2 hours ago, picket fence said:

4 WEEKS ?? nup, Severe reprimand, fined and if he ever does this agian then give him 4 weeks!

IMV

 

Has merit. Id add my other ideas to the pie still.

3 hours ago, Dr evil said:

It was a typo... i meant in a very poor team. 

even Jack viney didn't have the same impact Parish did in his first year of the Dees, and we were of a similar quality to what the Bombers were this year.

I watched quite a few Essendon matches throughout the year mainly because I liked watching them lose. As others have said Oliver probably has a higher ceiling than Parish but the young Bomber did show an AFL maturity that belied his age and statue. He was disappointingly good. 

So Clarry went home to country Victoria, got his girlfriend into trouble by getting her involved in the war in Syria, insulted the  Shooters Fishers and Farters local MP, trashed the training rooms at the local oval and then to top it all off he unfortunately failed a breath test, which can't have been that serious because there is no further police action, he immediately informed the club, who have handled it quietly and professionally................think he probably over drank coz he realised how far ahead of him Darcy Parrish is........................good grief, club will handle it........move on.......19yr makes mistake

Edited November 16, 20168 yr by Satyriconhome

3 hours ago, Satyriconhome said:

So Clarry went home to country Victoria, got his girlfriend into trouble by getting her involved in the war in Syria, insulted the  Shooters Fishers and Farters local MP, trashed the training rooms at the local oval and then to top it all off he unfortunately failed a breath test, which can't have been that serious because there is no further police action, he immediately informed the club, who have handled it quietly and professionally................think he probably over drank coz he realised how far ahead of him Darcy Parrish is........................good grief, club will handle it........move on.......19yr makes mistake

Bloody ASADA! Hopeless.

(Or is it WADA this time?)

22 hours ago, Dr evil said:

While i think Oliver is very talented and will be a very good player for us 

RIGHT NOW Parish is ahead of Oliver, he's a very well rounded player, wins his own ball, uses it well and held his own in a very good team, if he was OOC 18 clubs would be keen, not the same with Oliver. 

but that's not the arguement here, what Oliver did let himself, his family and the club down and i'm sure he'll cop some sort of punishment, maybe miss the start of the season, and move on to hopefully a goood decade at the DEES

Parish's ball use is overrated. Runs well out of contests and can kick a drop punt but he's far from perfect. 

As for the next bolded statement where is the evidence of this? Is it something you just made up? Have you consulted with any teams yet alone close to all 18?

A low range drink driving charge may see a few clubs lower their opinions a little but if by some means he was a free agent I'd expect every club would be seriously interested.

Hang on a minute he was on his annual leave Ie Away from club and on Vacation!! 

I take annual leave If i get arrested during my vacation what business is it of my employer??

Hnmm grey area why are the club involved at all!??

Interesting scenario because its not technically in footy season!

Hnmm 

The bloody kid deserves a medal (no pun intended) for all this stuff, other than the .05

Yep throw the book at him, make him read it and then tell him how much better he is than any GWS player and a TWSNBN AA player Captain

9 minutes ago, picket fence said:

Hang on a minute he was on his annual leave Ie Away from club and on Vacation!! 

I take annual leave If i get arrested during my vacation what business is it of my employer??

Hnmm grey area why are the club involved at all!??

Interesting scenario because its not technically in footy season!

Hnmm 

If it's not technically football season then I guess he doesn't need to show up to the club until 4PM on March 25.

Or does he have obligations to the club in the weeks and months before then?

I imagine your employment is not of the kind where you operate in front of 25,000 - 30,000 people each week, some of whom have your picture on their bedroom wall (god help them).

He is known as Clayton Oliver, Melbourne Footballer, even when there are no games of football on.

As such he is required to do things that we plebs in "normal" occupations don't have to do.

If he doesn't like that, he can always drop back to the DVFL or the VAFA or some other league where he doesn't have these onerous responsibilities (and big pay packet).

At least he wasn't in a stolen car with Benny Cousins,4 strippers and a bag of Persians .

Been there and done that and  it gets boring ,as Ethan would know in his role as Bennys life coach.

If anyone thinks Parish is ahead of Oliver in any possible way then they do not know anything about football.

He is Diesel 2.0, only taller. He is the best, in close - quick hands type player, debut season I have ever seen at Melbourne. 

Think about it. 

10 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

Parish's ball use is overrated. Runs well out of contests and can kick a drop punt but he's far from perfect. 

As for the next bolded statement where is the evidence of this? Is it something you just made up? Have you consulted with any teams yet alone close to all 18?

A low range drink driving charge may see a few clubs lower their opinions a little but if by some means he was a free agent I'd expect every club would be seriously interested.

Sorry mate, i didn't know that i had to contact all other clubs before i could post a comment on here, Parish is a quality young mid and in my opinion every single club in the comp would be interested, i am not sure Oliver is quite there yet, but as i said in an earlier post i think his ceiling is much higher than Parish. so right now Parish is a good young player who may be slightly ahead and would attract a lot of interest on the open market

Oliver is a talented young player who has the potential to be even better and i look forward to seeing how he responds to the drink driving thing and how well he goes this year. 

10 hours ago, picket fence said:

Hang on a minute he was on his annual leave Ie Away from club and on Vacation!! 

I take annual leave If i get arrested during my vacation what business is it of my employer??

Hnmm grey area why are the club involved at all!??

Interesting scenario because its not technically in footy season!

Hnmm 

Again we can agree to disagree but being an AFL footballer is much more than just turning up and playing on game day or in season training. 

Every move is scrutinized by the press 24/7, 365 days a year.

There is an expectation that due to this intense scrutiny and the fragility of every clubs brand that players must meet a certain standard of behaviour both on and off the field  - 7 days a week , 52 weeks a year -  Richmond's couple of alcohol incidents lost them the TAC as a sponsor, Essendon's drug problems lost them sponsors on mass ( albeit, their problems were "self inflicted club sponsored") Eddies rants have lost Collingwood sponsors over the journey.

If players don't want this scrutiny and behavioral restrictions then they should go and play suburban footy. The argument that if you get arrested what business is it of my employers completely misses the most important point that different professions in different industries have completely differing expectations on an employee.

( this is not directed specifically at Oliver but footballers in general and addressing the flawed argument  - "they are on their own time, they are on vacation" )

 

Edited November 16, 20168 yr by nutbean

9 hours ago, whers_jacka_now said:

If anyone thinks Parish is ahead of Oliver in any possible way then they do not know anything about football.

He is Diesel 2.0, only taller. He is the best, in close - quick hands type player, debut season I have ever seen at Melbourne. 

Think about it. 

I think that Parish's first season in football was better than Oliver's.

Like Dr Evil has said below - I also think that Oliver's ceiling is higher and I am not unhappy with selection and would absolute not change our selection. If he keeps improving and developing the inside skills and ball hunting skills he showed in season one he will be something special.  But I think anyone who thinks that Parish didn't pip Oliver in output in his first year is wearing Melbourne bias blinkers. 

 

On 15/11/2016 at 10:15 PM, Dr evil said:

While i think Oliver is very talented and will be a very good player for us 

RIGHT NOW Parish is ahead of Oliver, he's a very well rounded player, wins his own ball, uses it well and held his own in a very good team, if he was OOC 18 clubs would be keen, not the same with Oliver. 

but that's not the arguement here, what Oliver did let himself, his family and the club down and i'm sure he'll cop some sort of punishment, maybe miss the start of the season, and move on to hopefully a goood decade at the DEES

 

38 minutes ago, Dr evil said:

Sorry mate, i didn't know that i had to contact all other clubs before i could post a comment on here, Parish is a quality young mid and in my opinion every single club in the comp would be interested, i am not sure Oliver is quite there yet, but as i said in an earlier post i think his ceiling is much higher than Parish. so right now Parish is a good young player who may be slightly ahead and would attract a lot of interest on the open market

Oliver is a talented young player who has the potential to be even better and i look forward to seeing how he responds to the drink driving thing and how well he goes this year. 

I think they are both talented young players.

In making your point on Parish though I think you pushed it a little bit over the top by insinuating not all clubs would be keen on Oliver.

If he was OOC I would be more than surprised if he didn't have the same level of interest as Parish.

...by the way, I haven't contacted all clubs to confirm my thinking here.

2 minutes ago, rjay said:

 

I think they are both talented young players.

In making your point on Parish though I think you pushed it a little bit over the top by insinuating not all clubs would be keen on Oliver.

If he was OOC I would be more than surprised if he didn't have the same level of interest as Parish.

...by the way, I haven't contacted all clubs to confirm my thinking here.

you might well be right Rjay, i just wonder how many would rate Parish more highly, just at this moment. 

2 years time i am extremely confident Clarrie will be ahead of Parish and looking really good for the next decade.

On 11/15/2016 at 6:32 PM, Danelska said:

Ahhh, the age old conundrum of wanting a personality of high risk takers when you draft someone - have a Stevie J vibe about this one...

I think there's truth in that.  Clarrie comes as an entire package.  But poor preparation leads to poor performance - hopefully Macca can get through to him.

On 11/15/2016 at 10:15 PM, Dr evil said:

While i think Oliver is very talented and will be a very good player for us 

RIGHT NOW Parish is ahead of Oliver, he's a very well rounded player, wins his own ball, uses it well and held his own in a very good team, if he was OOC 18 clubs would be keen, not the same with Oliver. 

but that's not the arguement here, what Oliver did let himself, his family and the club down and i'm sure he'll cop some sort of punishment, maybe miss the start of the season, and move on to hopefully a goood decade at the DEES

I've got a wait-and-see on Parish.

Yes, he had a good first year, and he can certainly play. But I am not aware of any game in which he copped heat. Basically, anyone playing Essendon let the Bombers do their own thing. Now in his second year and with a full list from which to pick, opponents will take Essendon more seriously and Parish will cop attention if he gets too much of the footy.

That's why we picked Oliver. He's the inside machine. He had a taste of AFL in 2016, copped the odd tag, but was mostly left to develop at Casey. Plus, he has Diesel Williams-like poise in traffic.

When it comes to big games, I always prefer the strongly built talented inside player over the lightly built talented outside player. 

 

Edited November 16, 20168 yr by Tony Tea

1 minute ago, Tony Tea said:

I've got a wait-and-see on Parish.

Yes, he had a good first year, and he can certainly play. But I am not aware of any game in which he copped heat. Basically, anyone playing Essendon let the Bombers do their own thing. Now in his second year and with a full list from which to pick, Parish will cop attention if he gets too much of the footy.

That's why we picked Oliver. He's the inside machine. He had a taste of AFL in 2016, copped the odd tag, but was mostly left to develop at Casey. Plus, he has Diesel Williams-like poise in traffic.

When it comes to big games, I always prefer the strongly built talented inside player over the lightly built talented outside player. 

 

Parish is not only outside - he gets his hands dirty inside as well.

I still am very happy with our choice of Oliver (indiscretion aside)

As this convo is taking a siding ftm but remaining on rails  i would like to think we have an idea of Parish, he's very good and will get better. I have no idea how good Clarry will become 

The old 'we could have/should have taken player x instead of player y' game is one of my least favorite. I couldn't care less now. Oliver is ours and he is really good young player who has something about him that suggests a real x factor and untapped potential.  He's also got a pretty wide competitive streak (not to mention a touch of the angry pills) which is exactly what Roos and Goodwin were looking for

However it was clear when drafted he was a pretty immature young bloke. As evidence of that compare the draft night interviews of the Weid and Oliver. Now that's no bad thing in of itself but there is no doubt the club would have carefully considered that aspect and were well aware of what they were getting. We made a calculated gamble.

They obviously have backed themselves in to get the development and support right. Which i really like (by the by i shudder to think where he would be if he arrived at the dees 5 years ago). If we deliver our side of the bargain the rest is up to Oliver. My gut feel is that most young men he will mature and  work things out.

All that said it is serious crime he has committed and he deserves a good wack from the club and leadership group. I'll back the club in to get that wack right.

Edited November 17, 20168 yr by binman

1 minute ago, binman said:

The old 'we could have/should have taken player x instead of player y' game is one of my least favorite.

The old " I'm an expert on drafting s after the event and having watched the players go around for a couple of seasons so i can make an assessment now but i really didn't have a clue then" game.

I disagree - it is not one of my least favourite - it is my LEAST favourite - end of story.

13 minutes ago, binman said:

The old 'we could have/should have taken player x instead of player y' game is one of my least favorite. I couldn't care less now. Oliver is ours and he is really good young player who has something about him that suggests a real x factor and untapped potential.  He's also got a pretty wide competitive streak (not to mention a touch of the angry pills) which is exactly what Roos and Goodwin were looking for

However it was clear when drafted he was a pretty immature young bloke. As evidence of that compare the draft night interviews of the Weid and Oliver. Now that's no bad thing in of itself but there is no doubt the club would have carefully considered that aspect and were well aware of what they were getting. We made a calculated gamble.

They obviously have backed themselves in to get the development and support right. Which i really like (by the by i shudder to think where he would be if he arrived at the dees 5 years ago). If we deliver our side of the bargain the rest is up to Oliver. My gut feel is that most young men he will mature and  work things out.

All that said it is serious crime he has committed and he deserves a good wack from the club and leadership group. I'll back the club in to get that wack right.

agree with most of that, but the "it is serious crime he has committed" is a bit of hyperbole

Oliver will be our best midfielder in 5 years time. Mark my words. 

13 hours ago, whers_jacka_now said:

If anyone thinks Parish is ahead of Oliver in any possible way then they do not know anything about football.

He is Diesel 2.0, only taller. He is the best, in close - quick hands type player, debut season I have ever seen at Melbourne. 

Think about it. 

Parish is well ahead of Oliver at this early stage. He's super fit, has a good tank and is able to consistently play midfield time for extended periods.

I love Clarry, but we are once again falling into the trap of allowing talent to excuse poor behaviour and preparation.

Clarry is the more talented of the two, his skill sets have the potential to be devastating at AFL level. Parish however, despite the scum he plays for, has not put a foot wrong yet.

Oliver is still overweight and until he actually demonstrates consistent commitment, he hasn't proven anything. All potential at this stage until he can demonstrate elite behaviours, not just elite talent.

32 minutes ago, TeamPlayedFine39 said:

Parish is well ahead of Oliver at this early stage. He's super fit, has a good tank and is able to consistently play midfield time for extended periods.

I love Clarry, but we are once again falling into the trap of allowing talent to excuse poor behaviour and preparation.

Clarry is the more talented of the two, his skill sets have the potential to be devastating at AFL level. Parish however, despite the scum he plays for, has not put a foot wrong yet.

Oliver is still overweight and until he actually demonstrates consistent commitment, he hasn't proven anything. All potential at this stage until he can demonstrate elite behaviours, not just elite talent.

Agree with all of this.

My worry is his lack of a tank. If he can sort that out and reaches his full potential, from what I've seen I think he'll be our best midfielder. 

I would have thought that of all players on our list he would have worked the hardest in the off season but instead based on training reports he has come back under done always running at the back of the packs.

Now maybe he has an injury or given his osteopubis history the year before he was drafted maybe they have him on a modified running program. We wouldn't have a clue. Saty maybe you could get some info on this and what they think about how he has come back.  You'd think he'd be in the rehab group for the first period of the pre season like they are doing with Hibberd and Melksham who dont have injuries but are being eased in. 

Edited November 17, 20168 yr by It's Time