Salem's the one who is the dangerous kick, be good to see him getting the ball in his hands more this season which should happen.

Agree but I want 22 'dangerous' kicks, so does Roos

Who was the lad wearing number 9 today?

Tyson.

Was exceptional, but I didn't mention him because it's what we saw all last year really.

Going on other reports I seem to be in the minority with Brayshaw being advanced on Petracca - so I could well have missed a few pieces of work from Petracca this morning.

All in all I left feeling very positive, which is the main thing.

Would have said a hello if I knew who to look for TDI, by the way.

Nah, we all see different things, if you can debate them in a civilised way it makes for excellent reading...9 is Vandenberg by the way, Tyson wears a bloody cap and is hard to pick out, orange laces in white boots is him and in 12

I see no reason both can't play in early rounds, I think petracca is a good chance to be sub though, looks a burst player where was brayshaw just seems more ready to run out games.

I see no reason both can't play in early rounds, I think petracca is a good chance to be sub though, looks a burst player where was brayshaw just seems more ready to run out games.

I think Roos will give them both a go in the NAB Cup, Petracca told me he is getting used to the training loads, still trying to get his weight stabilised, Brayshaw managed to lose 2k through Gastro in the last couple of weeks, missed a chunk of last week, think he wanted to impress today, absolutely shattered he lost the goal kicking comp to Nathan Jones, wouldn't tell me what the 'prize'' was

I see no reason both can't play in early rounds, I think petracca is a good chance to be sub though, looks a burst player where was brayshaw just seems more ready to run out games.

Petracca has very strong hands and good goal sense. We are more likely to see him play forward or as you say sub coming into impact forward. Like Martin at the Tiges the kids going to be a handful, and I mean in the good on ground way.

She has a point though, he's done very little in 5 years, and now having missed a big chunk of this preseason he gets one of Curry & Beer's golden tickets. Let's reserve judgement until 2016 and so on...

No need to reserve judgements - I just found it odd coming in mid Feb. The last ball kicked in anger was 5 months ago. The season is a month and a half away - let the season reveal itself of Watts' evils.

My larger point was to agree with her - I realised that Watts wouldn't be a pillar of our rise a couple years ago - that isn't to say he or we wouldn't benefit from that rise or his skills - but that others are far more important now. We would all agree Hogan, Viney, Petracca, Brayshaw, McDonald, Jones, Tyson, Dunn, Jetta, Salem, Lumumba, and I also think Frost, JKH, Kent, and Dawes are more important than Watts.

And C&Bs Golden Tickets are an unfortunate reality of life in an elite sport. To reject that players with a hampered Pre Season are worse off than their peers is to reject the idea of a Pre Season at all - if it gives a benefit than those that don't benefit are comparatively worse off.

Agree but I want 22 'dangerous' kicks, so does Roos

And if we want dangerous kicks then Matt Jones isn't in our best 22. If he looks to be improving then that's fine, but if you go by his past few seasons then we all know that he is prone to big mistakes and missing simple targets. The modern game demands that players are good kicks of the footy, and he is not one of them.

No doubt he breaks the lines and he can run to position, but Cale Morton could do that too. Jones is a handy depth player, but he isn't best 22 in a side that wants to play finals football by the end of 2016.

Yes but that is what we should be practicing, he also does miles of running to get the ball. I was on the AAMI park side of the ground for the match sim most of the time, in the last session apart from the first 5 mins, the skills from everybody were very good, I think you are nitpicking slightly, the moments that got Roos expasperated involved Tyson and Cross rather than the usual suspects

TDI, was that you with the texta in hand? If so, I was the one on the bike 5 metres away.

Unfortunately it is the 3rd NAB game for us, but I would be playing as many young guys as possible against the Bombers.

Unfortunately it is the 3rd NAB game for us, but I would be playing as many young guys as possible against the Bombers.

reckon we should boycott them, red. i'd just feel dirty playing them.

And if we want dangerous kicks then Matt Jones isn't in our best 22. If he looks to be improving then that's fine, but if you go by his past few seasons then we all know that he is prone to big mistakes and missing simple targets. The modern game demands that players are good kicks of the footy, and he is not one of them.

No doubt he breaks the lines and he can run to position, but Cale Morton could do that too. Jones is a handy depth player, but he isn't best 22 in a side that wants to play finals football by the end of 2016.

Is it his kicking or decision making?

I tend to think the latter.

Is it his kicking or decision making?

I tend to think the latter.

A combination of both I think.

His decision making is average at best, but we've also see him miss targets when he has some time and space. Both of them together doesn't make a good combination.

I've always like Matt Jones' endeavour and his ability to run with the footy, something we've lacked a bit of in the past. But what has excited me about our list is that we now don't need to play guys like Jones on a consistent basis because we have better players to choose from. That's not a knock on Jones, as he always gives 100%, but he simply shouldn't be a guy who plays regular senior footy.

A combination of both I think.

His decision making is average at best, but we've also see him miss targets when he has some time and space. Both of them together doesn't make a good combination.

I've always like Matt Jones' endeavour and his ability to run with the footy, something we've lacked a bit of in the past. But what has excited me about our list is that we now don't need to play guys like Jones on a consistent basis because we have better players to choose from. That's not a knock on Jones, as he always gives 100%, but he simply shouldn't be a guy who plays regular senior footy.

Agreed. Guys like Matt Jones, Dean Terlich and Ro Bail, who we love for giving their all, are always going to be depth in a good side. It's just we are not there yet and must play some of them too often IMO. We've gone past Nico, Tappy and Evans, love them or hate them. There's probably another 5-6 that will go in October. AFL is a cutthroat industry that doesn't stop.

A combination of both I think.

His decision making is average at best, but we've also see him miss targets when he has some time and space. Both of them together doesn't make a good combination.

I've always like Matt Jones' endeavour and his ability to run with the footy, something we've lacked a bit of in the past. But what has excited me about our list is that we now don't need to play guys like Jones on a consistent basis because we have better players to choose from. That's not a knock on Jones, as he always gives 100%, but he simply shouldn't be a guy who plays regular senior footy.

I would have said exactly the same thing previously but I thought his kicking seems to have improved from watching training today in the match sim. Granted this is not of game day pressure but he might just be ok in this area. We shall see.

I would have said exactly the same thing previously but I thought his kicking seems to have improved from watching training today in the match sim. Granted this is not of game day pressure but he might just be ok in this area. We shall see.

It wouldn't matter to me how much training I've seen over the summer - unless it improves on match day then it hasn't improved at all, training or not. Any bloke with a foot can look good without the pressure that match day brings, whether that be in some match sim or during some drills. He is only as good as his last season, and his last season showed his skills and decision making to be average at best.

Until he can consistently show improvement on match day then I put no stock in training at all.

TDI, can you please provide an injury update on Watts, Howe and Vince and when their scheduled to return to full training.

Thanks heaps.

All three seemed to move okay today, not sure what exactly the issues are

Unfortunately it is the 3rd NAB game for us, but I would be playing as many young guys as possible against the Bombers.

I think that we should play Casey, plus our Rookies and young draft picks against them!

I spent a fair amount of time in court yesterday which is what lawyers do from time to time and didn't have much time to catch up with this and other threads but must comment on how more enjoyable it is reading the last couple of training report threads now that people are getting the message that these are meant to inform and discuss the team's preseason training rather than to personally attack those who go to the trouble of reporting or pander to individual egos.

The impression I always get at this time of year is one shrouded in rose colours and I actually made the comment half seriously at the one session I was able to attend that these days our grand final is Australia Day. I know it's a bit of a cliche but I do get the feel that it's different this year.

We seem to have a lot more depth on the list having cleared away a fair amount of deadwood including some players who I describe as "cultural deadwood" in that they were recruited often as high draft picks but came through a period in which our recruiting and development aims really weren't conducive to competing with the clubs that adopted best practice. I don't think many of us would have fully recognised it at the time but the signs were there, particularly with players who lagged badly in the early running and fitness phases. We tolerated players often because they came with big reputations as juniors but perhaps didn't or couldn't work hard enough when they got here.

I think that's what's different under Roos and what I've been sensing from the reports. Perhaps, and in deference to Dennis Denuto (the Kerrigan family lawyer from the Castle), I can call it the "vibe" but like Denuto, I've been wrong before.

It wouldn't matter to me how much training I've seen over the summer - unless it improves on match day then it hasn't improved at all, training or not. Any bloke with a foot can look good without the pressure that match day brings, whether that be in some match sim or during some drills. He is only as good as his last season, and his last season showed his skills and decision making to be average at best.

Until he can consistently show improvement on match day then I put no stock in training at all.

Surely the only way he can improve his deficiencies is to work on them during training and going by reports he has worked on his disposal, and his team mates are working on running to give more options.

Agree they need to show it on match days but I'm glad they are working hard at recognizing and improving what they need to, so they can improve.

After all that is what training is for and I'm not as quick to dismiss it out of hand.

And if we want dangerous kicks then Matt Jones isn't in our best 22. If he looks to be improving then that's fine, but if you go by his past few seasons then we all know that he is prone to big mistakes and missing simple targets. The modern game demands that players are good kicks of the footy, and he is not one of them.

No doubt he breaks the lines and he can run to position, but Cale Morton could do that too. Jones is a handy depth player, but he isn't best 22 in a side that wants to play finals football by the end of 2016.

I wonder how Cale Morton would have gone if Paul Roos got hold of him a few years ago instead of a bloke like Neeld...

I still think he could have been a good player, but was mismanaged.

I wonder how Cale Morton would have gone if Paul Roos got hold of him a few years ago instead of a bloke like Neeld...

I still think he could have been a good player, but was mismanaged.

he didn't need Roos he needed a testacle donor

Surely the only way he can improve his deficiencies is to work on them during training and going by reports he has worked on his disposal, and his team mates are working on running to give more options.

Agree they need to show it on match days but I'm glad they are working hard at recognizing and improving what they need to, so they can improve.

After all that is what training is for and I'm not as quick to dismiss it out of hand.

I don't necessarily disagree with this, however, we habitually put far too much credence into what the boys are doing at training. All I want to hear is that the intensity is good, the boys are working on improving the gameplan and that we have only a few injuries to worry about. Skill level can improve but we get too carried away with it when we see blokes hitting targets under little to no pressure. We've all seen how a guy like Matt Jones has gone with the ball in hand when put under some pressure and, going by last season, he doesn't deserve a spot in our best 22.

NAB Challenge will be the opportunity to show these 'improvements', and I'm happy to be wrong, but Matt Jones wouldn't get a run in any side that finished in the Top 12 last season and that tells us all we need to know going forward.

Is it just me or do I see Max King as absent in a lot of these reports?

Is he injured or what?