Message from the President...

[DemonWA 3,934]

I hate you Melbourne.

pull your head in

[Hells Gates 505]

agreed HG, we are thinking along the same lines

it's a question now of "if" they can get the right leaders both on and off field

I reckon they have more chance at first getting off field leaders than on field.... But hopefully bringing those people into the club will attract other on field leaders across. ( Did that make sense!!)

[daisycutter 29,616]

I dont understand the people here calling for the head of schwab or mclardy. This is an administration that has saved the club and people forget that the club saviour, big Jim was Dons biggest supporter. I think he was in a better position to make a call on Don than any of us on here. We've had a [censored] start to the year, stop crying, from what ive read and seen the football department and players are on notice and if the effort levels are not there they will be dropped or told where to go. As davey, green and watts have already seen this year. If we want to see the club fail again like the last 30 years lets all go our seperate ways, have a fight and break the club. Or if we back the vision and plan of big Jim, we must come together in this time and back what we have in. It is way to early and destructive not to

DMc is a nice guy,he has made obvious mistakes but always had his heart in the right place. He is however a reluctant and de-facto Chairman resulting from JS's illness and his desire to support his old mate's legacy.

I have a sneaking suspicion (no proof) he is probably looking around for his successor in time for the next AGM. A planned and orderly succession would be preferable to a public syte fight.

CS is a perplexing mixture of the good and the bad and does tend to polarize people. His contract is up at the end of the year. There is a lot of shyte sticking to him (all not necessarily fair) over the recent failures of the last 4 years and he represents to many as a part of the problem and if we are really to complete our club wide renewal and can score a top CEO type it might be good that CS's contract is not renewed

The above is not to blame conclusively either/both for our problems but just to recognise that they were intrinsically part of it and at best were too slow to react (and the buck stops here etc etc blah blah)

Anyway that is how I see thing panning out FWIW

[rufus 1,162]

I agree Neeld is the right man for the job. They have been training the house down for 5 years!! I hate writing on here but my source, who is also a current player says that Neeld has lost a few players, not just senior players but young ones too and even some LG players also, there are quite a few. As WYL has stated maybe he went a bit too hard too soon. Having said that they are all loving the new fitness regime. Dont shoot the messenger.

If this is true it worries me more than anything else about our current situation. We badly need the Coaches and players united (right now and in the future). If there are members of the leadership group that the coach has 'lost' (and who are openly telling people about it), then this is our biggest problem at the moment and needs to be addressed.

From the outside I completely felt the club needed a hard line approach from the new coach, and fully support that having happened, but if players who have been nominated as leaders aren't all buying into the message (or perhaps more the way it is being delivered) then I hope to hell it's being addressed right now and they can all get on the same page again. If not it's going to be another stinker of a 3 year period for all of us supporters.

[Adam The God 30,260]

Read Caro's article in this morning's Age very carefully - it covers a lot of ground!

The players were told that Ross Lyon was their coach. The next day Neeld was appointed.

[rpfc 28,433]

The players were told that Ross Lyon was their coach. The next day Neeld was appointed.

Where did you hear that?

And where did the person who told you hear that?

I think we have a few urban legends spawning like the one about us turning down the Sewell trade (we didn't, Ferguson refused to be traded).

[Geddy Lee 582]

The players were told that Ross Lyon was their coach. The next day Neeld was appointed.

Sauce?

[Adam The God 30,260]

I heard it from the best mate of one of the players. Not exactly from the horses mouth, but close enough.

[rpfc 28,433]

I heard it from the best mate of one of the players. Not exactly from the horses mouth, but close enough.

I just question it because I have heard that we had little interest in Lyon after his agent said he was happy at St Kilda and we moved on. Little did his agent know that Lyon had contacted Fremantle and organised it himself...

Remember, when Lyon was appointed coach of Fremantle the footy world was completely shocked, and Neeld was annointed the next day by Lyon on radio with the presser the following saturday.

So if your timeline of 'the next day' that would be a flatly erroneous. Our heart was set (very set) on Neeld during the Fremantle bombshell.

If a player was told "we are trying to get Lyon" and a few weeks later we got Neeld then that is different, but it is also completely innocent and a nothing story.

[Adam The God 30,260]

If a player was told "we are trying to get Lyon" and a few weeks later we got Neeld then that is different, but it is also completely innocent and a nothing story.

I'd agree. But that's not the case, as I understand it.

You're right though, because something doesn't quite add up. You don't tell the players they've got a certain coach before he's actually signed.

[Scoop Junior 3,472]

Fan: I'm not disagreeing with the idea that the older players may have been treated poorly. As a supporter I'm too far removed from the inner sanctum to know exactly how they've been treated and how they feel.

But a couple things:

1) I'm not necessarily agreeing on all of those senior players you mentioned being shadows. Green and Davey are simply coming to the end of their careers and are arguably are no longer best 22 players. Green was just as poor last year under Bailey and don't forget that Davey was also dropped last year under Bailey. In fact, I would argue that I've seen a "harder" Davey this year. He has definitely gone in harder for the ball then he did last year (and who could forget that shirk against St Kilda at Etihad).

Rivers I think has played reasonable footy this year and has been around about the level he produced last year.

The only two who I would say are shadows today based on their past output are Moloney and Sylvia. The effort has not been there from them this year.

2) The other point is that if the senior players are upset at how they've been treated, this in no way excuses or allows them to perform as they've performed this year. In fact, a lack of effort from any senior player says more about them than it does about how they've been treated, and it provides further support for their demotion from the leadership group. If you are so mentally weak as a footballer that you will go out and represent your football club and fail to put in the required effort because of some off-field issues then you are not the right type of person to lead the footy club.

As Paul Roos said on On the Couch last night, these players have not put in the required effort under Bailey, they didn't put in the required effort under Viney and now they're not doing it under Neeld. This means that they are just refusing to do as instructed and says more about them then it does about the coaching staff or footy department.

Also, I haven't seen the Collingwood players sooking after they lost their much loved coach. They have gone about their business this year in a professional way and have hit a pretty good patch of form.

Lastly, it is also worth mentioning that we have been complaining about our senior players for years. This is nothing new. How many times in the last few years have we said that our leaders did not stand up in a pressure situation during a game. This is something that has been going on for a long time and has been recognised as going on for a long time.

[robbiefrom13 887]

Looks like Roos and Sheahan liked my question Daisy and McLardy's response was damning. Not his fault, he just didn't want to tell the truth.

IMO the club has handled the older players so poorly it's no surprise they haven't "bought in". The organization has ostracised the older players and particularly last years leadership group. We all know they had limitations but under Bailey they did as well as their ability allowed and the playing group were united and commited. When McLardy and Stynes interviewed the leadership group leading into the Geelong match the leaders spilled their guts on Schwab, Connolly and one or two others. They supported Bailey. McLardy listened, thanked them and acted. Schwab would not be extendedand Bailey was likely to be. This all changed post 186 and Bailey and a few others who were in the Bailey camp were dumped and in Bailey's case in the worst of ways. The playing group and leadership group in particular felt responsible.

The players are not "politically savvy". They thought they were doing the right thing. But they have, almost to a man, been dumped and humiliated by the current football department. Their loyalty to the club has counted for nothing. No wonder Moloney, Green, Davey and to a lesser extent Rivers are shadows today and their older mates like Jamar and Sylvia impacted as well.

You reap what you sow. The FD lost the respect of those players and I can understand why. MFC have a history of treating its older players very poorly. And please don't come back with "but they're professionals". They are humans with all the feelings and reactions that go with it. They've been told they're not wanted. What did you expect?

Just a thought - what if the reaction on the Saturday night/Sunday morning was not so much a reaction to the 186 massacre as to the sacking of Schwab? (The massacre being an excuse which allowed for swift and decisive reaction to the undermining of Schwab...)

Who were the prime movers of the reaction, and who were their mates? And who - other than Bailey - has been clobbered for whatever it was that was reacted to? (Were they the ones to be blamed for the massacre?)

I know it's wrong to speculate, but McLardy is not speaking and we do think it is obvious that there is a problem needing identification...

(Such a scenario would presumably have included the senior players being very well aware of what was to come, once McLardy thanked them - could easily have unnerved them before the game. And, of course, it has nothing to do with Neeld, and how could he possibly succeed in his job with such a piece of history hanging over the place?)

Edited May 22, 2012 by robbiefrom13

[Geddy Lee 582]

Lastly, it is also worth mentioning that we have been complaining about our senior players for years. This is nothing new. How many times in the last few years have we said that our leaders did not stand up in a pressure situation during a game. This is something that has been going on for a long time and has been recognised as going on for a long time.

Excellent point Scoop.

It's a long time since Neitz, Viney, Lyon.

James McDonald was a leader but could not influence games like the above. We have lacked leadership for so long on-field it is verging on the statistically improbable.

[Rogue 585]

I only ask because I am surprised I never heard more of it, especially with someone like Buckley going to Collingwood.

I don't remember specifics, but I remember Buckley commenting on it (as I said earlier in the thread).

[old dee 23,791]

DMc is a nice guy,he has made obvious mistakes but always had his heart in the right place. He is however a reluctant and de-facto Chairman resulting from JS's illness and his desire to support his old mate's legacy.

I have a sneaking suspicion (no proof) he is probably looking around for his successor in time for the next AGM. A planned and orderly succession would be preferable to a public syte fight.

CS is a perplexing mixture of the good and the bad and does tend to polarize people. His contract is up at the end of the year. There is a lot of shyte sticking to him (all not necessarily fair) over the recent failures of the last 4 years and he represents to many as a part of the problem and if we are really to complete our club wide renewal and can score a top CEO type it might be good that CS's contract is not renewed

The above is not to blame conclusively either/both for our problems but just to recognise that they were intrinsically part of it and at best were too slow to react (and the buck stops here etc etc blah blah)

Anyway that is how I see thing panning out FWIW

FWIW I agree with you DC

The big problem that I see DC is who would want either of their jobs?

I do not see too many putting up their hands for DMc's job

And how are we going to entice anyone that is very good to the GM position.

Anyone of the type we want is going to run a mile in the opposite direction.

[daisycutter 29,616]

FWIW I agree with you DC

The big problem that I see DC is who would want either of their jobs?

I do not see too many putting up their hands for DMc's job

And how are we going to entice anyone that is very good to the GM position.

Anyone of the type we want is going to run a mile in the opposite direction.

not necessarily od. there are many attractive things about the club and there are people out there that relish a challenge (and an opportunity to be a hero)

the renewal of the total club is part done anyway, just needs a bit more cleanup

oh and of course..........patience (I nearly wrote patient as that's what I feel I will be before it is done)

[rjay 24,928]

FWIW I agree with you DC

The big problem that I see DC is who would want either of their jobs?

I do not see too many putting up their hands for DMc's job

And how are we going to entice anyone that is very good to the GM position.

Anyone of the type we want is going to run a mile in the opposite direction.

A good salary plus the challenge is how we get someone to the club. With a big part of the friction gone a good CEO would be able to get things moving again in all areas of the club, I don't think we stand a chance until this is done.

By the way where is our new recruiting manager, starting after this coming draft????

Surely we can't be serious; when Essendon were struggling they didn't p around they firstly went and poached Hawthorns CEO to set things up then got Heard, Thompson and even got one of our guys who had just signed on to stay with us.

[Norm Smith's Curse 2,602]

I'd agree. But that's not the case, as I understand it.

You're right though, because something doesn't quite add up. You don't tell the players they've got a certain coach before he's actually signed.

I heard we couldnt afford Lyon

[Deemanding 15]

Tom Scully represents everything I hate about football and this club

-He represents our continual failure. We lay in the gutter and tanked, only to have our 'prize' taken off us. That's cos we are a weak, poor, minnow club.

-He represents another 'elite' football person that was 'too good' for our amatueur outfit. Under no circumstances must the MFC ever have anything off the top shelf. From the CEO to the bootstudder. It is in the constitution.

-He represents the death of loyalty in football, and the individual greed of most people in life who put money well before anything else life has to offer, as well as the tendency of people to lie and sneak around in order to satisfy this greed.

-He represents the modern athlete, who is nothing but a mercenary. He is a non-drinking robot who probably doesnt have any mates at all because he was too busy running laps his whole life. Let's never hang out.

Most of all he is just another chapter in our pathetic story. Another example of how we manage to balls everything up. Look at the 8 number1 draft picks from 2000-2007: Riewoldt, Hodge, Goddard, Cooney, Deledio, Murphy, Gibbs and Kruezer. Then there was Swallow in '11. Think about the service they have/will given to their clubs. What happened with us? Watts and Scully. You beauty. Then you chuck Morton, Sylvia, McLean and Trengove(who has joined the elite-gone-stale club) and its enough to make you eat a bullet.

Watching the Tigers/Dons game on Saturday made me want to cry. Two clubs rising out of their bad patch under new coaches. Each loaded with high draft picks that are paying dividends. The passion, the heart, the individual brilliance. The big crowd and the tight contest. The bright future for all to savour. These are not the experiences of the Melbourne supporter. This is not our domain. Through it all, year after year, the pain is multiplied byt he constant media-bashing and sniggering of everyone you know about how bad we are.

I have to resent my dear-departed Grandfather for picking this club. In his defence it was the 1940s and he had no idea that 70 years later his descendants would be putting up with this nightmare.

I hate you Melbourne.

I feel your pain

[old dee 23,791]

not necessarily od. there are many attractive things about the club and there are people out there that relish a challenge (and an opportunity to be a hero)

the renewal of the total club is part done anyway, just needs a bit more cleanup

oh and of course..........patience (I nearly wrote patient as that's what I feel I will be before it is done)

The bed next to me is vacant DC but I have to type under the blankets when we get past lights out at 8.00 PM.

There is a distinct lake of oxygen under here, I think it is starting to affect my thought process but may be that is the tablets they insist I swallow.

Please hurry DC it is lonely in here almost as lonely as the MFC after match player get togethers

[Sir Why You Little 37,039]

Tom Scully represents everything I hate about football and this club

-He represents our continual failure. We lay in the gutter and tanked, only to have our 'prize' taken off us. That's cos we are a weak, poor, minnow club.

-He represents another 'elite' football person that was 'too good' for our amatueur outfit. Under no circumstances must the MFC ever have anything off the top shelf. From the CEO to the bootstudder. It is in the constitution.

-He represents the death of loyalty in football, and the individual greed of most people in life who put money well before anything else life has to offer, as well as the tendency of people to lie and sneak around in order to satisfy this greed.

-He represents the modern athlete, who is nothing but a mercenary. He is a non-drinking robot who probably doesnt have any mates at all because he was too busy running laps his whole life. Let's never hang out.

Most of all he is just another chapter in our pathetic story. Another example of how we manage to balls everything up. Look at the 8 number1 draft picks from 2000-2007: Riewoldt, Hodge, Goddard, Cooney, Deledio, Murphy, Gibbs and Kruezer. Then there was Swallow in '11. Think about the service they have/will given to their clubs. What happened with us? Watts and Scully. You beauty. Then you chuck Morton, Sylvia, McLean and Trengove(who has joined the elite-gone-stale club) and its enough to make you eat a bullet.

Watching the Tigers/Dons game on Saturday made me want to cry. Two clubs rising out of their bad patch under new coaches. Each loaded with high draft picks that are paying dividends. The passion, the heart, the individual brilliance. The big crowd and the tight contest. The bright future for all to savour. These are not the experiences of the Melbourne supporter. This is not our domain. Through it all, year after year, the pain is multiplied byt he constant media-bashing and sniggering of everyone you know about how bad we are.

I have to resent my dear-departed Grandfather for picking this club. In his defence it was the 1940s and he had no idea that 70 years later his descendants would be putting up with this nightmare.

I hate you Melbourne.

I haven't always agreed with your views C & B...But this is a mighty strong piece of writing....It does say a lot of things that i have thought for a long time.

We are not dead, yet..But we do keep F^&*'ing up..& it drives me beyond crazy!!

2 months after Jim leaves us all...look at this current week. It is adisgrace.

This club IS BETTER THAN THAT..But we the supporter have been too quiet for too long.

I would send this to the club and to all the newspapers & to the relevant Radio Stations.

This piece of writing just might wake up the inner soul of the MFC...That is the problem.

THE SOUL OF THIS CLUB needs to be woken.

This piece sure just woke MINE.

We will have 90,000 at our home ground....Back the coach to do what must be done. He has Malthouse and Craig as Back up

I do not understand the older players, but i am not them....but we must move on.

DEMONS...

Edited May 22, 2012 by why you little

[Je Roos Salem 661]

Does anyone else get the impression that our club is run by robots? Cameron Schwab- Chief Robot.

[Hardnut 327]

A very small point in this massive debate, but was it only MFC who 'tanked' in recent years? My memory is that we played Carlton in the last round one year and surprisingly won, giving them a significant pick!

[Sir Why You Little 37,039]

Does anyone else get the impression that our club is run by robots? Cameron Schwab- Chief Robot.

That is exactly what i am talking about...

Where is the soul? The energy of past players....?

it is what the club doesn't have....We need a place to meet after games to share a beer, stories of how we all saw the game in different ways.

Right now there is none of that....it is all waiting, be patient we will fix....

I for one am sick of that...I want to see the crowd on sunday really give it to this club.....

We have a right to expect Bang for the Buck....Most AFL Clubs do it regularly...The MFC is different.

Bullsh!t you are....Just get out there and play tough footy...GET DIRTY...dirt on your hands...be proud of it.

[Dannyz 2,759]

The whole 'Neeld is our man, he's a strong character who will make these guys work hard' reaks of local suburban football to me. That is not how you get the best out of elite athletes.