The Ox says the Dees in danger ....

[John Crow Batty 8,305]

9 hours ago, Fork 'em said:

 
Wasted his own career and blew his coin more concerned with getting on the punt.
Now just babbling BS to earn a crust.

I would suggest a little unfair to say he wasted his career. He was flying high before his multiple knee reconstructions and was still serviceable in between. Unfair also to deflect into his personal problems. If he kept his knees in good shape he would have been arguably better than Wayne Carey and we know about his personal issues. He was the best Melbourne player I have witnessed pre injuries. He was the type of player that if fully fit could have delivered us premierships.

Edited December 4, 2017 by america de cali

[BAMF 3,809]

Jeez you guys are a bunch of haters.

Loved watching the Ox. I like listening to his opinion but take it as just that. An opinion from one individual. I don't always agree.

[Fork 'em 6,572]

14 hours ago, america de cali said:

I would suggest a little unfair to say he wasted his career. He was flying high before his multiple knee reconstructions and was still serviceable in between. Unfair also to deflect into his personal problems. If he kept his knees in good shape he would have been arguably better than Wayne Carey and we know about his personal issues. He was the best Melbourne player I have witnessed pre injuries. He was the type of player that if fully fit could have delivered us premierships.

Yeah, yeah I know all that.
Have you read his book?

Much of the time he was more concerned who won race4 than what was happening on the ground.
Football was just a means to pay his gambling bills.
That's all.

 

Edited December 5, 2017 by Fork 'em

[rjay 24,046]

On 02/12/2017 at 10:28 AM, DaveyDee said:

The more you spend the closer to a flag you are. The big spenders in this area are Geelong, Hawthorn, Sydney, Adelaide, West Coast, Colingwood, Essendon & in recent years Richmond - do you recognise a pattern there? 

The only pattern I can see is that Hawthorn, Sydney (early in the season), West Coast & Collingwood all had a bad run of injuries that effected their season 2017.

...and if you didn't slip in Richmond as an after thought, none of them have won a flag in the last 2 years.

Do I win the prize?

edit: I don't think any of these clubs will win a flag in 2018 and that makes some of them with older lists much further from a flag than they would like.

Edited December 5, 2017 by rjay

[DaveyDee 421]

21 minutes ago, rjay said:

The only pattern I can see is that Hawthorn, Sydney (early in the season), West Coast & Collingwood all had a bad run of injuries that effected their season 2017.

...and if you didn't slip in Richmond as an after thought, none of them have won a flag in the last 2 years.

Do I win the prize?

edit: I don't think any of these clubs will win a flag in 2018 and that makes some of them with older lists much further from a flag than they would like.

Yes you win the prize for short term thinking - well done. Football department spending is a long-term investment - Now instead of thinking over one year, look over the last few decades. 

FYI Richmond was not an after thought - they have been late to the party in FD spending due to similar reasons to us. But while we were paying off debt they elected to invest inside there Footy Department and reduce debt at a slower rate. 

[rjay 24,046]

34 minutes ago, DaveyDee said:

Yes you win the prize for short term thinking - well done. Football department spending is a long-term investment - Now instead of thinking over one year, look over the last few decades. 

FYI Richmond was not an after thought - they have been late to the party in FD spending due to similar reasons to us. But while we were paying off debt they elected to invest inside there Footy Department and reduce debt at a slower rate. 

I just don't understand your point.

All clubs spend on FD but there is a cap on that spending.

If you are trying to say our injury list is because we don't spend enough on the FD then I think you are way off the mark.

'Chazz' sums it up for me...

On 04/12/2017 at 2:09 PM, The Chazz said:

Interesting, would love to read the paper on this "very, very strong theory".

I'm sure there would be a connection to sport science and a pattern of soft tissue injuries.  However, if you have a look at a lot of our injuries in 2017, I can't really see any pattern in terms of a flood of hamstrings, or calves, etc.  Jones had his quad, Watts his hammy, Viney's plantar, Jesse's testicular cancer, Gawn's hammy, Gus' concussions, Salem's thyroid, Kent's shoulder, etc etc (Vanders, Spencer, Smith x 2).

I think 2017 was just one of those crap years for us on the injury front.  How this could be put down to sport science is baffling.  But, given you have a clear issue with the amount we are spending in the football department, I expect you will have a different argument.

 

[The Chazz 4,077]

38 minutes ago, rjay said:

I just don't understand your point.

All clubs spend on FD but there is a cap on that spending.

If you are trying to say our injury list is because we don't spend enough on the FD then I think you are way off the mark.

'Chazz' sums it up for me...

 

It's getting to the stage where you just din't bother with this "DaveyDee", Rjay.  They continually bang on about how much (or little) we spend compared to other clubs, then as soon as they are challenged to provide some form of proof, they run away and bang on about the same topic in a different thread.

Collingwood is great proof that the quantity you invest into areas like Sport Science doesn't assure success, it's about the quality of the people you have at the club.  Same with the FD.  Do you have to pay more to get quality people?  Quite possibly, but Collingwood are paying a lot for minimal return.

But again, this doesn't help with "DeeDavey's" agenda, so don't expect a response.

Edited December 5, 2017 by The Chazz

[DaveyDee 421]

5 hours ago, rjay said:

I just don't understand your point.Not 

All clubs spend on FD but there is a cap on that spending.

If you are trying to say our injury list is because we don't spend enough on the FD then I think you are way off the mark.

'Chazz' sums it up for me...

 

I understand. All the best in you endeavors.   

I've been lucky I've been exposed to the inside of multiple AFL clubs - and I can see what they are doing right and wrong. 

But I share your passion for the Dees & hope one day we can learn from other clubs, implement what they do right and learn from their mistakes. But if you are only exposed to one club thats not so easy at times. 

I dont want to pick fights with the AFL, I accepted we are in a National competition and the importance of FD spending for all areas ie players development, injury prevention & management, player welfare, recruiting etc, etc

We have come a long way in a short time & long may it continue. We are a club committed to increase spending inside our footy department and long may that also continue. 

Go dees

[DaveyDee 421]

6 hours ago, rjay said:

I just don't understand your point.

All clubs spend on FD but there is a cap on that spending.

If you are trying to say our injury list is because we don't spend enough on the FD then I think you are way off the mark.

'Chazz' sums it up for me...

 

Oh and just for the record I accept FD spending is a long-term investment of 7-10 years. I also appreciate many MFC supporters want results today - best of luck. Many, many supporters cant think past the last game we played, at least you can think on a yearly basis which is credit to you. However, you dont win premierships thinking year to year. But feel free to disagree with that if you want. 

Edited December 6, 2017 by DaveyDee

[The Chazz 4,077]

43 minutes ago, DaveyDee said:

Oh and just for the record I accept FD spending is a long-term investment of 7-10 years. I also appreciate many MFC supporters want results today - best of luck. Many, many supporters cant think past the last game we played, at least you can think on a yearly basis which is credit to you. However, you dont win premierships thinking year to year. But feel free to disagree with that if you want. 

Where is this paper on the study/theory about larger sport science investment resulting in less injuries, which you claim is "very, very strong"?  You haven't provided it, which makes me wonder if it's something you made up.

Also, where's your reply about the amount Collingwood have invested over a larger period than 7-10 years?  How have they been travelling, especially in the last 5 years?

And you've been "lucky" to be exposed to the inside of multiple AFL clubs.  Really?  Do us a favour, say g'day to your Uncle Cameron, Craig or Barry (whichever one it is) for us.

[DaveyDee 421]

1 hour ago, The Chazz said:

Where is this paper on the study/theory about larger sport science investment resulting in less injuries, which you claim is "very, very strong"?  You haven't provided it, which makes me wonder if it's something you made up.

Also, where's your reply about the amount Collingwood have invested over a larger period than 7-10 years?  How have they been travelling, especially in the last 5 years?

And you've been "lucky" to be exposed to the inside of multiple AFL clubs.  Really?  Do us a favour, say g'day to your Uncle Cameron, Craig or Barry (whichever one it is) for us.

Ahhh Chazz just came across your post - Thank-you for your personally attack on me. 

But last time I saw BP that was on draft night at the North Melbourne table and before that at the Carlton table - geez he must be doing something right. Im happy with BP - no animosity from me, no abuse and vitriol from me on or offline. 

Last time I saw CC he was sitting with the Gold Coast boys, before that the GWS boys and before that the Richmond boys - geez he must be doing something right, especially now Gold Coast is under AFL control.  Im happy with CC - no animosity from me, no abuse and vitriol from me on or offline. 

Im sorry I can learn things from other clubs and people - I respect the position of head of football at all clubs, I respect the position of head of recruiting at all clubs, I respect the postion of head of junior development at all clubs. 

Football is not an exact science - you are dealing with human beings - I'm sorry I respect that fact. Do they get everything right - dont think so. 

But on draft night just out of interest - What table were you sitting on?

And if you every do get the chance to meet them - Im sure you will share your animosity, abuse and vitriol towards them - or will you? 

Personally, I cant change the past - so I dont even bother wasting my time thinking about it. I will leave that up to you. 

Personally, I like the way we are heading as a football club, AFL "recommended" CEO, AFL "approved" board, we are happy to increase our spending inside our footy department and rebuild a positive vibrant culture free of politics - geez I could not ask for any more. 

I'm sorry, I dont share the same views as you. 

Go Dees

Edited December 6, 2017 by DaveyDee

[Sir Why You Little 34,924]

1 hour ago, DaveyDee said:

 

And if you every do get the chance to meet them - Im sure you will share your animosity, abuse and vitriol towards them 

I would most certainly give them both barrels

they almost collectively killed the club

F$&@ing Amateurs....

[DaveyDee 421]

43 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

I would most certainly give them both barrels

they almost collectively killed the club

F$&@ing Amateurs....

Not a problem for me - in the past I've seen and heard many people give both our current & past employees "both barrels" but giving somebody "both barrels" when you come from outside a club can be somewhat interesting - I'm not sure you actually get your point across or find out why they made the decisions they did. 

But each to there own - I'm happy with the AFL, I'm happy with the direction of the MFC, I can live with the decisions of the past, I might not like the outcomes - but that is life. Thanks to the time of many people I have went and sought out or they have come to me in football Im content with the direction we are heading. Sure, I also appreciate people want a flag in 2018 and Im happy to hope for that also. 

I found AFL football is a tough game - we have good football people who give their best both past and present. 

Oh and just for the record - I like the direction Demonland is heading, those podcasts are outstanding.  

Edited December 6, 2017 by DaveyDee

[DaveyDee 421]

1 hour ago, Sir Why You Little said:

I would most certainly give them both barrels

they almost collectively killed the club

F$&@ing Amateurs....

I also forgot to mention - for your benefit

I could not give a f who we play

I could not give a f where we play 

I could not give a f at what time we play

I could not give a f what we wear when we play. 

But feel free to give the club "both barrels" on any of the above topics  

For me what i do care about 

I care about how much money we are speading inside our football department

- so we can develop our players

-  we can help prevent or treat injuries

-  we understand our player welfare needs,

- we can support our players both past and present 

- when it comes to recruiting in both drafting and trading we understand the players and assess their "coachability" with our coaching staff. 

But unlike you, when asked by Mr Jackson I dont want to talk about negative subjects, I want to build a whole new positive culture at the MFC. 

Go Dees

Edited December 6, 2017 by DaveyDee

[Sir Why You Little 34,924]

1 hour ago, DaveyDee said:

I also forgot to mention - for your benefit

I could not give a f who we play

I could not give a f where we play 

I could not give a f at what time we play

I could not give a f what we wear when we play. 

But feel free to give the club "both barrels" on any of the above topics  

For me what i do care about 

I care about how much money we are speading inside our football department

- so we can develop our players

-  we can help prevent or treat injuries

-  we understand our player welfare needs,

- we can support our players both past and present 

- when it comes to recruiting in both drafting and trading we understand the players and assess their "coachability" with our coaching staff. 

But unlike you, when asked by Mr Jackson I dont want to talk about negative subjects, I want to build a whole new positive culture at the MFC. 

Go Dees

You do work for the AFL

No doubt about it

it does matter where we play

For both Members and Sponsors....

The NT deal hurts even tho the $$$ is the cow. 

Dr. Who you treat people here, like 6 year old children. It is becoming irksome

[DaveyDee 421]

3 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

You do work for the AFL

No doubt about it

it does matter where we play

For both Members and Sponsors....

The NT deal hurts even tho the $$$ is the cow. 

Dr. Who you treat people here, like 6 year old children. It is becoming irksome

Why, you support that idiot Bartlett on SEN, I can see why the station is going bust with idiots like that on the radio. I must confess he does think like a 6 year old child. 

I could not give a f where we play, when we play, who we play and what we wear when we play - as I said I leave that up to you to worry about. If it matters that much to you - go for it - give the "both" barrels. Ironically - You are starting to sound like a ex-CEO we had but today big boy its a whole new ball game. But I was happy to tell the last CEO I dont want to get involved in politics and picking fights with the AFL - I want what the AFL want. 

I care about our players - if we win - why great lets do more of that, if we lose why - lets do less of that but there is always next week. 

[The Chazz 4,077]

4 hours ago, DaveyDee said:

Ahhh Chazz just came across your post - Thank-you for your personally attack on me. 

But last time I saw BP that was on draft night at the North Melbourne table and before that at the Carlton table - geez he must be doing something right. Im happy with BP - no animosity from me, no abuse and vitriol from me on or offline. 

Last time I saw CC he was sitting with the Gold Coast boys, before that the GWS boys and before that the Richmond boys - geez he must be doing something right, especially now Gold Coast is under AFL control.  Im happy with CC - no animosity from me, no abuse and vitriol from me on or offline. 

Im sorry I can learn things from other clubs and people - I respect the position of head of football at all clubs, I respect the position of head of recruiting at all clubs, I respect the postion of head of junior development at all clubs. 

Football is not an exact science - you are dealing with human beings - I'm sorry I respect that fact. Do they get everything right - dont think so. 

But on draft night just out of interest - What table were you sitting on?

And if you every do get the chance to meet them - Im sure you will share your animosity, abuse and vitriol towards them - or will you? 

Personally, I cant change the past - so I dont even bother wasting my time thinking about it. I will leave that up to you. 

Personally, I like the way we are heading as a football club, AFL "recommended" CEO, AFL "approved" board, we are happy to increase our spending inside our footy department and rebuild a positive vibrant culture free of politics - geez I could not ask for any more. 

I'm sorry, I dont share the same views as you. 

Go Dees

WTF was that rambling?

I ask again, where's the paper on your sport science theory?

And your response to Collingwood's lack of success given their significantly higher investment in to the sport science area.

[DaveyDee 421]

34 minutes ago, The Chazz said:

WTF was that rambling?

I ask again, where's the paper on your sport science theory?

And your response to Collingwood's lack of success given their significantly higher investment in to the sport science area.

Chazz you need to do the work for yourself. I'm happy with the AFL, with the MFC and Demonland, I especially like the removal of the AFL media filter and talking direct to MFC staff both past and present - IMHO all are doing a good job. 

[The Chazz 4,077]

7 hours ago, DaveyDee said:

Chazz you need to do the work for yourself. I'm happy with the AFL, with the MFC and Demonland, I especially like the removal of the AFL media filter and talking direct to MFC staff both past and present - IMHO all are doing a good job. 

As expected. You make claims, stating them as facts, then when one challenges you, you tell them to "do the work yourself".

But to entertain you (and myself), I'm happy to find this study you speak of. But to save me a bit of time, would you mind telling me which professor did the study?

I, too, like Demonland. I'm going to like it a lot more now that you're on my ignore list. Good day.

[DaveyDee 421]

48 minutes ago, The Chazz said:

I, too, like Demonland. I'm going to like it a lot more now that you're on my ignore list. Good day.

Finally we have agreement - I too look forward to that day . Thank-you again for your personal attacks on me. 

[Its Time for Another 4,058]

4 hours ago, The Chazz said:

But to entertain you (and myself), I'm happy to find this study you speak of. But to save me a bit of time, would you mind telling me which professor did the study?

Chazz I think you're likely to find there are a lot of them. I suggest you be a bit careful about which ones you choose to rely on. For instance I'd probably steer away from any with the name S Dank. D Robinson is probably another that comes to mind to avoid. 

I like to rely on facts where I can. It's very clear from the Financial Report and it's notes that the Club is on to this.

We increased spending in the FD by about $450,000 last financial period and PJ says in the notes there will be a focus on spending more on the FD in the next year so the financial result won't be as positive as this year. Mahoney & Co have already shown they have a knack for assembling very strong people in the FD. McCartney & Jennings come to mind. I don't know the breakdown of the positions in the FD and who the Sports Medicine people are but I trust they are working to be cutting edge without being Hird cutting edge.

I just read that the Bulldogs increased their FD spending this year by $2.8mill  for AFL VFL AFLW. I might have our increase in FD spending wrong but that's how I read it and if so then it gives a bit of a comparison to one of the other small clubs. 

Edited December 7, 2017 by It's Time

[Sir Why You Little 34,924]

12 hours ago, DaveyDee said:

Why, you support that idiot Bartlett on SEN, I can see why the station is going bust with idiots like that on the radio. I must confess he does think like a 6 year old child. 

I could not give a f where we play, when we play, who we play and what we wear when we play - as I said I leave that up to you to worry about. If it matters that much to you - go for it - give the "both" barrels. Ironically - You are starting to sound like a ex-CEO we had but today big boy its a whole new ball game. But I was happy to tell the last CEO I dont want to get involved in politics and picking fights with the AFL - I want what the AFL want. 

I care about our players - if we win - why great lets do more of that, if we lose why - lets do less of that but there is always next week. 

You want what the AFL want

Best thing you have said. 

Now go away Doctor....

[DaveyDee 421]

2 hours ago, It's Time said:

Chazz I think you're likely to find there are a lot of them. I suggest you be a bit careful about which ones you choose to rely on. For instance I'd probably steer away from any with the name S Dank. D Robinson is probably another that comes to mind to avoid. 

I like to rely on facts where I can. It's very clear from the Financial Report and it's notes that the Club is on to this.

We increased spending in the FD by about $450,000 last financial period and PJ says in the notes there will be a focus on spending more on the FD in the next year so the financial result won't be as positive as this year. Mahoney & Co have already shown they have a knack for assembling very strong people in the FD. McCartney & Jennings come to mind. I don't know the breakdown of the positions in the FD and who the Sports Medicine people are but I trust they are working to be cutting edge without being Hird cutting edge.

I just read that the Bulldogs increased their FD spending this year by $2.8mill  for AFL VFL AFLW. I might have our increase in FD spending wrong but that's how I read it and if so then it gives a bit of a comparison to one of the other small clubs. 

Well said - Yes, "sports scientists" where AFL CEO Andrew Demetriou "pet hate" - I always listened to his warnings on them, AD was always happy to listen to us, but some at the MFC never want to listen to the AFL. I on the other hand support the AFL so I'm happy to listen to what they say. 

Yes, its also great to see Bulldogs and us increasing FD spending to the levels we are - makes me one happy little Demon. 

If it means we have to play games in Alice Springs - you will get no complaints from me if it means more money into our Footy Department. 

If it means we have to play games at 3.20 on a Sunday at Ethiad against whoever because thats what the AFL tell us to do - you will get no complaints from me. 

We have a bright future - at last we are getting a fair go from the AFL & the MFC, long may it continue. 

After we win a premiership, build our crowds, build our memberships, build our alternative revenue streams - Im sure things like fixtures, games in the Alice, clash guerseys can come back on the agenda. But I wont bother me where we play and against whom. 

Go Dees 

Edited December 7, 2017 by DaveyDee

[Demon trucker 1,779]

Stop

[Fork 'em 6,572]

19 hours ago, DaveyDee said:

  I want what the AFL want. 

 

So you want Richmond , Collingwood, Carlton and Essendon all regularly playing finals together.

Edited December 7, 2017 by Fork 'em