The Gaffer coming home?

[Guest Dr Who]

To the contrary, the above comparison doesn't in fact say anything about the respective draft depths. At all. It's far too small a sample.

I accept I did not fully explain my point. It it should have been expanded to include many more drafts. However, time is a premium. It was merely one example and with no time restrictions I'm sure we all can come up with many more where it is fraught with danger comparing players from different drafts taken at pick number x.

This is not a game of bingo - we're actually talking about parting with low end first round picks we received for ONE player to try and secure an equivalent player to the ONE player we lost.

Your argument, to my mind, just doesn't stack up.

This is where your argument just does not stack up for me.

Funny thing is given we where forced to use the picks last year I would have agreed it was not a good compensation package. So yes, last year I would have done the deal. Two picks for Gaff. However, Gaff was not up for trade last year!!!

However, we have the ability to use those picks in a premium draft. We have the ability to sell in one market and buy in another - huge, huge advantage. Some argue that we did not get a premium price for Scully. I would argue its a luck break for us, we might have undersold him via the compensation we received but the buying power of that compensation in NEXT years draft is gold, gold, gold. (according to the pundits in the know)

[BIG JIM 508]

It would have been seen it as a slight loss, but Gaff doesnt have the injury concerns that Scully has.

Both are very similar imo, both high possession getters, Gaff with better disposal!

Really this is a silly comment now i hate scully alot but to say there very similar and gaff has better disposal says to me sour grapes. Scully is a much bigger prospect than Gaff. I would give up 1 compo pick and a 2nd rnd pick for Gaff. And it also depends on were we finish if we have a averge year we could be looking at picks 6,7 and 11 or 12 in a super draft so to say you would trade both picks is crazy. But everyone is hopeing for the best result i know because we lost a number 1 pick but lets just say i would be happy to trade 2 picks for a ready made gun like bartel or swan not Gaff. Lets not take a risk with these very good picks. We are 1 or 2 star players from having a real crack at a flag over the next 3 to 5 years. Lets not waste the best chance we have had since the late 80s. Does anyone think we should make a play for deledio?. He is coming out of contract and would add some class.

[1 red eye 1 blue eye 754]

Don't know a lot about Gaff myself but sounds good. I think from how I'm reading what's coming out of the club the question that may be needed to be asked is, has he got "grunt"?

[Jordie_tackles 354]

Really this is a silly comment now i hate scully alot but to say there very similar and gaff has better disposal says to me sour grapes.

Scully's worst trait is his poor disposal, its a fact, he kicks helicoters, i rate Scully he will be a very good player but he has limitations. WC supporters rate Gaffs disposal highly.

Scully is a much bigger prospect than Gaff.

Why?

I would give up 1 compo pick and a 2nd rnd pick for Gaff.

And WC would tell you to go get F@cked

And it also depends on were we finish if we have a averge year we could be looking at picks 6,7 and 11 or 12 in a super draft so to say you would trade both picks is crazy.

I said both picks, working on the numbers stated 10-17

But everyone is hopeing for the best result i know because we lost a number 1 pick but lets just say i would be happy to trade 2 picks for a ready made gun like bartel or swan not Gaff.

If you did that would be silly, those players have 3 years left in them.......Gaff is far far more valuable than both of them.

Lets not take a risk with these very good picks. We are 1 or 2 star players from having a real crack at a flag over the next 3 to 5 years. Lets not waste the best chance we have had since the late 80s. Does anyone think we should make a play for deledio?. He is coming out of contract and would add some class.

I dont know if Deledio is pure mid or not, plays well off the HBF but has been a while since he was a pure mid, which is what we need.

I think you got a bit excited, i obviously wouldnt trade 2 top 10 picks for Gaff, but i will take to first rounders to get him imo.

Scully has his issues, Knee's ect, playing in a rubbish team will hurt him imo.

And i am a Scully fan, cant say he wont be good, but doesnt mean i have to think he can kick

Gaff is a top 4 pick, mids picked in the top 4 are normally very very good, Gaff imo is of this quality,

The other big one is that we have another year to see Gaff play, once he plays full minutes not a sa sub his numbers will spike but 5+ possessions a game imo which is big. He is an accumulator like this and apparently has great disposal.

We will obviously re assess at the end of the season once we know alot more about all the players on offer, Danger, Deledio, Gaff, Caddy ect

Edited February 22, 2012 by Jordie_tackles

[BIG JIM 508]

I think you got a bit excited, i obviously wouldnt trade 2 top 10 picks for Gaff, but i will take to first rounders to get him imo.

Scully has his issues, Knee's ect, playing in a rubbish team will hurt him imo.

And i am a Scully fan, cant say he wont be good, but doesnt mean i have to think he can kick

Gaff is a top 4 pick, mids picked in the top 4 are normally very very good, Gaff imo is of this quality,

The other big one is that we have another year to see Gaff play, once he plays full minutes not a sa sub his numbers will spike but 5+ possessions a game imo which is big. He is an accumulator like this and apparently has great disposal.

We will obviously re assess at the end of the season once we know alot more about all the players on offer, Danger, Deledio, Gaff, Caddy ect

No scully is a much bigger prospect because teams dont throw 6 million to a kid with out doing there home work fullstop. They no more then you and me. And west coast will not tell me to get f%%% because if they do get to greedy and the kid wants out we have seen what can happen . And a top ten pick and a 2nd round pick is not a bad deal if he is home sick. So lets just say we have a diffrent view on this subject after all we both want the best for melbourne and its a good problem to have cheers.

[Pennant St Dee 11,322]

I have seen a fair bit of Gaff at WAFL level and also watched him carefully for the Eagles, he will be a gem. Uses the ball very well and makes the right decisions. He is very cool under pressure and is one of those players that seems to have that extra bit of time. Not sure about giving up 2 priority picks for him but like others have said see what happens. He could have a great year and we will be forced to use the picks to get him.

Cant see Carlton or Collingwood getting him they will struggle big time to fit him into their caps with their midfield stars on big dollars already, especially with Pendlebury coming out of contract at the end of the year. Essendon will make a big play for him IMO

[Jordie_tackles 354]

No scully is a much bigger prospect because teams dont throw 6 million to a kid with out doing there home work fullstop. They no more then you and me. And west coast will not tell me to get f%%% because if they do get to greedy and the kid wants out we have seen what can happen . And a top ten pick and a 2nd round pick is not a bad deal if he is home sick. So lets just say we have a diffrent view on this subject after all we both want the best for melbourne and its a good problem to have cheers.

Brisbane getting screwed by freo, new club steps in "us: steal the deal

Brisbane won that one

[rpfc 27,476]

Your first line goes without saying and funnily enough your second line goes without saying. Any other gems ?

Does it 'go without saying?'

Many have disagreed with the sentiment.

And they are all gems, BH...

[Hannibal 5,814]

Does it 'go without saying?'

Many have disagreed with the sentiment.

You said, "If we have to pull the trigger on the second pick for the right player I wouldn't hesitate".

You mean not everyone would give up a two 10+ picks for someone like Goddard ? Wow. I'd give up those picks for Shuey without hesitating.

You said, "We're trying to win a flag here".

You mean not everyone wants to win a flag ? Wow. A flag is the only measure of success and nothing else matters. These posters must be deleting their contributions before I spot them. Lucky you're here to point them in the right direction.

[rpfc 27,476]

You said, "We're trying to win a flag here".

You mean not everyone wants to win a flag ? Wow. A flag is the only measure of success and nothing else matters. These posters must be deleting their contributions before I spot them. Lucky you're here to point them in the right direction.

Funny you should say this, as it is exactly what I wanted you to say.

We had a huge thread on Land a couple years ago about whether or not "nothing else matters but winning a flag."

Apparently, to some people the club exists to exist, and not to win flags so I am happy with my statement of the not-so-obvious.

[Hannibal 5,814]

Funny you should say this, as it is exactly what I wanted you to say.

We had a huge thread on Land a couple years ago about whether or not "nothing else matters but winning a flag."

Apparently, to some people the club exists to exist, and not to win flags so I am happy with my statement of the not-so-obvious.

Wish I was around then ...

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

Wish I was around then ...

Second that....

[rpfc 27,476]

Wish I was around then ...

Second that....

http://demonland.com/forums/index.php?/topic/16100-what-is-the-essence-of-a-football-clubs-existence/page__pid__252374#entry252374

If you guys are keen for a semantical argument about 'existence' and 'sole/primary'...

[simma02 53]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/129490/default.aspx

Thread Closed.........................

[McQueen 17,864]

http://www.afl.com.a...90/default.aspx

Thread Closed.........................

Have to agree.

Seems like some very solid talk but would still like to see him say it on video. As we all know, contract talks can take 'all season'.

[dee-luded 2,958]

http://www.afl.com.a...90/default.aspx

Thread Closed.........................

Oh, enter GWS??? Until that Sig' is 'On', & the ink dry, then I'll think it's dusted.

[Sir Why You Little 34,527]

Oh, enter GWS??? Until that Sig' is 'On', & the ink dry, then I'll think it's dusted.

I was just thinking that....A certain person said in a press conference last year that "He wanted to be a one club player"....and now isn't..so until that contract is signed....

Game On.

[BIG JIM 508]

I was just thinking that....A certain person said in a press conference last year that "He wanted to be a one club player"....and now isn't..so until that contract is signed....

Game On.

Yes i think i can remember somthing like that. Still cuts me deep but compo picks should make me feel better very soon.

[Watts Cook n 0]

Gaff didn't hook up with a fem until he was 19 and was handballed the bird by WCE players. Says alot about a bloke...

[McQueen 17,864]

Gaff didn't hook up with a fem until he was 19 and was handballed the bird by WCE players. Says alot about a bloke...

Can you please expand on what you're saying. I'm unable to make sense of it.

[rpfc 27,476]

Can you please expand on what you're saying. I'm unable to make sense of it.

Can't find his own footy, so to speak...

[Macca 16,173]

Can't find his own footy, so to speak...

That'd make a certain Demon midfielder a veritable ladies man then .

[Ron Burgundy 8,584]

The simple reality is, it's highly unlikely we'll get him. Always was. Nonetheless, some of the wise men here thought that any offer less than one compo pick would secure him - if not, it would be too much to offer.

Well, the reality is this folks:

"Highlighting his potential, coach John Worsfold said he was not only optimistic the club would retain Gaff, but "confident he'll become one of our great players".

"His athletic profile is elite and his football smarts look elite as well from what we've seen," Worsfold said. "So the talent, nous and the physical attributes to perform are all there."

We'd be bloody lucky to get him with our two compo picks, let alone one of them. This is a science fact.

No wonder the MFC is seen to have delusional supporters.

And are Dr Who and Ben-Hur the same poster?

[Hannibal 5,814]

The simple reality is, it's highly unlikely we'll get him. Always was. Nonetheless, some of the wise men here thought that any offer less than one compo pick would secure him - if not, it would be too much to offer. Well, the reality is this folks: "Highlighting his potential, coach John Worsfold said he was not only optimistic the club would retain Gaff, but "confident he'll become one of our great players". "His athletic profile is elite and his football smarts look elite as well from what we've seen," Worsfold said. "So the talent, nous and the physical attributes to perform are all there." We'd be bloody lucky to get him with our two compo picks, let alone one of them. This is a science fact. No wonder the MFC is seen to have delusional supporters. And are Dr Who and Ben-Hur the same poster?

You know Ron, all we're doing is quibbling on price. If I don't reckon Gaff is worth two first round draft picks in this year's super draft it doesn't mean I don't rate him. It doesn't have to be either or. I do rate him and I'd happily give up two first round draft picks if the draft was the equivalent quality of 2003. I reckon that a pick around 11 or 12 in this year's draft may well be every bit as good as Gaff. If I'm right why would I want to give up two Gaff's for one ? Remember, Gaff comes from a compromised draft pool. I'd certainly give up one of those picks and a player, or another pick. Under the right circumstances I'd give up both picks, just not for a player that presently has one year under his belt. Who knows, by year's end I may have changed my tune based on another year of footy.

Right now, I rate Gysbert's the equal to Gaff. In fact his stats are better. Btw, I'm not basing my opinion on stats and I accept I've seen more of Gysberts. Perhaps I overrate Gysberts. Maybe I rate him more than some other supporters. But 190cm inside mids with great decision making who know how to find the footy don't grow on trees. We've only seen a glimpse of how good Gysberts will be. Do you think other clubs would give up two first round draft picks for Gysberts in this year's draft ?

Forgive me if I'll not place too much emphasis on a coach's comments about an out of contract player that he's trying to retain (once again, that doesn't mean that I don't rate Gaff, as I do).

And to answer your final question, no, we're different posters. We just happen to try and evaluate decisions without typically blinkered supporter emotion.

[green_machine 36]

You know Ron, all we're doing is quibbling on price. If I don't reckon Gaff is worth two first round draft picks in this year's super draft it doesn't mean I don't rate him. It doesn't have to be either or. I do rate him and I'd happily give up two first round draft picks if the draft was the equivalent quality of 2003. I reckon that a pick around 11 or 12 in this year's draft may well be every bit as good as Gaff. If I'm right why would I want to give up two Gaff's for one ? Remember, Gaff comes from a compromised draft pool. I'd certainly give up one of those picks and a player, or another pick. Under the right circumstances I'd give up both picks, just not for a player that presently has one year under his belt. Who knows, by year's end I may have changed my tune based on another year of footy.

Right now, I rate Gysbert's the equal to Gaff. In fact his stats are better. Btw, I'm not basing my opinion on stats and I accept I've seen more of Gysberts. Perhaps I overrate Gysberts. Maybe I rate him more than some other supporters. But 190cm inside mids with great decision making who know how to find the footy don't grow on trees. We've only seen a glimpse of how good Gysberts will be. Do you think other clubs would give up two first round draft picks for Gysberts in this year's draft ?

Forgive me if I'll not place too much emphasis on a coach's comments about an out of contract player that he's trying to retain (once again, that doesn't mean that I don't rate Gaff, as I do).

And to answer your final question, no, we're different posters. We just happen to try and evaluate decisions without typically blinkered supporter emotion.

With all due respect it seems like you do not understand how the draft works

Two picks at these levels represents a chance of getting a good player, but probably an avg player Dunn/bate anyone? I think there are about ten players in the last ten years taken in the range of our picks that are better than gaff

Quick statistic course that means that in the draft we have a 20% chance using both super compo picks to get someone who will be top ten at there club

As for people linking this to sully it is a terrible argument

Look at g abelett. Geelong got two compo picks let's say 8&12

Only comparable trade is Judd which was for pick 3, 20?, and Kennedy ( probably equivalent to pick 3 in terms of value)

Geelong got screwed on the same basis melb got screwed

We are not getting sulky back we have two picks that from a trade perspective might get a decent player and or gamble in the draft and probably get nothing.

Yes I am going on record that our recruiting people paid less or the same as the other 17 teams are not some how superior because they work for Melbourne.

Let us try to put some realism into our arguments

Btw if you going to do a rebuttal try to base it on the facts. Ie in this past draft we would have got xy&z therefore draft is better

If you can't do that don't do anything. Quoting this is a super draft so .... Does not count

Edited February 24, 2012 by green_machine