1 hour ago, Dwight Schrute said:

In 5 years is Luke Jackson a ruckman or a key forward? 

Anything he wants to be I’d say

13 minutes ago, mo64 said:

The 1st time I heard the "unicorn" tag it was used to describe draftee NBA player Kristaps Porzingis. He was drafted no.4 overall as a 7 ft 3 centre, but what made him a unicorn was his ability to shoot 3 pointers. Had a great start to his career, but after 7 seasons he's now at his 3rd club. He's had his share of big scoring games and his share of injuries, but the biggest criticism of him is that he doesn't do what is expected of a big man in the NBA. He's not a good rebounder and doesn't use his size to be a good defender. The "unicorn" tag was all hype.

This brings me to Jackson. His greatest strength as a big man is his ability at ground level. That's why he's tagged as a "unicorn". He's a developing ruckman, and I think he can become an elite tap ruckman, in the Nik Nat mould. If he reaches Nik Nat's standards, that puts him in the elite ruckman status. But as a big, I'd say he's a poor mark even for his age. I thought he took a big step last year with his marking, but has regressed this year.

So how do people project his career, and his impact on the team, regardless of whether he stays or goes. For the next potentially 3-5 years, he'll be playing 2nd fiddle to Max or Darcy.

IMO, he can only earn the "unicorn" tag if he becomes an elite contested mark.

First time I heard was with Giannis… 

Swings and roundabouts…

4 minutes ago, rpfc said:

First time I heard was with Giannis… 

Swings and roundabouts…

But Giannis is a great rebounder and rim protector. The initial criticism on him was his inconsistent shooting. But the "unicorn" tag is fitting for Giannis.

1 hour ago, layzie said:

Pretty much exactly how I would have expected the club to act with him right now. 

The club hasn't really got a choice ... when a player leaves the club typically find out in trade week not in the lead up to finals so they have to wait anyhow

54 minutes ago, Demonstone said:

He certainly was an individual!   

 

Uhm, thanks?

I’d forgotten how god-awful this was. 
Was happy to have forgotten. 
Am now on Day One of building up another forgetting of it. 

1 hour ago, Demon17 said:

Exactky what kane Cornes thinks also.

Again this week he said LJ is NOT what Freo needs.

He's  not a forward, has no forward craft, he's a No.1 ruck.  They have Darcy, a 24 year old star, why do they want Luke.?

1. Darcy loves an injury 

2. Darcy is a good set shot and a good clunk marker. I think he’s well ahead of Gawn for forward craft at the same age. Key forwards are getting harder to find. If you can have 2 rucks you don’t need 2 gun key forwards.

3. Jacko is seriously special around the ground. We haven’t seen it all that often because our game plan is stodgy at times but Freo like to open it up and then Luke can run rucks off their feet and open up the corridor as an extra mid. He can do the stuff Blicavs does for Geelong.

4. LJ’s excellent start to his career has hidden his rate of development and potential for growth. There’s a risk he gets a bit Grundy like and stalls or regresses. But look at Tim English, after years of getting man handled the lights have gone on this year and he’s killing them. Age wise, Jacko shouldn’t even have debuted!

3 hours ago, old55 said:

Freo's 1st, Treacy and Meek - we could do worse ...

Meek won’t be part of the deal 

Nathan Wilson apparently looking at options. Would we have any interest? 

3 hours ago, Redleg said:

 

I know this could sound silly, but I just wonder if the club sees some deficiencies in LJ's game and accept that at some stage he would like to go home and see this as an opportunity to solve our key forward and ruck issues, by perhaps getting a key forward and ruck from Freo, plus a pick good enough to get another key forward in the draft.

That could end up 3 players for one, who are all best 22 for us.

 

The problem with that idea is best 22 AFL rucks and key forwards that fit within our system are incredibly rare. Jacko is one. I’ve said repeatedly that I think McStay would be one. Jack Gunston would be too. Lobb would, but we don’t seem interested.

Everyone else after that is a prospect. Meek’s a nice one, but he might not fit with Gawn, similar to big Preussy (if less eccentric). He might be Max’s back up not Max’s partner. Treacy’s a nice depth option.

Once Luke announces he wants to go I think Freo will negotiate hard but eventually put something like the Lever or Hogan deal on the table. 2 firsts. Or a good first and a second. We’ll then have to accept it and do the best we can. It might take 12-24 months to actually target and land the Jackson replacement, yet alone the Brown/Macca key forward we need.

Good to see Luke celebrating Brayshaw's signing:

 

The unicorn was part of Scotland's coinage between 1484 and 1525. We also had a half unicorn. I think Rod Stewart might've been our first unicorn millionaire. 

39 minutes ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

I’d forgotten how god-awful this was. 

You'll be thrilled to know that I still have the 7" single.  It hasn't been near a turntable for some decades now.

23 minutes ago, Demons11 said:

Meek won’t be part of the deal 

Nor should he.

29 minutes ago, Dwight Schrute said:

Nathan Wilson apparently looking at options. Would we have any interest? 

He is a good quality half back. I think he is quick and can kick

But not exactly a key need for us

2 hours ago, mo64 said:

The 1st time I heard the "unicorn" tag it was used to describe draftee NBA player Kristaps Porzingis. He was drafted no.4 overall as a 7 ft 3 centre, but what made him a unicorn was his ability to shoot 3 pointers. Had a great start to his career, but after 7 seasons he's now at his 3rd club. He's had his share of big scoring games and his share of injuries, but the biggest criticism of him is that he doesn't do what is expected of a big man in the NBA. He's not a good rebounder and doesn't use his size to be a good defender. The "unicorn" tag was all hype.

This brings me to Jackson. His greatest strength as a big man is his ability at ground level. That's why he's tagged as a "unicorn". He's a developing ruckman, and I think he can become an elite tap ruckman, in the Nik Nat mould. If he reaches Nik Nat's standards, that puts him in the elite ruckman status. But as a big, I'd say he's a poor mark even for his age. I thought he took a big step last year with his marking, but has regressed this year.

So how do people project his career, and his impact on the team, regardless of whether he stays or goes. For the next potentially 3-5 years, he'll be playing 2nd fiddle to Max or Darcy.

IMO, he can only earn the "unicorn" tag if he becomes an elite contested mark.

Porzingus got injured and it curtailed his career. The trajectory of his decline - coincides with his ACL. Outside of the label ‘unicorn’, you cannot compare the two. Jackson isn’t solely a ruck, in the way Porzigus is solely a center with the ability to shoot outside. Jackson can play forward, mid, back, ruck. He could play any of those positions. It’s only due to size that he’s tabbed as a ruckman, and to be fair, his craft as a ruck appears to hold up in big pressure games. That ability to push the ball forward, tackle hard, and link as a midfielder - is a set of skills that stands up when the pressure is on.

But outside of the media label, Jackson Is no unicorn. He is simply a big, raw, versatile young lad, who has a set of skills that stand up well in big games, where pressure and momentum are at a premium. Jackson will resign with us, and we’ll be lucky that he does. We won’t afford his next signature. And that is fine too. 

Edited July 28, 20223 yr by KingDingAling

1 hour ago, DeeSpencer said:

The problem with that idea is best 22 AFL rucks and key forwards that fit within our system are incredibly rare. Jacko is one. I’ve said repeatedly that I think McStay would be one. Jack Gunston would be too. Lobb would, but we don’t seem interested.

Everyone else after that is a prospect. Meek’s a nice one, but he might not fit with Gawn, similar to big Preussy (if less eccentric). He might be Max’s back up not Max’s partner. Treacy’s a nice depth option.

Once Luke announces he wants to go I think Freo will negotiate hard but eventually put something like the Lever or Hogan deal on the table. 2 firsts. Or a good first and a second. We’ll then have to accept it and do the best we can. It might take 12-24 months to actually target and land the Jackson replacement, yet alone the Brown/Macca key forward we need.

We don’t have to accept any Freo offer, that’s the point.

A player we get, might be better than our current option and then is best 22. Doesn’t necessarily have to be a star. As an example, Larkey of the Roos is no star, but is better than our current options.

1 hour ago, Demons11 said:

Meek won’t be part of the deal 

Do you say that from knowledge, or just opinion?

4 minutes ago, Redleg said:

Do you say that from knowledge, or just opinion?

Just an opinion.

I don’t think there is much value attached to him, so I can’t see him forming part of the deal 

Edited July 28, 20223 yr by Demons11

1 hour ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

Uhm, thanks?

I’d forgotten how god-awful this was. 
Was happy to have forgotten. 
Am now on Day One of building up another forgetting of it. 

good luck, wcw.  it's definitely worthy of forgetting but difficult to erase such disturbing images once having seen them

1 hour ago, Rab D Nesbitt said:

The unicorn was part of Scotland's coinage between 1484 and 1525. We also had a half unicorn. I think Rod Stewart might've been our first unicorn millionaire. 

if only he was really scottish of course, rab

23 minutes ago, KingDingAling said:

Porzingus got injured and it curtailed his career. The trajectory of his decline - coincides with his ACL. Outside of the label ‘unicorn’, you cannot compare the two. Jackson isn’t solely a ruck, in the way Porzigus is solely a center with the ability to shoot outside. Jackson can play forward, mid, back, ruck. He could play any of those positions. It’s only due to size that he’s tabbed as a ruckman, and to be fair, his craft as a ruck appears to hold up in big pressure games. That ability to push the ball forward, tackle hard, and link as a midfielder - is a set of skills that stands up when the pressure is on.

But outside of the media label, Jackson Is no unicorn. He is simply a big, raw, versatile young lad, who has a set of skills that stand up well in big games, where pressure and momentum are at a premium. Jackson will resign with us, and we’ll be lucky that he does. We won’t afford his next signature. And that is fine too. 

Jackson hasn't demonstrated at AFL level that he can play forward, mid or back at an elite level. If he was even a capable forward, it would ease a lot of our current woes through injury.

14 minutes ago, daisycutter said:

if only he was really scottish of course, rab

His dad was from Leith but he was born down south which is hardy his fault, to be fair. 

21 minutes ago, Demons11 said:

Just an opinion.

I don’t think there is much value attached to him, so I can’t see him forming part of the deal 

Isn't that why his new nickname is "Steak Knives"?

1 minute ago, Rab D Nesbitt said:

His dad was from Leith but he was born down south which is hardy his fault, to be fair. 

but his mum was english and he spent most of his life in england. i also know many scots think he's a faux scot.

but let's be generous and say he is one of your referenced rare half-unicorns 😁

7 minutes ago, mo64 said:

Jackson hasn't demonstrated at AFL level that he can play forward, mid or back at an elite level. If he was even a capable forward, it would ease a lot of our current woes through injury.

In all fairness, Key Forwards or rucks even rarely have an impact in their first few years. Jackson has had an impact more in the ruck but has done a little damage up forward (well short of what we'd like obviously). His game time is also quite low compared to others, which begs a question around fitness.