CHANGES 2014 - Retirements, Trades and Delistings

[CBDees 3,167]

Surely some arrangement can be made as regards both Trengove and Evans in which nobody loses out and we can secure Jack back onto our list via the Rookie Draft [subject to an understanding reached with St. Kilda]? It seems a better scenario than immediately putting Jack onto the LTI list at the onset of the season and promoting a Rookie then, particularly if it enables us to use pick 40 [and maybe 53] in the National Draft. It seems the wrong way to plan for the long-term if we go into the draft with only two live picks!

[Bossdog 2,002]

I don't understand why people are obsessed with the draft.....Paul Roos has never been keen on the lottery that is the draft..

I think he has shown that trading and picking up players with some sort of AFL experience over fresh faced kids coming from the TAC cup

If we go to the draft with only 3 picks so be it.....I trust the footy dept to make the right calls now

I have had enough of banking on draft picks to be the next star only to be disappointed later when they don't come on as expected.

And then have posters complaining that we should have picked........instead of ........

[Coq au vin 755]

Absolutely!

I'm sorry but I disagree with the first statement strongly. Compare our list with any in the top 8 and I think you will agree.

[Coq au vin 755]

Surely some arrangement can be made as regards both Trengove and Evans in which nobody loses out and we can secure Jack back onto our list via the Rookie Draft [subject to an understanding reached with St. Kilda]? It seems a better scenario than immediately putting Jack onto the LTI list at the onset of the season and promoting a Rookie then, particularly if it enables us to use pick 40 [and maybe 53] in the National Draft. It seems the wrong way to plan for the long-term if we go into the draft with only two live picks!

trengove is finished.

[CBDees 3,167]

trengove is finished.

If that is the case then we should use whatever mechanism we can to remove him off the list so that we can avail ourselves of all options in the main, rookie and PS drafts.

[monoccular 17,401]

Michael Evans is studying law so if that turns out to be the case then I would suggest that he's about to get some handy lessons in contract law (and Redleg can tell you what an interesting subject that happens to be).

I think the club President used to work in that area of the law too so whatever happens I'm sure "Pickles" will be looked after and his contract will be honoured in terms of payment of it comes to that.

With the changes that have occurred with recruiting, drafting, trading, free agency and mature age rookies it has to be understood that the rookie list is not what it was when first introduced. Perhaps "rookie list" is a bit of a misnomer these days and the AFL should find something different?

Maybe revert to the old VFL days - supplementary list ?

[dazzledavey36 54,043]

Maybe revert to the old VFL days - supplementary list ?

I was a bit young when all that was happening.

Can anyone explain what exactly was the supplementary list?

[Adam The God 29,952]

I reckon we can comfortably lose another 8 players from that list. Then there are a couple of question marks, due to the fact that some have never even played a game before and/or require some time to judge.

[Whispering_Jack 29,631]

I was a bit young when all that was happening.

Can anyone explain what exactly was the supplementary list?

I'm not sure whether there was an official status for supplementary list players or what it meant in terms of pay scales etc. Back before the drafts when the VFL clubs would recruit through local and country zones, trading with other VFL clubs and with interstate clubs, they would announce their lists about a week before the start of the season. I don't think there was a limit to the number of players on the senior list and the clubs also had Under 19s and for a brief time some even had Under 17s. The supplementary list was usually a small list of players who missed out on the senior list but who clubs were still prepared to keep on, possibly for encouragement - similar to the rookie list of today.

Since the main list these days is called the "primary list", my suggestion would be to call the rookie list, "the secondary list". I would also allow clubs to move contracted players from the primary to the secondary list, especially in circumstances where they have suffered long term injuries without the necessity of delisting. This would certainly take away from the stigma that some people perceive would apply if a club a club moved someone like JT off the main list to cover for the loss of the player in such circumstances.

[dazzledavey36 54,043]

I'm not sure whether there was an official status for supplementary list players or what it meant in terms of pay scales etc. Back before the drafts when the VFL clubs would recruit through local and country zones, trading with other VFL clubs and with interstate clubs, they would announce their lists about a week before the start of the season. I don't think there was a limit to the number of players on the senior list and the clubs also had Under 19s and for a brief time some even had Under 17s. The supplementary list was usually a small list of players who missed out on the senior list but who clubs were still prepared to keep on, possibly for encouragement - similar to the rookie list of today.

Since the main list these days is called the "primary list", my suggestion would be to call the rookie list, "the secondary list". I would also allow clubs to move contracted players from the primary to the secondary list, especially in circumstances where they have suffered long term injuries without the necessity of delisting. This would certainly take away from the stigma that some people perceive would apply if a club a club moved someone like JT off the main list to cover for the loss of the player in such circumstances.

Cameron Bruce and Simon Godfrey are two that started out on our supplementary list.

Anyone else?

[Whispering_Jack 29,631]

Update as a result of signing Ben Newton:-

By way of adding to the above, here is a picture of where our list stands officially as of yesterday's list lodgement:-

2015 MELBOURNE LIST

Primary list

1. Bail, Rohan

2. Barry, Dominic

3. Cross, Daniel

4. Dawes, Chris

5. Dunn, Lynden

6. Evans, Michael

7. Fitzpatrick, Jack

8. Frost, Sam

9. Garland, Colin

10. Garlett, Jeff

11. Gawn, Max

12. Grimes, Jack

13. Hogan, Jesse

14. Howe, Jeremy

15. Hunt, Jayden

16. Jamar, Mark

17. Jetta, Neville

18. Jones, Matt

19. Jones, Nathan

20. Kennedy-Harris, Jay

21. Kent, Dean

22. Lumumba, Heritier

23. McDonald, Tom

24. McKenzie, Jordie

25. Michie, Viv

26. Newton, Ben

27. Pedersen, Cameron

28. Riley, Aidan

29. Salem, Christian

30. Spencer, Jake

31. Stretch, Billy

32. Terlich, Dean

33. Toumpas, Jimmy

34. Trengove, Jack

35. Tyson, Dom

36. Vince, Bernie

37. Viney, Jack

38. Watts, Jack

39. National Draft Pick 2

40. National Draft Pick 3

Rookie list

41. Harmes, James

42. King, Max

43. Rookie Draft Pick 2

44. Rookie Draft Pick 20

The list might change with further list lodgement before the National Draft and possible delisted free agency inclusions but any additional draft picks can only be gained by delisting or retirement of players but note all current players are contracted.

[Elusive Tunbridge 795]

If we've effectively dropped Pick 40 to pick up Newton, I'm happy enough with that. Delisting Evans, paying out his contract, in order to reinstate 40 is an option that may be exercised, though I doubt it. Trengove will stay on the list as LTI.

[InVINCEable 358]

Update as a result of signing Ben Newton:-

By way of adding to the above, here is a picture of where our list stands officially as of yesterday's list lodgement:-

2015 MELBOURNE LIST

Primary list

1. Bail, Rohan

2. Barry, Dominic

3. Cross, Daniel

4. Dawes, Chris

5. Dunn, Lynden

6. Evans, Michael

7. Fitzpatrick, Jack

8. Frost, Sam

9. Garland, Colin

10. Garlett, Jeff

11. Gawn, Max

12. Grimes, Jack

13. Hogan, Jesse

14. Howe, Jeremy

15. Hunt, Jayden

16. Jamar, Mark

17. Jetta, Neville

18. Jones, Matt

19. Jones, Nathan

20. Kennedy-Harris, Jay

21. Kent, Dean

22. Lumumba, Heritier

23. McDonald, Tom

24. McKenzie, Jordie

25. Michie, Viv

26. Newton, Ben

27. Pedersen, Cameron

28. Riley, Aidan

29. Salem, Christian

30. Spencer, Jake

31. Stretch, Billy

32. Terlich, Dean

33. Toumpas, Jimmy

34. Trengove, Jack

35. Tyson, Dom

36. Vince, Bernie

37. Viney, Jack

38. Watts, Jack

39. National Draft Pick 2

40. National Draft Pick 3

Rookie list

41. Harmes, James

42. King, Max

43. Rookie Draft Pick 2

44. Rookie Draft Pick 20

The list might change with further list lodgement before the National Draft and possible delisted free agency inclusions but any additional draft picks can only be gained by delisting or retirement of players but note all current players are contracted.

Delist Nathan Jones.

[Nasher 33,607]

Pick 3 being our last live pick doesn't sit fantastically well with me I've got to say.

I hope Newton and Frost add something long term to the club, as they are essentially our second and third round picks. Taking non-22 players from other clubs at the expense of the draft seems risky, though I accept that the draft is risky too.

Interesting times.

[Lucifers Hero 39,292]

Pick 3 being our last live pick doesn't sit fantastically well with me I've got to say.

I hope Newton and Frost add something long term to the club, as they are essentially our second and third round picks. Taking non-22 players from other clubs at the expense of the draft seems risky, though I accept that the draft is risky too.

Interesting times.

Agree.

Feel comforted that we have an 'un-live' pick 43 (Stretch).

So recruiting in terms of our age profile:

- 3 - (18 year olds),

- 2 - 22 year olds, and

- 2 - 26/27 year olds

Looks ok from a team balance point of view but I pray that they turn out to be good decisions.

Time will tell: I now fluctuate, almost daily from great excitement to good god I so hope this new recruit works out!

[poita 3,889]

Pick 3 being our last live pick doesn't sit fantastically well with me I've got to say.

It is actually the dumbest thing this club has done in a long time, and that is saying something. If we were Hawthorn I could understand wanting to keep a premiership list together and not wanting to use mid-range draft picks, but we have the worst list in the competition. There are at least ten immediate candidates for delisting and we need to make a hard decision or two to improve the list further.

[InVINCEable 358]

It is actually the dumbest thing this club has done in a long time, and that is saying something. If we were Hawthorn I could understand wanting to keep a premiership list together and not wanting to use mid-range draft picks, but we have the worst list in the competition. There are at least ten immediate candidates for delisting and we need to make a hard decision or two to improve the list further.

Please tell me you're joking

[drdrake 3,151]

It is actually the dumbest thing this club has done in a long time, and that is saying something. If we were Hawthorn I could understand wanting to keep a premiership list together and not wanting to use mid-range draft picks, but we have the worst list in the competition. There are at least ten immediate candidates for delisting and we need to make a hard decision or two to improve the list further.

Really, we get Frost, Garlett, Harry O and Newton, 4 players that will most likely be in our round 1 team, plus we still get pick 2, 3 and Stretch . Frost and Newton are young, Garlett has 5 years left. To me we have the right balance, bring in players that will improve our side for 2015 plus get 3 all Australian U18 players and have no requirement for them to play if they are not ready.

It is all about balance, we are recruiting for now and the future rather than a 5 year plan based around U18 kids.

[jackaub 1,402]

I reckon we can comfortably lose another 8 players from that list. Then there are a couple of question marks, due to the fact that some have never even played a game before and/or require some time to judge.

I agree ADAM last year I had 17 players on my list to go

There now remains 8 more and they will go next year I hope. All are damaged /Underperforming/ Lazy / poor draft picks

[Nasher 33,607]

Agree.

Feel comforted that we have an 'un-live' pick 43 (Stretch).

So recruiting in terms of our age profile:

- 3 - (18 year olds),

- 2 - 22 year olds, and

- 2 - 26/27 year olds

Looks ok from a team balance point of view but I pray that they turn out to be good decisions.

Time will tell: I now fluctuate, almost daily from great excitement to good god I so hope this new recruit works out!

Thanks for that, looking at the age spread and where our list is, I think it makes sense that we've taken this path. We've clearly taken Newton, Frost, (Michie) as players of an age right before they're due to become really good players. Hopefully they actually can, because if they do it should accelerate our improvement drastically. And as someone pointed out in the Newton thread, if these guys step up, it undoes some of the damage of the disastrous 2010 draft.

Don't think I'll ever be able to not be nervous about filling our list with other clubs fringers and misfits, but there's probably a healthy dose of MFCSS driving that.

As I said, interesting times. This will be a fascinating off period to reflect on no matter what happens. Poita has already put his view out there!

[Deemotivated 550]

I agree ADAM last year I had 17 players on my list to go

There now remains 8 more and they will go next year I hope. All are damaged /Underperforming/ Lazy / poor draft picks

Evans, Terlich, McKenzie and Matt Jones are the ones I'd be pushing out. 1 this year and 3 in October 15

I'd like to use pick 40 in the draft. We know what these 4 offer our team, all are limited footballers. ND 40 whilst a speculative pick could be a 10 year gun or a bust but you've got to inject the talent and not just persevere with list clogger's.

Trengove situation is a really bad one and difficult to handle to do the right thing for both parties.

[NowWeKnow 130]

What's Roosy on about here? Is pick 40 alive or not? I'm confused.

Pre-season to go to another level: Roos

“I think we’ve got some good youth and experience and then we’ve still got picks two and three and 40 [in the NAB AFL Draft],” he said.

[beelzebub 23,310]

What's Roosy on about here? Is pick 40 alive or not? I'm confused.

Pre-season to go to another level: Roos

“I think we’ve got some good youth and experience and then we’ve still got picks two and three and 40 [in the NAB AFL Draft],” he said.

What don't you get? lol

i.e. extrapolated it means ...

[beelzebub 23,310]

Evans, Terlich, McKenzie and Matt Jones are the ones I'd be pushing out. 1 this year and 3 in October 15

I'd like to use pick 40 in the draft. We know what these 4 offer our team, all are limited footballers. ND 40 whilst a speculative pick could be a 10 year gun or a bust but you've got to inject the talent and not just persevere with list clogger's.

Trengove situation is a really bad one and difficult to handle to do the right thing for both parties.

actually its dead simple....and fair to both parties. It just seems abhorrent to some here; probably doesnt within the club.

[samcantstandya 1,041]

Evans, Terlich, McKenzie and Matt Jones are the ones I'd be pushing out. 1 this year and 3 in October 15

I'd like to use pick 40 in the draft. We know what these 4 offer our team, all are limited footballers. ND 40 whilst a speculative pick could be a 10 year gun or a bust but you've got to inject the talent and not just persevere with list clogger's.

Trengove situation is a really bad one and difficult to handle to do the right thing for both parties.

We need 2 put 2 of them at least on the rookie list on full pay or bite the bullet & pay them out.