.  It was pretty willing, evidenced by Tmac (I think) leading out at full tilt with Hore drifting back and KK trying to spoil.  Hore and KK were both flattened. Luckily no major harm although KK left training to get his elbow seen to.

After the full oval match sim they broke up into various groups doing different activities.  Mainly seemed to focus on skills, although some players would be cycled through activities that looked a bit like trying to work on explosiveness.  For example, 3 players would be on their stomachs, and the coach would roll a ball near 1 and call out.  2 would jump up, the closest to get the ground ball and the second to tackle.  Seemed to be working on recovery, getting to feet, evading or tackling etc.

Another group were totally focussed on kicking to the wing.  Others were doing 150m sprints, and other doing stoppages again with ground balls.  For the ground ball stoppages, the coaches were continuously calling out for longer handballs to the outside.

At one stage, Stafford was working on goal kicking.  Hunt and Weideman did a lot of work.  Then they setup a spot 40m out and had a camera directly in front and one to the side. Stafford was managing, and had Petracca, ANB, Oliver, Melksham, and Fritsch filmed for about 10 kicks each.  No one else. Petracca still has a lot of work to do and I’m sure his routine will be sorted.  Was still walking up to kick.  The rest looked pretty good, but all seemed to be told to get some forward momentum, or at least compared to Petracca seemed to be accelerating in to kick with pretty good results.  Especially Melksham who didn’t seem to miss.

Some of the highlights for me overall were Petracca.  He is in ripping nick, and ran in a group with Brayshaw and a few others in the repeat sprints.  He is in better running nick than ever, was right up the front, and looked to handle it better than Brayshaw. 

Another highlight was May.  It looked like he had to do extra’s, and he did not lag behind in any of the sprints.  His group included Max and he was side by side with him the entire way.  He also looks in great nick.  In one drill, there was a handball chain that ended with a player at 40m running toward goal.  May drilled everything.

The other was TMac.  He has his running legs, and was continuously getting in good positions and marking in the full oval match sim. 

Viney is doing all the running and more.  His foot is not a problem touch wood, and he is loving the program Burgess has given him.  Already he feels fitter than ever, and he did the extras. 

Oscar Mac looks in great nick and to have bulked up a lot.  In the inside 50 skills match sim his kicking is really good.  I didn’t see him miss a kick, which I probably couldn’t say about most of the squad. 

Overall, and I don’t have much to compare against as I didn’t see training last year, the squad looks in excellent nick.  I did talk to a few of the veteran supporters to ask how it compares to prior years.  They all seemed to think it’s the fittest they have seen them.

Now, I don't intend to disparage anyone else's report (all of which are appreciated) but this is probably the best, most-informative report I've read over many years.  Stay a bit longer, by all means.

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,820]

3 hours ago, kev martin said:

Both are into full training. They are looking unhampered. Tom is looking a bt fitter than Jack. Great to see them going hard.

If T Mac plays 20 games next year fit and healthy, we’re winning games.

In 3 of our 5 unimpressive wins, he kicked 3,3 and 6 goals.

[CHF 2,738]

Sitting half the world away I appreciate the input from all on the training threads as well as across the board on all the forums. So a big thank you for that.

A comment on the impression I get from the early training reports. I find it very encouraging that from the very start we seem to be doing a majority of our field work, as opposed to gym work, with the ball in hand. Last season our play broke down time and time again because of poor execution and dull skills.

We need to fit to run out games for sure but that needs to be balanced with critical work on improving and maintaining the player skills.

Note: skills, not craft.

[sue 9,104]

13 hours ago, Ugottobekidding said:

Imagine if Trump was coach, he'd build a wall at half back.

And stack the umpiring panel with his mates.  The MRP however is dubious enough already and needs no further adjustment.

[Gator 17,346]

13 hours ago, JakovichScissorKick said:

Praying we have a gameplan in 2020.    The players can be as fit as the have have ever been,   but without a legitimate gameplan we are dead in the water ...

But Ruprecht, what professional sporting organisation in the world foregoes having a game plan ?

Being super fit with your best 22 gives the greatest opportunity to implement the game-plan to its highest and most skillful degree. 

[dazzledavey36 54,925]

10 hours ago, CHF said:

Sitting half the world away I appreciate the input from all on the training threads as well as across the board on all the forums. So a big thank you for that.

A comment on the impression I get from the early training reports. I find it very encouraging that from the very start we seem to be doing a majority of our field work, as opposed to gym work, with the ball in hand. Last season our play broke down time and time again because of poor execution and dull skills.

We need to fit to run out games for sure but that needs to be balanced with critical work on improving and maintaining the player skills.

Note: skills, not craft.

Think you you'll find player are still fitting in gym work 3 times a week. Usually after they have done their training out on the track they'll head into lunch then smash out another hour and a half of gym and extra touch.

Edited November 22, 2019 by dazzledavey36

[Mel Bourne 4,515]

12 hours ago, dworship said:

The learning (god I hate new age speak, what’s wrong with lesson?)

Nothing! Let’s all work together to destroy “learnings”. 

[Neil Crompton 5,556]

14 hours ago, kev martin said:

East Malvern FC, south east suburban football league, did some combined reprentative games for the league. Also played in the seniors matches after the morning game.a few times. I think the club disbanded in 1984.

The coach was Blair Cambell. Played for MFC in 1969. Knee injuries cut his career short.

 

Blair Campbell didn’t play for long, but he left a lasting legacy on our game. He is credited with initiating the boomerang / banana / check side kick when shooting for goal.

Edited November 23, 2019 by Neil Crompton

[daisycutter 29,614]

17 hours ago, kev martin said:

East Malvern FC, south east suburban football league, did some combined reprentative games for the league. Also played in the seniors matches after the morning game.a few times. I think the club disbanded in 1984.

The coach was Blair Cambell. Played for MFC in 1969. Knee injuries cut his career short.

 

that must have been after the federal league collapsed in the 70's. think east malvern fc went dormant then for a few years

[bing181 9,235]

23 hours ago, dieter said:

Even better, he'd make Mexico pay for it. Swell operator, the Pres of the USA...

We'll get Collingwood to pay for it.

[CHF 2,738]

10 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Think you you'll find player are still fitting in gym work 3 times a week. Usually after they have done their training out on the track they'll head into lunch then smash out another hour and a half of gym and extra touch.

Yep DD. I understand that they are working hard in the gym. I was not clear. I wanted to say that we seem to be ‘game’ training with ball in hand a greater percentage of the time than in the past few seasons while out on the ground. 

[dazzledavey36 54,925]

20 minutes ago, CHF said:

Yep DD. I understand that they are working hard in the gym. I was not clear. I wanted to say that we seem to be ‘game’ training with ball in hand a greater percentage of the time than in the past few seasons while out on the ground. 

Stark different to the Neeld years when all we ever did at training right up until xmas was 400m runs around the oval..

[CHF 2,738]

1 hour ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Stark different to the Neeld years when all we ever did at training right up until xmas was 400m runs around the oval..

Thank goodness!

[Dr. Gonzo 24,215]

13 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Stark different to the Neeld years when all we ever did at training right up until xmas was 400m runs around the oval..

Just the thing to get the players pumped for preseason ?

[Satyriconhome 10,877]

15 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Stark different to the Neeld years when all we ever did at training right up until xmas was 400m runs around the oval..

Wrong,

I have attended training for last 7 years, they have been mostly the same,  but each coach and 'fitness' guy brings little tweaks and changes, Burgess is doing the running on a Saturday so weekday sessions can be more ball work

Attended one or two of Bailey@s and the emphasis was on ball work as well, those seasons went well no?

 

[sue 9,104]

 Looks like Saty can't post anything wthout being mocked.   Since I have no idea what has happened in the past at training, I was interested to see what he said in response to DD36.   

[drysdale demon 4,833]

21 minutes ago, sue said:

 Looks like Saty can't post anything wthout being mocked.   Since I have no idea what has happened in the past at training, I was interested to see what he said in response to DD36.   

I very much doubt that any coach or fitness coach would have you only doing running for the first 6 to 7 weeks of preseason. I attended training for 10 years straight back in 1987 to 1997 and they certainly didn't do it then.I realize dazzledavey is referring to Neeld but I heard nothing of that.

Edited November 24, 2019 by drysdale demon
correction

[Fork 'em 6,983]

On 11/22/2019 at 9:06 PM, Earl Hood said:

Regarding old school thinking on training, I played 200 plus mediocre games of suburban footy in the 70’s and 80’s but I don’t remember much physical contact at training. We ran laps, Indian file stuff, interval sprints, circle work one way, then reverse on your left side. We did a bit of one on one stuff competing for a ball, some evasive drills where you were first to the ball with  2 people chasing behind and tackling but no real intimidating  physical stuff, that happened on game day, so not sure where the old school is coming from? So not sure of this train soft, play soft stuff, as we managed to win 3 flags in 10 years in our own small footy world. 

I remember when I playing a few medicore games back in the day I'd joined a new club and we were doing pre-season match simulation.
The ball was kicked to me and went over my head so I turned and when after it to be confronted by one of our more skillful players coming the other direction towards the ground ball.
I made the decision I wasn't going to deviate and needless to say there was heavy body contact that resulted in the other bloke having his collarbone busted.
The coach came up to me later and said " You meant that didn't you." to which I replied "No I didn't, I just wanted the ball." (which I did.)
He then said. "Well, I saw what his problem is tonight...... He goes in half arsed."

 

Edited November 24, 2019 by Fork 'em

[sue 9,104]

1 hour ago, Wiseblood said:

 

I have read his posts and responses for many years.  My impression is that this all started when he posted what many saw as reports seen through overly rose-coloured glasses.  Which is his right, and readers are free to discount or credit his reports as much as they like. 

But while some merely disagreed with him on that, others started to attack him and increasingly rather nastily. And over time he has reacted by becoming snarky in response sometimes.  Sad that it came to that, but not surprising.  I'm not sure how I'd react to such relentless bagging

1 hour ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Personally I read his comments and reports with interest but through dark glasses to counter their rosy colouring.  For some other perennially negative posters I don those dark glasses so that their dark reports almost vanish.  Preserving sanity as a MFC supporter is important.

Edited November 24, 2019 by george_on_the_outer

[daisycutter 29,614]

think a few posters need to be put on an avo.......alternative to enforced holiday