Team first - for certain a goal

[Redlagged 806]

4 hours ago, one_demon said:

According to Fox, it's a serious problem 

https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/teams/melbourne-demons/afl-news-2022-bayley-fritsch-ignoring-teammates-selfish-doesnt-kick-it-to-charlie-spargo-video-melbourne-demons-win-over-port-adelaide-power/news-story/7f2541db16c827aed12272613e82834a

 

According to Fox? Have things come to that? Sitting in front of a laptop and calling himself an 'analyst' doesn't make David King a blinding genius. Unfortunately in his job he occasionally has to speak - that's when his problems begin.

[sue 9,009]

3 hours ago, Clintosaurus said:

Leave Fritta alone. 95 goals in 2021 and 2022 indicates he's doing his job.

I think he may have a spacial awareness issue that would explain the Trac one at the least. That mark he took then played on with 2 Port defenders within a metre was one that I cold not work out.

Only explanation is that rather than taking a selfish set shot, he was trying to pass it to a team mate. Who unfortunately wasn't where he expected.

[John Crow Batty 8,780]

All this selflessness and selfish talk is getting a little tiring. Its not just Fritsch but any player that takes a pot shot at goal and misses seems to be fair game for being labeled selfish if there is another option to take. If Pickett missed a couple of his snaps he would have copped the flak for sure. Tmac cops it, Petracca cops it, BBB cops it. I have heard it all too often this season and it mostly seems applicable to us. I blame the media for beating this selflessness issue up and too many fans have fallen for it. It will get to the stage when players won’t trust their instincts and invariably stuff up. 

[Billy 2,462]

Fritsch has has a rare talent around the goals, l wouldn’t be surprised if Goodwin has told him if he’s anywhere in the vicinity of goal to have a shot (within reason)

Maybe he’s forgotten that he can’t kick them from anywhere & has tunnel vision 

l don’t think he’s deliberately burning his teammates 

[rjay 24,604]

7 hours ago, one_demon said:

According to Fox, it's a serious problem 

https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/teams/melbourne-demons/afl-news-2022-bayley-fritsch-ignoring-teammates-selfish-doesnt-kick-it-to-charlie-spargo-video-melbourne-demons-win-over-port-adelaide-power/news-story/7f2541db16c827aed12272613e82834a

 

Fox would know...they have to come up with something to troll on every week.

I think the one he should have given Trac was really poor, was that the Cats game? apart from that I haven't noticed anything else I would put in that category. They were, take the shot or don't..in other words 50/50's.

As someone else pointed out, he's paid to take the shot when it's there.

[DemonOX 8,699]

It’s not the first time he has burnt a teammate either. I think I have seen him do it 3 times over 3 different games. 

Hopefully he adjusts it and all will be good as it wasn’t a part of his game last season. 

[DemonWA 3,885]

This is the biggest non issue IMO. 

The media are trying to keep the narrative of us struggling up front going.

These sorts of things happen alot in most games and the counter argument is that we've often butchered the ball in the F50 trying to be too unselfish in more recent times- I don't mind a forward backing themselves to kick a goal if they think it's kickable. 

When Petracca has set shots form 55 on tigh angles and doesn't make the distance or kicks points it doesn't become a media circus. 

[Little Goffy 14,008]

In the past Fritsch has been pretty good at setting up teammates - he's one of our better inside-50 delivery agents.

I wonder if there's a factor of feeling the pressure to be 'the goalscorer' when there's so much talk about our forwards not kicking goals.

People often make their worst mistakes when they are over-correcting something else.

[John Demonic 5,522]

Bailey Firstch

 

Edited July 18, 2022 by John Demonic

[JimmyGadson 3,455]

Lol.

The joke is on those vehemently defending him. 

The reason he is in the media is his fault alone. 

There's a difference between deciding to take a low percentage shot on goal, (high angle) whilst under pressure and burning a team mate who is literally in the goal square on his own VS deciding to take a high percentage (no angle) shot on goal and missing but having a team mate open. (which players do all the time but are never spoken about in the media for what I would have thought were obvious reasons. Clearly not on Demonland). 

Fritsch is a great player. But those incidents are unforgivable and go against everything the club constantly preach which isn't a good look. It is also symptomatic of the way we're currently playing. Clunky, trying too hard and worried. Of course it's not the end of the world, but it's definitely a problem and a really really bad look. 

And if anyone has played the game, you never like playing with team mates who are repeat offenders of this kind of thing. 

Fritsch needs to pull his finger out. Clearly. 

[Jaded No More 67,671]

17 hours ago, deegirl said:

Fritsch is a hard player to love and this is one of the big reasons why.  And yes, I'm well aware of how valuable he is, but he's never going to be a favourite of mine.

Really? 
He’s one of my absolute favourite. Medium forwards have such a tough gig these days given how congested forwardlines are. 
 

He kicked 6 [censored] goals in a grand final and is once again our leading goal kicker. How can anyone not love him?

[Phil C 718]

13 minutes ago, JimmyGadson said:

Lol.

The joke is on those vehemently defending him. 

The reason he is in the media is his fault alone. 

There's a difference between deciding to take a low percentage shot on goal, (high angle) whilst under pressure and burning a team mate who is literally in the goal square on his own VS deciding to take a high percentage (no angle) shot on goal and missing but having a team mate open. (which players do all the time but are never spoken about in the media for what I would have thought were obvious reasons. Clearly not on Demonland). 

Fritsch is a great player. But those incidents are unforgivable and go against everything the club constantly preach which isn't a good look. It is also symptomatic of the way we're currently playing. Clunky, trying too hard and worried. Of course it's not the end of the world, but it's definitely a problem and a really really bad look. 

And if anyone has played the game, you never like playing with team mates who are repeat offenders of this kind of thing. 

Fritsch needs to pull his finger out. Clearly. 

What tosh. The Brisbane one wasn’t great I admit but talk about overblown nonsense. 

[JimmyGadson 3,455]

2 minutes ago, Jaded No More said:

Really? 
He’s one of my absolute favourite. Medium forwards have such a tough gig these days given how congested forwardlines are. 
 

He kicked 6 [censored] goals in a grand final and is once again our leading goal kicker. How can anyone not love him?

Yes. 

We can see that those like you who think it's ridiculous he's being singled out is because he's one of 'your favourites'. 

[Lord Nev 13,512]

12 hours ago, Billy said:

Fritsch has has a rare talent around the goals, l wouldn’t be surprised if Goodwin has told him if he’s anywhere in the vicinity of goal to have a shot (within reason)

Maybe he’s forgotten that he can’t kick them from anywhere & has tunnel vision 

l don’t think he’s deliberately burning his teammates 

His teammates reactions would tell you he's not just following coaching instructions.

 

[pitmaster 3,446]

Missing from this discussion is the fact that over his first five seasons Fritter has improved his accuracy markedly.

From 2018-20 he kicked 59 goals 52 behinds in 61 games.

Since, he has kicked 95 goals 43 behinds in 41 games.

Not only has his output increased markedly, but his accuracy has lifted from 53% to 69%.

He is entitled, more often than not, to back himself. More often than not, but not always. He is one of those blokes who has a licence to have a shot - the Petracca missed handball, however, was a shocker.

The non-pass to Spargo this week, not so worrying. Spargo is to put it politely, vertically challenged and a chip shot on the run with a defender between Fritsch and Spargo may well have been spoiled depending on how much air time the kick needed to firstly, clear the defender and secondly to reach Spargo.

[JimmyGadson 3,455]

Just now, Phil C said:

What tosh. The Brisbane one wasn’t great I admit but talk about overblown nonsense. 

Can't be tosh if he's in the media for it. Can it? 

Unless you have a bias because he's your favourite player.

 

[WalkingCivilWar 39,264]

1 minute ago, JimmyGadson said:

Can't be tosh if he's in the media for it. Can it? 

Unless you have a bias because he's your favourite player.

 

LOLZZZ 😂😂😂

[JimmyGadson 3,455]

1 minute ago, pitmaster said:

The non-pass to Spargo this week, not so worrying. Spargo is to put it politely, vertically challenged and a chip shot on the run with a defender between Fritsch and Spargo may well have been spoiled depending on how much air time the kick needed to firstly, clear the defender and secondly to reach Spargo.

Hahaha. 

Talk about clutching at straws. 

It was an elementary drop punt to an open player. 

[Phil C 718]

Just now, JimmyGadson said:

Can't be tosh if he's in the media for it. Can it? 

Unless you have a bias because he's your favourite player.

 

The media have to create content 24/7 so they basically pick apart the game in minutiae until there’s nothing left. This isn’t a story at all. His only crime on Sunday was spraying his shot on goal, not burning Spargo. 

[WalkingCivilWar 39,264]

9 minutes ago, JimmyGadson said:

Yes. 

We can see that those like you who think it's ridiculous he's being singled out is because he's one of 'your favourites'. 

#PatronisingMuch???

[layzie 32,869]

Sorry but I'm not buying this 'being caught in two minds' crap. A good forward always has the ability to see a wide open man ahead of him in a better position. Yes you need a little greed as a forward but some of these burns are really really bad and have a worse effect than people think. I will admit the media scrutiny has been over the top and that this happens everywhere but I don't care about everywhere I care about here. 

[Jaded No More 67,671]

43 minutes ago, JimmyGadson said:

Yes. 

We can see that those like you who think it's ridiculous he's being singled out is because he's one of 'your favourites'. 

It's got nothing to do with him being a favourite.

I just think he is being singled out for ridiculous reasons. 

Is Pickett selfish if he tries to kick a goal from the pocket? Is Trac selfish for attempting a set shot when he's generally really poor at them? Is it selfish of Oliver to try a blind handball? Is May selfish if he tries marking the footy at FB instead of punching the ball?

These guys make hundreds of split second decisions in the heat of battle. Everyone was so mad at Tmac for  marking Harmes' shot on goal earlier this year, but would have been angrier if that kick bounces in front of the line. 

How often do you yell "just go for goal" because we try passing it inside 50 and stuff around with it so much?

Fritsch is an elite medium forward. He has proven himself time and time again and delivered a performance not seen for a decade in a grand final. So he chose not to handball inside 50 a couple of times. Lets hang him for it and make all our players perfect robots. 

Everyone loves him when he kicks great goals. He is an opportunistic forward and sometimes he will make poor decisions. He is hardly alone. 

 

Edit: as for the media, please give me a break. Two weeks ago Ginnivin is a ducking cheat. This week he's being robbed of free kicks. The media are a bunch of flogs trying to feel space with rubbish. 

Edited July 18, 2022 by Jaded No More

[Winners at last 5,158]

18 hours ago, deegirl said:

Fritsch is a hard player to love and this is one of the big reasons why.  And yes, I'm well aware of how valuable he is, but he's never going to be a favourite of mine.

Au contraire ... I love him.

[layzie 32,869]

29 minutes ago, Jaded No More said:

It's got nothing to do with him being a favourite.

I just think he is being singled out for ridiculous reasons. 

Is Pickett selfish if he tries to kick a goal from the pocket? Is Trac selfish for attempting a set shot when he's generally really poor at them? Is it selfish of Oliver to try a blind handball? Is May selfish if he tries marking the footy at FB instead of punching the ball?

These guys make hundreds of split second decisions in the heat of battle. Everyone was so mad at Tmac for  marking Harmes' shot on goal earlier this year, but would have been angrier if that kick bounces in front of the line. 

How often do you yell "just go for goal" because we try passing it inside 50 and stuff around with it so much?

Fritsch is an elite medium forward. He has proven himself time and time again and delivered a performance not seen for a decade in a grand final. So he chose not to handball inside 50 a couple of times. Lets hang him for it and make all our players perfect robots. 

Everyone loves him when he kicks great goals. He is an opportunistic forward and sometimes he will make poor decisions. He is hardly alone. 

 

Edit: as for the media, please give me a break. Two weeks ago Ginnivin is a ducking cheat. This week he's being robbed of free kicks. The media are a bunch of flogs trying to feel space with rubbish. 

The key thing I take from your post Jaded is that whatever you do, be decisive. Eg, I'm going to mark this, I'm going to kick this and not have one bit of indecisiveness about it. If it doesn't work then fine but it's easier to fix the slight selfish issues than a confidence issue. So I do give credit for this.

I don't have an issue with Fritsch going for goal if he believes it's gettable, there's been plenty of times where he has dobbed the goal and I've turned around to whoever and said "He had to kick that because player X was open" but this isn't a bad thing because it shows a guy who isn't afraid to take it on himself. It's a better problem to have than a Joe Daniher looking to give off a handball when he was brought in to kick goals.

The issue has also been massively amplified because all of these instances come when goals seem to be at a real premium for the team and we badly need one. We're having enough trouble scoring right now as it is and yes Bailey probably cops it a little harshly as a result because yes, he is our leading goal kicker and at some moments he seems like our only avenue to goal. 

All I want is if a teammate is in a much better position for him to see that. The Spargo one was this in a nutshell for me. 

 

 

Edited July 18, 2022 by layzie

[mo64 5,491]

Firstly, if there is an opposition player between you and your teammate, then the player with the ball still has to weight their kick or handball perfectly. In the Langdon instance, it was more difficult for Fritsch to pass the ball to Langdon than to take the shot. It would require a 10 metre lob across his body and over Menegola. He just miskicked his dribble kick.  In the Spargo instance, he just backed himself to kick the goal, which is his role. The Trac one was the only instance where he should be criticised, as Trac was clearly in his vision with no opposition player in between.

It wouldn't be hard to dig up instances of player X having a running shot from 50m with teammates open in front of him. Guys like Dangerfield and Trac do it all the time, but I'm sure their coaches encourage them to back their abilities and instincts, even though it may be the lower percentage option.

Personally, I'm glad we have a player with the hunger and confidence to kick goals. Fritsch is invaluable to the team. 

Edited July 19, 2022 by mo64