The interesting thing with Gaff would be whether the Eagles have made him an offer. If they have and he is just ignoring it, I think he is gone.If his Manager is negotiating with the Eagles then I think he will stay. If the Eagles haven't made him an offer, then they either realize he is going, or are just stupid.

If you want to keep a player, you make them an offer and start negotiating. A failure to do so is a negative sign to the player.

On the same note, I hope we are in negotiations with Gus and Oscar.

1 hour ago, Dee93 said:

Am I overplaying our weaknesses/should we persist with who we have? Is Gaff overrated?

Polec would be another one who'd be great to get, but seeing as he's actually from Adelaide can't see him leaving Port.

Gotta give up quality to get quality. If we traded Hogan and got Gaff + a lower pick/player it would be a win imo**

 

Thanks for your thoughts Adam...

If you are thinking of trading Hogan in a deal for a free agent then you are highly overrating Gaff.

A few might also be overrating Tommy Mac if they think we could do without Hogan.

18 hours ago, Dee93 said:

It's probably not a popular idea, but I'd seriously consider including Hogan in a trade for Gaff (assuming WC matched any offer as a restricted free agent).

Hogan is a jet who every club would love to have and I don't want to lose. But seeing us get chopped up by Hawthorn & Collingwood then losing to the bloody Saints at the 'G highlights our glaring, recurrent deficiencies on the outside. Even when we smashed the doggies at Etihad we were made to look slow and second rate in that area, which makes me slightly worried about this weekend (I still think we'll get up given they're pretty undermanned).

It seems like currently we're relying on the below few to provide outside run and ball use:
Neal-Bullen - tries harder than anyone but is really a B/C grader. His turnovers in the forward half can kill momentum
Harmes (increasingly outside) - playing well, but still lacks a bit of polish. Do rate though
Fritsch - classy, but more half forward
Salem - classy, but more half back
Stretch - played decently last week, but is he gonna make it?

Our fortunes this year have proved that winning contested ball and relying on grunt/effort/"bullying" opposition around the ball isn't gonna get us to a flag. We still haven't made finals and look set to miss again, which is annoying because we have such a good list still.

When we lose, we look absolutely nowhere near it in terms of speed and spread - any team is capable of showing us up in this area on their day. And the lack of quality ball use contributes to the horrendous going inside 50 efficiency seen this year. Our outside issues are always exacerbated at the G given its size; the "pinball" crash and bash style on a smaller ground suits us better now, and we're a serious team at Etihad. But we've gotta align our game plan and personnel to our home ground and the ground where finals are played, when we finally do make it. I think we really need to re-assess and restructure to move forward, it's not just "choking" or mental weakness that's holding us back at the moment.

Given the above list consists mainly of fringe players or flankers, we surely need to prioritise either developing or getting in a quality player who can play 100%/majority of the game in the midfield. Gaff is probably one of the fittest players in the comp and racks up huge numbers on the wing. Don't know his efficiency stats, but seems to rarely turn it over. Type of player aside, he's a past best and fairest winner & All Australian, and on track to make it again this year, sitting equal 3rd in Brownlow betting @ $9 (with Gawn). He's out of contract, Victorian and a Dees supporter growing up (which probably counts for nothing).

With Hogan there's always been the "go home" worry and currently he's only contracted for one more year (I think?). Right now he'd be at premium trade value - 23 and having his best season yet, until recently I reckon was on track for All Australian this year himself. With Kennedy nearing the end you'd think WC especially would be very keen. 

From our point of view, we'd have to back Tommy Mac to stay fit and Weidemann developing/Smith/someone else filling 2nd key forward post. Think this is less important than having the right midfield mix though, and less important in the game generally than it used to be anyway.

Am I overplaying our weaknesses/should we persist with who we have? Is Gaff overrated?

Polec would be another one who'd be great to get, but seeing as he's actually from Adelaide can't see him leaving Port.

Gotta give up quality to get quality. If we traded Hogan and got Gaff + a lower pick/player it would be a win imo**

 

**Just realised probably don't even need to trade players if restricted FA, so if so ignore Hogan comments! Regardless, crux of the post is I support getting Gaff!

Well written/thought out post Dee93. Not sure I agree though. WC is the perfect team for Gaff. Not sure that he'd be as good at MFC. Also he's a few years older than Hogan. 

18 hours ago, Redleg said:

The interesting thing with Gaff would be whether the Eagles have made him an offer. If they have and he is just ignoring it, I think he is gone.If his Manager is negotiating with the Eagles then I think he will stay. If the Eagles haven't made him an offer, then they either realize he is going, or are just stupid.

If you want to keep a player, you make them an offer and start negotiating. A failure to do so is a negative sign to the player.

On the same note, I hope we are in negotiations with Gus and Oscar.

They did last month.

31 minutes ago, McQueen said:

They did last month.

Ok.

So the question now is if he is in negotiations with them. If not, IMO he is gone.

If it is big money offered by the Eagles and for 6 years and he is not even negotiating, then he clearly wants out.

If he was staying, you would think he would be locked away by now, given the Eagles offer was more than 3 weeks ago or you would hear that they are close to a deal. 

2 minutes ago, Redleg said:

Ok.

So the question now is if he is in negotiations with them. If not, IMO he is gone.

If it is big money offered by the Eagles and for 6 years and he is not even negotiating, then he clearly wants out.

If he was staying, you would think he would be locked away by now, given the Eagles offer was more than 3 weeks ago or you would hear that they are close to a deal. 

We're going to find it difficult to match an RFA offer of that magnitude if true. Two first rounders for Lever has 'hamstrung' our trade hand as well so we're up against it.

19 hours ago, rjay said:

Thanks for your thoughts Adam...

If you are thinking of trading Hogan in a deal for a free agent then you are highly overrating Gaff.

A few might also be overrating Tommy Mac if they think we could do without Hogan.

Exactly

22 hours ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Donald J Trump han an opinion on everything worldwide, that is shoved down our throats daily. 

Opinions can be very dangerous in the wrong hands. 

Did Pres Trump mention Gaff playing with us next year, or did the Russians sign him already?

11 minutes ago, Satyriconhome said:

Exactly

Opinionhome, can you tell me if Gaff is staying or going ?

I'm keen to know in advance.

4 minutes ago, faultydet said:

Did Pres Trump mention Gaff playing with us next year, or did the Russians sign him already?

We should find out on Monday Faulty

although the news could be fake...

not sure why posters talking of trades wrt to gaff

the big attraction to us is that he is an rfa and trade free

yeah, i know weagles could match offer and then it's trade time, but if it came to that we would not be interested

matching a six year deal with some form of loading (front or back who knows) would be a challenge for any club.

BTW I heard the Hawks football manager on 3AW saying that Cyril Rioli's would not be in their salary cap next year as he had retired. Understandable but it does open the cap up to some manipulation. A retirement job at Visy or similar perhaps. Not suggesting that was the case for Cyril.

32 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

matching a six year deal with some form of loading (front or back who knows) would be a challenge for any club.

BTW I heard the Hawks football manager on 3AW saying that Cyril Rioli's would not be in their salary cap next year as he had retired. Understandable but it does open the cap up to some manipulation. A retirement job at Visy or similar perhaps. Not suggesting that was the case for Cyril.

one doesn't have to match weagles offer. it is the other way around.

player first nominates (say) melbourne. melbourne offer 4 years at 800k. weagles then have to match that offer.

my reading is they have to match both years and amount per year.....or of course exceed them

i.e. i don't think 6 years at 600k matches or exceeds even though total amount is greater (3.6m vs 3.2m)

i could be wrong.......anyone have more info?

11 minutes ago, daisycutter said:

one doesn't have to match weagles offer. it is the other way around.

player first nominates (say) melbourne. melbourne offer 4 years at 800k. weagles then have to match that offer.

my reading is they have to match both years and amount per year.....or of course exceed them

i.e. i don't think 6 years at 600k matches or exceeds even though total amount is greater (3.6m vs 3.2m)

i could be wrong.......anyone have more info?

Yep, match means match. You offer exactly the same or better. 

11 touches and a goal in the third quarter. Lifted the Eagles to a 22 point lead at 3/4 time. Should be our number one target. 

1 minute ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

11 touches and a goal in the third quarter. Lifted the Eagles to a 22 point lead at 3/4 time. Should be our number one target. 

just an accumulator. no impact.

3 minutes ago, daisycutter said:

just an accumulator. no impact.

It’s all about opinions chap. 

Edited July 15, 20186 yr by Ethan Tremblay

Please tell me we are getting this guy.

On 7/13/2018 at 7:32 AM, McQueen said:

Saty, my post was trying to reference your incredible ability to call on ‘potential outcomes’ after they’ve actually happened - as with Sloane. If it makes you feel better, then I’m happy for you.

Have a great day.

Sloane's no good anyway, he's never won a B&F or been All Australian.

8 minutes ago, FireInTheBelly said:

Sloane's no good anyway, he's never won a B&F or been All Australian.

another accumulator

Haven't seen much of Gaff...but watching the Weagles today he looked to go ok ? Is that his normal fare ?

3 hours ago, beelzebub said:

Haven't seen much of Gaff...but watching the Weagles today he looked to go ok ? Is that his normal fare ?

Not his usual 40+ game bub. Only a lazy 30, equal game high. So he's even slipping as an accumulator! 

Second or third rounder should do it if Weagles match offer

Don't want the chap.  Just an accumulator, goes missing when the going gets tough, and my next door neighbour claims he should never have won a best and fairest, even though I'm pretty sure he's never won one.

Pass.

From one of the commentators over the weekend (sorry can't remember which one, but it may have been Gerard Healy) was that with the money the Eagles had offered Gaff he'd be financially irresponsible to stay.

I think they're probably pretty keen to get the other McGovern who apparently definitely wants out of the Crows - so that limits what they can pay Gaff whose compensation they would need to help get McGovern.

Edited July 15, 20186 yr by grazman

2 minutes ago, grazman said:

From one of the commentators over the weekend (sorry can't remember which one, but it may have been Gerard Healy) was that with the money the Eagles had offered Gaff he'd be financially irresponsible to stay.

Do you mean stay or go?

How the f would Healy know?