Farewell Jack Watts

[beelzebub 23,377]

12 hours ago, GCDee said:

Jesse has done more in 2 years than jack has in 7!

 

has he?  Can you elaborate ?

[Die Hard Demon 1,224]

19 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

they the ones wearing invisible cloaks ??

We play like a rudderless ship all too often.

Watts is far from perfect..I reckon hes got about 39 other mates in that category !!

That so MUCH is placed at his feet as being HIS fault..is laughable.

He's become EVERYONE'S whipping boy.

If I was Goody and Jones etc Id be shutting up big time. The buck doesnt stop with Jack.

Talk about not learning lessons and being hypocrites..fmd

Not saying our leadership on field is great .. but the spotlight doesn't seem to be on Watts for that .. He seems to be the ONLY guy over 25 who continues to disappoint off-field – which is what Jones is pointing out. Watts had one good season in 2016 .. then rocks up in 2017 out of shape acting like he's a millionaire with nothing left to prove. Sure .. He kicked the winning goal against the pies.. I can guarantee you he's the type of bloke to be satisfied that he's done enough for the year on the back of that. Hence why that seemed to be his peak for the whole season before he fell away badly. I'm sorry .. but he needs to go.

[GCDee 3,199]

4 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

has he?  Can you elaborate ?

Rising star

80+ goals in a bottom side

Clearly works his ass off to perform and return from injury.

 

My question to you if Watts was a pick 15+ would we have stuck by him all these years? No chance.

 

[Akum 2,660]

2 minutes ago, Die Hard Demon said:

Not saying our leadership on field is great .. but the spotlight doesn't seem to be on Watts for that .. He seems to be the ONLY guy over 25 who continues to disappoint off-field – which is what Jones is pointing out. Watts had one good season in 2016 .. then rocks up in 2017 out of shape acting like he's a millionaire with nothing left to prove. Sure .. He kicked the winning goal against the pies.. I can guarantee you he's the type of bloke to be satisfied that he's done enough for the year on the back of that. Hence why that seemed to be his peak for the whole season before he fell away badly. I'm sorry .. but he needs to go.

OK, you're perfectly welcome to bag Watts, that's your right. But when you state fiction as fact, that's another thing.

Whatever it was that Jack was disciplined for preseason, it wasn't that he was "out of shape" or "acting like a millionaire". The club stated that he wasn't doing some things right at training, and it's still vague about exactly what it was. I have my guesses just like you, but they're guesses.

And I can guarantee you that he is absolutely NOT the type of bloke who will be satisfied with ever having done enough.

I've become used to him being traded. What concerns me is that the club is pushing a narrative that all that's wrong with the team is a "lack of intensity" and they're starting to connect that with whatever Jack's done. In other words, trying to hide other problems with our lack of skill, inadequacies in our game plan, inability to counter when the other team closes us up.

But most of all in the latter part of the season there was a fear to take the game on that definitely wasn't there in the early part of the season when they were so fearless in "taking the game on" and attacking that they were prepared to persist even if it meant they conceded a few easy goals "out the back". I'd like to know where that enterprise, that fearlessness, vanished. It's as if they became scared to make mistakes, so tried to play within themselves in a number of games.

But it seems to me too easy to hint at lack of intensity and hint at Watts (and to some extent Salem who was also dropped after our really poor game against GWS) being the problem.

[Bitter but optimistic 22,241]

One thing's for certain.

If Jack does go, I'll be able to fit the full Dland home page on my I-phone 5.

With space to spare!

[Die Hard Demon 1,224]

7 minutes ago, Akum said:

OK, you're perfectly welcome to bag Watts, that's your right. But when you state fiction as fact, that's another thing.

Whatever it was that Jack was disciplined for preseason, it wasn't that he was "out of shape" or "acting like a millionaire". The club stated that he wasn't doing some things right at training, and it's still vague about exactly what it was. I have my guesses just like you, but they're guesses.

And I can guarantee you that he is absolutely NOT the type of bloke who will be satisfied with ever having done enough.

I've become used to him being traded. What concerns me is that the club is pushing a narrative that all that's wrong with the team is a "lack of intensity" and they're starting to connect that with whatever Jack's done. In other words, trying to hide other problems with our lack of skill, inadequacies in our game plan, inability to counter when the other team closes us up.

But most of all in the latter part of the season there was a fear to take the game on that definitely wasn't there in the early part of the season when they were so fearless in "taking the game on" and attacking that they were prepared to persist even if it meant they conceded a few easy goals "out the back". I'd like to know where that enterprise, that fearlessness, vanished. It's as if they became scared to make mistakes, so tried to play within themselves in a number of games.

But it seems to me too easy to hint at lack of intensity and hint at Watts (and to some extent Salem who was also dropped after our really poor game against GWS) being the problem.

Yes, sorry.. I'm only speculating with those remarks.

[DeeZone 9,846]

For me Jack is a Keeper, just need to strengthen his core and kick to him when he repeatedly finds space, the boys need to think quicker and kick cleaner.......................Go Dee's!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[beelzebub 23,377]

15 minutes ago, GCDee said:

My question to you if Watts was a pick 15+ would we have stuck by him all these years? No chance.

its an interesting question. If he was that pick15 + would we always be having these threads ?

Jack is what Jack is..  I dont for one moment think the club views him as Pick1 _Watts.   He's just Jack

[GCDee 3,199]

13 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

its an interesting question. If he was that pick15 + would we always be having these threads ?

Jack is what Jack is..  I dont for one moment think the club views him as Pick1 _Watts.   He's just Jack

No I don't think we would because he would have been de listed or traded after 4 years and forgotten very quickly

[binman 42,975]

1 hour ago, Fifty-5 said:

You've been pressing this line for ages - and it has happened - look at Ryan Ferguson for Brad Sewell.

But if the club makes it clear to Watts that they don't value retaining him then he's going to be better off moving on.  Think about the conversation.

Indeed. I do have a bit of broken record itis on some issues. 

What happened in the Ryan Ferguson Brad Sewell scenario? I don't recall. I can't think of any examples where a player under contract does not want to leave but is forced to.

But the point remains if the club make it clear they don't value retaining him he still needs to agree to be traded. Which as you rightly say may well be in his best interests to do so.

However i maintain that he will have zero interest in going to a club in the bottom half of the ladder. Any trade would have to be mutually beneficial and if put on the table he would want to go to a top four club.  

[binman 42,975]

Anyway it is a moot point. Watts is a required player. As several people have noted you don't trade a player with the skills your team so sorely lacks. 

Edited September 20, 2017 by binman

[GCDee 3,199]

8 minutes ago, binman said:

Anyway it is a moot point. Watts is a required player. As several people have noted you don't trade a player with the skills your team so sorely lacks. 

Even if it has been stated by Captain and coach that he isn't up to scratch off the field? 

 

[DV8 2,271]

1 hour ago, binman said:

Anyway it is a moot point. Watts is a required player. As several people have noted you don't trade a player with the skills your team so sorely lacks. 

When your team need many things, including gogetability, sometimes that draft pick received is good enough to turn into something we do want.

Edited September 20, 2017 by DV8

[DV8 2,271]

3 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

1) Agreed, all players should be held accountable, Jack included.  Players are often named and called out after a poor game or doing something stupid and rightly so.  Then they let it go publicly.  But with Jack it has been a constant, negative and vague narrative.   

2) Tbh I don't know what Jones means by 'out of hours' activities.  Rehab maybe?  None of the players that had soft tissue injuries (Watts, Tyson, Garlett, Gawn, Salem) played very well on return.  But let's assume Jack was the only one that didn't do his rehab properly.  Why on God's earth would Jones say anything at all especially now that the season is over.  It simply feeds the 'he is up for trade narrative' which may be what he and the club want.

Whatever Jack's lapses have been I simply don't like how the club has negatively publicly portrayed him all year.  

Over and out on this.

Lets assume that not doing everything in preparation to be the best you can be for the club & team.

Jack doesn't seem to like or tolerate pain much.

So does he seek special rubdowns on sore spots or does he avoid that?

Does he do the excruciatingly hot & freezingly cold treatments on soft tissue injuries, or does he avoid those. He was slow rehabbing from his hammy strain?

Will he stretch to the limit when tight & sore?

Is he prepared to be conservative & responsible when out partying & drinking ??? when out of hours?
How is his attitude in the Gym, pushing weights and building on his frame?

I reckon my hunch is, he is poor in these areas of commitment, just as he is reluctant to commit to big crunches out in space around the ground.

 

He lacks muscle definition, and he has been at the Mfc for about 9 Yrs.

These are all pointers to how JW treats his time at this club.

Edited September 20, 2017 by DV8

[DV8 2,271]

19 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Do you really think Jack is the only senior player that is recalcitrant from time to time?  That he is the only senior player that has his activities questioned by the club? 

Yet such senior players don't have negative public comments made by the club let alone a negative public narrative run on them over a whole season. 

It is that that I find inconsistent and therefore distasteful. 

9 yrs, "is time to time"?  Its about time he pushed a weight in the gym then, he might be ready by now.

[DV8 2,271]

12 hours ago, Akum said:

Seems to me that the club wants to avoid putting a large part of its younger fan-base off-side, so they don't want to be seen to be responsible for taking the initiative to show him the door, while making it difficult for him to stay. This is the only way I can explain the bizarre juxtaposition of Watts being "disciplined" with the indiscretions by the younger players before & during the season. The narrative seems to be that we have to be harsh on Watts to guard against our standards slipping, otherwise these other sorts of things can happen.

For the first time, I'm now beginning to believe that a significant chunk of the club (or the coaches or footy dept or whatever) want him gone, but want him to take the initiative. For many reasons I certainly think this is unwise from our (MFC) point of view, though for Watts to go elsewhere, it might actually remove the shackles of expectation from him, especially if he goes for a low price.

I mean, it's not like we have a history of shooting ourselves in the foot just as things look like they might be getting better.  

If this is true, then we would need to change the board and administrators again, because that would mean they are as soft as JW.

[SFebes 4,884]

I'm told by a friend that Jack likes to frequent Southbank area on week nights and on weekends, ie; likes a beer and social life. I think that's who Jack is, a nice guy who loves life. If his heart isn't in it for AFL by now it will never be unfortunately. A late 2nd or 3rd round pick is what we'd be looking at I think. So much talent but doesn't have the heart. I'm not sure if this is what Jones is alluding to either in regards to preparation etc. Jack just seems like a nice version of Nick Kyrgios. Talent to burn, but no desire.

[DV8 2,271]

3 hours ago, binman said:

Right. And if jack say's no to being traded what does the club do with its testis?

If he was to say NO to being traded, I can imagine what past admin's have done in that scenario. 

They would promptly go & sit down to pisss.

 

Now, this Admin has the opportunity, to stand up & take it's strongest action.

Edited September 20, 2017 by DV8

[DV8 2,271]

3 minutes ago, SFebey said:

I'm told by a friend that Jack likes to frequent Southbank area on week nights and on weekends, ie; likes a beer and social life. I think that's who Jack is, a nice guy who loves life. If his heart isn't in it for AFL by now it will never be unfortunately. A late 2nd or 3rd round pick is what we'd be looking at I think. So much talent but doesn't have the heart. I'm not sure if this is what Jones is alluding to either in regards to preparation etc. Jack just seems like a nice version of Nick Kyrgios. Talent to burn, but no desire.

sounds like sylvia mk11

[DV8 2,271]

2 hours ago, GCDee said:

Rising star

80+ goals in a bottom side

Clearly works his ass off to perform and return from injury.

 

My question to you if Watts was a pick 15+ would we have stuck by him all these years? No chance.

 

Yes unfortunately, because we are too patient & understanding when it comes to AFL football.

Mfc are 'the softest touch' in Aussie rules footy.

And players know it, & many have come to us for the 'super'. benefits.

Not for the wins.

[GCDee 3,199]

Just now, DV8 said:

Yes unfortunately, because we are too patient & understanding when it comes to AFL football.

Mfc are 'the softest touch' in Aussie rules footy.

And players know it, & many have come to us for the 'super'. benefits.

Not for the wins.

I begg to differ now with the new coaches/administration... we cut pick 4 toumpass pretty quickly when we realized he isn't up to it.

I just think that was our mentality and unfortunately we can overturn our entire list in 2 or 3 off seasons it takes time.

We are on the right path, and if everything about watts is true then to continue down that path we need to cut ties with him. No matter how good of a kick he is.

[DV8 2,271]

1 hour ago, binman said:

Indeed. I do have a bit of broken record itis on some issues. 

What happened in the Ryan Ferguson Brad Sewell scenario? I don't recall. I can't think of any examples where a player under contract does not want to leave but is forced to.

But the point remains if the club make it clear they don't value retaining him he still needs to agree to be traded. Which as you rightly say may well be in his best interests to do so.

However i maintain that he will have zero interest in going to a club in the bottom half of the ladder. Any trade would have to be mutually beneficial and if put on the table he would want to go to a top four club.  

Usually the club tells them, they don't think they will be picked to play in the 1sts for the whole season, if they stay on.

So likely to play the whole season at the VFL level.  With possibly some games in the development league.

We could employ him as a mascot.

[DV8 2,271]

5 minutes ago, GCDee said:

I begg to differ now with the new coaches/administration... we cut pick 4 toumpass pretty quickly when we realized he isn't up to it.

I just think that was our mentality and unfortunately we can overturn our entire list in 2 or 3 off seasons it takes time.

We are on the right path, and if everything about watts is true then to continue down that path we need to cut ties with him. No matter how good of a kick he is.

Toumpas, your kidding right. The most popular player ever at this club. That was a tough decision then, wasn't it.

And one swallow does not make a Summer.

Toumpas was not playing regualr seniors so they could have spent more time developing him before they took action.

JWatts has 9 Years.. 9 Yrs fleecing this club, and you speak of taking time to sort the list?

 

Just get rid of him, so we can all hold our heads high.  I would take a packet of chicken Twisties, to end this saga.

And I don't like chicken.

[GCDee 3,199]

1 minute ago, DV8 said:

Toumpas, your kidding right. The most popular player ever at this club. That was a tough decision then, wasn't it.

And one swallow does not make a Summer.

Toumpas was not playing regualr seniors so they could have spent more time developing him before they took action.

JWatts has 9 Years.. 9 Yrs fleecing this club, and you speak of taking time to sort the list?

 

Just get rid of him, so we can all hold our heads high.  I would take a packet of chicken Twisties, to end this saga.

And I don't like chicken.

I'm agreeing with you.... previous administration would keep Watts, 9 years (Holly [censored] it's been 9 years) is too long to be having these off field issues now.

[DV8 2,271]

14 minutes ago, GCDee said:

I'm agreeing with you.... previous administration would keep Watts, 9 years (Holly [censored] it's been 9 years) is too long to be having these off field issues now.

That is exactly it.  9 yrs of ho hum Jack.

We are like some sort of Holiday Resort, for nice type players.