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I thought legally proved guilt was the biggest issue.

Well here is my view on this whole sordid episode. The MFC should be completely exonerated, due to lack of any legally binding evidence and the damage/penalty it has already suffered, to its brand and commercial operations, as a result of a selective investigation, for a course of conduct widely accepted being done by many other clubs, with most gaining substantially more benefit and advantage than the MFC, yet without investigation by the ruling body and without any explanation from it, as to why that is so.

Could we please leave the personal attacks against other posters out of this and concentrate on the subject matter. Thanks

Two good questions.Firstly, it is presumed that the charges will be one, two or all three of bringing the game into disrepute, draft tampering or in the case of Bailey, not allowing his team to play on its merits (the latter is what Demetriou and others at the AFL have called "tanking"). Up till now list management, resting players etc. have never been included under the AFL's definition of tanking. Legally, there must be evidence to prove each element and the AFL can't second guess or use circumstantial evidence which might be equivocal as a basis of a finding of guilt. None of that matters in practical terms because it's fairly clear that the parties are trying to nut out a settlement. The views of you, me and the faux intellegensia on bigfooty matter jack squat about the final details to be nutted out. We will all have our opinions, many of which have already been expressed here. As far as I'm concerned the club should be looking forward to building itself up in the field and therefore what Mark Neeld and the players on the list do next is of paramount importance to me. Notwithstanding that, I'm 99% certain that had this gone to court, we would have creamed the AFL and even Wilson grudgingly concedes this (it's only her bloodlust and hatred of the club that motivates her to produce her regular idiotic rants). The second point is even more interesting. I agree that the general football public is becoming immune to this whole saga. I agree that not many people are interested in the subject as some would believe. It will blow over and the end result of Wilson's bloviating on this and other issues will be that she will have made herself irrelevant in much the same way as has happened to the once beautiful newspaper she works for (which is today very much a sinking ship).

I notice that some around here are writing letters and sending emails to Wilson and the Age. You're wasting your time - the Age is struggling across the board but the fact that people are responding (even negatively) suggests to them that their policy of unleashing a feral Wilson is working to attract more interest and readership. Instead, it would be better to write to the advertisers of the Age whose product appears on any page where a Wilson article appears, that you will be patronising their competitors and not purchasing their product as long as she remains their chief football writer.

Redleg. I have to issue you with an official warning. We at Demonland regard the issue of bullying very seriously and by asking Ms. Wilson some questions about football (which are outside the bounds of her comprehension) you have clearly crossed the line.You are guilty and should be ashamed of yourself and in future if you have any questions to ask of Ms. Wilson then please confine them to around the water cooler small talk. Thank you.

Back to CW for a moment. In her latest piece of trash she states that it is true that the AFL has strong evidence in its 800 page report on Melbourne tanking. My info is exactly the opposite and our President agrees. Next she said " TANKING is a sensitive issue, particularly for Melbourne people who know how badly the club botched its attempts to gain early draft picks - and how the club botched the results. Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/muckup-to-be-a-stain-on-demons-20130215-2eisg.html#ixzz2L0mx7QHR I thought we actually got the picks and then selected T$ and JT. One is the highest paid inexperienced AFL player in the history of the game and he was taken from us by the AFL in pathetic fashion, with AFL money and handed to another club, the other player is our Co Captain. For losing T$ we have a Dawes, Barry and Hogan. Question to the harpie, how did we botch the attempt to get the picks and next how did the club botch the results?

It's just amusing that Caro's piece on Friday turns into a 'report' on Saturday (and, surprisingly, on the AFL website). She endows her own opinion with a degree of official authority. But what's the real, official report? We still don't know.

I was there today and some of it was really interesting rather than a highlights reel. The first thing to note was that apart from a couple of the young boys, we are a much physically stronger list than last year. No skinny legs, Muppet arms etc... Even a lot of the newer recruits have some serious size about them. The scratch match seemed to be planned around ball movement from defence to attack. At times, when the umpire blew the whistle or there was a goal/behind, one of the coaches would move the play to the other end of the ground or the wing, and give the ball to the defensive position team. If any of you guys remember that Dean Bailey's main practice emphasis was on running patterns when Dees had the ball, you would have been happy to see the succession of handballs moving the ball forward today. There were few poor kicking options chosen. If things were closed down, they ran and handballed in patterns until a gap was found. It was refreshing to see. If the half-backs had no options forward they would simply run into spaces between half-back and centre line until a gap was found - a little like Hawthorn or Fremantle. There was no Mitch Clark, no Dawes, and Pederson hardly ever went forward after the first 5 minutes. So the emphasis was not on our forward structure whatever it might be. It was on moving the ball out of defence. Some of the interchanges of handballs was outstanding to watch because it looks like the horrible Melbourne habit of panicking and handballing to a stationery target is gone. 1. Hogan - have to agree - star in the making. Leads well, contests well. Was bumped off the contest or led under it by mature defenders but his leading and contest at the mark is of a very high standard. . 2. Jones - Very vocal around stoppages and efficient with the ball.. 4. Watts - With the ball in his hands he is simply a gun. He still hangs back a bit when he could contest and did it a few times in the first half. However, it seems he was being instructed to play wide and loose at times. 5. Toumpas - His pace of the mark is amazing. Didn't get a lot of it but was clean when he got it. Hits the ball at full pace which is exciting to watch. 7. Viney - was in and at every contest, but was unclean and sloppy at times. Obviously loves the hard stuff. 8. Frawley - Definite backline general and I reckon I saw a bit of his old arrogance at times. He is in for a huge 2013. 10. Byrnes - Everywhere, quick, accurate and knows where the spaces are. Those looking for a forward spot have to get past him. BOG today. . 12. Sylvia - Hardly saw him, but was efficient when he had it. 13. Jordie -Usual great work rate, but a few times handballed when kicking was clearly the right option. Other players let him know this each time. 14. Dunn- was everywhere today, often in the right place at the right time. He reads it so well and with Watts looks to be the rebound 50 designated player. His kicking still is outstanding. Also some fumbles and strange choices. 15. Rodan- Amazing first half. He was in everything and leading into spaces other players could not find. 17. Blease - One of the best today. His running to the next play after disposal was excellent. His kicking a little wobbly sometimes but he just kept running and getting it. 19. Strauss - Some people don't like the phrase "elite kick" but I can now confirm he is one. Great game down back and after watching our defensive kicking out from the backline over the past 5 years, he is a must for starting 22. 20. Garland - Didn't notice him a lot but he is that quiet 'humphrey' type. Efficient but not brilliant. 21. Pedo - OK, but didn't impact contested opportunities when he could have. 22. Magner - As usual went hard at every contest and did some good set up work through the wing at times. 23. Tynan - grew in confidence in the second quarter and had about 6 good, solid touches in a row. Cleaner by foot than I expected and seemed to understand our defensive structure quite well. 25 TMac - Didn't stand out but his spoiling, reading of the game and defensive positioning was good. 26. Nicho -didn't notice him a lot. 27. Gillies - He makes our starting back 6 more problematic. Reads the play OK and is very aware once he has the ball. A good game. 31 Grimes- Spent a fair bit of time on the bench but was OK when in play. His kicking was cleaner than previously. 32 Evans - didn't notice him a lot - just OK. 33. Barry - didn't get into the game much and might be a year away. Very quick. 34 Kent - Liked what I saw. Looks ready to match it physically and is team oriented. Skills might need some refinement. 35 Tappy - Was playing as a forward and the emphasis was on defense, but was quite good in patches. 36 Davey - Chased and tackled really well but we want him kicking. Didn't win or receive a lot of the ball. 39 Jetta - Didn't get a heap of it but when he was involved looked really, really good. Ran well, kicked well, made options well. 40. Jamar - Bustled at the bounces and throw ins but provided nothing around the ground. I thought he was out done by Spencer today. 41. Davis - Looks made for defence and positions well. Still not convinced of his kicking but he was marginally better today. 42 Pencil - Broke even in ruck contests with Jamar but provided run and options around the ground. A good game. 43 Taggert- Really goes at it but doesn't win a lot of it. 45 Jones - Really surprised me, did some top notch stuff and could challenge for a spot. 46 Terlich- saw him do some nice things, but didn't notice much 47. Couch - Got better as the game progressed and ended up playing really hard and really well. Looked more ready than last year. 48. Fitzy - He is SO unco but played a good game at times. His pace and second efforts for his size are surprising. On today's performance will definitely challenge Pederson for that 3rd forward/ruck help position. It was a game that highlighted the half-backs and the midfielders. All of them had a go and showed their wares at times. I have picked Viney in my Supercoach starting 22 but on today's performance I am not sure if he is ready. Tynan, M. Jones, Terlich and Fitzy were the ones who surprised me today. Davey and Sylvia were disappointing Loved it - the footy is back!

Yeah, because a bunch of half wits over at bigfooty think we're getting off lightly we should just accept punishment. Keyboard warrior is defeatist roll-over in the real world. Lol who woulda thunk it?

Perhaps the dumbest post I've seen on Land.

As I said, if there are no sanctions with regards to draft picks it's a very good outcome.

I think he can win his own ball inside as well, but he's more predator than first dibs. Like Toumpas I reckon he'll be more outside, but quite capable in congestion. How they utilise the likes of Grimes, Toumpas, M. Jones, Bleaze and Bail will be interesting. Trengove is on record as saying he wants to play an inside role this year, so if he can step up to help Jones and Viney we should have the outside runners that were lacking last year. It was noticeable at the intra that players weren't getting sucked into the contests like they were in 2012. They need to trust their teammates for the midfield to improve.

You could be correct on the second point, but as that leading journalist CW says, the club will be stained. Personally I believe the current Board owes it to those who went before and will come after, to maintain the best possible image for the club and therefore as I am confident that in a "legal " fight we would win, I would not accept any finding of cheating. Find another set of words and it may be fine. As to your first point I believe the AFL can do whatever they want, using whatever standards they need, to make findings and administer their competition. HOWEVER, if those findings are challenged they need to pass the Natural Justice test in a Court and then a legal interpretation is placed on the behaviour and they must pass that standard, or have their rulings set aside. That can happen in a multitude of ways, as simply for example as a Court finding that decisions were wrongly made, bias has been shown, hearings if any weren't porperly conducted, evidence was illegally obtained, a finding was so far against the weight of evidence as to make it wrong, etc, etc,etc.,

It's CW snide and belittleing remarks which actually do me in as well as that she is so loose with her facts: Dean Bailey..." will miss some weeks of football but not enough to ruin him as the Melbourne experience nearly did". On DM's response "if people fell for this" - imagine if she said the same about Eddie. Statements she makes as if fact: DM - "he knows what his board and staff have been declaring behind closed doors" - how would she know (unless there is still a rogue element/fan inside MFC) AFL " "had in its 800 pages of evidence, a good case against Melbourne" - how does she know this DB " would have been cruel to end his career given he was contrite" - if he was contrite why would he be fighting the charges. But then she goes on to say he "did not completely fess up to actually deliberately losing". Doesn't make sense. No other journalist is actually going to openly query her very selective pieces or the AFL because they don't want to bite the hand that feeds them. The Club should be asking the question of the AFL as to how such information (if it is true) is being leaked. How can the AFL act for the Clubs if it knowingly leaks information - selective or not. The smell of rotting fish is everywhere.

Thanks to everyone who posted their views on the inter club match. It's always great to read what others see and take away from training sessions etc. I have read through the entire thread, and would agree with just about everything written. I went down under my own steam, and found myself on the reality bus for the return trip home. If someone had asked for my thoughts on leaving I would have said 'uninspiring' (perhaps a little too harsh a word). From being able to attend a handful of training sessions, and knowing our fitness was much improved, I was now looking forward to see how they performed under some game pressure. For starters, as I got closer to the ground, the gentle breeze I left behind, had now turned into a strong wind, not ideal, add to it, it was hot, my expectations were lowered a little, add this together, it was going to be tough going out on the ground. First of all, what did we have? We have a team on the wrong end of the ladder, with approx 36 players divided into 2 teams. Both teams of even levels of skill and experience. All still learning new structures and add new team mates. What we got was a intense battle that never really reached great heights. Throw in, players were at times switching sides and that was unsettling I am sure for a few players. For a first full blown hitout, some things I noticed. Hogan is going to be a gun. He presents himself with leading and demanding the ball. Looks like an older traditional full forward from what I observed. He leads well, contests well. His kicking will improve as will all other aspects of his game. If he stays fit and healthy, Casey have great kid playing for them this year. That passage of play on the half forward line, on the boundary line, he worked his way out of a tight spot, to nail a 35 metre pass to Davey, who was a metre from goals, hit him smack on the chest. Blease as I stated in a training report pre Xmas, has stepped up a snotch or 2, with some consistent game time, I expect him to keep improving. He does need to find his own ball, but when he has it, IF Toumpas wants to 'light' up the wing on the MCG, Blease is going to light up the whole of the 'G". He was a bit in and out of the game, but so were many on the day. Rodan is going to be more than handy, his experience and nouse will cause some headaches for other teams, as well as being able to guide and bring others into the game. Gillies showed he can be more than handy, as did M Jones, Barry (but may need time to build up a bit more, and with experience with Casey should crack a few senior games), he showed some class in patches. As did Toumpas. Garland murdered Davey, out sprinted him to the ball, won the ball, and run away, left Davey struggling to regain his breath. I am not sure about Flash. Perhaps the All Star trip to Darwin, caught up with him today. He is borderline if he can get past 2013. No doubting his skills, his tank is under a question mark, or perhaps the body is telling him its nearly over. I hope not, I would love to see some of the old Flash back. Jamar and Spencer broke about even around the ground. Both were hardly sighted, Jamar took 1 great contested grab and apart from the hitouts. in his favour, didn't get into the game much. I hope Gawn doesnt suffer any more set backs, because our ruck stocks are a bit low (I am keeping on eye on J.Hannath, and will be taking an outside interest on his development. We sniped Clark and perhaps Hogan (ex W.A) so I guess Freo got one back on us.) Standouts (not in order) Viney, Byrnes, Blease, the Jones boys. and throw number of others into a hat. To sum up, two teams, under trying conditions, all trying to impress, made for a tight contest. Some really good signs, loved the white team on the outer wing, in one passage of play, they strung together a chain of handballs to running players that opened up the game. It was excellent ball movement by hand. As noted in previous posts, I only seen one hospital handball to a stationary player. Overall, I wasn't entirely convinced on our propects for the year. but its way too early to judge on one hitout. Some NAB Cup games, I hope we get further into that comp this year, as every game we play we will improve our game plan/structures, and the more they play together the better they will be. Some good things I came away with, but the 'lid is still on atm.

In breaking news, Caroline Wilson will be sacked from The Age, effective immediately. Ms Wilson's sacking follows a spate of articles written in relation to Melbourne's ongoing tanking investigation. The findings were published on Monday night that absolved all Melbourne staff of any responsibility. The Age's representative stated that the publication and Ms Wilson are heading in different directions. Part of the new direction of 'The Age' was to lift the integrity of the publication, by checking facts, not passing innuendo as quotes, distinguishing opinion and reporting, letting go of personal gripes and to not take notes next to the water-cooler. During the seven month investigation Ms Wilson wrote that Melbourne leaders, Cameron Schwabb, Chris Connolly would be 'finished' at Melbourne. Melbourne's 2009 coach Dean Bailey was reported to be suspended from any active duty within the AFL, all of which were not part of the official findings. When interviewed Ms Wilson raised the point that despite the official findings, "there was an unofficial finding that corroborated (her) version of events." "Unofficially, Melbourne Football Club, Cameron Schwabb, Chris Connolly and Dean Bailey are in a lot of trouble. Despite the findings officially, they were to be unofficially sanctioned by the AFL." When pushed on what this meant, Ms Wilson stated "pay-backs a [censored]... so call me Pay-Back." 'The Age' has been accused by Ms Wilson of being childish by shooting the messenger. Part of Ms Wilson's unofficial defense has been that other people wrote similar finding's, there was systemic failure in the media that allowed her to publish those ideas, the findings she printed were true at the time, she was acting on good information that had been leaked from AFL house by a former employee who had the authority to push those findings 7 months out from the conclusion. Ms Wilson then accused the AFL, of being 'soft' for not backing up what she'd written in her article and said "if the media aren't going to be protected from the truth, it will burn a lot of ordinary journalists." Ms Wilson also took a veiled swipe at her now ex-employer stating that "the place had really gone to hell over the past 7 months." Ms Wilson was reticent to take any of the blame for the short-comings of the publications, intimating that she'd noticed a trend around the place to substitute facts with opinions and repeat it often enough until it became public perception. Ms Wilson was happy to be leaving such a amoral publication and wouldn't want to be part of a paper that would put up with innuendo, poor structure or lax fact checking. When it was brought up that 'that is now The Age', she burst into tears and said "she'd try to meet with them next week to smooth things over." Standers by observed Ms Wilson trotting towards here car yelling "IT'S NOT FAIR!" and then she neighed and through her hair back.

How many ways can one person be so wrong on the same thing? Caro has set some sort of record. Remember, originally she said Scwhab and Connolly were "finished" at the club. Bailey was going to be banned. There were no ifs, buts or maybes. These things WERE GOING TO HAPPEN. Bit by bit she has backed off until we have this outcome which is so far from what she declared was certain that there should be a lesson for her. She is wrong, wrong, wrong and in any other field of journalism would be castigated by her bosses, but it seems no-one cares at The Age any more. She has besmirched the rep of what once was a very fine paper. She should be gutted this morning, but she'll be telling herself 'I was right at the time'. If she is right just this one time, it'll be a first. What a [censored]!

If that's true and the AFL have leaked the actual results both GM and AD should resign or be forced to. What a bloody circus.

Not for tanking. When one thinks of the ramifications for being found guilty of what we've done it's a relief. I don't understand how that doesn't resonate with biased supporters. I accept that you don't agree that we should have been investigated in the first place, I accept that if it went to court we have an exceptionally strong case, I accept that others have done it, but it's a weak penalty for the crime. If you want to go to court over it that's another matter. I wouldn't. I'm just stoked that our bungling hasn't exposed us more.

When you search in google images, go to advanced search options (click on the wheel at the top right of the page below the Sign in button)...then: 1. Click on the Image size option (it's the first option under "Then narrow your results by..." 2. Scroll down and select Larger than 1024x768 3. Click on the Advanced search button at the bottom of the page 4. Bob's your uncle!

That's what I was trying to explain to Sue and others. This is a tremendous outcome for the club. It's not the best outcome, but we're not privy to all of the evidence. It's certainly not worth going to court over.

Apologies. I fully accept I wasn't being harsh enough.

Two things: Does the AFL need to absolutely prove the charges with unequivocal evidence or does it only need to show reasonable cause for a guilty finding, i.e. that there was enough circumstantial evidence for them to form such a conclusion ? Secondly, on the HS website they list their top 10 read stories each day. There are 4 AFL stories in their top 10 today - and I've checked a few times since about 7.30 am to a moment ago - and the "Demons to dodge draft ban" isn't one of them. My view is that the wider public aren't as fascinated by this story as you think. I don't see that the tarnishing of the brand will be that severe and that it will be out of people's minds pretty quickly. Winning games of footy will put it on the back burner very quickly.

Was that dream before or after the Bev dream?

I find it a little bemusing that many posters seem to think rolling over & accepting a sanction(even viewed as small) is acceptable. I would presume any sanction that is not fought by the club is an admission of guilt & the club would then run the risk of losing its gaming license which would then kill the club.Unless the penalties handed down don't relate to match fixing or tanking in any way I don't see how the club can afford to accept any guilty verdict as it would result in the death of the club.

Like it where kerosene caro seems to be praising Gillon for the outcome, suggesting he may now be in line for the top job. This after condemning the final outcome.

I find it interesting that she calls for James Hird to be sacked over drug allegations as the senior coach, yet Dean Bailey was the innocent "pawn" in this affair.

What a great acquisition Mitch Clark has been both on and off the field and what a wonderful example he sets for our youngsters. Let's hope we see plenty of 'on the field 'contribution from this very admirable person.

Binman - I don't care about perception, I am happy to take a settlement on any issue if it is in the best interests of the club. Sometimes we can hang ourselves with our own pride. Having said that, I am worried about the size of any fine, the wording of our culpability, and the repercussions of guilt. That is the sum of my concerns, honour and righteousness is on the periphery. I don't think my position not to take this unconfirmed deal is that fanciful.

Some random thoughts: Gary Lyon completely blew it. Way too emotional and also too aggressive. Crossed the line by some margin and i think he knew it. CW was understandably in fight or flight and as she was stuck there was always going have defensive body language (eg crossing the arms). Also ensured there could be no intelligent discussion. Made for very uncomfortable viewing. How no one mentioned that the suggestion players deliberately fumbled was in fact in the newspapers beggars belief (some posters said GL did say it but he actually said it was in the report). Who is briefing these people? Speaking of crossing the line. Quite a few demonland posters have crossed the line with their personal insults of CW. Sure critically analyse her articles, even slam them but all this with witch, shrew (and the rest) business is pathetic. Whoever the poster was that said they would be happy if she died should be ashamed of themselves (even with the rider) and i hoped has been banned or suspended. I suspect her latest article (which by the by is a good straight forward article) is the product of a strategic leak from the AFL to both papers given it largely is the same info as in John Ralph's Hun article. I guess the idea is to prepare the public for an outcome that doesn't involve throwing the book at us. All this palaver about us fighting the good fight, standing our ground, going to war, not accepting any compromise blah, blah blah is tiresome in the extreme. I tell you all the DL critics of the board would have every reason to slam them if they don't find a reasonable negotiated outcome that means we avoid court. And to end my rant. The idea that a negotiated settlement means we will forever be tainted as cheats is so stupid it gives me a headache just reading it. The only intelligent comment about the the issue the other night on FC was from Hutchy and was along the lines of get the deal done and get on with the season. Even without the drug scandal no one would have thought us any different to 5-6 other clubs who did the same thing (ie list managed to improve draft position). For gods sake there is Carlton game that will forever be called the Kruezer cup! But with the drug scandal - which will drag on for much longer than the tanking investigation - this whole thing will be buried and forgotten. Do the deal and lets get on with it. $500k ? Cheap at twice the price. Connoly suspended from being in a footy position? As several media people have pointed out he isn't in one atm so who cares? (by the by what no one in the media has pointed out is that was a very clever move by the board). Of course he won't be pleased but its big business and they play rough. He knows that - he's been a senior coach fcs. Get the deal done. Edit: the article i refer to above is not the opinion piece that has just gone up. That's made my headache worse!

This latest saga of mud-slinging by the media is actually baring it's heart to everyone. 1. They are not close to reporting they are desperately trying to influence. 2. This was pursued by AA for another beef. 3. AA was the leaky valve in the AFL feeding information to the media 4. CW hasn't had a source since AA left, GM has shut up shop to leaks (as mentioned in CW's article) 5. MFC wont' cop a punishment, because anything other than a full acquittal is an admission of guilt. Pokies are worth too much to allow that to happen. So, bang or bust. Even if the fine is less than the legal fees to contest it.

Jeez you can crap on and over-exaggerate.

SERIOUS HIT OUT OR DANCING WITH YOUR SISTER? by the George on The Outer Intra-Club Casey Fields 15 February 2013. I think it was Kevin Sheedy who coined the phrase “dancing with your sister” to describe intra-club practice matches. Both could never be taken too seriously and a lack of true physical contact would be a no no ... So what to make of a “match simulation” for the same event, as described in press releases from the Club? Well, they had umpires. It all looked serious enough without the serious physical aspects, but keeping score was irrelevant especially when points scored saw the ball taken to the opposing half-back line for a restart. Anyhow you looked at whatever it was called, it was more than a normal training run, but less than the real McCoy. It certainly provided the opportunity to gauge how the newer recruits would hold up in a more intense atmosphere. No shows, as would have been expected were Clark, Dawes, Trengove and Gawn. Didn’t sight Jack or Max, but the other two were seen on the boundary, with Dawes doing the warm-ups. So he can’t be too far away from more serious work. Joel McDonald sat out and only did slight warm-ups with one of the training staff. Four quarters of about 15-20 minutes in 30 degree temperatures was testing for everyone, but it must be said that it was hard to find anyone seriously affected by the heat and exercise. No-one lying half dead on the ground after, as the whole group just walked calmly from the oval. Good signs, and the benefits of the current fitness regime and the Darwin trip may be showing already. The two sides were in blue and white respectively, and while the blue side had the ascendancy on the day, with only a few exceptions, it would be the side that we can see on the park next week. So just some observations: ■ Jack Viney is a seriously good player. He is simply into everything and just doesn’t stop. His natural ability is matched with a ferocious competitiveness that mean he makes the ball his time after time. He will play plenty this year,providing he can tolerate the demands of AFL at senior level. ■ Jimmy Toumpas is silken class and another natural footballer. Still working his way into the rhythm and speed of the game, he shows more than glimpses of his underlying talent. ■ Get excited about “Hulk Hogan”, and make sure you get down to Casey to see him play this year. This kid could be anything. At just 17 he is seriously scary and already can hold his own against long established players. ■ Shannon Byrnes went off in the last with icing to his calf, but probably because he overused his leg from the number of kicks he was getting. ■ David Rodan will be another positive in the mid-field with strong body and simply superb vision in the packs. He can dance through bodies and finds space effortlessly, the hallmark of a truly gifted player. ■ And Cam Pedersen will be another more than useful pick-up from last year. Strength, height and the ability to open space in front of himself produced options that we simply didn’t have last year. ■ Mark Jamar is back to his best. He is jumping off the ground again, unlike last year, and gave Spencer an absolute bath in the ruck. Sadly, Spencer still is not concentrating on the ball, despite his enormous height advantage, and apart from a good single mark, he did not touch the ball in general play or at ruck contests. By that I mean he did not touch the ball … ■ Overall, it was good to have so many players on the field at this time of the year. The fitness staff have to be congratulated as it will give us options in the weeks to come. ■ Impressive was the speed of movement of the ball. Yes, it is difficult to judge when we are playing amongst ourselves, but some of the change of direction and ability to break through lines with swift and accurate handball was a delight to watch. ■ Don’t expect too much from Aaron Davey this year. While his delivery is simply sublime when he has it in his hands, he has simply lost the yard necessary to make the electrifying moves of years past. He was unable to open space between himself and his opponent constantly, and barely touched the ball. A loose bouncing ball in the goal-square would have been a certain 6 pointer years ago, but today only resulted in a scrimmage and ball-up. ■ Have to give Rory Taggert a rub for a beautiful 50 metre goal from the boundary line ... and because his mum wasn’t too far away from where we were sitting ... Overall, the session was more than a dance ,,, it was quick, efficient and lacking in howler type blunders. There was plenty to be pleased about with lines of players like Watts, Strauss, M. Jones, Sylvia, Frawley, Barry, Tom McDonald, all showing the skills that they have consistently, repeatedly and properly. Take this into the season, and we have plenty to hope for. See you all next Friday …

I'm with BH. Despite the voluminous arguments here, or what Wilson says are 'unofficial' positions, or her referral to them as 'flimsy', I don't care about them, or anyone else's excuses here, or real (or feigned) indignation, or journalists barking from the sidelines to sell newspapers. They're all peripheral and fill up pages. I only care about what is in the AFL report, Melbourne's official response, and the outcome. I just hope it's positive for the club.

Intra-Club Casey Fields 15 February 2013. I think it was Kevin Sheedy who coined the phrase dancing with your sister to describe intra-club practice matches. Both could never be taken too seriously and a lack of true physical contact would be a no no ... So what to make of a match simulation for the same event, as described in press releases from the Club? Well, they had umpires. It all looked serious enough without the serious physical aspects, but keeping score was irrelevant especially when points scored saw the ball taken to the opposing half-back line for a restart. Anyhow you looked at whatever it was called, it was more than a normal training run, but less than the real McCoy. It certainly provided the opportunity to gauge how the newer recruits would hold up in a more intense atmosphere. No shows, as would have been expected were Clark, Dawes, Trengove and Gawn. Didnt sight Jack or Max, but the other two were seen on the boundary, with Dawes doing the warm-ups. So he cant be too far away from more serious work. Joel McDonald sat out and only did slight warm-ups with one of the training staff. Four quarters of about 15-20 minutes in 30 degree temperatures was testing for everyone, but it must be said that it was hard to find anyone seriously affected by the heat and exercise. No-one lying half dead on the ground after, as the whole group just walked calmly from the oval. Good signs, and the benefits of the current fitness regime and the Darwin trip may be showing already. The two sides were in blue and white respectively, and while the blue side had the ascendancy on the day, with only a few exceptions, it would be the side that we can see on the park next week. So just some observations: ■ Jack Viney is a seriously good player. He is simply into everything and just doesnt stop. His natural ability is matched with a ferocious competitiveness that mean he makes the ball his time after time. He will play plenty this year,providing he can tolerate the demands of AFL at senior level. ■ Jimmy Toumpas is silken class and another natural footballer. Still working his way into the rhythm and speed of the game, he shows more than glimpses of his underlying talent. ■ Get excited about Hulk Hogan, and make sure you get down to Casey to see him play this year. This kid could be anything. At just 17 he is seriously scary and already can hold his own against long established players. ■ Shannon Byrnes went off in the last with icing to his calf, but probably because he overused his leg from the number of kicks he was getting. ■ David Rodan will be another positive in the mid-field with strong body and simply superb vision in the packs. He can dance through bodies and finds space effortlessly, the hallmark of a truly gifted player. ■ And Cam Pedersen will be another more than useful pick-up from last year. Strength, height and the ability to open space in front of himself produced options that we simply didnt have last year. ■ Mark Jamar is back to his best. He is jumping off the ground again, unlike last year, and gave Spencer an absolute bath in the ruck. Sadly, Spencer still is not concentrating on the ball, despite his enormous height advantage, and apart from a good single mark, he did not touch the ball in general play or at ruck contests. By that I mean he did not touch the ball ■ Overall, it was good to have so many players on the field at this time of the year. The fitness staff have to be congratulated as it will give us options in the weeks to come. ■ Impressive was the speed of movement of the ball. Yes, it is difficult to judge when we are playing amongst ourselves, but some of the change of direction and ability to break through lines with swift and accurate handball was a delight to watch. ■ Dont expect too much from Aaron Davey this year. While his delivery is simply sublime when he has it in his hands, he has simply lost the yard necessary to make the electrifying moves of years past. He was unable to open space between himself and his opponent constantly, and barely touched the ball. A loose bouncing ball in the goal-square would have been a certain 6 pointer years ago, but today only resulted in a scrimmage and ball-up. ■ Have to give Rory Taggert a rub for a beautiful 50 metre goal from the boundary line ... and because his mum wasnt too far away from where we were sitting ... Overall, the session was more than a dance ,,, it was quick, efficient and lacking in howler type blunders. There was plenty to be pleased about with lines of players like Watts, Strauss, M. Jones, Sylvia, Frawley, Barry, Tom McDonald, all showing the skills that they have consistently, repeatedly and properly. Take this into the season, and we have plenty to hope for. See you all next Friday http://bit.ly/Ydq6uD

The other issue will be what other clubs did. If the AFL's 'unofficial' thinking is that they can punish Melbourne and sweep the preceding tanking allegations under the carpet because in Caro's words, "they were less blatant" then that is absolute garbage and shows a serious flaw in the AFL's application and administration of it's own rules.

Well I've gone and signed up for the weekend HUN with Digital Pass. Dad would be rolling with laughter in his grave. He worked at the Herald & Weekly Times all his life. I told him long before he died I would never read his rag again. Dad I guess I was wrong. PS Mum and Dad were life long bombers

Dunn and Watts having a dance battle?

You mean the worst case scenario is that we DON'T lose any draft picks and our CEO isn't charged ?

I don't know if it's because Caro is stupid or vindictive, but she continues to trot out the same tired arguments. One of these is that McLardy didn't address her issues. Perhaps this is because in nine articles lambasting Melbourne, she never once demonstrated that Melbourne actually violated AFL rules, and therefore anything she had to say was inconsequential.

This quote from Wilson demonstrates not only the perversity of her logic but also the problem McLaughlin and the AFL are facing right now. If other clubs "tanked" why were they not investigated for the same offence? Was Terry Wallace not even more blatant than Melbourne when he admitted in an article that he as a coach did nothing to beat St. Kilda in a game in late 2007? How much of the "truth" would have been uncovered if Carlton, Richmond, Collingwood and West Coast were also looked at in a broader investigation of tanking lasting 6 or 7 months? The so-called stain will be on the AFL and should give rise to cries of corruption and possibly a government enquiry into the running of the game. After all, it's a billion dollar industry with a large betting component and multiple problems facing it at the moment. The AFL is in trouble if only one club among many is targeted over an issue that has involved perhaps half of its constituent clubs.

Exactly. Had months to prepare and if he had stayed calm could have completely shown up how illogical her arguments are/were. Particularly the issue of this unofficial business. CW clearly had implied in her article that this was what the club had put forward as a defence not what some random insiders and supporters were saying. Hence DM's completely reasonable response. She was being completely disingenuous on the FC (and again in her latest article). But the clincher was that he missed the chance to completely show her up when she replied to his comment that players deliberately fumbling were raised in the report that it was never covered in the media. He must have known it had (and i would have assumed she would have been told after raising it the previous week). ​He also let her derail the conversation by asking the others if we deliberately lost games in 2009 (and they all agreed) and raising the conflict issue (when he lost it). I get the passion and all that but jeez he had the chance to drive a truck through her logic and flat out missed it.

He really could have hit her out of the park if he'd done some research. So many inconsistencies and misleading comments (re: the whole official/unofficial thing). Old Gaz just seemed a bit lost once CW went into politician mode where she backed out of everything and changed the subject matter.

Couldn't disagree with this any more. Given the situation I think he conveyed the frustration of the Melbourne faithful without crossing the line. In fact the only time he really got his back up was when she decided to question his credibility. "Made for uncomfortable viewing"? Sorry, but get real mate. Someone had to hold her to account, and I salute Garry for the way he did it.

The timing of this article, combined with the effort she's put in (obvious by the length of said article) shows this is purely a personal fight for CW, and those type of extremely emotion (or pride) driven opinion pieces are usually a sign of the beginning of the end for a journo's career. Really surprised The Age has let her continue her personal war, although as many have mentioned they have certainly changed direction in recent times.

And I thought that I was opening a thread about us taking the tanking issue to the highest level ;-)

I can remember watching Pencils awkward kicking style at least 3 times, but reckon there were a few more. Big Max was there. Taggert a lovely goal was about 30 meters, was sitting just near man on mark. Baffled that we would lock a thread with 5 or 6 thorough match reports to send everyone to a thread with one. Seriously...

A pack and a ball up.

I have a feeling Kent would perform much better in wet weather rather then on a dry day however.