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These kinds of reactions are usually welcome after losses. But not today's loss. In Round 1 of a new year, with a new coach and coaching team, new captains, up against a side who wasn't very good last year and who cannot claim to be any better than us, at home, with great home crowd support, and with as much motivation as you can ask for, we played as badly as we have in our entire period of mediocrity. In context, this is inexcusable, and it's not an appropriate response for us, nor for the club, to simply say 'let's wait and play some more matches before we criticise'. Supporters are perfectly entitled to feel like we are utter rubbish after today.

The game plan can absolutely be blamed, because the Brisbane players knew exactly what was going to happen.......so they set up numbers for the contested spill from the long bomb, or the boundary line hug, shot the ball out to space, connected possessions and goal after goal resulted. Watch a replay if you can bear it, because it became woefully hilarious how obviously they were able to do that every time.

We missed Newton today.

I am still confident that Neeld is the man we need. The PLAYERS are the problem, this is the third coach now we are seeing the same problems with. "are the same 22 going to travel to Perth? Not on your life" was my favourite line from the presser.

It does take time to learn and adjust to a new game plan and I'm willing to accept that early in the season there will be times when we get caught out of position or players run to the wrong spot etc. But the basics of footy are the same no matter what your game plan. Winning the footy at the stoppages is a basic - every game plan relies on that. And keeping possession when you have the footy is another. Those two areas we were absolutely horrible at today. And to be honest I expected more in these areas, as winning the footy and keeping possession are not concepts that purely rely on learning a new game plan - it is something that footballers have known about their whole careers. I lost count of the number of times we'd get first hands on the footy but get caught, while the Lions would then pick it up and run away. And those were the few times we actually got first hands on the ball at a stoppage, as most of the time Black and Rich just did what they liked. They were just so much better at getting a quick possession out to a running player, while we seemed quite stationary at the stoppages. Then when we did get the ball, we couldn't string together any chains or passages of play. The Lions on the other hand were able to move the ball with speed and generally used it pretty well. If you can't get the basics of footy right then you have no chance. Absolutely shocking display of footy from the players today.

Because 1/ We are lazy and dont work hard enough to present options 2/ When we do present options we do not respect the option and pull the trigger 3./ The long bomb to the ruckman should be used when all the hard working options ( which there arent any) are covered

Three things I learned. 1/ Magner is a magnet 2/ We were second to the ball the whole game 3/ Lions were prepared to run and spread - we werent. 4/ The long bombing or 2012 is the chipping the ball backwards of 2011. If we are not prepared to work hard and present options you only have two choices - bomb long or chip backwards. Until we are prepared to gut run and keep presenting and giving options, we will continue to disappoint 5/ I cant count.

3. Magner no-one else worth a vote

Trengove - never stopped trying Grimes - was terrific early Jones - always under pressure Bartram - skill - less as ever Watts - failed to impress Bate - limited game time Frawley - far from reliable Clark - overpaid and underperformed Mckenzie - selected too soon Blease - was rarely sighted Green - was never sighted Garland - was he playing? Moloney - not on field Rivers - not the worst Macdonald - possibly the worst Martin - gave a little Davey - career possibly over Howe - spectacular , not effective Jamar - was comprehensively destroyed Bail - was rarely sighted Magner- the only highlight

So how did Neeld get the best out of first gamer Magner and not Davey and Green? How is it they are put to shame by a first gamer? Individuals need to start taking responsibility a step up on their own. The coach should be more concerned with players who really need it than players who have been around forever and frankly shouldn't need anyone other than themselves to get the best out of them.

I am just not on either side anymore. People go the extreme one day and just go on and on and on about everything that is wrong about the club, but then there are people that tell them to back off, and that they'll "always have faith" and "go dees", which I think makes some people even more angry. I am not sure there are any acceptable excuses for today. Just none. We should by this stage be slamming a team like Brisbane, and we're not, and the loss is really just indicative of everything negative that is said of the club: as a whole, for a long time, it is a weak club with a very poor culture. I am not sure that one extreme is acceptable, but I don't think brushing off the loss as "just round 1" or "emotionally drained" is really going to lead to much constructive discussion. Why is this club consistently putting in efforts like these? I see so many people getting angry, and I don't really think anything of it because I genuinely sympathise with these people. People are sick of losing. It's just frustrating now. And trying to empathise with the players doesn't do anything for me, because they're paid to perform, like everyone else in this world. It was a weak effort. You don't need to be an angry Melbourne supporter to realise that. It was weak and just really, really dumb football. Geelong 186-point loss type footy. Had we been playing a top side it'd have been a 100-point loss. It was really, really bad football. I don't trust anyone. I just want to see results. I am past the whole, "I have faith" stage. I'm not 12 anymore. Oh, and inb4 "they've had a tough, emotional pre-season". Here come the excuses!

For over fifty years I've been following this club and, believe me I've seen some brutally insipid, limp performances in that time. One thing that I have learnt over that time is that this club will always find ways of letting it's supporters down and today was no exception.However i just don't know what to make of today's half hearted, gutless, unprofessional and soul destroying game. One thing for sure is that Green and Davey's playing days are well and truly over and it's a no brainer that they should now see out their contracts playing at Casey One thing that this current group lacks (with a small handful of exceptions) is courage and we next come up against a side that we've been scared of for many years so we can expect another good belting in round two. These current girls that are playing right now have been given a fresh start with a new, hard, experienced coach and professional back up team and still manage to serve up this tripe. I probably shouldn't call them girls as most of them couldn't compare with some of the women playing in the ladies league. Sady, there's probably only a dozen testicles to be shared around this bunch of talentless turkeys. I'd made my mind up that this year, I wouldn't purchase a membership until they, the players, proved themselves to me that they were worthy of my dollars rather than me having to prove my loyalty. it was only the death of Jim that made me change my mind and I'm now regretting this. After all the recent work done by the management and staff of the MFC and the support of the long suffering member, these current players should be ashamed of themselves. I'm glad I waited a few hours to vent my spleen, otherwise I may have told them what I really think of them.

I actually thought his press conference was brilliant. But coming after "stonewall" Bailey, anyone's presser would be better.

What don't you understand? He said four players were good enough to play at AFL level based on their performance today. What would you like him to say? You can't polish a turd, it is what it is.

Davey is a joke of a player these days he has lost all of his pace and has a pea heart And should not to be in the team for the rest of the year, he has no interest other than getting his pay check Trade him for 2nd/ 3rd rounder

i think you accidentally pressed the "i" and the "n" button

I think we will know next week if the Coach will stick to his word that you must earn your spot in the team. If Davey gets a game after his performance today itt will all be just words and same soft approach as coach's before him. He must not even be on bench, 2 to 3 weeks at least in the Vfl. This performance and attitude can no longer be accepted.

OUT: Davey, Green, Macdonald IN: Tapscott, Petterd, Sellar

We were stagnant we almost broke out in a algae bloom. I cant recall one piece of clean ball movement the whole day. Our senior players seemed as poor as our game plan appeared. We got destroyed in the clearances in the middle. Really poor showing all around. Very poor signs indeed particularly after half time. For all our glorious pre season we seemed unfit, immobile and unable to keep up with Brisbane.

I honestly cannot imagine a worse performance, given the context of this game. I'm going to put Jim to one side. Whilst we showed him nothing on the field, who's to say what was going on in the minds of the players. Let's just look at the match for what it was. Brisbane is not Geelong. They are Brisbane. We should be, at the absolute worst, on par with them. To lose by as much as we did, in the manner in which we did, is nothing short of disgraceful. There will be those who say that it's about the future and one bad performance does not ruin that. That is true. But it does not change the fact that today's performance was utterly abysmal. What has improved since Neeld took over? We kick the ball a heck of a lot more than under Bailey. But what else? Are we more skillful? We weren't today? Are we faster? Or stronger? Or tougher? Not today we weren't. The kick-to-handball ratio aside, I see no changes. We're still soft, still slow, still unskilled, and still have no decipherable gameplan. And we still can't kick in from behinds. Today was as bad as I think we have ever played, and it would show on the scoreboard if we had played Hawthorn or Geelong. We cannot brush this aside as simply a bad week in a development year. We have been writing off bad years as 'development years' for enough now. For mine, performances like this against mediocre sides are, quite literally, inexcusable.

The Green/Davey/Green combo goal epitomised where we are at.

Pretty terrible day for the club after the terrible week and preseason we've had. The problem is I can't see where the improvement will come from. It's been 6 years now since finals, and we're still looking at bottom 4-8 with no light at the end of the tunnel. It's at the stage now where I hope we trade in a bunch of middle of the road players like Sydney just so I can see my team compete. These kids are going nowhere. I'm not proud supporting this club anymore, especially when the players aren't proud to play for it. To hear that the effort isn't there after what's happened this week, a new coach, Round 1, is heartbreaking. If anything I expected this to be the most effort I see all year. Show some [censored] heart for gods sake! I've invested decades of my life into this club. I buy memberships for family members who aren't even in the country anymore. I'm not getting any return on that investment, and now I don't enjoy watching us play. Things better change soon or I and 6 other freebie memberships every year, are done.

Much of the same output from the same players across 3 different coaches now. When will some of you realise that it's the players that let us down. Not the coaches. Bailey, Viney and now Neeld. The players don't respond and are not good enough. How many different gameplans and coaches will you all be happy with churning through before you realise. The players need to stop waiting for someone else to bring the silver bullet. They need to work out what it means to be a real team and win for each other. They are not a team. They care more about themselves than the club. Look at the comment on Sylvia in this thread. Why isnt he looking concerned? These players have become used to losing and are ok with it. That is the problem. Stop blaming the coaches. Blame the players.

Must be good to always have a level head Nasher. Get some fight in you son! Us chest beaters are passionate, I'd rather live my life with passion.

Well done to be able to frame it that way. Denial at its best.

Pretty embarassing second half but its round one and as much as it pains me to say it Neeld does deserve some time. Will be good to see his response, because if Davey isn't playing at Casey next week I will be shocked.

Before we all put the team to the sword just stop and think about what's happened to the club over the last couple of weeks. No one knew just how this was going to effect the players, it was always going to be extremely emotional, they probably were mentally drained even before the first bounce. Give them a couple of weeks at least, then if they're playing the same then fair enough, bag them all you want, but not this week.

I was disappointed that me and the boys couldn't make the game today as my wife had to work. Now I'm thinking of ringing her work and thanking them.

If I was Neeld I would have said to the seniors you're playing for your career in this quarter, don't expect another game of AFL football if you don't earn it in the next 30 minutes

Gameplan is flawed. Will get beaten by every side using it. Almost negligent to instruct this or allow it to happen

this is not the players, this is neeld. the repeated long bombing is awful.

What is it about the remarkable story of Irishmen and the MFC? There was Stynes. There was Wight. And now there's the remarkable story unfolding about yet another one. James ("Jimmy") Magner was born here in Australia in 1987 (the same year our beloved Jimmy Stynes debuted with the MFC) to Irish immigrants. Our new Jimmy also had a steely determination to succeed, not unlike the Stynes boy. He's put himself up for the AFL draft no less than six times, only to be ignored on every occasion, before being picked up by the MFC as a mature aged rookie. The new Jimmy is as tough as nails. And, he makes his debut the same week that we farewelled our other Jimmy. As one chapter closes, another opens. It's a wonderful story. And I, for one, hope that our new Jimmy carves for himself his own piece of MFC history! (For those of you who have not yet done so, take the time to read the article "Irish Pride" on the MFC website. It's a great read.)

A man can have two faiths - Jesus Christ and the MFC. No tension at all here for me.

Packed train on the way in, full of fans in a sea of red and blue, blood pumping, Carn Melbourne!

Richmond can have Delidio (good, but not great) but Martin and Cotchin are welcome any time at Melbourne.

Why has it been so long since there has been a post on Jack Watts? One thing i'll say is watching the Hawks tonight they have some seriously good kickers of the ball. The thought crossed my mind that the only two players we have who are a grade kicks of the ball are Davey (who was down in this department last year - too cute by half) and Watts. JW's disposal skills are crucial in our "workman like" line-up. Measure his contribution by goal assists and i prdict he will be our most important player this year.

I got the call today. It's not the first time my brother has told me he's disappointed in me. But apparently my niece and nephew are now excited little Dees fans running around the house with their horns on. And if I wasn't already in my sister in laws bad books, i certainly will be now, she's just had her face painted red & blue. Priceless.

Wash your mouth out! Grimes will play. He'll play for 5 minutes before somehow breaking 8 toes and not resurfacing for 18 rounds.

Personally I dont like the idea. I do not want the boys to play FOR Jimmy (unsustainable). I want the boys to play like Jimmy (acheivable).

I'm really glad that the club has gone down this road instead of a minutes silence. The rest of the games (as far as I know) have been doing a minute silence and I think this does put us in a different category when I comes to Jimmy. I've seen it done at EPL matches and it just seems right. In Jimmy's case it seems even more appropriate because his life and his achievements should be celebrated. In terms of a song, I would think an Irish song of some kind would be the way to go. Danny Boy comes to mind (with changed lyrics), but I reckon I'd tear up every time I heard it!

With the utmost respect to Jim, no one man will ever be, or should be bigger than the MFC. Not even the late and great Jim Stynes. Even Jim would agree with this. The club was around long before any one of its living past/present players, and it will be around (hopefully) for another 150 years at least. And with regard to the idea of a chant, it would need to be pretty decent, or else it would just be lame. If we were able to create a chant/song that was as unique and spine-tingling as Liverpool's 'you'll never walk alone' then i'm all for it (yes i know that Celtic also uses this song as well).

http://www.bbcshop.com/content/ebiz/bbc/invt/ltdmg012/bb_flobbatastic_300.jpg

What??? You are kidding!!!!

How long does it take people to realise that the position a player is named in the selected team has no relevance to where they are actually lining up.

there are a number of really good key forwards who have either started their life on the wing or had spells there. Michael Roach, Paul Roos, Richo. One of the greatest full forwards I have seen ( Dunstall) started in the back pocket. If JW tears it up in the midfield, wing, backline or where ever I am not going to say "but he is meant to be a key forward". I am looking for Jack to make visible improvements on last year. What position he does that, I dont really care.

Do you really belive he reads this crap???

I thought this was supposed to be a forum for 'supporters'. There are so many who do not support... they just want to tear down a 21-year-old before the season even starts. And perhaps those who sing the praises of Nic-Nat should take their 'support' to West Coast. Do any of you think about how all the negative comments from so-called Demon supports could be affecting Watts? I am not going to read another post about Jack Watts during the season. Let him listen to his coaches, continue to learn and improve throughout the season and judge him at the end of September.

Perhaps "Booze Bus Benny" should try using Modafinil. http://www.gizmag.com/go/3574/ It's legal so must be okay. I'm off to see my government sanctioned drug distributor (GP/pharmacist) to see if I can get some on the PBS.

I like to think of it as a work in progress.