Off-Season Improvement

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

And so,

we find ourselves at the beginning of another off-season and at a time where in years gone by, the excitement and hype for suffering Melbourne supporters hits an all time high.

Free agency, trade period and a plethora of young talent ready to embark on another pre-season, three ingredients that every club's supporters seem to think are exclusive to their team only.

In what will most likely be a fairly quiet trade and free agency period for us, my mind is already on the 2017 home and away season and the possibility of us being a top 8 side for the first time in a decade.

However what I'm finding increasingly difficult to do, is to pen in who I can say I think we'll comfortably beat next year, given how even the competition is.

At the moment, the only teams I feel confident in saying we'll beat are Richmond and Brisbane. For obvious reasons.

But any of Fremantle, Carlton, Collingwood, Essendon, St Kilda, Port and the Gold Coast is too difficult to say in my opinion. Freo, Essendon, Collingwood and Gold Coast will all be very different sides next year with the amount of players they'll have coming back. Carlton and St Kilda are on the up and beat us this year and Port are wildly inconsistent but have a ruckman coming back next year and will improve I'm sure.

So that's two clubs I see for pencilled in wins for us at this stage. Am I the lord of pessimists? 

How do others see us stacking up against the rest of the competition, given the improvement they'll similarly be banking on during the off-season?

The competition is insanely even going into next year.

Edited October 8, 2016 by stevethemanjordan

[mo64 5,881]

I think you've nailed it. 

If Goodwin can instill consistency of effort and coach well on matchday, we have the talent to be a top 8 team. If we hear the same postgame excuses after a loss as we did with Roos, we'll remain around the 10-12 region.

It's up to you Goodwin.

[Sir Why You Little 37,242]

Most important Preseason for 52 years

if we go backwards in 2017 i fear the club will always be a bottom feeder

We must beat teams. Fear no one

[Deevolution 103]

It's winning time !!!

[Ricky P 757]

There's always teams that go backwards unexpectedly and teams that improve out of nowhere. Hard to say who specifically we'll beat. I don't have a very entertaining answer - I just think we'll win two or three more games than last year and play a final or two. 

[DistrACTION Jackson 9,620]

With the continuous development of our 19-23 year old players I believe we SHOULD beat the following teams next season:

Brisbane, Carlton, Essendon, Fremantle, Richmond, Collingwood, St Kilda, Port Adelaide, North Melbourne, Hawthorn, WCE (if at home).

Plus I believe we will pinch 2-3 wins from the top 6 sides.

My prediction for next season is 13-15 wins and our first final in 11 years!

Go Dees.

[Diamond_Jim 12,643]

I like to think we will see wins against St Kilda and North in 2017.

Both teams relied on older players to deliver that little bit of an edge that is enough to see the "Old Demons" off. Time for that to change.

Essendon is an unknown quantity. Re-introduction of 10-12 players after a year off must have some consequences on team play.

I see the games against Port and Collingwood as pivotal in addition to the above.

Win all of those ( a hard but not impossible task) and assuming we play them each twice that is 10 wins. Add in Richmond and Brisbane you have the makings of a good season.

Frankly a season that sees less than 14 wins next year will be disappointing.

 

[Sorry.... I forgot to insert Freo... but our home game is Darwin and an away game against Freo will be a good test.]

Edited October 8, 2016 by Diamond_Jim

[The Backyard Charizard 1,202]

Richmond, North Melbourne, Brisbane, Gold Coast, Hawthorn, Carlton, Essendon and Collingwood should all fear the emerging Demons...

That's a minimum 8 wins right there just by natural progression....

Considering we will probably play 5 of those teams twice that could be 13 straight off the bat...

Finals is on the way people... 

Get excited!

 

[Adam The God 30,541]

11 hours ago, stevethemanjordan said:

And so,

we find ourselves at the beginning of another off-season and at a time where in years gone by, the excitement and hype for suffering Melbourne supporters hits an all time high.

Free agency, trade period and a plethora of young talent ready to embark on another pre-season, three ingredients that every club's supporters seem to think are exclusive to their team only.

In what will most likely be a fairly quiet trade and free agency period for us, my mind is already on the 2017 home and away season and the possibility of us being a top 8 side for the first time in a decade.

However what I'm finding increasingly difficult to do, is to pen in who I can say I think we'll comfortably beat next year, given how even the competition is.

At the moment, the only teams I feel confident in saying we'll beat are Richmond and Brisbane. For obvious reasons.

But any of Fremantle, Carlton, Collingwood, Essendon, St Kilda, Port and the Gold Coast is too difficult to say in my opinion. Freo, Essendon, Collingwood and Gold Coast will all be very different sides next year with the amount of players they'll have coming back. Carlton and St Kilda are on the up and beat us this year and Port are wildly inconsistent but have a ruckman coming back next year and will improve I'm sure.

So that's two clubs I see for pencilled in wins for us at this stage. Am I the lord of pessimists? 

How do others see us stacking up against the rest of the competition, given the improvement they'll similarly be banking on during the off-season?

The competition is insanely even going into next year.

I think we'll win between 12-14 games. But it's pointless predicting wins at this stage.

I also don't believe Brisbane will be the push overs you claim they will be. Their list is not actually that bad. Their midfield is decent if harnessed correctly. They have some young, emerging book ends and I think under decent tutelage, they'll win 5-7 games next year. They won't be the basketcase they were this year.

I think North will finish in the bottom 6, possibly bottom 4 and Hawthorn and Geelong will come back to the field.

GWS will be a scary proposition next year, fuelled by ultimate failure this year.

And Essendon will start slowly in the first half of the year, but will improve generally as the year goes on. I can see them finishing anywhere between 12th and 6th, but more likely on the fringe of the 8.

I think Gold Coast will be mid table next year. Their midfield is going to take a hit with O'Meara, Prestia and Swallow leaving or remaining injured. Ablett is another unknown, but I suspect he'll never be the player that he was again. His shoulder is too volatile. That puts them in a bit of trouble. I'm not convinced Eade is the man to take them forward either. He might be more of a list builder like he was at Sydney and then with the right coach in 2-3 years, they could be scary once more, with their access to top end talent in the Northern Academies and top draft selections they've acquired/will acquire.

The biggest yard stick for us though is consistency and beating the sides below us that we should. I want to see a couple of spankings too. We managed one against the Suns this year, but there were a number of other games (namely the Freo game), where we should have rolled them by 10-15 goals. We also need to ensure there are no efforts like the Essendon, St Kilda (x 2), Carlton and Geelong performances next year. My fear is we've still got one or two of those games left in us next year.

I expect to see improvement from the entire list, but the guys I'm most excited about next year are (in this order) Oliver, Petracca, Brayshaw, Hunt, Tyson, Hogan, Viney, Salem, Stretch and seeing how Gawn backs up his AA year. If we can get improvement out of all of those guys (our best players), we'll be pushing closer to 14+ games. History tells me we're another year or so off from having a realistic crack at the top 4 though.

I also look forward to the new Goodwin style. I want to see more trust in our team mates and playing for each other. Blocking, shepherding, tackling at high intensity etc. The stuff the top 4 teams do. If we can put that together for 10-12 games next year, we'll be tracking well on our way.

Edited October 8, 2016 by A F

[Return to Glory 8,448]

26 minutes ago, KrazyJay said:

Richmond, North Melbourne, Brisbane, Gold Coast, Hawthorn, Carlton, Essendon and Collingwood should all fear the emerging Demons...

That's a minimum 8 wins right there just by natural progression....

Considering we will probably play 5 of those teams twice that could be 13 straight off the bat...

Finals is on the way people... 

Get excited!

 

Yes, we always do well when we make claims about who we'll beat. I sat at the G for the certainties against Essendon and Carlton this year. Really enjoyable.

[Bitter but optimistic 22,289]

1 minute ago, Return to Glory said:

Yes, we always do well when we make claims about who we'll beat. I sat at the G for the certainties against Essendon and Carlton this year. Really enjoyable.

Thank you RTG, I was getting all a flutter for a moment!!

[Return to Glory 8,448]

7 minutes ago, Bitter but optimistic said:

Thank you RTG, I was getting all a flutter for a moment!!

BBO, it's always better to believe the World is about to cave in at any moment. A little life philosophy of mine. Go Dees.

[The Backyard Charizard 1,202]

My days of being a glass half empty member are over...

I go in to every season now with the utmost confidence that we make finals...

Hawks had their "line in the sand" moment...

I may have possibly just had my "line on the mirror" moment 

[Return to Glory 8,448]

20 minutes ago, KrazyJay said:

My days of being a glass half empty member are over...

I go in to every season now with the utmost confidence that we make finals...

Hawks had their "line in the sand" moment...

I may have possibly just had my "line on the mirror" moment 

I commend you KJ. So, just to clarify, when Neeld strode onto the ground at the start of the year a few seasons ago, you were getting on to Ticketek to book your finals tickets?

[The Backyard Charizard 1,202]

4 minutes ago, Return to Glory said:

I commend you KJ. So, just to clarify, when Neeld strode onto the ground at the start of the year a few seasons ago, you were getting on to Ticketek to book your finals tickets?

I go in to every season now should have read "every season from NOW on" 

And please refrain from using the N word in future 

[Bitter but optimistic 22,289]

55 minutes ago, Return to Glory said:

BBO, it's always better to believe the World is about to cave in at any moment. A little life philosophy of mine. Go Dees.

A dash of "chicken little"  does help to keep one grounded in reality.

Although  RTG, just between myself and your goodself, I'm no longer certain just what "reality" is.

[Little Goffy 14,670]

I'm not at all convinced it is a very even competition.

Three distinct groups; the dominant, the adequate, and the strugglers.

It is possible that this coming season will see a tightening of that into the dominant, the adequate, and the Queenslanders, but I've never heard of a class system being called 'even'.

As far predicting who we'll beat in advance, don't even try given the Demon paradox;

A better record against highly rated teams than does any team below or around us.

A worse record against lower rated teams than does any team above or around us.

Anything could happen.

[Fitz Fitzpatrick 886]

I think our list is insanely over rated...again. We have a few future stars, of course, but its a very weak list. Wiedman is miles off, , Hogan is severely over rated, our midfield has soe talent but the midfield game does not stack up against the current game. 

the future of the current list is that of a solid mid table team. We must bring in some pure talent. 

[Moonshadow 17,678]

5 hours ago, stevethemanjordan said:

And so,

we find ourselves at the beginning of another off-season and at a time where in years gone by, the excitement and hype for suffering Melbourne supporters hits an all time high.

Free agency, trade period and a plethora of young talent ready to embark on another pre-season, three ingredients that every club's supporters seem to think are exclusive to their team only.

In what will most likely be a fairly quiet trade and free agency period for us, my mind is already on the 2017 home and away season and the possibility of us being a top 8 side for the first time in a decade.

However what I'm finding increasingly difficult to do, is to pen in who I can say I think we'll comfortably beat next year, given how even the competition is.

At the moment, the only teams I feel confident in saying we'll beat are Richmond and Brisbane. For obvious reasons.

But any of Fremantle, Carlton, Collingwood, Essendon, St Kilda, Port and the Gold Coast is too difficult to say in my opinion. Freo, Essendon, Collingwood and Gold Coast will all be very different sides next year with the amount of players they'll have coming back. Carlton and St Kilda are on the up and beat us this year and Port are wildly inconsistent but have a ruckman coming back next year and will improve I'm sure.

So that's two clubs I see for pencilled in wins for us at this stage. Am I the lord of pessimists? 

How do others see us stacking up against the rest of the competition, given the improvement they'll similarly be banking on during the off-season?

The competition is insanely even going into next year.

I appreciate snd applaud your enthusiasm,  but "insanely even going into next year" is a huge stretch. IMO it's reasonably even for about the top 5 (Syd, Haw, Geel, GWS and WB not in that order), undefined for the next 6-8 and no real surprises for the bottom 12-18. We sit somewhere near the centre of the middle band. There will possibly be one or two that climb or slide beyond expectation, but it's still an uneven and stacked 'competition'. This year's win by the Bulldogs might be better described as an insane irregularity, however it certainly gives us Demon supporters some hope. 

[Demonised 1,361]

I think it's too early for us to start talking back to back premierships just yet.

[Pennant St Dee 13,324]

With the trade period to come I see 4 sides who will definitely make finals.

Swans, GWS, Dogs & Crows

Hawks imo will slide somewhat into the next group unless they manage to snare all of O Meara, Mitchell, a key defender, Vickery and Roughy comes back. The holes started to appear this year just like Cats in 2013.

I am not sold on the Cats they took a big gamble last season and they have a lot of ageing stars. LTI to Danger or Selwood leaves them vulnerable.

I have the Hawks and Cats as the leaders of the next group fighting for the top 8 spots so in that group is 

Hawks, Cats, Saints, Meth Coast (don't be fooled there easy draw at the first 2 thirds of the season glossed over some very big cracks and a very soft underbelly), Dees, Bombers and Pies.

I think the Bombers have done really well to get some experience into some quality kids and there midfield has some depth. We have improved and drafted very well since 2013 and I see nothing to suggest we won't continue to do so. Our list needs to understand without putting in some real hard yards it wont just happen.

Of course one of the unmentioned sides will just prove us all wrong and all of Port, Freo, North, Carlton & Richmond will depending on injury be able to put good runs together but not really threaten the top 6 IMO. 

Suns and Lions are both starting from a long way back.

Trades drafting and the draw will all play a big part in my views on each team

 

 

[Wiseblood 24,637]

On our best day we can beat anybody.  I'd pencil us in, but not use a pen, for any game next year.  

If we get our consistency up and see the improvement across the board from our young brigade then anything is possible.  If not, then we're in for potentially a tough season.

[DeeSpencer 26,091]

I'm a pessimist too and I think the season will be really even. Brisbane can improve quickly and Richmond can too. Essendon will be decent, GC improved, Freo the same. 

But in order to not be too pessimistic I'd say the following teams we will really struggle to beat:

- GWS, Adel, Syd, Geel away
- Dogs anywhere due to their ability and the match up
- St Kilda anywhere because we never beat them

The trade off means we can win any of the rest of the games which could be about 17 games. I think we can win travelling to WA, QLD, v Port or to Tassie. 

Mix up some good and bad performances, if we drop a couple early then bounce back to 2-2, then try to get to 5-5 and then to 10-10 like we were this year and see how we finish. 

 

 

[M_9 2,108]

Our inability to play Etihad will again, more than likely, cost us wins against Saints, Dons, Carlton and Norf. Every chance we'll get a home game against one of these teams ( a la the Saints this year) meaning 5 losses.

IMHO we need, or all teams need, a different game plan for that p**ck of a place. A training venue with the same dimensions as Etihad may help, although Gosch's Paddock probably is just that.

Edited October 8, 2016 by M_9

[DubDee 26,191]

Don't understand people thinking bombers will be good next season. I'm tipping bottom four.  Half the team haven't even seen the other half all year!

stanton and Jobe (32 by start of season) are getting on and the lack of continuity will not help them. They have 6 or so good players and struggle after that. Poor ruck, no forwards aside from Daniher. Not much speed and spread. Missed the draft for 2 years. Not many kids coming through. 

I may be clouded by my rampant hatred for them however.