Around The Grounds - Round 18

[P-man 13,366]

12 hours ago, deeko said:

I despise nearly everything about the filth and enjoy seeing them lose but I just can't hate Pendles.

Just love watching him go about it, plays a different game the way he hand balls long to players running into dangerous spot. 

Other than that.... Eff em

Still one of my favourites. I don't think of him as a Pies player as that would make it impossible to like him. I consider him a Melbourne fan who ended up at the wrong club.

[Redleg 40,913]

10 hours ago, olisik said:

The pick we got that helped us move up the draft was from Toumpas

And the player we lost in the first place, oh sorry, it just fell out of my mouth.

[Wadda We Sing 10,685]

Whos gonna win out of GC and freo......tending towards GC i think?

[samcantstandya 1,045]

3 hours ago, P-man said:

Still one of my favourites. I don't think of him as a Pies player as that would make it impossible to like him. I consider him a Melbourne fan who ended up at the wrong club.

So you must have liked Chris Judd even though he picked Carlton over us. Maybe you might also like Prestia if he moves to Richmond. Me I like players like Stretch & Harmes who are father - sons or lifetime supporters. 

[Adam The God 30,247]

I gotta say. I can't deny I'm a little envious and [censored] off that a coach like Bolton can bring structure and work rate from ordinary players so quickly. We clearly have more talent on our list and going forward I wouldn't want to be Carlton (they're peaking too early too), but it is frustrating to watch. That said, the caveat is certainly our inexperience meaning it's harder to implement those structures and work rate for longer, on a consistent basis.

[Adam The God 30,247]

I guess the main frustration is imagine our guys with Bolton's structures and work rate.

[P-man 13,366]

3 minutes ago, samcantstandya said:

So you must have liked Chris Judd even though he picked Carlton over us. Maybe you might also like Prestia if he moves to Richmond. Me I like players like Stretch & Harmes who are father - sons or lifetime supporters. 

If Prestia is dumb enough to choose Richmond I'll pity him more than anything.

I like Pendles because of his playing ability and his professionalism. I rationalise it (clearly tongue in cheek I thought but perhaps not clear enough) by his supporting the MFC as a kid.

A little bit snippy for a Saturday afternoon mate. Wait until the final siren today before getting your angry pants on.

[Sir Why You Little 37,035]

38 minutes ago, AdamFphlebeb said:

I gotta say. I can't deny I'm a little envious and [censored] off that a coach like Bolton can bring structure and work rate from ordinary players so quickly. We clearly have more talent on our list and going forward I wouldn't want to be Carlton (they're peaking too early too), but it is frustrating to watch. That said, the caveat is certainly our inexperience meaning it's harder to implement those structures and work rate for longer, on a consistent basis.

Do we clearly have more talent?

People keep saying if around here but seriously i am yet to see it for more than 10 minutes and then it stops...

 

[Adam The God 30,247]

10 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Do we clearly have more talent?

People keep saying if around here but seriously i am yet to see it for more than 10 minutes and then it stops...

 

Yes.

The Blues' best players are all 26+, with the exception of Cripps (who is probably my favourite non-Melbourne player outside of Prestia  ). Their list is bog ordinary. They've got a surprising amount of experienced players in that team.

[John Crow Batty 8,863]

5 minutes ago, AdamFphlebeb said:

Yes.

The Blues' best players are all 26+, with the exception of Cripps (who is probably my favourite non-Melbourne player outside of Prestia  ). Their list is bog ordinary. They've got a surprising amount of experienced players in that team.

Their list is crap because they are too old? Ours is crap because it's too young? 

Edited July 23, 2016 by america de cali

[beelzebub 23,369]

Just checking scores....see Blues are up..

And at the scg.....wtf !

Other clubs seem so much more capable of getting up and running. Consensus had Carlton and Ess fighting off the spoon ffs.

[Redleg 40,913]

3 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Just checking scores....see Blues are up..

And at the scg.....wtf !

Other clubs seem so much more capable of getting up and running. Consensus had Carlton and Ess fighting off the spoon ffs.

Its not the starting, its the finishing.

[Adam The God 30,247]

11 minutes ago, america de cali said:

Their list is crap because they are too old. Ours is crap because it's too young? 

Their list has experienced B graders, while ours has inexperienced kids who have a much higher ceiling. You're being a little obstinate, ADC. Do you seriously think Carlton have a better list than us? We're playing the most inexperienced team in the comp week in, week out and we've still won more than them (with their B grade leaders).

[Adam The God 30,247]

13 minutes ago, AdamFphlebeb said:

Their list has experienced B graders, while ours has inexperienced kids who have a much higher ceiling. You're being a little obstinate, ADC. Do you seriously think Carlton have a better list than us? We're playing the most inexperienced team in the comp week in, week out and we've still won more than them (with their B grade leaders).

FWIW though, I've said to my Carlton mate all year that I think they'll beat us. They match up well on us for some reason.

[John Crow Batty 8,863]

4 minutes ago, AdamFphlebeb said:

Their list has experienced B graders, while ours has inexperienced kids who have a much higher ceiling. You're being a little obstinate, ADC. Do you seriously think Carlton have a better list than us? We're playing the most inexperienced team in the comp week in, week out and we've still won more than them (with their B grade leaders).

They have have demonstrated they can put on good show against quality opposition unlike us. They have improved in one season more than we have in three. This inexperience excuse is getting a little tiring.  Been the cop out excuse since 2009. 

Edited July 23, 2016 by america de cali

[Sir Why You Little 37,035]

2 minutes ago, AdamFphlebeb said:

Their list has experienced B graders, while ours has inexperienced kids who have a much higher ceiling. You're being a little obstinate, ADC. Do you seriously think Carlton have a better list than us? We're playing the most inexperienced team in the comp week in, week out and we've still won more than them (with their B grade leaders).

Adam i have heard for years our list is better than x y z clubs. I just want to see it and not read about. 

The last time we played Carlscum was an absolute disgrace. 

Potential is a lot different to actually becoming it...

[beelzebub 23,369]

Just now, america de cali said:

They have have demonstrated they can put on good show against quality opposition unlike us. They have improved in one season more than we have in three. This inexperience excuse it getting a little tiring.  Been the cop out excuse since 2009. 

They were seen as the Baby Boos this year, what their mass import of kids.

We struggle to get off the tarmac perennially.

[Adam The God 30,247]

10 minutes ago, america de cali said:

They have have demonstrated they can put on good show against quality opposition unlike us. They have improved in one season more than we have in three. This inexperience excuse it getting a little tiring.  Been the cop out excuse since 2009. 

I'm sorry, but we're still ahead of them, mate. Look at the ladder. We're younger and they're older. We'll only get better. This is their ceiling. I've liked your posts over a number of years, but your obstinate view of everything Melbourne being negative is what's getting tired. Yes, our improvement could have been steadier, but if it's a comparison between Melbourne and Carlton, we're still ahead.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

10 minutes ago, america de cali said:

They have have demonstrated they can put on good show against quality opposition unlike us. They have improved in one season more than we have in three. This inexperience excuse is getting a little tiring.  Been the cop out excuse since 2009. 

They look decent in half a season of footy.  We've taken it up to quality opposition, just like they have.  Let's see if their gameplan and list stand the test of time.  Roos has always said that he was building from the ground up for sustained success, not a quick fix that might shoot us up the ladder a little but flounder under pressure on in the finals.

7 minutes ago, AdamFphlebeb said:

I'm sorry, but we're still ahead of them, mate. Look at the ladder. We're younger and they're older. We'll only get better. This is their ceiling. I've liked your posts over a number of years, but your obstinate view of everything Melbourne being negative is what's getting tired. Yes, our improvement could have been steadier, but if it's a comparison between Melbourne and Carlton, we're still ahead.

Agreed.  There are the usual's who see everything in a negative light and won't budge from that no matter what you say.  There are both clear positives and negatives for the club at the moment, and I pity those that can't see both.

[deeko 952]

55 minutes ago, AdamFphlebeb said:

I gotta say. I can't deny I'm a little envious and [censored] off that a coach like Bolton can bring structure and work rate from ordinary players so quickly. We clearly have more talent on our list and going forward I wouldn't want to be Carlton (they're peaking too early too), but it is frustrating to watch. That said, the caveat is certainly our inexperience meaning it's harder to implement those structures and work rate for longer, on a consistent basis.

Very much the same in the envy party. They are tracking well. Not sure about the "peaking to early" part however as I think winning breeds more winning.

Bolton definitely has them believing in themselves again. Especially players like Ed Curnow, Touhey, Armfield who Malthouse had in the scrap heap. From the few games I have watched of them this year they seem to be playing ok footy. 

There leaders in Gibbs, Murph, Kreuz, Casboult all have 5-6 years left in them and there kids in Weitering, Docherty, Cripps, Sumner, Charlie Curnow and Silvagni will be players as well. Simpson plays the soft role in the spaces on the flank and will probably play till he's 40 like Burgoyne, Bob Murphy, Enright and Matt Boyd.

I think we will pass them over the next two years easily but they will knock us off later this season

[beelzebub 23,369]

1 hour ago, AdamFphlebeb said:

I gotta say. I can't deny I'm a little envious and [censored] off that a coach like Bolton can bring structure and work rate from ordinary players so quickly.

This ^^^^^^^

[Adam The God 30,247]

12 minutes ago, deeko said:

Very much the same in the envy party. They are tracking well. Not sure about the "peaking to early" part however as I think winning breeds more winning.

Bolton definitely has them believing in themselves again. Especially players like Ed Curnow, Touhey, Armfield who Malthouse had in the scrap heap. From the few games I have watched of them this year they seem to be playing ok footy. 

There leaders in Gibbs, Murph, Kreuz, Casboult all have 5-6 years left in them and there kids in Weitering, Docherty, Cripps, Sumner, Charlie Curnow and Silvagni will be players as well. Simpson plays the soft role in the spaces on the flank and will probably play till he's 40 like Burgoyne, Bob Murphy, Enright and Matt Boyd.

I think we will pass them over the next two years easily but they will knock us off later this season

RE: Peaking too early - they need draft picks to build their ordinary list. Of those you mention, Weitering Docherty, Cripps, Curnow and maybe Sumner will be winners. Not convinced on SOSOS. Gibbs is 27, injury-riddled Murphy is 29, injury-riddled Kreuzer is 27 and Casboult only has one string to his bow at 26. No way they all play 5-6 years more. Gibbs might. Murphy has 2-3 max, as does Kreuzer. They need a serious injection of talent. Outside of Cripps where are their A grade mids going to come from?

RE: "I think we will pass them over the next two years easily, but they will know us off later this season" - we're already ahead of them, mate. We've had more wins. We'll leave them in our wake over the next 2-3 years. But funnily enough, I too think they'll knock us off this season too.

[SaberFang 7,151]

Thankfully Roos spent those two years instilling defensive habits into our list... it's really paid off. 

[Adam The God 30,247]

10 minutes ago, SaberFang said:

Thankfully Roos spent those two years instilling defensive habits into our list... it's really paid off. 

I still think he used this as a way of bringing respectability to the scoreboard each week, but ensuring we still picked up the required top draft picks at the end of each season.

[deeko 952]

1 minute ago, AdamFphlebeb said:

RE: Peaking too early - they need draft picks to build their ordinary list. Of those you mention, Weitering Docherty, Cripps, Curnow and maybe Sumner will be winners. Not convinced on SOSOS. Gibbs is 27, injury-riddled Murphy is 29, injury-riddled Kreuzer is 27 and Casboult only has one string to his bow at 26. No way they all play 5-6 years more. Gibbs might. Murphy has 2-3 max, as does Kreuzer. They need a serious injection of talent. Outside of Cripps where are their A grade mids going to come from?

RE: "I think we will pass them over the next two years easily, but they will know us off later this season" - we're already ahead of them, mate. We've had more wins. We'll leave them in our wake over the next 2-3 years. But funnily enough, I too think they'll knock us off this season too.

All fair points Adam and i didn't know Murph was that old. Thought he was only mid 20s as well for some reason.

I say 5-6 years as players with talent are playing a lot longer now with 18 teams spreading the talent thinner. I think a few of these boys might hold on - pending injury obviously. Of course, Jones and Vince for us also will do this.

I know we have won more games but I have been impressed as much with them this year knocking over Port, Cats and pushing the weagles last week.

Our list has more talent imo also but as we agree, it's a danger game Rd 22.

cheers mate