3 minutes ago, Billy said:

Why does Hunter continually get a game before JJ

Hunter is slower & don’t like his dinky underground handballs or head ducking

 

Because he is much quicker-thinking and creative. I think Hunter has been fantastic. Currently the Mongrel Punt has him no 5 on the wingmen list, ahead of Langers who is no 10.

Prior to this year, I didn’t think JJ would be a long term prospect, but I think he’s definitely improved this season, with quicker decision making, improved sprinting ability and much better kicking, and the key question is how much more improvement is still to come?
 

The reality is fringe players at top clubs will, and should, look to get more regular games at other clubs. The way things are looking now, be surprised if JJ doesn’t ask for a trade at season end. 

2 hours ago, chook fowler said:

A can’t believe the constant devaluing of JJ. He has been a consistently excellent contributor, rarely makes a mistake and is still early in his career - will end up having a significant career, if not with us, elsewhere.

I call into the camp that he will be a 200 gamer elsewhere - he ain’t no plodder, I was asking the q from provocateur @adonski 😀

11 minutes ago, Engorged Onion said:

I call into the camp that he will be a 200 gamer elsewhere - he ain’t no plodder, I was asking the q from provocateur @adonski 😀

I rate him. I'd have him in our best 22, I think he's a better player than both Harmes and Sparrow, but I also acknowledge his deficiencies I.e ploddiness

Jordon's achilles was his excessive caution when he got posession, he often killed the team momentum.

This year he has improved & has played pretty well but last week he was poor & has paid the price.

Really disappointed he has been dropped. Spargo is great to have, but with Chandler in such top form there is no way I would have dropped Jordon so Spargo can play. 

36 minutes ago, Maldonboy38 said:

Really disappointed he has been dropped. Spargo is great to have, but with Chandler in such top form there is no way I would have dropped Jordon so Spargo can play. 

You and me both.

1 hour ago, Maldonboy38 said:

Really disappointed he has been dropped. Spargo is great to have, but with Chandler in such top form there is no way I would have dropped Jordon so Spargo can play. 

Not me, Spargo a far better proposition at the moment.

3 hours ago, Engorged Onion said:

I call into the camp that he will be a 200 gamer elsewhere - he ain’t no plodder, I was asking the q from provocateur @adonski 😀

I wasn’t having a go at you but some of the comments that preceded your post.

One thing that hurts Jordan is that he is a really solid all round midfielder without having an xfactor in any area.

Doesn't have super endurance to make him a top tier winger, explosive pace or brutal strength, he isn't a silky kick, not an especially creative handballer, he isn't particularly tall and strong overhead for a midfielder. Probably one thing he does significantly above average is tackle.

He doesn't have major deficiencies and does everything well, better than most players, so fills gaps perfectly. But in almost every position, a specialist gets the nod ahead of him at Melbourne at the moment.

I think he has 200 game foot soldier written all over him, if we can somehow keep him. But I think that he will be attracted to the certainty of getting a go somewhere.

No doubt he will request a trade at seasons end, I think he is a little bit stiff to be on the outter at the moment, always plays his role when he gets the opportunity.

Get the feeling he is a role player in a good side, not sure how he would go in a middle to lower side. 

8 hours ago, deanox said:

One thing that hurts Jordan is that he is a really solid all round midfielder without having an xfactor in any area.

Doesn't have super endurance to make him a top tier winger, explosive pace or brutal strength, he isn't a silky kick, not an especially creative handballer, he isn't particularly tall and strong overhead for a midfielder. Probably one thing he does significantly above average is tackle.

He doesn't have major deficiencies and does everything well, better than most players, so fills gaps perfectly. But in almost every position, a specialist gets the nod ahead of him at Melbourne at the moment.

I think he has 200 game foot soldier written all over him, if we can somehow keep him. But I think that he will be attracted to the certainty of getting a go somewhere.

With Viney in his 30’s, Dunstan probably leaving for more opportunities and maybe Harmes also looking for more opportunities, his chances improve and hopefully that would sway him to stay. Bailey Laurie could be another in demand who might leave.

 

6 minutes ago, Redleg said:

With Viney in his 30’s, Dunstan probably leaving for more opportunities and maybe Harmes also looking for more opportunities, his chances improve and hopefully that would sway him to stay. Bailey Laurie could be another in demand who might leave.

 

It's a good point, but Viney has only just turned 29. You'd think he has 2-3 good years left before age becomes a factor. Lachy Hunter will be 29 at the end of the year and should have a few years left too.

Meanwhile Jordan will be 23 at the end of this year. Does he really want to wait until he is 25-26 to own his own spot?

 

I'd think his best chance of winning a flag is with us, and that would be the carrot to dangle, not Vineys age.

 

He has actually had a pretty good run. From debut in R1 2021 to R23 2022, he played every game. He was an unused sub only 3 times, including the GF (where I think we did the wrong thing by him).

He wasn't selected for the finals last year (probably a mistake in hindsight) and didn't play R1-2 this year. I expect he'll be sub again this week.

He is probably a victim of us not having many injuries to our midfield in that time. Oliver, Petracca, Viney, Langdon, Brayshaw, Sparrow, Pickett, Spargo, ANB, have all had very good runs. With just one of them down at went time and Jordan would have had even more game time.

9 hours ago, deanox said:

One thing that hurts Jordan is that he is a really solid all round midfielder without having an xfactor in any area.

Doesn't have super endurance to make him a top tier winger, explosive pace or brutal strength, he isn't a silky kick, not an especially creative handballer, he isn't particularly tall and strong overhead for a midfielder. Probably one thing he does significantly above average is tackle.

He doesn't have major deficiencies and does everything well, better than most players, so fills gaps perfectly. But in almost every position, a specialist gets the nod ahead of him at Melbourne at the moment.

I think he has 200 game foot soldier written all over him, if we can somehow keep him. But I think that he will be attracted to the certainty of getting a go somewhere.

I agree with everything you’ve said other than his endurance which is elite if the preseason running is anything to go by where he is in the top group with Nibbler. 
As for not playing well last week I think that is rot. 17 possessions at 88% efficiency (second behind McVee) and only 67% game time tells a different story. 
I agree that his issue is being a generalist and I think he’ll do very well elsewhere. After this years draft he will most likely fall further down the pecking order. I’d like to keep him but I’m resigned to him leaving. 
The rise of McVee and Chandler has probably signed his papers. 

It’s a very competitive business but I would hate to see this guy leave. He has shown improvement each year and has reliability and consistency marked all over him. 

I like JJ, but with opportunity in the midfield limited and at this stage, a minimum of 4 top 36 draft picks that I'd expect to be used on regenerating the midfield, I think he might be best placed looking elsewhere. 

Normally I'm ambivalent about fringe players, but I like Jordon and at just 22 years of age and 53 games under his belt we'll be missing out on his best footy if he leaves.  Plus we won't get much for him.

I accept good teams lose what they'd rather keep, but I really hope he stays.  He's also a good size at 187cm.

And who will forget that he's another Jason Taylor gem.  He was on zero draft boards in 2018.  When his name was called out pretty early (33) no-one had heard of him.

He may never be a star, but he does everything well and can be a first rate part of any midfield rotation.

It is what its is, I suppose.

1 hour ago, Tough Kent said:

I like JJ, but with opportunity in the midfield limited and at this stage, a minimum of 4 top 36 draft picks that I'd expect to be used on regenerating the midfield, I think he might be best placed looking elsewhere. 

I think you have to use a minimum 3 draft picks each year. We definitely won't be using the 4 top picks we have in 2023 and might package some lower picks to get Kynan Brown (trade down for points?) but I guess potentially picking a high draft mid isn't going to help JJ's prospects. But of course by the time of the draft JJ will have already signed on (or not) and it depends on likely interest from other clubs (which I think will be quite strong). As I've posted elsewhere, I'd like to see JJ picked ahead of James Harmes, and if JJ signs on we could trade Harmes out a year ahead of free agency.

6 hours ago, Slartibartfast said:

I agree with everything you’ve said other than his endurance which is elite if the preseason running is anything to go by where he is in the top group with Nibbler. 
As for not playing well last week I think that is rot. 17 possessions at 88% efficiency (second behind McVee) and only 67% game time tells a different story. 
I agree that his issue is being a generalist and I think he’ll do very well elsewhere. After this years draft he will most likely fall further down the pecking order. I’d like to keep him but I’m resigned to him leaving. 
The rise of McVee and Chandler has probably signed his papers. 

I think generalist is the right word. Lots of clubs would love to have him, and in 95% of my time watching Melbourne he would have been amongst the first picked.

You're right about his endurance being a strength, maybe I haven't seen it on display as much because of how often he is sub?

Edited May 13, 20231 yr by deanox

Article on AFL site has a few clubs circling JJ, Essendon and Suns named as a couple amongst them.

Clubs still view him as more likely to remain with the Demons, who are keen to retain him. 

I'd like to keep JJ, but I accept that he is on the fringes of the 22 (and should be IMO), so if he wants more regular starting games, he's more likely to get them elsewhere.

That said, you never know. If he can put together a strong block of form in the second half of the season, he might he able to nail down a 22 starting position in front of someone else.

On 5/13/2023 at 9:40 AM, deanox said:

It's a good point, but Viney has only just turned 29. You'd think he has 2-3 good years left before age becomes a factor. Lachy Hunter will be 29 at the end of the year and should have a few years left too.

Meanwhile Jordan will be 23 at the end of this year. Does he really want to wait until he is 25-26 to own his own spot?

 

I'd think his best chance of winning a flag is with us, and that would be the carrot to dangle, not Vineys age.

 

He has actually had a pretty good run. From debut in R1 2021 to R23 2022, he played every game. He was an unused sub only 3 times, including the GF (where I think we did the wrong thing by him).

He wasn't selected for the finals last year (probably a mistake in hindsight) and didn't play R1-2 this year. I expect he'll be sub again this week.

He is probably a victim of us not having many injuries to our midfield in that time. Oliver, Petracca, Viney, Langdon, Brayshaw, Sparrow, Pickett, Spargo, ANB, have all had very good runs. With just one of them down at went time and Jordan would have had even more game time.

Agree deanox but remember JJ had a significant foot injury late last year.!!

Edited May 24, 20231 yr by DeeZone
Spellchecker changed deanox to Franco. Lol.!!

I was hoping that JJ would have had regular game time in 2023 and given similar opportunities as Riv and Sparrow. Hopefully he gets a better run now with Clayton sidelined if not he mustn’t be in our future plans.!!

From what I remember, because we didn’t resign JJ on a full contract one year, and then picked him up in the rookie draft he is an unrestricted free agent. If he leaves we will most likely get no compensation. 

5 minutes ago, Stu said:

From what I remember, because we didn’t resign JJ on a full contract one year, and then picked him up in the rookie draft he is an unrestricted free agent. If he leaves we will most likely get no compensation. 

Correct!