Caroline Wilson's descent into gutter journalism

[Jack Jack 415]

The only way I can see anything happening to us is if the AFL investigators have a Denis Denuto law degree.

I'm not worried, but it is annoying that it has dragged on for so long and encourages these negative articles.

The AFL integrity investigation is diminishing the integrity of the AFL.

[hoopla 418]

The one thing that annoys me about the current administration is their reticence to get on the front foot and defend the honour of the club. Now that the article is in print and its contents are being discussed on the airwaves I want them to categorically deny that tanking ever took place and that Melbourne will vigourously defend any suggestion to the contrary. Some will say that they can't comment because it's a current investigation, or that it won't matter anyway, but they can most certainly declare the club's innocence and willingness to fight these suggestions.

I'm absolutely certain that Kennett or Maguire would be denying these suggestions and defending thie club to the hilt in the same circumstances. Get on the front foot and defend your club. And do it now.

In many ways I agree with you .But we need to be very careful before putting the AFL off-side.

There is no doubt that Eddie and Co would making all sorts of statements about legal challenges etc etc.Perhaps this just another example of a competition increasingly dominated by the power clubs? The fact is that our survival depends on the continued goodwill of the AFL - and Collingwood's does not.

[jnrmac 19,207]

I would plead guilty on the terms that we would be stripped of our Pick number 4 in the 2007 draft.

About to tear into you and then realised '2007'. Sadly 5 years too late.

[rjay 23,970]

what was Smith's stance by way of curiosity, cheers.

What did he say?

It is on the SEN podcast this morning with KB, comes in half way at about the 4 min mark. In a nutshell he believes the AFL was at fault and in denial about tanking in the competition and it would be hypocritical to take action against Melbourne. Hope the link works. Cheers.

KB is joined by Patrick Smith

[beelzebub 22,269]

thanks rjay

thats the essence. The AFL cant actually commit anyone to the sword as its a situation of their own doing and encouragement ( essentially )

They handed over guns and bullets and suggested you go "play"..

[nutbean 8,837]

I heard two minutes of Patrick Smith in the car. The two things he said was that MFC only worked a system that the AFL themselves put in place. The other thing he said was in response to a caller and he said if the AFL went the MFC they cannot stop there and must then do the same to other clubs.

[Sir Why You Little 34,705]

This could well go to court. The AFL set the rules. Too many grey areas.

Tanking did happen. But the AFL put their head in the sand during those years.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

I don't think people know what "tanking" means.

[Sir Why You Little 34,705]

I don't think people know what "tanking" means.

it's merely a word.

The action took place.

[beelzebub 22,269]

It is on the SEN podcast this morning with KB, comes in half way at about the 4 min mark. In a nutshell he believes the AFL was at fault and in denial about tanking in the competition and it would be hypocritical to take action against Melbourne. Hope the link works. Cheers.

KB is joined by Patrick Smith

almost looks like somethings been yanked... no podcast avail ( not when I just looked )

[Jonesbag 487]

rabble rabble rabble

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,502]

it's merely a word.

The action took place.

But it can be used with different meanings. "Tanking" meaning to experiment with players and put others in for surgery is quite different to "tanking" meaning to deliberately lose so someone's bet is rewarded. I'm not suggesting the latter has occurred in our game but it has happened in other sports most famously with the Chicago White Sox when Arnold Rotstein bet on the outcome...and rewarded players for "tanking".

[nutbean 8,837]

it's merely a word.

The action took place.

There is your major contradiction in one. Without defining the word then how can you can determine guilt or innocence.

Did our coaching staff put a higher price on experimentation than on winning - yes

Did the players try to lose games - no

Did the coaching staff try to lose games - ahhhh - try and prove that one

and therein lies your problem

[rjay 23,970]

almost looks like somethings been yanked... no podcast avail ( not when I just looked )

Just tried it 'BB' and it worked for me, maybe give it another shot.

[beelzebub 22,269]

Just tried it 'BB' and it worked for me, maybe give it another shot.

you may have some link in cache.. currently that podcast shows nothing in time length etc...it doesnt run..its empty

30-10-12

KB is joined by Patrick Smith ()

Edited October 30, 2012 by belzebub59

[beelzebub 22,269]

This is not about what we , or other clubs did that was supposedly right or wrong.. This is about a handful of "nose out of joint sh!theads" pushing a barrow.

Carro has just joined the pushers and I now no longer rate her at all. Shes ventured into revisionist perspectives to suit her cause. And worse.. shes f*#cked up facts. lol and trampled on logic !!

[Sir Why You Little 34,705]

There is your major contradiction in one. Without defining the word then how can you can determine guilt or innocence.

Did our coaching staff put a higher price on experimentation than on winning - yes

Did the players try to lose games - no

Did the coaching staff try to lose games - ahhhh - try and prove that one

and therein lies your problem

i didn't say it could be proved. But it did happen.

A court of law would rip the AFL apart. Herein lies their problem.

[beelzebub 22,269]

I hear you but I am of the exact opposite opinion. The AFL are still saying nothing - it is the media beating the drums. Don't give it more oxygen. There is plenty of time to defend the club IF the AFL come out and start making unsavoury noises. I am still of the firm opinion that there are two factors that will make this a non event - firstly, tanking is purely subjective (unless there is something in writing or someone who was privvy to the strategy willing to say " we threw" games) for tanking to be proven there needs to evidence that we actually threw games - such a fine line between list management and tanking. Secondly, if the AFL wants to take us down then they are obIiged to go at least 4 other clubs which I am sure they are reticent to do.I am happy with the "nothing to see here - lets move on" approach.

I can see what youre saying and in a perfect world id agree but we're dealing with some knobs who wont abide by reason , logic or common sense. Thye are agenda driven, a multiplicity thereof but some congruence of efforts.

Theyre like scrub fires. These you need to step on..and step on until the fires tire.

Some might suggest instead of confronting we need to 'turn ' them but id counter they are like a rabid dog with bone, they are incessant and beyond reasonable discussion or nurturing.

Feral comes to mind lol

[BarnDee 287]

Schwab, McLardy and Connolly. Better start making arrangements to clear your offices.

I wonder what the recently departed former leadership group have to say about all this?

thought we were to have a break from you and what your full of ?

[rpfc 27,591]

i didn't say it could be proved. But it did happen.

A court of law would rip the AFL apart. Herein lies their problem.

A few months ago you wanted us 'to take our punishment and get on with it' and now it can't be proved?

We didn't tank.

We experimented with players, we sent them off early for surgery, and we culled seasoned pros in an attempt to better position ourselves in the future.

The AFL know that any allegations of tanking is frought - which is why AD says that tanking is only when plaeyrs are instructed to lose.

Being instructed to experiment isn't tanking.

Being instructed to send players off for season ending surgeries isn't tanking.

Being instructed to replace Whelan, Wheatley, Brown with Martin, McNamara, and Cheney isn't tanking.

We did not tank.

[stuie 7,374]

Schwab, McLardy and Connolly. Better start making arrangements to clear your offices.

I wonder what the recently departed former leadership group have to say about all this?

I reckon they would say you're a troll, just like the rest of us do.

[stuie 7,374]

A few months ago you wanted us 'to take our punishment and get on with it' and now it can't be proved?

We didn't tank.

We experimented with players, we sent them off early for surgery, and we culled seasoned pros in an attempt to better position ourselves in the future.

The AFL know that any allegations of tanking is frought - which is why AD says that tanking is only when plaeyrs are instructed to lose.

Being instructed to experiment isn't tanking.

Being instructed to send players off for season ending surgeries isn't tanking.

Being instructed to replace Whelan, Wheatley, Brown with Martin, McNamara, and Cheney isn't tanking.

We did not tank.

Finally some friggin logic about this whole thing.

I'm glad someone understands what tanking is and isn't.

[hoopla 418]

I heard two minutes of Patrick Smith in the car. The two things he said was that MFC only worked a system that the AFL themselves put in place. The other thing he said was in response to a caller and he said if the AFL went the MFC they cannot stop there and must then do the same to other clubs.

How about that. Spot on Mr Smith. I'll never entertain criticism of you again

[Roost It 1,434]

The one thing that annoys me about the current administration is their reticence to get on the front foot and defend the honour of the club. Now that the article is in print and its contents are being discussed on the airwaves I want them to categorically deny that tanking ever took place and that Melbourne will vigourously defend any suggestion to the contrary. Some will say that they can't comment because it's a current investigation, or that it won't matter anyway, but they can most certainly declare the club's innocence and willingness to fight these suggestions.

I'm absolutely certain that Kennett or Maguire would be denying these suggestions and defending thie club to the hilt in the same circumstances. Get on the front foot and defend your club. And do it now.

Neither Schwab nor Mclardy should be at the club now. Connolly should walk as well. This club is still run by amateurs at the top.

[dee-luded 2,958]

If Melbourne were to cop a whack, Carlton would too. I can't see it happening.

and Richmond & Collingwood.

The Tiges didn't want the points either. Thats why the out of positioning became so obvious. & so it was who would list the management harder.

Don't forget the Hawks trading players out, getting lowly picks, & then trading those outsourced players back in later for a flag tilt. What sort of trade draft tampering was that?

Players whistling dixie are the women scorned of the current afl predicament.

Maybe we were all too open & honest about a draft situation on these boards which led to an honesty uncomfortable by the governing authorities.

Maybe they'd prefer the whole truth was kept like a mushroom.