This is probably too much to ask, but if we add Langdon to one wing, I'd love to see KK have a great pre-season and slot into the other.  I think it has the capacity (nothing is guaranteed of course) to vastly improve our side moving forward.  I know there are plenty of questions around Kolo, and that's fair, but the kid has shown he can play, and getting him through a pre-season will be a big positive for the club.

16 hours ago, Dee Zephyr said:

No mucking around by Ed if the article is accurate, skipped mad Monday to ramp up talks. Good on him for eagerly wanting to be a Demon. Just get a deal done now.

Yep, I think I'd skip one day of getting pizzed to sign on for 700k a year

29 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

This is probably too much to ask, but if we add Langdon to one wing, I'd love to see KK have a great pre-season and slot into the other.  I think it has the capacity (nothing is guaranteed of course) to vastly improve our side moving forward.  I know there are plenty of questions around Kolo, and that's fair, but the kid has shown he can play, and getting him through a pre-season will be a big positive for the club.

I agree Wiseblood, sadly I think the likelihood of KK playing any really good consistent footy for us is a long shot which is a shame and of course i hope im wrong.

 

Edited August 28, 20195 yr by Demon3

How I see this going.

Start here:

When they demand a first round pick move here:

Then likely end here:

PS: If anyone is interested I'm using this handy tool https://www.draftguru.com.au/pick-value-calculator

9 minutes ago, ArtificialWisdom said:

PS: If anyone is interested I'm using this handy tool https://www.draftguru.com.au/pick-value-calculator

Yeah it's a good bit of fun that calculator, and I think as much as it should be an easy straight up swap for our 2nd, the deal is likely to drag well into the trade period. Freo have an academy kid who is likely to get a mid teen to early 20s bid, but have only have a their first and a second rounder themselves, so I'm sure they'll be wanting extra picks to help with that. It might all depend on what they get for BHill and if they get involved with Kelly as well. You can throw all sort of scenario's into the tool and come out with all sorts of answers!

I think our 2nd round pick is fair, but if Freo are difficult (which wouldn't suprise me), is the PSD a practical option?

Scenario: Ed asks for a one year deal worth 2 years of $, which is then renegotiated but wards off GCS?

Ifs this is realistic, then its also excellent leverage over Freo.  

I still have hopes for KK on the other wing.

1 hour ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

This is not just about Langdon, but can any contract be signed and any trade be formally announced prior to the official trade period, even if the clubs and players involved agree?

Nope. It'd just be a verbal agreement at this stage. Contracts  technically run until end of October I think.

I like where this is going. Langdon would make a huge difference to our structure. If KK gets on the ground after a good preseason, and some of the others pull up their socks, lock us in for a flag!

I wouldn't make pick 21 our first offer and only if needed would it be our final offer. We've got an out of contract player signed on for us, there's no need to play nice on this one.

Agree. Pick 21 is starting point.  He is out of contract and we have #2 in pre season draft. 

19 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

I wouldn't make pick 21 our first offer and only if needed would it be our final offer. We've got an out of contract player signed on for us, there's no need to play nice on this one.

When has Josh Mahoney ever played nice at the negotiation table?

5 hours ago, Ron Burgundy said:

The problem is that he seems to negotiate, not like a modern lawyer, but like a suburban litigation solicitor from the 1970s who seems to think it’s really clever to not concede a thing and play a game of tedious WW1 style brinkmanship, with the result that no one gets a good deal including, critically, Freo.

Fingers crossed, common sense, commercial acumen, and just general decency prevails here. Surely our first second rounder is eminently fair - get it done early, which allows each club to focus on other potential deals.

 

Like this guy on the right??

https://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/afl-trades-essendon-keen-on-jack-martin-again-ed-langdon-to-join-melbourne/news-story/55d0376792dea435714dee2759e14231

Edited August 28, 20195 yr by one_demon

2 hours ago, jumbo returns said:

Yep, I think I'd skip one day of getting pizzed to sign on for 700k a year

Hope it really isn't $700k, is it?  He would be in our top 3-4 paid players.  Is he that good?

Also, we are apparently paying Lever and May around $800k each.  So the 3 would be about $2.3m of our sal cap. ie nearly 20%.  I wonder how our young talents feel if they see players traded in at the top end of our salary profile and then think how much of the pie is left for them?

Langdon on the outside, Gus back on the inside, Petracca more time in the middle - I like where this is headed!

12 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Hope it really isn't $700k, is it?  He would be in our top 3-4 paid players.  Is he that good?

Also, we are apparently paying Lever and May around $800k each.  So the 3 would be about $2.3m of our sal cap. ie nearly 20%.  I wonder how our young talents feel if they see players traded in at the top end of our salary profile and then think how much of the pie is left for them?

They can feel what they like.  ATM, how many of these ‘young guns’ are even earning (deserving of) the AFL minimum?  Prove that you are worth it, I say.  If we have to bring in expensive talent to make them look good, it should come out of their pockets.  If they are good enough, we dont have to pay overs to get talent in.

Edited August 28, 20195 yr by buck_nekkid
Clarity

15 minutes ago, buck_nekkid said:

They can feel what they like.  ATM, how many of these ‘young guns’ are even earning (deserving of) the AFL minimum?  Prove that you are worth it, I say.  If we have to bring in expensive talent to make them look good, it should come out of their pockets.  If they are good enough, we dont have to pay overs to get talent in.

A bit harsh as 2019 is not entirely the player's fault.  If those expensive trade-ins had been available 2019 would not have been as bad.  And, if we had made better list decisions and developed players better we may not need someone like Langdon.  Just saying lots of reasons for 2019.

My comment about the salary cap was more about tying up ~20% on three players (if Langdon's $ are per jr's post) on longish contract years and the medium term impact when it comes to renew existing player contracts.  Sure this year Lewis and Jones free up some coin but looking into 2020+ OOC players the available pie doesn't looks so big.

Edited August 28, 20195 yr by Lucifer's Hero

30 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

A bit harsh as 2019 is not entirely the player's fault.  If those expensive trade-ins had been available 2019 would not have been as bad.  And, if we had made better list decisions and developed players better we may not need someone like Langdon.  Just saying lots of reasons for 2019.

My comment about the salary cap was more about tying up ~20% on three players (if Langdon's $ are per jr's post) on longish contract years and the medium term impact when it comes to renew existing player contracts.  Sure this year Lewis and Jones free up some coin but looking into 2020+ OOC players the available pie doesn't looks so big.

Mahoney has been pretty good over the years with how we manage the salary cap, so you would assume that this would continue for the next few years.  I feel like the club plans for years in advance, as evidence with us being able to bring in recruits on good money while still retaining the young players on our list.  As you say, Lewis comes off the books and Jones takes a much lower deal, which frees up room with some of it going to Langdon (for whatever it is he gets).  

Proof will be in the pudding of course, but I feel comfortable with where we are at salary cap wise.

1 hour ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Hope it really isn't $700k, is it?  He would be in our top 3-4 paid players.  Is he that good?

Also, we are apparently paying Lever and May around $800k each.  So the 3 would be about $2.3m of our sal cap. ie nearly 20%.  I wonder how our young talents feel if they see players traded in at the top end of our salary profile and then think how much of the pie is left for them?

Arbitary amount - just a deeper reflection on outrageous coin in sport

1 hour ago, Wiseblood said:

Mahoney has been pretty good over the years with how we manage the salary cap, so you would assume that this would continue for the next few years.  I feel like the club plans for years in advance, as evidence with us being able to bring in recruits on good money while still retaining the young players on our list.  As you say, Lewis comes off the books and Jones takes a much lower deal, which frees up room with some of it going to Langdon (for whatever it is he gets).  

Proof will be in the pudding of course, but I feel comfortable with where we are at salary cap wise.

Don't forget Wise, that some of these easing pressures may be offset by players on lower salary scales 'coming good'

But, I agree...I reckon it's planned years in advance

Having said that, if we have a war chest, I hope we net a whale!

 

Oops, that's what you said..lol...sorry :)

Edited August 28, 20195 yr by jumbo returns

Lewis $$ replaced by Langdon. Expect circa $450000 per year over 4 years.  Still very good coin. 

4 minutes ago, spirit of norm smith said:

Lewis $$ replaced by Langdon. Expect circa $450000 per year over 4 years.  Still very good coin. 

For kicking a footy? [censored], yeah!!

3 hours ago, Wiseblood said:

Mahoney has been pretty good over the years with how we manage the salary cap, so you would assume that this would continue for the next few years.  I feel like the club plans for years in advance, as evidence with us being able to bring in recruits on good money while still retaining the young players on our list.  As you say, Lewis comes off the books and Jones takes a much lower deal, which frees up room with some of it going to Langdon (for whatever it is he gets).  

Proof will be in the pudding of course, but I feel comfortable with where we are at salary cap wise.

How so? He said we couldn't afford May if we had Hogan. 

Which part of retaining young players was getting rid of Hogan? (I forecasted when we got Lever that it would cost us Hogan, Brayshaw, Petracca or Oliver and it only took one year for that to happen).

We have Lever on one of the biggest contracts at the club and he isn't in our best 10 players.

We seem to be quite tight with the cap and just finished 17th.

37 minutes ago, Watts the matter said:

How so? He said we couldn't afford May if we had Hogan. 

Which part of retaining young players was getting rid of Hogan? (I forecasted when we got Lever that it would cost us Hogan, Brayshaw, Petracca or Oliver and it only took one year for that to happen).

We have Lever on one of the biggest contracts at the club and he isn't in our best 10 players.

We seem to be quite tight with the cap and just finished 17th.

What part of retaining players allows you to totally overlook the fact that, apart from Hogan (who had a desire to go home anyway), we have signed up every other player who is crucial to our list?  I love how you focus on Hogan but ignore how we've signed Gawn, Tom Mac, Viney, Oliver, Petracca, Gus, Salem etc to contracts while still being able to recruit the players we want.

To me, Mahoney has done a stellar job and Hogan was a different one.  He indicated a desire to go home and, when the Steven May opportunity presented itself, we went for it.  Nothing wrong with that.

2 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

What part of retaining players allows you to totally overlook the fact that, apart from Hogan (who had a desire to go home anyway), we have signed up every other player who is crucial to our list?  I love how you focus on Hogan but ignore how we've signed Gawn, Tom Mac, Viney, Oliver, Petracca, Gus, Salem etc to contracts while still being able to recruit the players we want.

To me, Mahoney has done a stellar job and Hogan was a different one.  He indicated a desire to go home and, when the Steven May opportunity presented itself, we went for it.  Nothing wrong with that.

Adding to this we've also built a reputation of identifying players we want to target early and being good to deal with and focussing on our overall trade period, rather than trying to win every trade.  This approach helps in players nominating us because they know we will be fair in deaping eith their existing club and will make the deal happen.