WELCOME TO THE MELBOURNE FOOTBALL CLUB - CLAYTON OLIVER

[hoopla 418]

He was just being self effacing.[/quote

He certainly was self effacing . Nothing wrong with that of course - I just hope that he quickly comes to terms with the fact that he is now a top 4 draft pick who is expected to succeed at AFL level. He's no longer the kid who didn't quite make it - he's the potential champion everyone will be watching. Will he be comfortable in his new skin?

If he is - then we might just have the midfield presence we need.

[DeeSpencer 25,695]

Clayton 'Clarry' 'The Hamburglar' Oliver.

Love it.

[Gator 17,341]

Jimmy Toumpas played the last part of the 2011 in the SANFL and played in the Woodville/West Torrens premiership side in only his 5th game and I recall the same things being said about him.

Having said that the biggest two changes at the club since Toumpas' drafting is the emphasis on developing junior talent from day one and Roos stated policy of zero expectations on 1st year players. If there is talent and upside in these draftees I have faith that the structures now in place will bring it to the fore.

There was one early warning sign about Toumpas that proved telling. He had one of the lowest contested possession percentages going around. From memory it was in the 20's. Conversely, Oliver is nigh on 60%.

Even in Quigley's 2012 write up of Toumpas he touched on his poor contested work.

Edited November 25, 2015 by ProDee

[KingDingAling 3,757]

Lots of good junior footballers who get drafted, never make it because some are just too lazy. They think that after getting drafted to an AFL list, their talent is enough to win them a spot on the AFL team. Clayton Oliver on the other hand has worked hard at getting his body ready for the combine after playing a season of underage football little overweight. He was made aware of the fact that he was overweight and he took it upon himself to do something about it. Players like Blease, Morton, Gysbert and Sylvia did nothing and hoped that their talent was enough.

I agree. Not only that, here is a kid who missed the Nationals, was coming off of a limited prep - yet fought back to win the Morrish Medal. I like the way Oliver goes about his business on the field, but indications are that he is self motivated off field. He obviously has a healthy confidence in his own ability, and a motivation to ensure he gets the best out of himself. He simply wasn't going to let a missed State opportunity hinder him as player - if anything it motivated him. Those are the type of players we need at MFC. Of course its also a bonus that he is a bull and a clearance machine.

[mauriesy 7,295]

You can be a skinny Toumpas or a skinny Heppell. There's nothing early on that says how you'll end up. Heppell goes OK. Essendon might get a lot of value out of Parish.

[drdrake 3,163]

I agree. Not only that, here is a kid who missed the Nationals, was coming off of a limited prep - yet fought back to win the Morrish Medal. I like the way Oliver goes about his business on the field, but indications are that he is self motivated off field. He obviously has a healthy confidence in his own ability, and a motivation to ensure he gets the best out of himself. He simply wasn't going to let a missed State opportunity hinder him as player - if anything it motivated him. Those are the type of players we need at MFC. Of course its also a bonus that he is a bull and a clearance machine.

That is something that stood out with all our 4 picks, each have had to overcome something to get drafted. To me it shows that they had the hunger to work hard to get themselves in a position to get onto an AFL list

[TRIGON 4,783]

You can be a skinny Toumpas or a skinny Heppell. There's nothing early on that says how you'll end up. Heppell goes OK. Essendon might get a lot of value out of Parish.

I think Essendon will get great value from their two first picks and they're both pretty safe selections. We've been a tad more speculative - Oliver's relatively light exposure to top level competition and Weideman's ankle issues - however if our bet comes off we've set up the forward line beautifully and have added a really explosive mid/forward. This will make us a really hard side to contain.

Edited November 25, 2015 by TRIGON

[rpfc 28,417]

i actually just went to Footy Wire to compare their stats in regards to averages that are related to the inside mid role, i.e contested possession etc.

Both players have played 50 games, pretty much- Viney 49, Tyson 50. And Their stats are actually almost identical with each player "one uping" here and there by a decimal point. So to be honest as much as i like to argue the point, i think i will have to call it a draw. They are both as good as an inside mid as one another.

Viney sprinted past Tyson in 2015 and eclipsed Tyson's 2014 with 12 CPs to 9, 6 Clearances to 5, and the general fact that if no-one gets between Viney and the footy.

Put Tyson in a room with Viney and a Sherrin and he wouldn't see it.

[bandicoot 1,395]

you just ruined it Nut !! lol

Luckily Brick already has meat and his hips are fine I believe

edit..VFL > SANFL also

I tend to agree... There are more AFL listed player running around in VFL than WAFL and SANFL combined

[DeeSpencer 25,695]

Viney sprinted past Tyson in 2015 and eclipsed Tyson's 2014 with 12 CPs to 9, 6 Clearances to 5, and the general fact that if no-one gets between Viney and the footy.

Put Tyson in a room with Viney and a Sherrin and he wouldn't see it.

Give them a ruckman each, bounce it and see who gets more touches from the hitouts.

Anyway, I don't really care. There's plenty of room for both. Just got to get Dom back on track and I'm confident he will be.

I'm in no hurry to add Brayshaw, Petracca and Oliver to our centre square rotations on anything more than a casual basis. Jones and Vince, then Viney and Tyson and after that Vanders probably deserves first crack at some midfield minutes. If the youngsters are ready then we can always move Jones or Vince out. The Dogs did that this year with Boyd but we might be a year or two from that.

[Bay Riffin 1,474]

You can be a skinny Toumpas or a skinny Heppell. There's nothing early on that says how you'll end up. Heppell goes OK. Essendon might get a lot of value out of Parish.

Heppell is a lot bigger than Toumpas.

[Lucifers Hero 39,779]

He was just being self effacing.[/quote

He certainly was self effacing . Nothing wrong with that of course - I just hope that he quickly comes to terms with the fact that he is now a top 4 draft pick who is expected to succeed at AFL level. He's no longer the kid who didn't quite make it - he's the potential champion everyone will be watching. Will he be comfortable in his new skin?

If he is - then we might just have the midfield presence we need.

Sorry 'hoopla', I need to reword that sentence: I just hope he quickly comes to terms with the fact that he is now an AFL player who will be given the development and opportunity to be the best he can be and does not need to be the messiah people hope for

...and is not burdened at being a high draft pick as it means zip.

Edited November 25, 2015 by Lucifer's Hero

[Hobbits's 17]

I think Essendon will get great value from their two first picks and they're both pretty safe selections. We've been a tad more speculative

I think everyone will get value with their picks. Had we gone Parish with first pick the consensus may have been accusing Dees of playing at safe.

At the end of the day the Dees went best available in their mind, so did Dons. The safe and speculative innuendo is just that.

[rjay 24,923]

Viney sprinted past Tyson in 2015 and eclipsed Tyson's 2014 with 12 CPs to 9, 6 Clearances to 5, and the general fact that if no-one gets between Viney and the footy.

Put Tyson in a room with Viney and a Sherrin and he wouldn't see it.

Put the ball in a pack and Tyson would be the extractor.

[jnrmac 20,061]

That's the only thing about his game that made me squirm, he almost throws it when he bounces.

Needs to fix that up big time...

[DemonOX 8,791]

Couldn't be happier with this kid, I really thought we would go with Parish and thank fruitcake we didn't!!!!

Welcome Walshy.

Why?

[DemonOX 8,791]

All highlights from draftees look good.

I will reserve judgement on Olie and The Weid until I c them play.

None of us have any idea how they will go until they r put into the real stuff.

I have been over enthusiastic before and now I'm taking the wait and c approach.

Edited November 25, 2015 by DemonOX

[Gator 17,341]

Give them a ruckman each, bounce it and see who gets more touches from the hitouts.

Anyway, I don't really care. There's plenty of room for both. Just got to get Dom back on track and I'm confident he will be.

I'm in no hurry to add Brayshaw, Petracca and Oliver to our centre square rotations on anything more than a casual basis. Jones and Vince, then Viney and Tyson and after that Vanders probably deserves first crack at some midfield minutes. If the youngsters are ready then we can always move Jones or Vince out. The Dogs did that this year with Boyd but we might be a year or two from that.

Agreed. Tyson reads the ball beautifully and he's just one of those players that the ball bounces for. He'll whip his left arm out and it will just fall perfectly in place.

Viney and Tyson complement each other.

[Gator 17,341]

You can be a skinny Toumpas or a skinny Heppell. There's nothing early on that says how you'll end up. Heppell goes OK. Essendon might get a lot of value out of Parish.

Parish will be a gun.

He's got everything (except size) and unlike Toumpas, he has a high level of contested possessions.

[bandicoot 1,395]

Parish will be a gun.

He's got everything (except size) and unlike Toumpas, he has a high level of contested possessions.

Parish might turn out to be a gun however the football departments preference was for a bigger bodies mid

[Chris 2,892]

Lots of good junior footballers who get drafted, never make it because some are just too lazy. They think that after getting drafted to an AFL list, their talent is enough to win them a spot on the AFL team. Clayton Oliver on the other hand has worked hard at getting his body ready for the combine after playing a season of underage football little overweight. He was made aware of the fact that he was overweight and he took it upon himself to do something about it. Players like Blease, Morton, Gysbert and Sylvia did nothing and hoped that their talent was enough.

Sylvia was never overweight, he made sure he looked great on the beach and was shredded for stereo every year!

[Pennant St Dee 13,173]

I tend to agree... There are more AFL listed player running around in VFL than WAFL and SANFL combined

Often Peel and East Perth have 13 or 14 AFL listed players running around in their line ups. And with Port and Adelaide now having stand alones sides I dare say they would often have around 10 to 12 players in their sides. Overall a lot of AFL listed players playing regularly at VFL, WAFL & SANFL level are either young and developing or just depth and you can see the young developers may have great skills an smarts they can get crunched by the bigger bodies whilst the with the AFL depth list cloggers their skills aren't great they get by on their superior fitness.

The biggest upside on Oliver for me is yes he looks great on video against kids and he has done well at VFL level, What I like more than anything is the change in body shape over the season and the condition he turned up to the combine in. Speaks volumes of determination and the right attitude. That is in a player and very hard to teach

Welcome to the club Oli

[nutbean 8,838]

OK, this is about the 10th time in the last day I have read somebody use the example of Jimmy Toumpas to nullify any point that is being made about young guns and the draft. We all KNOW for a fact that the top 10 of the draft yields the most AFL superstars. It just does. SOME of them are complete duds like Toumpas and Morton etc BUT it is more LIKELY that a top10 pick will end up being good. The existence of Jimmy Toumpas has precisely ZERO to do with Clayton Oliver.

I think you are overreaching - I was not just outright comparing Toumpas to Oliver. I was addressing Bandicoot's post where he was lauding the fact that Oliver had made a very good fist of it in the VFL as an indicator of what is to come and Toumpas had done EXACTLY that in the SANFL. So it is clear - in no way shape or form am I suggesting that Oliver will turn out like Toumpas. The point is good open company form is not necessarily an indicator that you will make it. Toumpas proved his form against men could not replicate it when he came to the big league. Conversely Hogan played good VFL footy and has replicated it.

What is more impressive as stated elsewhere - is his commitment to dropping weight and getting fit.

Edited November 25, 2015 by nutbean

[DeeSpencer 25,695]

The Toumpas comparisons with Parish are silly. In 3 or 4 preseasons and I actually think Parish after beginning his career on a wing or back flank will end up like Nathan Jones, despite coming from a completely different body shape and skill set.

Our skipper is about 180cm, wins his share of ball at the contest, covers the ground and links up well and is an underrated kick on either foot.

3 or 4 preseasons from Clayton Oliver and he could be Luke Parker, even a Patty Dangerfield or a Jake Stringer (with a greater midfield v forward mix). I like the risk.

[bandicoot 1,395]

Often Peel and East Perth have 13 or 14 AFL listed players running around in their line ups. And with Port and Adelaide now having stand alones sides I dare say they would often have around 10 to 12 players in their sides. Overall a lot of AFL listed players playing regularly at VFL, WAFL & SANFL level are either young and developing or just depth and you can see the young developers may have great skills an smarts they can get crunched by the bigger bodies whilst the with the AFL depth list cloggers their skills aren't great they get by on their superior fitness.

The biggest upside on Oliver for me is yes he looks great on video against kids and he has done well at VFL level, What I like more than anything is the change in body shape over the season and the condition he turned up to the combine in. Speaks volumes of determination and the right attitude. That is in a player and very hard to teach

Welcome to the club Oli

Nearly every AFL aligned VFL side has 10-12 AFL players.

That's a lot more than 2 at WAFL and SANFL