PREGAME: Rd 18 vs Essendon

[Fromgotowoewodin 1,467]

20 minutes ago, DemonOX said:

Looks like someone else has the same concerns as a few posters on here including myself. 
 

From sen article  

David King is concerned about this call, wondering if the Demons have already lost this game at the selection table.

If we’ve lost Kingy…

 

lock in a 6 goal win

[Ollie fan 2,894]

As for the general thrust of this thread: Henny-Penny, the sky is falling, the sky is falling.

No it isn't.

We will crack in on Saturday night and beat them.

[The Corridor 119]

In isolation I might see this selection as a bit strange but not worry-inducing.  

But in the context of a number of bizarre and very costly selections in recent years it is hard to not be concerned any time there is another glaring selection question mark. Even in the past year we have had:

- Laurie sub for 2023 qualifying final, which made no sense at the time and came home to roost

- Schache sub for 2023 semifinal, which made no sense at the time and mustn't have made sense to the coaches/selection committee either as he didn't get on the ground. Giving a fresh legs advantage to the opposition was a massive own goal. Worth 2 points on the scoreboard perhaps?

- Playing Spargo in Round 0 when he was clearly not fit and clearly did not have adequate preparation

That's just a sample of selection in 3 consecutive AFL games. You have to be trying hard to come up with a defence for some of these things. 

[Kent 2,822]

My main concern is whether Pettys' foot can stand up again It appears a somewhat conic injury

[DistrACTION Jackson 8,282]

A mate of mine played golf with the Bombers president who said they are supremely confident of beating us this week.... which makes me happy because if they are drinking their own bathwater no doubt they will sheet the bed

[John Demonic 5,454]

23 minutes ago, DistrACTION Jackson said:

A mate of mine played golf with the Bombers president who said they are supremely confident of beating us this week.... which makes me happy because if they are drinking their own bathwater no doubt they will sheet the bed

It was a long time ago, but after that bath they gave us in gather round, I wouldn't expect any less than them being supremely confident they can out ruck us and out run us. 

Edited July 11 by John Demonic

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,259]

33 minutes ago, The Corridor said:

- Schache sub for 2023 semifinal, which made no sense at the time and mustn't have made sense to the coaches/selection committee either as he didn't get on the ground. Giving a fresh legs advantage to the opposition was a massive own goal. Worth 2 points on the scoreboard perhaps?

That selection was literally Simon’s worst moment as coach of the MFC.

Fancy not utilising a fresh sub on an unseasonably warm September night. Carlton bring on a fresh Ollie Hollands who was instrumental in the winning chain of play then ended in the Acres goal and heartbreak for us. Meanwhile we have a 201cm immobile player warming the bench for the entire game.

We can’t afford to have these selection shenanigans.

[DubDee 24,106]

21 pages talking about Rucks when in reality tap work usually has little impact on the outcome

We'll miss Gawn around the ground but the replacement doesn't matter much in the greater scheme of things

[dice 660]

14 hours ago, At the break of Gawn said:

Don’t think they could possibly get any taller. Already got 11 players above 190cm listed. They’re surely the tallest team in the AFL

Wright

Langford

Ridley

Mckay

Jones

Caddy

Stringer

Cox

Jones

Draper

Martin

I’m praying for a wet night 

Yes, in the immortal words of the 12th man, we need it to "rain and to rain hard"

[Chook 14,987]

Petty has had a lot of trouble getting into the game as a forward. Having him be a defensive ruck following Draper around the ground and helping out defensively could work very well in theory.

1. Gets him into the game
2. Utilises his defensive nous and knowledge of the backline structure
3. Potentially providing a good marking target down the ground
4. Keeps the forward line open for players who know what they're doing (Roo, Melk, Fritta, Kosi) to go to work

Better than Fullerton, who wouldn't really be able to do any of that

[58er 5,841]

22 minutes ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

That selection was literally Simon’s worst moment as coach of the MFC.

Fancy not utilising a fresh sub on an unseasonably warm September night. Carlton bring on a fresh Ollie Hollands who was instrumental in the winning chain of play then ended in the Acres goal and heartbreak for us. Meanwhile we have a 201cm immobile player warming the bench for the entire game.

We can’t afford to have these selection shenanigans.

Kynan Brown Pup says Hi  only 2 weeks in a row again. 

Will Goody ever learn?

Also the point about Bedford and Jordon is that the same selection tricks and issues are being played out with Laurie Woe and now Kynan.

If I was Dog Brown I would be furious with the treatment of Kynan.

BTW the record of Schache and Kynan as subs is 1 close win vs Roos 4 pts and  2 losses by 2 points vs Blues in SF and Lions by 5 pts in Round 16. 

Surely you deserve to lose games and players when you burn them at  that rate.

[leave it to deever 17,401]

1 hour ago, The Corridor said:

Laurie sub for 2023 qualifying final, which made no sense at the time and came home to roost

Well said .

That was the biggest head scratcher ever 

Should serve a lesson that the sub really is there for emergencies.

Helped lose us a final, that call.

Laurie had maybe six games under his belt ( most as a sub).

Hard to fathom what the selection committee was thinking or rather they clearly weren't.

[DistrACTION Jackson 8,282]

11 minutes ago, 58er said:

Kynan Brown Pup says Hi  only 2 weeks in a row again. 

Will Goody ever learn?

Also the point about Bedford and Jordon is that the same selection tricks and issues are being played out with Laurie Woe and now Kynan.

If I was Dog Brown I would be furious with the treatment of Kynan.

BTW the record of Schache and Kynan as subs is 1 close win vs Roos 4 pts and  2 losses by 2 points vs Blues in SF and Lions by 5 pts in Round 16. 

Surely you deserve to lose games and players when you burn them at  that rate.

So who is Kynan Brown replacing in our side?

He is a first year rookie and is nowhere near ready for AFL yet, given his slight frame.

I was sad to see Bedford go, but to be honest Chandler is just a good a small forward as he is.

The James Jordon one was unfortunate, as I think he would've stayed had Gus immediately retired before the trade period. I've got a feeling he will find himself as the sub or even out of the Swans team now that Mills and potentially PArker come back.

[Damo 3,214]

1 hour ago, old55 said:

Petty is the best replacement for Max's key strength - down the line marking target. He's the next best contested mark we have and was just hitting form in this area against Brisbane when he took 5 contested marks - a very high number. So I'm very happy to see him selected.

But he doesn't have to ruck to provide that target and he didn’t against Brisbane, he can play high forward and get up the ground to do it, while JVR, Fritsch and Melksham play deeper.

I agree with the above and am happy that the team that has been performing well for the last few weeks is not changed too much.

I also think that if it is dry we just may see a late change from Goody which is unusual for him, but is what Brad Scott often has pulled. Id like to see Tom Mac, Disco as well as JVR and Harry pitch in. Im hoping for the same intensity we have seen lately to be on show again. Hoping to see a cohesive forward line with Petty in there again.

[Tarax Club 3,727]

1 hour ago, John Demonic said:

It was a long time ago, but after that bath they gave us in gather round, I wouldn't expect any less than them being supremely confident they can out ruck us and out run us. 

Last year in fact. Expect Simon to have done his homework this time and learned his lessons. As evident last Sunday, bushwhacked out West earlier in the season, to emphatic victors in the return match.

Meanwhile he has backed in the young blokes, plus overseen a return to form of or from injury of key experienced players. The team performance has improved with a return  to the basics of pressure, contest and placing a premium on defense. The bounce back from the rout in Alice, almost imperceptible at first, has gathered momentum from becoming competitive to winning.

Cream, l prefer mine double fortified rather than whipped.

 

 

Edited July 12 by Tarax Club

[The Swimming Dee 1,904]

The Coach bashing is so tiresome.

[binman 41,788]

2 hours ago, DemonOX said:

Looks like someone else has the same concerns as a few posters on here including myself. 
 

From sen article  

David King is concerned about this call, wondering if the Demons have already lost this game at the selection table.

Personally, David King wouldn’t be my go to guy to support a position i held.

But each to their own.

[58er 5,841]

8 minutes ago, DistrACTION Jackson said:

So who is Kynan Brown replacing in our side?

He is a first year rookie and is nowhere near ready for AFL yet, given his slight frame.

I was sad to see Bedford go, but to be honest Chandler is just a good a small forward as he is.

The James Jordon one was unfortunate, as I think he would've stayed had Gus immediately retired before the trade period. I've got a feeling he will find himself as the sub or even out of the Swans team now that Mills and potentially PArker come back.

Kynan is not too light a player like Windsor was going to be too light or Jefferson is too light. Players with skill can play in certain positions as skill will always win over strength if it is good enough. 

Kynan could have replaced Maxy who was injured from half til on  and also vs Roos Harry was injured. Please don’t say about like for like. You switch the team around to confuse the opposition !

Also just acknowledge that Goody’s use contributed to both Jordon leaving and Toby. Both made their decisions freely to leave. I rest my case. 

And if he doesn’t learn both Woe and Laurie and Kynan will do the same. Shameful use of players and Subs being  burnt. 

[Fromgotowoewodin 1,467]

2 minutes ago, 58er said:

Also just acknowledge that Goody’s use contributed to both Jordon leaving and Toby. Both made their decisions freely to leave. I rest my case. 

And if he doesn’t learn both Woe and Laurie and Kynan will do the same. Shameful use of players and Subs being  burnt. 

You pick your best 22 to win games, not to keep players happy in case they get a better offer in the trade period. 

If we knew Gus was going to get concussed in the QF and then retire preseason then maybe we should’ve given Jordon more game time through 2023 but that’d be some extreme Nostradamus foresight. He wasn’t good enough to win a spot over others so he played as sub. Toby was behind Kos, Chandler, ANB and probably would still be now.. you can’t fit everyone in, that’s just how it goes. Nothing shameful about it. 

[middleagedemon 324]

18 minutes ago, binman said:

Personally, David King wouldn’t be my go to guy to support a position i held.

But each to their own.

Given he uses 'stats' to back many of the opinions (not all) he holds, why is that? 

I mean, obviously he gets things wrong, as we all do. No more than you though?

How many times have you been realllly confident that we'll get a win due to the phase of 'loading' we're in (which you like to back by the 'stats' you think correlate to our performances) only to be wrong about the result? 

Many. 

I like your optimism about us in general. But I think it pulls you so far over to one side that what you're actually looking for most of the time is the 'stats' that you think back the non-negotiable view you hold about us or a subject to do with us. Ie, 'loading'. Or Godwin at the selection table. Etc. 

Edited July 12 by middleagedemon

[Wells 11 5,234]

Severe MFCSS...but short term only

My fear is that this week will be the final nail in the coffin of a [censored] 2024. Im expecting a 10 goal loss and for it to seal the deal for the year and for the press to sharpen their knives...again. We're down Trac, Brayshaw and, as good as he is, an underdone Oliver....and now Max.  4 of our best 6? Its too much for mine.

On the positive side though . I dont think this team is anywhere near finished in terms of 25 and 26 . IF we were to recruit a key forward and or another gun mid and IF trac and Clarry are back next year even close to their best then we will be right back in the top 4 imo. 

 

 

[binman 41,788]

It's totally nuts the amount of hand wringing on here about the non selection of a kid who is two years away from being AFL ready and an ex basketballer who could only manage 19 games accross 3 seasons at the lions, is not even the main ruck at VFL level (he only averages 11.6 hit outs - by way of contrast majak daw averaged 26) and has been in the best in the maggoos no more than 2-3 times.

Edited July 12 by binman

[sue 8,985]

A lot of furious hindsight being thrown around here about poor selection decisions in the past, the basis of which we don't know.  For example, Schache was an unused sub for 2023 semifinal. On the face of it seemed madness.

But do we have all the facts that guided the selection committee?  Maybe there was someone in the team who had a serious injury concern about whether they could run out the game. Club felt they were good enough to take the risk of playing him and Schache was insurance for that player. But it turned out he was not needed, so in hindsight a different player would have been a better sub.  Not saying there was and it wasn't a bungle, just saying we never know all the facts so we should temper our outrage.

Our cupboard is rather bare - how many teams could lose 3.5 of their best players and be confident of winning by putting in players who have not impressed at VFL level. And Essendon are full of confidence (hopefully over full).  If we lose we'll need deeper analysis of why, rather than just putting it down to selection mistakes.

Edited July 12 by sue

[middleagedemon 324]

For the record, I think King is clearly knowledgeable. Much more so than any poster on here given his experience as an AFL player and assistant coach at the level. 

The only problem I have is that AFL media is so ove-saturated and he is on so many programs that he is clearly going to be wrong often given the amount of opinions he needs to give on a weekly basis. 

But his stuff with Daniel Hoyne is great. And first crack generally has some interesting insights. Regardless of whether or not one 'likes' the personality. 

[dice 660]

12 minutes ago, binman said:

It's totally nuts the amount of hand wringing on here about the non selection of a kid who is two years away from being AFL ready and an ex basketballer who could only manage 19 games accross 3 seasons at the lions, is not even the main ruck at VFL level (he only averages 11.6 hit outs - by way of contrast majak daw averaged 26) and has been in the best no more than 2-3 times.

At least give either of them a chance over a completely out-of-form, injury prone coach's Pet-ty!

Edited July 12 by dice