No Passion, no Hardness, no leadership

[jacey 333]

A bit harsh on Warnock and Garland considering how bad we were getting smashed in the clearances and the ball was being peppered into the F50.

I thought Garland actually won more of his 1 on 1 contests with Reiwoldt than he lost.

Warnock smashed Kozzie even with a rampant STK midfield.

Garland wasn't too bad either considering the supply.

[jacey 333]

McLean, Jones and McDonald are our starting three, but they got thrashed today. As well, they are collectively as slow as treacle. McLean totally lacks the awareness that would allow him to overcome a lack of pace. The number of times he gets caught holding the ball is frightful. All teams have to do to beat Melbourne is tag McLean and Jones with pacey taggers and we don't generate any run whatsoever.

How many effective taps did our midfield get.

King and Gardiner gave their midfield an arm chair ride today.

Please MFC ruckmen. Give us a contest.

[grazman 7,432]

I don't see how you can absolve McLean from responsibility today. Apart from a lack of marking forwards, a lack of experience in defence and pathetic, ineffective tackling, our biggest deficit today was in the clearances. We are getting walloped in that area every week.

McLean, Jones and McDonald are our starting three, but they got thrashed today. As well, they are collectively as slow as treacle. McLean totally lacks the awareness that would allow him to overcome a lack of pace. The number of times he gets caught holding the ball is frightful. All teams have to do to beat Melbourne is tag McLean and Jones with pacey taggers and we don't generate any run whatsoever.

That was the most embarrassing game I've been to this year. At least the Hawks and Bulldogs in Rounds 1 and 2 played like class teams. St Kilda played mediocre, scrappy football and still made us look like dunces.

To defend McLean today he did have his nose flattened.

He's alternating between having a good game and a bad one. Not having seen the game today Maurie, do you think his getting caught is simply a lack of awareness or a lack of options to kick it to? (I think one of his weaknesses is his over reliance on disposing of the ball by foot)

[mauriesy 7,287]

To defend McLean today he did have his nose flattened.

He's alternating between having a good game and a bad one. Not having seen the game today Maurie, do you think his getting caught is simply a lack of awareness or a lack of options to kick it to? (I think one of his weaknesses is his over reliance on disposing of the ball by foot)

I think it's a combination of three things:

1. He might use disposal by foot too much. Perhaps he doesn't have the awareness to hand pass, or else it's always in tighter pack-type situations and a handball either isn't necessarily an option, or he can't pick one out.

2. He doesn't make enough space into which to receive the ball. He's almost purely inside with little outside capability. I think that's a speed issue, because a tagger with pace will always keep up with him.

3. When he receives the ball, there more often than not seems to be someone on his hammer. He either gets caught before he can kick or handpass, or he rushes his disposal to avoid the tackle.

I think Jones is a similar situation, but he mangles his disposal even more.

[Hannabal 4]

McLean totally lacks the awareness that would allow him to overcome a lack of pace. The number of times he gets caught holding the ball is frightful.

McLean will be a solid meat and potatoes 200 gamer, but I doubt he'll ever be elite. And you're right about his lack of awareness. He doesn't have a weapon. He doesn't evade like Judd, handball like Black, mark like Bartel, or swivel like Mitchell and Kerr. He's just a solid citizen. And there's nothing wrong with that, but some need to lower their expectations.

[Jerry Lundergard 420]

McLean will be a solid meat and potatoes 200 gamer, but I doubt he'll ever be elite. And you're right about his lack of awareness. He doesn't have a weapon. He doesn't evade like Judd, handball like Black, mark like Bartel, or swivel like Mitchell and Kerr. He's just a solid citizen. And there's nothing wrong with that, but some need to lower their expectations.

I think that's a measured and reasonable assessment Hannabal.

It annoys me the amount of criticism of Brock gets on these boards though.

I am not sure whether this is due to peoples own expectations of him, or they just think he is a crap footballer.

Definitely not a crap footballer in my eyes and would look a hell of alot better with the right mix of midfiedlers around him, and ruckman who could tap it down his throat.

[Jaded No More 68,906]

I don't see how you can absolve McLean from responsibility today.

I did not absolve him of responsibility, I was simply pointing out that once again he got very little help. Players are not helping him or protecting him at the bounce. Unlike Luke Ball he is not protected by the umpires, and he can't be expected to win all the clearances on his own. Yes we were smashed in the middle, and yes McLean is absolutely partly responsible for that, but why does the blame always fall on his shoulders? When was the last time our brilliant ruck duo got us an effective tap? I was almost missing Jamar's physicality out there!

Maybe he won't ever be the star midfielder we are looking for, but to be the number one tagged player each week, at 22, must be very frustrating when you are surrounded by senior players who don't put their bodies on the line and don't get their face smashed into the turf every 5 minutes.

The reality is that if we keep relying and looking to him to win us the majority of clearances every week, we'll be bitterly disappointed. Maybe that's why so many supporters are picking on every average game he has, instead of looking at the big picture. The fish always rots from the head, and when your leaders are not putting in, why should anyone else?

I don't think it's a secret that McLean is one of my favourite players, but I also don't think it's a secret that McLean works harder than most on the field and for that I command him. We reward fancy underachievers far too much at the MFC... like the supporters who actually command Yze on kicking 3 goals today. Give me a break!

[Hellaintabadplacetobe 4,294]

I cannot believe that after last weeks effort, the Melbourne Football Club would put in such an insipid, pathetic account of themselves.

At half time, we had 12 players who had not laid one tackle!!! After last week, that statistic is damming. We have no leadership, we have players like Jeff White going through the motions and playing with no bloody guts or passion, we are too slow in moving the ball and our forward line offered nothing.

The jury is out as far as I'm concerned as too whether Dean Baily is the man for the job, with the player list we have. The players have little faith in his game plan - That is bleeding obvious!!!

SHOW SOME BLOODY FIGHT AND SHOW SOMETHING MELBOURNE

I agree with you on most of this and feel the same pain. However, how can we blame Bailey for lack of hardness and elementary skills. We know they can play his gameplan as witnessed against Freo 2nd half and Tassie for the whole match last week. The hardness was awesome last week and the main reason we were in the game. We simply have a bad habit of playing out of our skins one week and failing miserably the following week and it has happened for years! Remember Adelaide flogged us the following match after our Freo game of the millenium.!!Maybe we need Robbo to come out and announce his retirement this week and we will come out on fire against Collingwood?? Saints getting flogged by their coach and media didnt help our cause but the fact that we had a blinder last week had me quietly expecting a pasting today. Just didnt think we would be so soft though!

[Mono 455]

What do you expect from a club that has Bruce as a joint skipper?

We are a laughing stock.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

[Bobby McKenzie 2,385]

I did not absolve him of responsibility, I was simply pointing out that once again he got very little help. Players are not helping him or protecting him at the bounce. Unlike Luke Ball he is not protected by the umpires, and he can't be expected to win all the clearances on his own. Yes we were smashed in the middle, and yes McLean is absolutely partly responsible for that, but why does the blame always fall on his shoulders? When was the last time our brilliant ruck duo got us an effective tap? I was almost missing Jamar's physicality out there!

Maybe he won't ever be the star midfielder we are looking for, but to be the number one tagged player each week, at 22, must be very frustrating when you are surrounded by senior players who don't put their bodies on the line and don't get their face smashed into the turf every 5 minutes.

The reality is that if we keep relying and looking to him to win us the majority of clearances every week, we'll be bitterly disappointed. Maybe that's why so many supporters are picking on every average game he has, instead of looking at the big picture. The fish always rots from the head, and when your leaders are not putting in, why should anyone else?

I don't think it's a secret that McLean is one of my favourite players, but I also don't think it's a secret that McLean works harder than most on the field and for that I command him. We reward fancy underachievers far too much at the MFC... like the supporters who actually command Yze on kicking 3 goals today. Give me a break!

Command or commend? You are a dominant lady aren't you?

[Damo 3,355]

Jeff White should not be let off yesterdays pitiful effort.

When the ball was marked on the wing, he was not prepared to go forward and contest, he would many times run to space behind the ball and demand a soft kick. He tries to make sure he is not in a position to contest in any manner. If he was a decent kick for goal(at least 50 metres) I wouldnt mind so much but all he is guided by is getting cheap possessions.

With Dutchy injured (I cant stand the thought Bailey didnt need him) White needed to use his run to create an option.

I dont think any of the players on the field can respect White any more.

It isnt right that courageous older players like Carroll and Holland may be shelved when Jeff gets off scot free.

[Deeoldfart 8,016]

It's unfair to blame Bailey for this situation. A lot of very experienced footy watchers on this forum have long lamented our lack of genuine "hardness" and the failings of the core group of players. I'm sorry, but if people were expecting (but not necessarily hoping) anything different from today - then obviously they haven't been watching the same Melbourne side I have over the years.

We didn't get enough from our senior players... the record's been stuck on this track for a long time.

Bailey knows what has to be done, but to expect him to turn around a problem that's been years, decades even, in the making is naive.

..........

I've supported this club all my life, I hate losing, but I won't give in to emotion and attack the thing I love.

Ditto. Beautifully stated Graz.

[Deeoldfart 8,016]

Jeff White should not be let off yesterdays pitiful effort.

When the ball was marked on the wing, he was not prepared to go forward and contest, he would many times run to space behind the ball and demand a soft kick. He tries to make sure he is not in a position to contest in any manner. If he was a decent kick for goal(at least 50 metres) I wouldnt mind so much but all he is guided by is getting cheap possessions.

With Dutchy injured (I cant stand the thought Bailey didnt need him) White needed to use his run to create an option.

I dont think any of the players on the field can respect White any more.

It isnt right that courageous older players like Carroll and Holland may be shelved when Jeff gets off scot free.

I hate bagging our players, but I have to admit that I agree with a lot of Franky's assessment of Jeff White yesterday. Perhaps the fact that he was resuming from a back complaint is some excuse for what appeared to us observers as easy options and lack of interest.

[titan_uranus 25,014]

I watched Channel Seven's awful coverage, and Commetti made a good point. He noticed that at most of the clearances, especially in the 2nd quarter, our players were all too focused on their opponents and not on actually getting a clearance. Doesn't help when our ruck division is thrashed.

We can't blame Bailey (yet) because, as has been stated, when the players commit, the game plan works (vs Geelong, Fremantle 2nd half, Hawthorn). Blame should be directed to the more experienced players such as White, Yze, Bruce, and maybe also to the selectors. 5 changes to a team that clearly played its best game of the year, of which 1 was forced (though Morton probably needed a rest).

[Weedster 174]

I watched Channel Seven's awful coverage, and Commetti made a good point. He noticed that at most of the clearances, especially in the 2nd quarter, our players were all too focused on their opponents and not on actually getting a clearance. Doesn't help when our ruck division is thrashed.

We can't blame Bailey (yet) because, as has been stated, when the players commit, the game plan works (vs Geelong, Fremantle 2nd half, Hawthorn). Blame should be directed to the more experienced players such as White, Yze, Bruce, and maybe also to the selectors. 5 changes to a team that clearly played its best game of the year, of which 1 was forced (though Morton probably needed a rest).

I'm sorry but Dean Bailey DOES have to take some responsibility - we haven't just been beaten this year - in EVERY ONE of games except for the 2 1/2 you have mentioned we have been comprehensively thrashed ..more often than not the game has been lost by quarter time..I think he's had a dream run to have escaped scrutiny so far..what game plan am I supposed to be seeing ??

[titan_uranus 25,014]

I'm sorry but Dean Bailey DOES have to take some responsibility - we haven't just been beaten this year - in EVERY ONE of games except for the 2 1/2 you have mentioned we have been comprehensively thrashed ..more often than not the game has been lost by quarter time..I think he's had a dream run to have escaped scrutiny so far..what game plan am I supposed to be seeing ??

Dean Bailey has had 10 matches to work with this team. Let's wait until the end of the year before we turn on him. He doesn't need it, and the club doesn't need it. I did say 'yet': in other words, wait until we've played some of the other teams languishing down the bottom with us (i.e. West Coast and Essendon), and let the season play out in its entirety before we criticise a first-year coach.