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Really? Liam Jones had not the slightest influence on the game. I don't understand the angst with Tom here. It's like people are just waiting for a fumble or miss kick so they can make a (poor) point. He's been terrific this year and allowed Frawley to go forward.

When will people realise there is no longer an attitude of shifting the deck chairs on a weekly basis. Unless you are not attempting to play your role or unless someone consistently smashes it at Casey there will not be changes. Calls for Blease who has had one week of getting some decent ball in or Bail to be dropped who is running his guts out and has one of our highest tackle counts is laughable. The only two I would expect that will be considered will be Riley or Clisby who have put multiple weeks of good form together but truthfully I expect no change.

If we are complaining about umpires, i thought the boundary umpires were woeful at throwing the ball in. Some were too weak to throw it in 10 metres, whilst the others threw the ball in at right angles????

It was hard for anyone to get the footy today. Players would receive a handpass and prepare to kick and the ball would slip out of their hands. Walking out to the huddles, it was like a cattle yard out their and smelt like it too. Either very slippery and muddy or just water skiing. Carlton must have been in the middle of the rain last night. Blease was a ilttle unlucky when Northern got a goal in the second quarter. I didn't see the third quarter turnover. I just felt he got involved in the play today in a way that really surprised me considering the conditions. Both sides dropping marks today with such a slippery ball and the congestion around where the ball was dropping because of this, or if it did get out it was a race in the mud that resulted the ball going to the boundary line. It was amazing that Smith took so many marks in the second quarter - they were really rare. And nothing wrong with the Toump's game today. I was watching him, Hunt, Michie and Riley. Toumpas came back on after an injury at the start of the second - winded or knackered I think. He contributed all day and in the last took a couple of handy marks and nearly held a couple more - they were hard to come by with the slippery conditons and packs everywhere. The most common thing happening all day was players receiving a handball but not being able to dispose of it in time because of the greasy conditions. Riley has thighs on him like a tree trunk and didn't look out of place at this suburban ground. Didn't have the impact that Michie did or McKenzie and probably is lacking some fitness. Michie looked very comfortable at this level as did Evans who was very reliable at this level and in these conditions. Dom Barry also surprised me under these condtions. He got kicks sending us forward a few times (remember, this was rare for the whole game on this ground, which was far from anything we are used to these days; it was really really substandard. They couldn't have any drainage there). In the second quarter in particular I was really impressed with Dom. I could not criticise any player's game today - they all put in and it was really quite impressive with the injuries and with Carlton coming back so strongly in the third and fourth quarters where they were able to get a lot of clean possessions (and in the third quarter some umpire assistance). Finally, Jayden Hunt. Even before his winning goal I thought he had looked like he belonged in the second half. In the first half he was on and off the bench and when he was on he would be looking after some empty wing of half forward flank where the ball was not coming.He contributed to our only goal in the third quarter (kicked by Tapscott) and got that great goal to finish the match (our only goal in the last quarter) with 3 or 4 minutes to go. It was not a match to show any of his wares but the final goal showed a lot of composure. And It was not a match to start worrying about any player's future. It was a mud wrestle and then hoping the luck went your way. All the players put in today. I can't name all the players. I love Georgiou and Evans who are so reliable - but this was a swimming pool today. I'm not at the G tonight. I have to cook for guests. This report is just passing on a normal spectator's observations - like I like to read the training reports in Dec Jan and Feb.

Don't care if he's not the future. Neither is Daniel Cross, but both players are the present and if players who are the future want their spots, they can earn them.

Like the team Joeboy you will put in a shocker now and again, this is one of them

Jesus Christ! You'd think with how negative most of these are that we'd been belted by 100 points! We actually LOST the game ourselves, they didn't win it. I know a loss sucks, but we weren't that bad by a long shot.

OK. I was shouting at the TV over that idiotic free to Crameri, but in the final washup it didn't cost us the game. If anything, I would say Matt Jones' two missed shots in the last did that if anything did. Even beyond that, our continued poor passing into the forward line meant we weren't keeping scoreboard pressure on them. We should have been well up by half time. It's great to see how well our kids are coming on now. They are fearless, they are skilled and they are starting to figure out how to play at this pace and intensity. The future is looking brighter all the time. Also very nice to see how well our traded-in players are doing. They are all contributing and setting a great example for the young-uns. All in all, I think that tonight's result was about right for where the team is. We are pretty close to the doggies, but they have a little more polish and cohesion than us right now and in the end it was the difference. To our great credit, for large portions of the game they were reduced to piling bodies on the ball to stop us from using it. Given that they pride themselves on their ability to extract the ball I think that's a pretty good sign. I am disappointed that we couldn't pull it off, but not devastated.

I did the double header yesterday , inner city living has it's advantages, Blease - my comment when I got home to my lovely lady "some really good stuff but with one or two of his usual schoolboy errors" Michie - a really good solid game, same with McKenzie, Evans Riley - a bulldozer that works really well in mud Tapscott - getting back to where he shoud be, he had a a cut under his eye, by the look of it Hunt - agree, worked his way into the game Barry - was surprised as well on how well he went Toumpas - relax , he is getting there Fitzpatrick - I asked Andrew Nicol, went over on his ankle in ruck contest, blew up straight away, they don't think really serious

Pederson would be top 4 B&F. Anyone calling for him to be dropped doesn't watch the game to see how hard he works and competes.

At least this time you had the grace to name Clisby instead of Tapscott this time, but your idea of dropping Bail and Terlich is no better than it was last night. Dropping Bail is particularly laughable; he's one of our side's hardest runners, he gets in space and his ball use has improved significantly. I get the impression that the coach is a fan.

I'm not mad, we played really well.. Tyson, Viney, Salem, JKH.. All our young kids are tracking along beautifully. This year we are putting in A LOT of effort, that is all that matter. The scoreline doesn't matter, wins would be great, but this year we see effort and intent.. And dare I say - consistency.

Interesting that in the article on the MFC website, Roos again reiterated that we would not have taken Kelly had we held on to pick 2. I suspect they wanted Salem and took the view that he'd still be there at 9. If that's the case, we got Tyson basically for nothing. Sounds pretty rosy. Since we'll never know the truth, I choose to believe it

I posted elsewhere that it isn't surprising. We have the advantage of knowing there must have been head high contact because we see Terlich on the ground motionless after the impact. If he didn't actually see the shoulder hit the head, the umpire follows the play and doesn't notice Terlich hasn't moved. And we certainly wouldn't want them to pay frees on the back of motionless players or we'd see the field littered with prone players trying to milk a free. The head high impact that bothers me was the head-lock that Dunn was put in by Cameleri (I think?). Crude, not in the play, intentional, prolonged and dangerous. I hope they rub him out for it but they won't even cite it

People doubting Watts and his tackling ability tonight are blinded by his ridicule. Saw him make several ripper, strong tackles which should have less to holding the ball decisions. His intensity has lifted for sure

I thought Russian was tremendous for us tonight. Minson is a mountain and Jamar beat him comprehensively to give us first use consistently. With as many stoppages as we create, having a quality tap ruck man is very useful.

I'd rather be supporting a team where 16 point losses hurt more than 100 point floggings.

OMG yes to Shannon Byrnes being gone forever. He is literally useless. We are playing a man down. Contributes nothing. Fumbles, doesn't get near it, doesn't crumb goals. Useless. I would rather 10 Toumpas touches that gain him experience than watching Byrnes get games.

Heartbroken. We should have won. Got to say though, I love the hard style of game we are playing. Sod those who moaned about how boring Sydney were, I couldn't agree less. Dom Tyson just keeps getting better. BOG for mine. What a gun.

thought there was a big improvement the past few weeks. Some of his kicks were just sublime last night and he saved us at least 2-3 goals by laying some ripper tackles. Some people can't see the forest for the trees of jack watts insults. I was over him at times this year, yes, but the kid is noticeably trying to improve himself.

Hope you also noted when Watts worked on multiple leads then chased across the ground in one passage and then was bad mouthed by supporters for not having chased hard enough, completely ignoring the work he put in just to get across to the contest. Watts bashing is becoming de rigour on this forum but last night he definitely worked hard off the ball and was happy to tackle and scrimmage when able. He is not getting the possessions we would like but he is trying to do more 1% stuff to assist team mates. He was miles from being our worst last night.

Tyson would've been spent. Don't forget it is basically Dom's first year. GWS must surely be kicking themselves atm, I know Kelly is good.. But Tyson is looking sublime.

On the Matt Jones goal (and not wanting to blame the youngster) but as he enters 50, JKH comes screaming towards him. The problem is that the hyphen doesn't affect the contest at all as he doesn't get to Jones and all he ends up doing is leading his man to the running Jones. The Hyphen should've stayed where he was, let his man go to Jones and called for the handball over the top. I think he was caught up in the drama of the situation and lacked composure (as many of our players did last night). It's a good learning curve for him and I'm sure the coaches will bring it to his attention. Vision here - WARNING: Heartbreaking!

He wasn't switched to play on Crameri last night when it was needed and he was giving Dunn a bath - if he doesn't play on his bunny Riewoldt next week I think it's clear what Roos thinks.

Bail? i think he has earned his spot in the team - has potential as a half forward who can rotate through the middle. At least the kid tries to tackle (had 7 tackles - third most) - unlike a couple in the team. He provides important run and carry.

Yep....that about sums it up for me. Just got home. Difficult to stomach but there's a few issues that were found short in today. Vince amazing first 2 and a half quarters. A little quieter late in the game. Tyson improving by the week. Looking all class and like he has more time than most in our line up. Nice. Cross another workman like performance. Jones boy needs to work on his disposal at times but in and under. Not great but serviceable. Howe was pretty good down back. Terlich too until he got hammered. We are carrying a few players. While Watts improved in patches today he still isn't strong enough (through the legs/core) IMO to enable him to beat or at least match his opponent both in the air and when the ball hits the ground on a one on one contest. He wins some of the time don't get me wrong. But he isn't getting anywhere near a 50/50 split required to break even. He is losing these battles far too often and we are paying a heavy price for it. Yes, he laid a few tackles, ran hard to get to contests, worked his way through traffic tonight and created some good forward momentum passes etc. Good positive signs .But he STILL doesn't appear to have the ability/strength through the core/legs to work himself to the front of a one on one contest, work his opponent off the ball or lead up hard and present. I'm neither a Watts lover or hater and i truly want him to succeeed. But the competitive one on one things in at crucial times in a match are the things you need to be capable of doing if you're going to be successful and REMAIN in a forward role. Byrnes just doesn't work hard enough when he isn't near the ball or in possession or near the drop of the ball. And he's not doing either of those nearly enough to warrant a spot in this team. Bail. Tries hard and generally looks ok in patches.......but he just aint getting enough of it or impacting enough around the ground. Needs to work much harder to earn a permanent place in this team. I would be hoping we can bring in one of the following to replace the last 2 players (Byrnes/Bail) at some point this year IF they earn it at Casey. From either.... Kent, Toumpas, Clisby and or Mitchie. And don't laugh. both Toumpas and Clisby rate much higher possesion/disposal/quality of disposal wise/contested marking etc, based on last years stats at AFL level. And this year Toumpas/Mitchie and to a lessor degree....Kent, also rate higher than Byrnes/Bail. We had a few "under done" players tonight. In particular Garland and Jamer. Both completely understandable given their lack of match time to start the season. I would add Byrnes in there as well.....but ...ummm. This hurt us big time in the last 15 minutes or so. I think the game last week may have taken it's toll a little on some of the blokes. The CramerFree really hurt us at the worst time. There were a number of gettable shots at goal we could have potted throughout the game which would have given us a bit of breathing room. I don't blame our loss on the Matty running miss. Guy ran his guts out all night and spread pretty well to create options, especially in that first half. He also hit up a few good lead up targets earlier in the match for set shots on goal. Played ok and is easily in our top 10 players this year so far IMO. Can someone please explain to me why we started Jones in our forward line in the first 10 minutes or so of that last quarter? We were breaking even/winning the middle contest until then IMO. The doggies got the first 2 or 3 out of the middle while he wasn't there and probably the first goal of the last. Quite possibly the "Match Losing" move of the night?? First time i've seen/heard a really passionate Melbourne crowd all over the ground in a few years. Probably since the last time we beat the Bombers in 2011. I really hate losing and i'm so sick of it. That win would have been a sweet addition to last week's effort. Opportunity lost.

How would you know? You're just choosing to believe it because it's convenient.

McDonald wasn't as bad as people are making out. He has a good burst of speed and is still a promising defender. As for Watts, did some good things tonight there were two instances where he chased and brought down two doggies as they were about to kick for goal. He also used his body well to take a good contested mark I think in tHe 3rd quarter. Dom Tyson is looking like the star player the Dees have been forever searching for, really impressed. Dissapointing game, goal for goal most of the game. I thought we were the better side but just couldn't break away from them.

Tonights loss burns. Haven t been so gutted about a loss in a long time. But we are building toward something good, and I have no doubt we can beat Richmond. In - Aidan RIley Out - Shannon Byrnes

Thanks Todd.

Me too. It's a feeling I hadn't felt in a long time though - that filthy feeling of "should have won, no excuse for not winning". The only feelings I've felt in the last three years have been "I can't believe we still manage to be even worse than the week before" or "I don't mind the loss - at least we were competitive". This must be what it's like to be a North Melbourne supporter.

I feel those that keep calling for Bail to be dropped don't really understand the brand of footy Roos is trying to instill.

If Dunn stands on Riewoldt then we've lost sight of Dunn's role IMO. I think last night showed that we're worse off having him stand the opposition's most dangerous forward. He has played his best footy as third man up and distributor coming out of the 50. Lots of other options for Riewoldt. Frawley back or Georgiou back in the side as a horses for courses change would be my preference. Garland is also an option; all these are better options than Dunn I think. I'd like to see Dunn in tandem with Howe on the half back flanks, or forward when needed.

lolThose were frustrating misses, but leaving him out because of it? lol The idea for making unforced changes is to improve the side. As Matt Jones has demonstrated this year that on work ethic and fitness he's easily, easily best 22, if you leave him out, you've automatically made the side worse. And it's Riley, not Reilly.

I think it was erroneous to have dropped AG esp as we lamented composure esp in the back. Bring back the Bean

I had the biggest Bulldogs nuffies behind me all game yelling "ball" every time a player looked like being tackled.

You can now see how destabilising that particular foolishness of Neeld's was. We had a lot of confused players. I reckon the only changes this week will be injury forced but Byrnes is a luxury we cannot afford to carry for much longer. I mean him no disrespect but unless he is positively and clearly impacting on the game, we might as well give a younger player a go.

People don't realise that the reason we are shutting teams down well and creating contests everywhere is because players all over the field are doing unfashionable hard work. Chasing, pressuring, tackling, harassing ..... I think that keeping those players who are creating this culture and backing it up several weeks in a row deserve to stay in the team unless either they stop doing those things, or somebody in the VFL absolutely smashes the door down with their performances. I think that we'll see no change again, but Salem will get a full game (just as JKH spent several games as a sub before getting a full game).

No change, or Clisby in if Terlich comes up no good from concussion.

just saw some people want byrnes/bail/pedders to be dropped whenever we lose. the gut running of these 3 has been terrific and the box them in game that PR has us playing is very difficult to learn and concentrate on for a whole match.it was inexperience that let the ball out to open field with dunny trying to protect to much ground that was the killer towards the end. you cant teach every kid this game in 5 minutes and you need hard body experienced players to maintian that game plan. PR was always gonna bring this plan here and all supporters wanted to not be flogged every week,well hes done it and now we must be patient until players learn the ropes of this plan. look at how many players are in the ressies learning the plan and will be ready to play to it when their chance comes.i know its difficult,but we need MORE patience.

These are the kind of comment that I really really detest!! The guy does not pick himself in the side. The guy does the best he can and if he is not good enough, then that is hardly his fault that the game has passed him by. How many games of AFL have heroes like Dees13 played that entitles the likes of him/her to abuse a player because he gets a game???

Picket fence, we have toumpas, wines is a port adelaide player might be time to give up the pointless rambling on past decisions hey?

Whinge away about the umpires crucifying us then. Our players didn't convert the chances when they were presented to them, 4 in fact. Kick them, we win.

No way. That's not the situation the rule is there for. Cross didn't slide into him, he couldn't even see Williams. He made a legitimate contest at the ball. Meanwhile that spud wouldn't even bend over to contest, just kneed him in the head. Disgraceful free kick.

I'd much rather Kent.

Dom Tyson is Dom Tyson. He is not Pendlebury, or anyone else for that matter. And yes, he is very good.

What the **** does Byrnes do to constantly get a game?! 10 touches and 2 tackles, that bloke can go into a bloody nursing home, put Salem or someone fresh up forward for that geriatric fool

Was there to be won and we arent good enough yet. Simple as that. Come a long way , still along way to go

So far, we clearly have lost that one. Though all hope is not lost with Toumpas. Confident Roosy can turn him into an effective player for us. Doubt he will ever be as good as Wines though. But time to move on. You win some you lose some. For every Toumpas, there's a JKH. The Tyson and Salem decision appears to be a good decision too (more than happy with that trade).

I'm furious we lost this, that free against Dunn really hurt us but we had every chance to win and screwed ourselves. M Jones, learn to bloody kick on the run or give it off to someone who can. After being so hard to kick goals against last week we let so many soft goals through and that was the difference. Every goal for us seemed to be really hard to come by. We really needed to win this to build on our confidence and again we've let a very winnable game slip.