he wasn't joking saty

he was just saying that to appease you

Stirrer

Frawley hegded his bet with McDonald in front of him he started to move to the goal square for the long bomb to the vacant square, however the kicker went short and Frawley was left out of position.

Well that was seriously dumb of him, because it allowed the tallest bulldog on the ground to have free reign in a 2-on-1 contest in his team's favour.

Well that was seriously dumb of him, because it allowed the tallest bulldog on the ground to have free reign in a 2-on-1 contest in his team's favour.

not really, mac would not mark it but bring it to ground 9/10

that's why you train together and learn off each other

it was a fair bet to play for the long bomb,

not really, mac would not mark it but bring it to ground 9/10

that's why you train together and learn off each other

it was a fair bet to play for the long bomb,

I agree jazza

And everyone is a rocket scientist after the event.

Can someone give the name of a player that does not make errors?

not really, mac would not mark it but bring it to ground 9/10

that's why you train together and learn off each other

it was a fair bet to play for the long bomb,

McDonald was never going to bring that to ground because he had his hands full with his own man.

Well that was seriously dumb of him, because it allowed the tallest bulldog on the ground to have free reign in a 2-on-1 contest in his team's favour.

Yeah it was a mistake but the biggest mistake was by either a loose man or midfielder not getting back to make an extra man at that contest or pushing up and pressuring the kick in to Cordy so it didn't go to him or did go to Frawley.

The last 10 minutes compared to the rest of the game highlighted what we've said all year about our backline not being too bad and our midfield being rubbish and therefore scoring against us being very easy.

Given we have Hogan in next year, Clarke back (hopefully) and Dawes playing well I would try Fitzy in the role Lonergan plays at the Cats. Lonergan would cover resting rucks and tall forwards like Tippett and Westhoff. Who knows, he might develop into a Carlisle who went to the Bombers as a forward but has killed them at CHB with a bit of swinging to top off his contribution. According to all the brilliant Demonland scribes Fitzy is the club's fastest over 20m, 50m and 100m. Closing speed and height would be a great asset in the backline. It is the role Sellar has tried to fill but doesn't have the agility or speed or talent to perform well in. Combine that with taking the tap in the backline and you potentially have a great new role for Fitzy!

It's a possibility but who's spot is he expected to take? He's not better than Frawley that's for sure. He's not better than Garland as a third tall. So it will become him v McDonald. Fitzy has worked out a technique for kicking on goal but I'd still prefer McDonald's field kicking and that says something. I'd also prefer McDonald's fitness and natural instinct and chopping the ball off and winning the ball on the ground. Also he isn't in top form yet but I think McDonald can get intercept marking happening just like Carlisle does. Remember Watts and McDonald BOTH took that saving mark in the dying minutes!

I'd say we leave McDonald at CHB and keep Fitzy in his role and rotate Clark, Dawes, Hogan out of the team at times. It's fair to expect one of them to miss some parts of the season. Hogan shouldn't play more than 15 full games next year anyway it's too much to ask and we can even go tall and play all 3 and use Howe as a wing man or drop him at times.

There's 3 key position defenders at Fitzy's height in the league currently. 1 very good - Carlisle. 1 decent with potential - Rory Thompson and one who's a bit of a maybe in Jordan Roughead for the dogs. Seems like every other team is more for traditional guys like Frawley and McDonald who are around the 195cm mark. Even Lonergan is big but he's not 200cm. And some of the best defenders are closer to 190cm mark like Scott Thompson for North.

Yeah it was a mistake but the biggest mistake was by either a loose man or midfielder not getting back to make an extra man at that contest or pushing up and pressuring the kick in to Cordy so it didn't go to him or did go to Frawley.

The last 10 minutes compared to the rest of the game highlighted what we've said all year about our backline not being too bad and our midfield being rubbish and therefore scoring against us being very easy.

And some supports just whingeing for whingeing sake, move on and get back on topic, there are plenty of other threads to whinge in

Fitz is a fwd who can ruck rather than someone like gawn who is a ruckman that they send fwd... Hopefully he can keep it up but with the rule changes to a interchange cap he has a position created for him by the afl

That crystallises my thoughts well - Gawnius maximus with another hopefully uninterrupted preseason and added fitness could do the majority of the ruck work, relieved by Fitzy but with both on ground most of the match. It allows an extra runner on the bench.

It may be worth during the experimental end of the season to consider giving him at least some time in defence, as were he able to do this it would add flexibility in the event of an intra-match injury to a defensive tall.

No! This is a horrible theory. Pedersen is 193cm, Gawn 208. When you have a throw in deep in a pocket which one do you want to make sure Aaron Sandilands or Dean Cox doesn't give silver service to a running midfielder?

The ruckman is an onballer just like any other midfield and therefore should be at the stoppage when in the defensive 50. It's not inefficient at all. Certainly making them run forward to the forward 50 stoppages is but you have to have your best ruck at a stoppage in the defensive 50. Plus why would you pick Pedersen or Sellar over Frawley or McDonald purely because they can contest a few ball ups in the backline?

Definitely - the designated ruck must contest every ball up or boundary throw in all over the ground except maybe deep in attack, where the opposition have to worry about our ruck work. A part timer doing this in defence is too risky, and also he has to leave his man unattended.

He played a huge part in our first goal. Nathan Jones bombed the ball high to the square, towards Fitz & Watts and their opponents. Watts peeled off, and Fitz went up against the two tall Dogs, and palmed it perfectly to Watts who snapped the goal. Just good smart thinking, but the sort of thing that's mentally and physically so far beyond Jamar & Spencer. If the two Jacks can continue to combine like that, we may be really on to something.

It looked as if the more experienced JW was fully confident that JF could bring it to ground. Would he have been as confident had Jamar or Spencer been down there - or indeed would they have had the agility, and nous, to make the contest?

Strauss has been so unreliable

I get nerves when he gets the ball and I really dont think he is able to focus and concentrate for long enough

I personally haven't seen him in person this season, but certainly last year I was concerned by his attack on the ball, and his decision making.

I take it you didn't watch Strauss' game for Casey on Saturday then?

Back on topic, re Fitzpatrick, he has played seven games, he has overcome shoulder surgery, Chronic Fatigue Syndrome and being diagnosed with Diabetes 1 (and the changes to lifestyle that entails), he has played his guts out at Casey and been rewarded.

He is growing in confidence with every game and until Clark is fit, he will do me up forward, it is up to him to keep his place on the list and if he continues on from Saturday he will do it

From somebody who has watched him in junior games and at Casey, when he had the shot from the boundary I sat back and said to my lovely lady he'll kick this.....seen him do it before

Geez - I hope you are right about Clark getting fit and coming back. It may be pessimism born of decades of following the Demons, but I will believe it when I see it.

I am old enough to remember Paul Prymke, Glenn Lovett, Stephen Tingay, TheOx, Sean Charles, Alen Jackovich, even James Cook and to an extent Gary Lyon's careers ruined or curtailed by recurring injuries.

Long-term I think Gawn is no. 1 ruck and Fitz is backup/spare forward. Spencer may push for that no. 1 spot, but neither of them are good enough around the ground to be the second ruck/utility/forward that Fitz and Clark can be. This will of course leave us with too many tall forwards. Clark, Dawes, Hogan, Watts and resting ruck is way too much for the forward line. Competition for spots is a good thing, but it's a waste to have one or two of them playing reserves.

JW - it was really great to see him deep up forward again Saturday night, and he looked the part, but playing him off a HFF or a wing could be sensational, given his poise, decision making and delivery. Whilst he can do a good job off HBF I feel he is better used delivering directly to a goal kicker, or kicking them himself.

WE WON!!!!!!!!!!!!!! and this topic is about Fitzpatrick, give it a rest, I am already looking forward to see them having a crack against Sydney and Fitzy taking another step

S - there are many here who don't appear to take a lot of joy out of a win, which is, after all, a win.

He had a great game, but that non-contest was diabolical, especially given the state of the game.

At the time I almost didn't notice it, but watching back on the replay, I have no idea how it happened. Lose of concentration? did he lose his footing?

It didn't help that there was no pressure on the kicks coming in either. Because at the end of the day, the comeback started in the middle where the Dogs got one uncontested clearance after another, and we did not give a yelp. Yes, Gawn being out on his feet didn't help, but our position was god awful and Griffin finally broke loose of Nicholson and it all turned to absolute shite.

My biggest wish for next year, apart from getting a gun senior coach, is getting a great midfield coach. Our positioning at the bounce is seriously shambolic. I don't understand how we are constantly caught with numbers on the wrong side of the contest.

Bring back Ratten?

Good call - by all means a top line midfield coach is a necessity, but I just wonder how much improvement will evolve naturally with improved fitness and stamina (Mr Missen's task). I think a lot of the errors and apparent lack of concentration and effort in Q4 was contributed by the fact that most of the players were out on their feet after the superlative efforts of the first 3Q.

Mono....just a note on Strauss, read the latest Casey review, they have been really working on his aggressiveness or perceived lack thereof, they belt him around at the trainings I have seen

With the midfield, I raise this point, last year Port's midfield was a supposed basket case like ours, they added a big bodied kid and got another pre season into the youngsters in the midfield and bang.......this is the plan, Toumpas, Evans, Matt Jones, Viney (wait till you see the size he has put on) et al, Terlich will be able to go in.......take a deep breath everybody......Gawn/Spencer/Fitzpatrick/? will all have another pre season as well........the club said they wouldn't mind another quality midfielder, let them work on it

It will come, again we saw flashes of it on Saturday, this week will be a real test, but you learn from them

The coaching is the last thing to worry about, at least they are trying things, Nicholson as a tagger, he will have learnt so much on Saturday trying to curail Griffen, give him Hanneberry this week

Edited July 1, 201311 yr by Satyriconhome

Mono....just a note on Strauss, read the latest Casey review, they have been really working on his aggressiveness or perceived lack thereof, they belt him around at the trainings I have seen

I would like to see Strauss have the confidence to go and get the ball, we have a few younger players like this. They show ability but have been shown up by Terlich and Clisby both of whom are ball getters. When Strauss backs himself he will be a good player, he was good on Saturday.

I see no value in pushing Fitzy into the backline. He is just starting to find his feet as a forward and has shown he can do the job. Why mess with him at this point? The insane drive towards "versatility" has done a lot of harm to a number of players. There is absolutely nothing wrong with playing a specific role and doing it well. In his case he is clearly heading towards that spare tall forward/second ruck spot that was earmarked for Pedo last season. He is a far better prospect in that role than Pedo will ever be, so let him do the job.

Breakout game from Jack. Needs to back it up with another solid one next week. May look a bit clumsy and startled at times, but improving with every game.

This is what happens when players do a proper apprenticeship in the VFL, most of Collingwoods players are brought through the system like Fitzy has been, great effort and perseverance from the guy, hopefully he kicks on and plays 150 games.

I can see why he was once rated a top 5 to top 10 pick. The guy can seriously play and it makes me wonder why last year and even this year Neeld refused to play him. He has battled some demons along the way with injuries, chronic fatigue and Diabetes. If anything it would have tested his mental strength and so far he is coming out a winner. Credit must go to him for his determination and perseverance.

Onya Fitzy!

He looks like some sort of weird prehistoric creature but love his improvement. It's going to be a real battle for a spot in the forward line next year.

Fritzel? As in the rape dungeon guy?! Ouch!

I'm a fitzy fan!

Best Demon on the ground.

Merge thread?

Yes, a great game today. I've got no doubt he will be a key player for us in the future.

Having watched him often at Casey, he was always a standout in as much as he has elite speed for someone so tall and use both at Casey very effectively, but I suspect he was so hidebound by Neeld that he was not allowed to show off his natural talents.

He used his speed, marking ability and strength today. A hey, he can even kick straight .

It is interesting that all of Dawes, Fitzy, Clark, Howe and hogan are first class kicks for goal. All we have to do is get it down to them now.

Edited July 7, 201311 yr by Dees2014

If he can improve his rucking and Gawn continues to rise then Jamar may not get a game.

This is what happens when players do a proper apprenticeship in the VFL, most of Collingwoods players are brought through the system like Fitzy has been, great effort and perseverance from the guy, hopefully he kicks on and plays 150 games.

Yep, someone else was trying to blame Mark Neeld for not bringing Fitzy on earlier but he has obviously served the right apprenticeship

Which is another reason why the year spent in the VFL by Hogan will be perfect for his development

He was held back because of his many health issues. Not just the diabetes and CFS, but several injuries during the pre-season. They said on a few occasions that they wanted to be absolutely sure his body was ok before they put him into the senior side so he didn't just break down again.

Fitzy's output has been great, really looks comfortable at the level. Really wrapped to see him do well against a good side in Sydney today. Given our forward stocks now though, we will probably have to look at trading him with Hogan in next year. To the Dogs perhaps, for their 2nd round pick? If everyone is fit, he's our 5th choice key forward.

If he can improve his rucking and Gawn continues to rise then Jamar may not get a game.

+1