14 hours ago, titan_uranus said:

And GWS' isn't?

Yes it is, but I was making the point that they both had deeper depth than us and could have players not playing in their senior side , that might be better than some of ours who were. In Tomlinson’s case he has continued to play in their senior side. 

44 minutes ago, Nelo said:

So it seems like it will be Frost out and Tomlinson in. Immediate downgrade. Great start to the trade period. ?

Next season Frost for Coaches Award, Players Association MVP, Brownlow and Norm Smith.

50 minutes ago, Nelo said:

So it seems like it will be Frost out and Tomlinson in. Immediate downgrade. Great start to the trade period. ?

Over the last 3 years, Frost has managed 51 games for a club that made finals once in that time and this year finished 17th.

In the same time, Tomlinson has played 73 games for a club that played finals every year and this year played in the Grand Final.

I love Frosty, but I also recognize the realities of what he has and doesn't have. This all just seems like the classic overrate your own players syndrome.

 

3 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

Over the last 3 years, Frost has managed 51 games for a club that made finals once in that time and this year finished 17th.

In the same time, Tomlinson has played 73 games for a club that played finals every year and this year played in the Grand Final.

I love Frosty, but I also recognize the realities of what he has and doesn't have. This all just seems like the classic overrate your own players syndrome.

 

I think it's the emotional side rather than the logical side that is driving a lot of people to overvalue Frost and other players in the team.

11 hours ago, Demon Disciple said:

Well if you are anywhere close to accurate, then i'd agree with the footy department behind that decision.

Frost's worth should be no more than $500k.

Half a Mill. for what he delivers?

Has the world gone mad re: value?

Both players are very similar based on this season which is a good comparison given the amount of games played. 

Tomlinson takes a few more marks but Frosty takes more contested and spoils significantly  more (closing speed), double the intercepts and double intercept marks.

The same number of clangers this season and, believe it or not, Tomlinson turns the ball over more often than Frosty.

Pressure acts and tackles Tomlinson has the edge.  He gets a bit more uncontested and marginaly more contested (on average) but need to keep that (and the rest) in context with the gap between the level both teams were playing at throughout the year.

Keeping in mind Tomlinson played in a team surrounded by No.1 / top draft picks and one that made a GF while Frosty played in a [censored] storm of a season.

https://m.afl.com.au/stats/stats-pro#/Compare?playerIds=CD_I293738,CD_I291819&comparisonTab=h2h

Edited September 29, 20195 yr by Rusty Nails

51 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

Over the last 3 years, Frost has managed 51 games for a club that made finals once in that time and this year finished 17th.

In the same time, Tomlinson has played 73 games for a club that played finals every year and this year played in the Grand Final.

I love Frosty, but I also recognize the realities of what he has and doesn't have. This all just seems like the classic overrate your own players syndrome.

 

Frost was our best lockdown defender. Yeah he makes mistakes but he has pace and closing speed and has improved his decision making.

You only have to listen to David King and he describes Tomlinson’s ball use as terrible and is just a tall player who can run a lot. Brings no value to the team. 

11 minutes ago, Nelo said:

Frost was our best lockdown defender. Yeah he makes mistakes but he has pace and closing speed and has improved his decision making.

You only have to listen to David King and he describes Tomlinson’s ball use as terrible and is just a tall player who can run a lot. Brings no value to the team. 

David King just called Tomlinson a “Wingman with no influence”

 

1 minute ago, Sir Why You Little said:

David King just called Tomlinson a “Wingman with no influence”

 

Yeah not sure that’s what we want. 

Just now, Nelo said:

Yeah not sure that’s what we want. 

So excited at the prospect 

The only one who will notice he has left GW$ will be his Mum, going by his September form

Oh well we get Noah Anderson 

Sadly, Tomlinson's seriously out of form at the wrong time when more eyes have been on the Giants than ever before. Its a 2 way street, because he has also played great games for them in the past in finals as well.

He wont be a popular pick up, but its up to the FD to maximise his strengths.

Can’t believe I’m saying this but I’d rather Frost over Tomlinson.

We’re the slowest club in the AFL and we’re now happy to punt the fastest player on our list.

24 minutes ago, Nelo said:

Frost was our best lockdown defender. Yeah he makes mistakes but he has pace and closing speed and has improved his decision making.

You only have to listen to David King and he describes Tomlinson’s ball use as terrible and is just a tall player who can run a lot. Brings no value to the team. 

I'm not knocking Frost by any stretch, but implying he is a better user/decision maker than Tomlinson is incorrect IMO. King is making calls based on what he's seen in the finals this year I reckon, I doubt any sensible commentator would say Tomlinson is a "butcher" when looking at his career.

I don't think Frost is our best "lockdown" defender at all. He's great on the rebound, but he was quite often beaten in one on one standing contests inside 50. There's also been a bit of rumour around that both May and Lever weren't happy with Frost's ability to stay within the defensive structures this year.

A best 22 player for a Grand Finalist team who "brings no value" to the 17th placed team? Bizarre comment.

 

A lot of posters talking about other posters overrating Frost. I think we all know where Frost is at, can’t blame him for wanting more money, it’s only natural. The two most overrated players on Demonland in recent history are Hogan and Petracca, at least Hogan could dominate the weaker sides.

 

Edited September 30, 20195 yr by Bombay Airconditioning

41 minutes ago, Nelo said:

Yeah not sure that’s what we want. 

But it's what we love.

15 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Yeah can't believe Lever retired without ever paying back the faith we showed in him

What relevance does that have to the specific quote I mentioned? 

I would love nothing more than to be wrong on Lever, but we messed up.

 

1 hour ago, Demon17 said:

Half a Mill. for what he delivers?

Has the world gone mad re: value?

half a million puts you in the top one third of players.

Now that is not the top one third of 22 but the top one third of the list ... ie top 15.

At age 25 players  tend to maximise their value so 500k for either Tomlinson or Frost is not outrageous.

34 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

 

A best 22 player for a Grand Finalist team who "brings no value" to the 17th placed team? Bizarre comment.

 

Yes, but what influence did he have on the ground during September?

Nothing that I saw...

24 minutes ago, Bombay Airconditioning said:

A lot of posters talking about other posters overrating Frost. I think we all know where Frost is at, can’t blame him for wanting more money, it’s only natural. The two most overrated players on Demonland in recent history are Hogan and Petracca, at least Hogan could dominate the weaker sides.

 

Very big call... but I agree.

On this years form, you can add some others to that list as well. I won't name names but lets hope this year was an anomaly 

13 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Yes, but what influence did he have on the ground during September?

Nothing that I saw...

So going off by your reckoning we should not ever chase Lachie Whitfield going from his GF performance or Steele Sidebottom from last years GF also?

18 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Yes, but what influence did he have on the ground during September?

Nothing that I saw...

Had a poor September, no doubt. Doesn't define him as a player though.

I see him as a mobile CHF that will work up and back all day.  We need a player that can be a link man from defense into attack and that's what I see this guy doing, hard to match up due to his size and will run all day.  That allows McDonald and our second tall forward to play deeper.  He basically becomes our 7th midfielder working from deep defence to deep forward.  We play this way now a forward pushes into the midfield leaving us with a 5 man forward line ANB plays this role. 

 

7 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

Had a poor September, no doubt. Doesn't define him as a player though.

His prelim game was good. Not great but good.

10 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

So going off by your reckoning we should not ever chase Lachie Whitfield going from his GF performance or Steele Sidebottom from last years GF also?

No. I am talking about Tomlinson 

Not injured players