THE ESSENDON 34: ON TRIAL

[beelzebub 22,282]

An excellent question. I'd also love to know what they said about their decision to the other players and coaches and doc and what the reactions were.

youd think somehow, for someone , it would inspire the question......" why arent they doiing this?? "

[binman 39,070]

From the other side 9a EFC fan who loves James), something to unite us:

'It still puzzles many Essendon fans as to why Hird was aggressively targeted and nominated as the architect. In today's complex management structures, Hird was on the periphery of the supplements program.'

'AAnd yet people still refuse to acknowledge simple facts such as his contrition about the supplements saga. Many claim Hird remains unrepentant, but he has apologised on three separate occasions –to the AFL Commission, to Essendon fans through the club website, and to the general public..'

read here: http://www.theage.com.au/comment/james-hirds-essendon-story-has-yet-to-be-told-20150303-13sa71.html

[biggestred 4,374]

And to that i say

http://m.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/hird-was-warned-the-inside-story-on-essendons-drug-scandal-20130821-2savu.html

[dpositive 1,557]

Have followed this thread with interest. Thanks for everyone who has contributed.

I am coming to a conclusion without being able to reference all who have provided detail to lead me to it that there is definitely guilt.

The program was conducted records have mysteriously disappeared.

ASADA and WADA are bigger than the AFL which has tried to remove the problem telling Essendon to stop and fining them.

Hird and Little actions bought time to satisfy AFL but has inflamed ASADA

The difficulty of this first revealed offence in AFL has huge ramifications for the total competition which AFL knew

scapegoats will be needed to satisfy WADA

DAnks gets banned for life.

Hird gets banned for life

DR gets banned from sport for life

Little and EFC board banned and removed.

Players who have left get 2 years

Watson forfeits brownlow

Watson and Fletcher 12 months from International game

players still listed get 12 months from when notices issued free to play after 4 rounds

EFC disbanded Workcover claims against Little and other legal entities

New Tassie bombers emerges from the wreckage to take their place in the AFL competition.

Will be interested to see if any of those are even close to the mark

BB would like your opinion on this comment of mine. I appreciate others opinions but think I have been convinced by your argument.

[beelzebub 22,282]

From the other side 9a EFC fan who loves James), something to unite us:

'It still puzzles many Essendon fans as to why Hird was aggressively targeted and nominated as the architect. In today's complex management structures, Hird was on the periphery of the supplements program.'

'AAnd yet people still refuse to acknowledge simple facts such as his contrition about the supplements saga. Many claim Hird remains unrepentant, but he has apologised on three separate occasions –to the AFL Commission, to Essendon fans through the club website, and to the general public..'

read here: http://www.theage.com.au/comment/james-hirds-essendon-story-has-yet-to-be-told-20150303-13sa71.html

Bin...do you think these luddites buy into this...idea that Hird isnt "THE ONE" because to do so is too painful and neccessitates a total re-evaluation of how they view the club and so called legends...or is it that are just dumb ?

[beelzebub 22,282]

BB would like your opinion on this comment of mine. I appreciate others opinions but think I have been convinced by your argument.

me ?

[dpositive 1,557]

me ?

Yes

Well not the preamble and the tassie bombers bit.

but the scaling of penalties from Danks down to the players.

That is that as the AFL need a scapegoat to show WADA that they are genuine about drugs in sport

Danks can be banned for life.

Hird gets banned for life.

DR Reid gets banned from sport for life.

Little and EFC board banned and removed.

Players who have left get 2 years.

Watson forfeits brownlow .

Watson and Fletcher 12 months from International game.

players still listed get 12 months from when notices issued free to play after 4 rounds.

This allows for severity to be acknowledged and some players disposed of while allowing the club to continue in a revised form with existing "duped" players continuing in a remorseful state.

[Dees2014 2,377]

Sure. Though i haven't made any grandiose or black and white predictions about outcomes. If i were to make a prediction it would be a guess (as of course yours is) as i don't have sufficient information to determine the likely outcome.

So with that in mind my guess is the players will be found guilty and given a 2 year ban, halved to 12 months (backdated to last competitive match) based on being duped. That will wipe out this season but not the next and they will be able to restart training in September when the 12 months elapses.

The players will accept this penalty (under pressure from EFC who will have to pay all contracts) and sit out the year. Top up players will be brought in. ASADA will also accept this penalty as will WADA. There will be no further appeal. CAS will not be needed.

The decision will be made not to penalise EFC any further as the argument will be the losing 17 players will be penalty enough when added to the penalties received for the governance breaches. There will be uproar about this.

EFC will dismiss Hird, who in turn will sue EEFC for wrongful dismissal.

Not sure if ASADA will go after Hird (or other coaches eg Goodwin?). I don't think they will or else they would have done so already.

As you say we will see who is right (or more right as the case may be)

I actually agree with most of what you say.

Amazing isn't it!

[beelzebub 22,282]

Yes

Well not the preamble and the tassie bombers bit.

but the scaling of penalties from Danks down to the players.

That is that as the AFL need a scapegoat to show WADA that they are genuine about drugs in sport

Danks can be banned for life. has to...and he'll probably wonder why

Hird gets banned for life.....ditto ^^^^^^

DR Reid gets banned from sport for life. Ought to...amazed hes not stricken off already tbh...then again

Little and EFC board banned and removed. Yep...about tright

Players who have left get 2 years. Am thnking players will get 18 months with allowance from Nov... so effectively 15mnths

Watson forfeits brownlow . If he's honourable hell do it himself...and he might !!

Watson and Fletcher 12 months from International game.... nupp same 18 mnths from the games...more poor advice...diddums

players still listed get 12 months from when notices issued free to play after 4 rounds. all players ..18mnths

This allows for severity to be acknowledged and some players disposed of while allowing the club to continue in a revised form with existing "duped" players continuing in a remorseful state.

i say 18 mnths ..but could be 2yrs or more...they havent helped their cause have they

[What 18,810]

read here: http://www.theage.com.au/comment/james-hirds-essendon-story-has-yet-to-be-told-20150303-13sa71.html

Wow.

That is a really sad indictment on The Age that they have actually decided to post crap like that.

[What 18,810]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-03-03/senior-bombers-players-meet-with-afl-ceo-gillon-mclachlan-as-antidoping-verdict-approaches

A DELEGATION of senior Essendon players met with AFL chief executive Gillon McLachlan last week in the countdown to the AFL Anti-Doping Tribunal's decision on whether they will face suspensions.

Gotta ease them in to what will be the worst news they can get. Enjoy the 2 years off fellas

Edited March 3, 2015 by hogans_heroes

[beelzebub 22,282]

[url=http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-03-03/senior-bombers-players-meet-with-afl-ceo-gillon-mclachlan-as-antidoping-verdict-approaches]http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-03-03/senior-bombers-players-meet-with-afl-ceo-gillon-mclachlan-as-antidoping-verdict-approaches[/url

Gotta ase them in to what will be the worst news they can get. Enjoy the 2 years off fellas

personally I prefer the Mack Truck approach !! Edited March 3, 2015 by beelzebub

[daisycutter 28,680]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-03-03/senior-bombers-players-meet-with-afl-ceo-gillon-mclachlan-as-antidoping-verdict-approaches

Gotta ase them in to what will be the worst news they can get. Enjoy the 2 years off fellas

It is understood potential outcomes of the Anti-Doping Tribunal were not discussed.

so they meet with the afl ceo and chief counsel in a private meeting anf don't discuss potential outcomes? yeah sure.......they just talked about food prices at etihad and half time entertainment

[beelzebub 22,282]

so they meet with the afl ceo and chief counsel in a private meeting anf don't discuss potential outcomes? yeah sure.......they just talked about food prices at etihad and half time entertainment

would have thought that this meeting was somewhat inappropriate. .. just me ??

[biggestred 4,374]

Slight conflict of interest id have thought

[beelzebub 22,282]

Slight conflict of interest id have thought

AFL is desperate to soothe

[Bitter but optimistic 21,507]

No doubt I am simple minded but I am over this shite and speculation. It is BORING!!!!

Please!!! Let there be an end to it!!

[beelzebub 22,282]

No doubt I am simple minded but I am over this shite and speculation. It is BORING!!!!

Please!!! Let there be an end to it!!

Seriously. Dont be here then.

Interesting to some of us

[CHF 2,615]

No doubt I am simple minded but I am over this shite and speculation. It is BORING!!!!

Please!!! Let there be an end to it!!

Hate to be the one to tell you this but it aint going to be over any time soon.

My take on the path of things to come?

Within the next few weeks the AFL tribunal will submit a guilty finding against the players and then proceed to evaluate the penalties. Once the penalties are handed down, I expect that there will be two appeals. one from the players and the other from ASADA. from the players because they will maintain their innocence and from ASADA because the penalties are not harsh enough.

After the appeals are heard then there will be the referral to CAS by WADA if the penalties are not satisfactory in their view.

After the players are dealt with them attention will turn to the club and possible penalties that may be levied against them. As I understand it, this may well be taken out of the hands of the AFL and referred directly to CAS via WADA. The club may be sanctioned as a whole because of the structure of the abuse.

Short term outcome?

In my opinion the players will be sentenced to 12/18months with WADA via a CAS appeal taking that to 24months.

In the medium term, I think the club will be sanctioned via WADA/CAS and may have some difficulty maintaining it's very existence.

Longer term I see Workcare looking at charges.

Sorry BBO, I see this dragging on for quite a bit of time.

[beelzebub 22,282]

Prety much on the money I suspect CHF

[daisycutter 28,680]

would have thought that this meeting was somewhat inappropriate. .. just me ??

private inappropriate meetings are the afl's modus operandi, bub

transparency has always been a dirty word

[Giles 179]

http://ondemand.rrr.org.au/player/128/201503010000 Go to the 13 minute mark of this radio broadcast interview with Stevie Dank... Has anyone Hird this? I've had one listen, but I'll be revisiting again and again. Extraodinary.

[Giles 179]

http://ondemand.rrr.org.au/player/128/201503010000 Go to the 13 minute mark of this radio broadcast interview with Stevie Dank... Has anyone Hird this? I've had one listen, but I'll be revisiting again and again. Extraodinary.

I still don't understand. If records were kept and they all did nothing wrong, then disclose it and move on... no problems.

[hardtack 10,127]

It just keeps getting better at Windy Hill... apparently Sheedy is poised to return...
http://www.smh.com.au/afl/afl-news/essendon-rejoices-as-kevin-sheedy-is-set-to-return-home-20150303-13u4yf.html

[bing181 8,208]

would have thought that this meeting was somewhat inappropriate. .. just me ??

No, not just you.

Old habits die hard.