POST MATCH DISCUSSION - Round 22

[pitmaster 3,561]

Because Bisbane won the first quarter whereas we were ten goals down after the first quarter.

Five. At least get the basics right.

[sue 9,107]

Because Bisbane won the first quarter whereas we were ten goals down after the first quarter. The Hawks were playing catch up!

Catch up? Why didn't they stop 'catching up' after being 3 goals down at Q1. Wouldn't they be satisfied to be 6 goals up at half-time? But according to you they must have foolishly risked injury etc to win by 72 pts.

Have a look at the score differential in our match compared to that one:

http://www.afl.com.au/match-centre/2015/22/fre-v-melb

http://www.afl.com.au/match-centre/2015/22/haw-v-bl

Ours is horizontal after the start of Q2, the Hawks increase the gap between the teams for most of the time after Q1. If you say Freo took the foot of the pedal, you have to ask why the Hawks did not based on the entire game. I can't see how you can put it down to Q1.

[sue 9,107]

If Whorethorn wish to blow a head gasket before week 1 of the finals it is no concern of mine...Freo were sitting on top points ahead of opposition. There position could not be improved....

Like a long motor race....Nurse the baby home

More important tasks are ahead....

Nor could Hawthorn's. They already had a hefty percentage.

[Sir Why You Little 37,046]

Nor could Hawthorn's. They already had a hefty percentage.

well ask Clarko!!

I know what i would be doing. Exactly what Freo did and will do next week.

[Mazer Rackham 14,971]

Umps. The losing team generally gets the worst of it. Because the winning team is usually first to the ball. And the winning team is usually higher on the ladder.

It's not fair but that's the way it is. If you want the run of the umps, win more matches.

Same with teams that look slow, unskilled, etc. The losing team in a blowout always looks slow. Perennially losing teams look like they're up to their waists in molasses. Against Geelong it looked like we could go another quarter.

"But if you ARE slower, of course you will lose!" Which came first, the chicken or the egg? It's a bit of both. That's why lower teams have to work harder.

[sue 9,107]

well ask Clarko!!

I know what i would be doing. Exactly what Freo did and will do next week.

Sure. I might do the same (when I'm appointed coach). But the issue we have been debating is not whether it is good policy, but whether Melb started playing competitively or if Freo had merely stopped competing.

Of course the truth could be somewhere in between. I dare say Freo would have been more frenetic if we were up a few goals going into the last quarter and they might lose a home final depending on the next week's results if they didn't win.

[Sir Why You Little 37,046]

Sure. I might do the same (when I'm appointed coach). But the issue we have been debating is not whether it is good policy, but whether Melb started playing competitively or if Freo had merely stopped competing.

Of course the truth could be somewhere in between. I dare say Freo would have been more frenetic if we were up a few goals going into the last quarter and they might lose a home final depending on the next week's results if they didn't win.

10 goals to Nil 40 mins into the game gives me the clear answer Sue

[junk 342]

The supporters are to blame for their negativity,one way to cure that is to support another club.How many times this year have the dees failed to switch on especially at quarter time.Roos puts it down to depleted stocks yet he is responsible

for the playing list.Perhaps when Goodwin takes over he gets himself a Bolton type assistant !!! Another rebuild looks certain perhaps the coaching staff should be included in the purge.Next week we can successfully finish off the year with

another loss.

[Pennant St Dee 13,190]

10 goals to Nil 40 mins into the game gives me the clear answer Sue

FFS and that is it to you really it's all black and white, did you watch the game or are you making that assessment having occasionally checked on the scores you think that explains the game, do you really think you can compare yesterdays effort with the previous two weeks.

By your account Adelaide kicked 9 and took the foot of the pedal and allowed Meth Coast to kick the next 5 that must be how it works, and why did Collingwood take their foot of the pedal on Friday against the Cats

We dropped our heads yesterday and the structure went out the window for about 10 mins that is what killed us. The plan was the right plan in the first quarter what killed it was some turnovers and poor delivery inside 50m and being overrun in time on by a more experienced and stronger team (it happens to all sides with so many players limited on experience) The pressure was there as was the effort any lack of endeavour by our players similar to the last fortnight would have seen a 20 goal loss. Once the boys went back to turning the game into an arm wrestle and trusting the plan they held their own, this was very much a game of two sides who play similar styles but one is currently far superior with

• their experience in terms of games played,
• executing the plan and
• being able to cover the ground both ways which is required.

Their games average yesterday would have been far superior to ours and it played a massive part in the outcome, they made better decisions which resulted in less turn overs. We turned the game into a scrappy affair and held our own, our players battled hard throughout and the fact you could not see that says more about you

• Am I happy with the loss - No
• Do I think we are still a long way off - yes the list still needs turning over
• Would I like us to be ahead of where we currently are - yes
• Can I fault the boys effort yesterday - no for the most part they held their own and gave all they had
• Have we improved - yes we have been hurt badly by injury to key players and what we now have is players who were in 2012-14 part of our regular 22 are now again getting games because that is where we are at in terms of our depth

You call many of us for accepting mediocrity, we all as Dees fans want the same but you set unrealistic timeframes to what your expectations are and when we should reach our goals

[Sir Why You Little 37,046]

FFS and that is it to you really it's all black and white, did you watch the game or are you making that assessment having occasionally checked on the scores you think that explains the game, do you really think you can compare yesterdays effort with the previous two weeks.

By your account Adelaide kicked 9 and took the foot of the pedal and allowed Meth Coast to kick the next 5 that must be how it works, and why did Collingwood take their foot of the pedal on Friday against the Cats

We dropped our heads yesterday and the structure went out the window for about 10 mins that is what killed us. The plan was the right plan in the first quarter what killed it was some turnovers and poor delivery inside 50m and being overrun in time on by a more experienced and stronger team (it happens to all sides with so many players limited on experience) The pressure was there as was the effort any lack of endeavour by our players similar to the last fortnight would have seen a 20 goal loss. Once the boys went back to turning the game into an arm wrestle and trusting the plan they held their own, this was very much a game of two sides who play similar styles but one is currently far superior with

• their experience in terms of games played,
• executing the plan and
• being able to cover the ground both ways which is required.

Their games average yesterday would have been far superior to ours and it played a massive part in the outcome, they made better decisions which resulted in less turn overs. We turned the game into a scrappy affair and held our own, our players battled hard throughout and the fact you could not see that says more about you

• Am I happy with the loss - No
• Do I think we are still a long way off - yes the list still needs turning over
• Would I like us to be ahead of where we currently are - yes
• Can I fault the boys effort yesterday - no for the most part they held their own and gave all they had
• Have we improved - yes we have been hurt badly by injury to key players and what we now have is players who were in 2012-14 part of our regular 22 are now again getting games because that is where we are at in terms of our depth

You call many of us for accepting mediocrity, we all as Dees fans want the same but you set unrealistic timeframes to what your expectations are and when we should reach our goals

Fremantle kicked the first 5 goals of the game and then the first 5 goals of the 2nd quarter. In that period of time we managed 2 points (1 was rushed) That is a lot longer than 10 minutes PSD

I am just being brutally honest

I am tired of being fed the crap year after year.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

PSD you remind me of me about 8 weeks ago.. just trying desperately to find anything that can add some some of currency to the charade that is 'we are improving'

As a matter of fact I have been singing that tune for about 9 years until they lost me in the latter half of this year

What has happened since the great win down at Geelong is nothing short of deplorable and simply cannot be excused

and you can talk for a million years but there is no set of circumstances where I will ever accepot being down ten goals to none, that is wooden spoon stuff

[Sir Why You Little 37,046]

PSD you remind me of me about 8 weeks ago.. just trying desperately to find anything that can add some some of currency to the charade that is 'we are improving'

As a matter of fact I have been singing that tune for about 9 years until they lost me in the latter half of this year

What has happened since the great win down at Geelong is nothing short of deplorable and simply cannot be excused

and you can talk for a million years but there is no set of circumstances where I will ever accepot being down ten goals to none, that is wooden spoon stuff

Exactly. The magnificent win down at The Cattery should have become the springboard for the whole club

But it sure as hell has not happened at all.

[Ethan Tremblay 30,864]

Exactly. The magnificent win down at The Cattery should have become the springboard for the whole club

But it sure as hell has not happened at all.

Any other club it most likely would have been.

I really have no idea what's going on at the MFC.

[Sir Why You Little 37,046]

Any other club it most likely would have been.

I really have no idea what's going on at the MFC.

For sure. That is why i said a couple of weeks ago that something is actually missing within the club, but nobody knows what it is

Success has elided us for so long.

[Little Richard 6,264]

Any other club it most likely would have been.

I really have no idea what's going on at the MFC.

I often fall into this thinking, but there is no denying that we are improving. Very slowly, and in often agonising fashion.

We have more wins this year, are statistically much better in a number of fields and are taking it to teams we only could have dreamed of getting close to in past years. There is clearly a serious issue with our starts in the past month. But I take a little encouragement out of the fact that in the last 3 quarters we've almost come even with some very good sides, including WBD and Freo.

It doesn't mean much when we still lost those games by significant margins, but there is a little bit of improvement there. And I'll cling to that as long as I can, because the door isn't big enough for both Rose and I and it's cold.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

Look at my signature, a measly FOUR POINTS on the scoreboard is how much we have improved since last year

[Adam The God 30,266]

PSD you remind me of me about 8 weeks ago.. just trying desperately to find anything that can add some some of currency to the charade that is 'we are improving'

As a matter of fact I have been singing that tune for about 9 years until they lost me in the latter half of this year

What has happened since the great win down at Geelong is nothing short of deplorable and simply cannot be excused

and you can talk for a million years but there is no set of circumstances where I will ever accepot being down ten goals to none, that is wooden spoon stuff

Well, no. We clearly have improved (6 wins, two better than last year). I don't disagree that we've been deplorable the last few weeks and shouldn't be excused though.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

Well, no. We clearly have improved (6 wins, two better than last year). I don't disagree that we've been deplorable the last few weeks and shouldn't be excused though.

you may have been typing over the last post

FOUR MEASLY POINTS

You could well argue also that despite having 2 more wins, we were more competitive last year because we lost 5 games by 20 points or less last year, and this year we have only lost 2 close ones, the others were all comfortable losses (15 of them including 6 by 9 goals plus)

[Deespicable 2,726]

Look at my signature, a measly FOUR POINTS on the scoreboard is how much we have improved since last year

Yes, but I think anyone who has truly been watching this season knows we have improved and that our list now is catching up with the modern game and with a few more tweaks (primarily an infusion of midfield pace, ideally another key tall, a back-up left-foot defender for Salem so that we can play down our left wing on occasions), we should be able to make significant ground on what is a transition period at the top - Hawthorn, Freo, Sydney, North and Geelong all are very old sides - and barring them manipulating the draft, we will make gains on them.

Sure you could argue we were in this position six years ago under Bailey when it looked like we had a good crop of youngsters to back up the older guys, but the young guys we had then (Morton, Blease, Strauss, Gysberts, Scully, Wonaemirri and Bennell) simply were not modern-day players and it has shown when they have tried to switch to other clubs.

Yes we still have a few on our list that don't possess the requisite requirements (disposals skills/big bodied tackling units or pace), but we now have a core group of youngsters who simply aren't going to lose ground massively and Roosy's greatest testament is that he has ensured we have an environment where guys don't do a Scully.

[Adam The God 30,266]

you may have been typing over the last post

FOUR MEASLY POINTS

You could well argue also that despite having 2 more wins, we were more competitive last year because we lost 5 games by 20 points or less last year, and this year we have only lost 2 close ones, the others were all comfortable losses (15 of them including 6 by 9 goals plus)

I think when we're on, we're very damaging and dangerous. When we're not, we're as bad as we were under Neeld.

[leucopogon 1,519]

This has been a perennial problem for years. It seems to me that when guys get the ball they often have no one to kick to, particularly going into the forward line. Commentators often say it and it seemed prevalent yesterday. Unfortunately watching it on TV you don't get the perspective. I Often get annoyed that they take too long move the ball on. Watching other sides they just seem to know a team mate will be there and handball or kick to position. Obviously there is a significant amount of faith in their mates but it must also be the game plan. We just don't seem to have it and consequently have to take that extra second to look. The other problem is the bombing it long in the Hogan direction. I get it that the team has changed week in week out and he has not really had the number of games with the same players so that they know instinctively what and where he will lead, but still they just launch it hoping he will take a huge contested mark, because thats what he does. I reckon you could count on 1 hand the times we have had a lace out pass into the forwards.

I was watching from behind the goals yesterday and paid close attention to Hogan. Don't know if he does this every week, but the thing that stood out for me is that he hardly ever leads from the goal square. Seems like he just likes to play from behind and point in the general direction of where he wants the ball bombed in so that he can try to use his body strength to nudge his opponent under the ball. This strategy came majorly unstuck yesterday because Freo had a veritable forest of tall defenders that just chopped off our slow long bomb entries. Infuriating. Hogan needs to lead hard and demand the footy in more dangerous positions if he's ever going to be a great full forward.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

I was watching from behind the goals yesterday and paid close attention to Hogan. Don't know if he does this every week, but the thing that stood out for me is that he hardly ever leads from the goal square. Seems like he just likes to play from behind and point in the general direction of where he wants the ball bombed in so that he can try to use his body strength to nudge his opponent under the ball. This strategy came majorly unstuck yesterday because Freo had a veritable forest of tall defenders that just chopped off our slow long bomb entries. Infuriating. Hogan needs to lead hard and demand the footy in more dangerous positions if he's ever going to be a great full forward.

Isn't he supposed to be following orders? So are the orders garbage or is he ignoring them? either way it's not good

[Henrietta Lumbago 331]

Well, no. We clearly have improved (6 wins, two better than last year). I don't disagree that we've been deplorable the last few weeks and shouldn't be excused though.

Roos has always said how we are going is represented by our percentage....

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

I think when we're on, we're very damaging and dangerous. When we're not, we're as bad as we were under Neeld.

What % of time would you say we are 'on'? 10? 15?

[Henrietta Lumbago 331]

Sure. I might do the same (when I'm appointed coach). But the issue we have been debating is not whether it is good policy, but whether Melb started playing competitively or if Freo had merely stopped competing.

Of course the truth could be somewhere in between. I dare say Freo would have been more frenetic if we were up a few goals going into the last quarter and they might lose a home final depending on the next week's results if they didn't win.

We didn't see Hawthorn take the foot off the pedal, because there were about 12000 supporters including me braving the conditions to support them...and put aside the fact that Brisbane was leading at quarter time, because there at least a six goal breeze blowing to that end of the ground...

No team should stop competing because it isn't fair to their supporters who have come out to watch them kick goals and compete hard..If Fremantle did stop competing, which is more than likely, for us to still loose by 10 goals is even more embarrassing.