Fourteen losses so far. The worst in a long time - since 2019.

But in six games in season 2025 , the Dees were well within grasp of victory

Pies 1 point

Giants 3 points

Saints 6 points

Bulldogs 6 points

Blues 8 points

Crows 13 points

In some of these, the Dees snatched defeat from the jaws of victory.

Dees were smelling victory but seemingly lost due to a combination of

Knowing how to win

Fitness

Decision making

True Desire

Poor Umpiring

Some good ball movement today but not so good skills.

We need a coach with a winning culture.

Just now, spirit of norm smith said:

Fourteen losses so far. The worst in a long time - since 2019.

But in six games in season 2025 , the Dees were well within grasp of victory

Pies 1 point

Giants 3 points

Saints 6 points

Bulldogs 6 points

Blues 8 points

Crows 13 points

In some of these, the Dees snatched defeat from the jaws of victory.

Dees were smelling victory but seemingly lost due to a combination of

Knowing how to win

Fitness

Decision making

True Desire

Poor Umpiring

I listened to an interview with fitness coach Andrew Russel about his time at Carlton (he was at Hawthorn during their golden era) and he said two things that really stuck out to me:

1. Carlton had a mindset of losing. They were used to losing and that becomes ingrained in players and the culture. He said in the Prelim where they lost to Lions from being 5 goals up, they were 2 points down at half time but he was confused, as the feeling in the rooms was they were down by 10 goals.

2. At the end of that game, he was expecting everyone to be angry/heartbroken at the loss, but instead Carlton was cheered off the ground in that game and he found the whole thing bizarre as that just wasn’t ever a mindset he experienced at Hawthorn.

He basically said there was the big disconnect between what was happening and everyone’s response.

Makes me wonder about these close losses.

Inability of our experienced mids to hit targets more than anything

Viney culprit #1, Petracca #2

As much as Oliver has the odd brain fade with his kicking I find he is always cleaner than the above pair and usually plays more within his limitations

I know it is not the answer but to my memory, under Northey we never lost the close ones.

I think back then the players just had a mindset of somehow getting the ball forward and somehow kicking the necessary score and then defending as if their lives depended on it

3 hours ago, BoBo said:

I listened to an interview with fitness coach Andrew Russel about his time at Carlton (he was at Hawthorn during their golden era) and he said two things that really stuck out to me:

1. Carlton had a mindset of losing. They were used to losing and that becomes ingrained in players and the culture. He said in the Prelim where they lost to Lions from being 5 goals up, they were 2 points down at half time but he was confused, as the feeling in the rooms was they were down by 10 goals.

2. At the end of that game, he was expecting everyone to be angry/heartbroken at the loss, but instead Carlton was cheered off the ground in that game and he found the whole thing bizarre as that just wasn’t ever a mindset he experienced at Hawthorn.

He basically said there was the big disconnect between what was happening and everyone’s response.

Makes me wonder about these close losses.

This is going to sound crazy, but I don't think Gawn is great when we lose. It's probably unfair as we know little about what happens inside the 4 walls. However, he has plenty of interviews where, in my opinion, he gives off a laid back attitude/vibe. Probably because it's in his nature to be light hearted, crack a joke etc.

I think on the other side of the coin you have Jack, who in his first year was telling his teammates he was embarrassed at the lack of fight in the team. So a middle ground probably needs to be struck.

Further to BoBo's point, one thing that stuck with me was an interview Oliver did after we lost to Adelaide by a few points in the season we won the flag. The battling Crows ended our long unbeaten run, and spoiled Clarry's milestone game from memory. Oliver had 30+ and kicked 2 or 3, basically willed us to the line and we lost. Post game he just said: "not a lot of positives to take to be honest, I hate losing."

Those words from Oliver made me believe we were on for the flag more than any of our previous performances. So now when I look at Clarry and the other senior boys, I ask myself, do they hate losing as much as they once did?

4 hours ago, spirit of norm smith said:

Fourteen losses so far. The worst in a long time - since 2019.

But in six games in season 2025 , the Dees were well within grasp of victory

Pies 1 point

Giants 3 points

Saints 6 points

Bulldogs 6 points

Blues 8 points

Crows 13 points

In some of these, the Dees snatched defeat from the jaws of victory.

Dees were smelling victory but seemingly lost due to a combination of

Knowing how to win

Fitness

Decision making

True Desire

Poor Umpiring

Whilst I a agree you can kind of find excuses for a few of them.

Pies - i can't remember my phone blowing up from neutral supporters (everyone hates Collingwood but almost nuetral) like it did after that game. Everybody was saying the umpiring was a disgrace

Giants - we debut 6 kids

Saints - get done by a technicality

Bulldogs - outplayed by a team desperate to make finals

Blues - embaressing loss

Crows - best team in the league and we only lost because Pickett was sent off for concussion protocol's in dubious circumstances

Don't even get me started about the hawthorn game when kozzie was running into an open goal and got deliberately tripped. No MRO, not even a free kick. He kicks that goal and our season is up and running

1 hour ago, MurDoc516 said:

This is going to sound crazy, but I don't think Gawn is great when we lose. It's probably unfair as we know little about what happens inside the 4 walls. However, he has plenty of interviews where, in my opinion, he gives off a laid back attitude/vibe. Probably because it's in his nature to be light hearted, crack a joke etc.

If you saw the look on Max's face after the siren today you will know what you've said here is not true.

He was filthy...

1 hour ago, rjay said:

If you saw the look on Max's face after the siren today you will know what you've said here is not true.

He was filthy...

He must've been filthy a lot this season then... hasn't changed anything.

3 hours ago, Wrecker45 said:

Whilst I a agree you can kind of find excuses for a few of them.

Pies - i can't remember my phone blowing up from neutral supporters (everyone hates Collingwood but almost nuetral) like it did after that game. Everybody was saying the umpiring was a disgrace

Giants - we debut 6 kids

Saints - get done by a technicality

Bulldogs - outplayed by a team desperate to make finals

Blues - embaressing loss

Crows - best team in the league and we only lost because Pickett was sent off for concussion protocol's in dubious circumstances

Don't even get me started about the hawthorn game when kozzie was running into an open goal and got deliberately tripped. No MRO, not even a free kick. He kicks that goal and our season is up and running

Saints technicality .. we blew a 46 point lead!

It happened often last year too… this isn’t just a 2025 thing. It’s been happening since we lost 2 close finals in 2023. I can barely remember the last game under a goal we won. Bad kicking for goal, missed opportunities, simple errors, umpires, plain bad luck. But the fact is that losing a lot of close ones does say something about a team.

The positive. The dees ARE showing we’re not that far away. We’re matching it with everyone else’s n fact and I was proud of them today. But Bridging that small gap and walking away with more wins than losses is a mindset/ fitness/ skill thing that a new coach is going to have to change.

Max aside, we can’t rely on our senior expensive stars to stand up and execute when it matters. It’s a huge problem and greatly contributes to not being able to close out close games

Petracca’s inconsistent output and horrific ball use is very deflating. Viney tries his hardest but he is extremely limited as a player. The game has gone past Clarry and I don’t think he has the tools to become a dominant force again.

We can’t expect to win close games late in the season off the back of our younger players, it’s the senior players that need to drag us over the line and sadly Max can’t do it every week on his own.

I really hope we make some ruthless trades this off season. We’ll be relevant again with this young core group and some astute trades.

Our skills were terrible today. The desire was there. Skills can be cleaned up. The hunger to win was there imo too.

7 hours ago, Wrecker45 said:

Whilst I a agree you can kind of find excuses for a few of them.

Pies - i can't remember my phone blowing up from neutral supporters (everyone hates Collingwood but almost nuetral) like it did after that game. Everybody was saying the umpiring was a disgrace

Giants - we debut 6 kids

Saints - get done by a technicality

Bulldogs - outplayed by a team desperate to make finals

Blues - embaressing loss

Crows - best team in the league and we only lost because Pickett was sent off for concussion protocol's in dubious circumstances

Don't even get me started about the hawthorn game when kozzie was running into an open goal and got deliberately tripped. No MRO, not even a free kick. He kicks that goal and our season is up and running

10 minutes ago, Smokey said:

Max aside, we can’t rely on our senior expensive stars to stand up and execute when it matters.

Love Max but I think Demonland (and the footy world) overrate his impact in those close games, partly because some of his marks ‘look great’.

I can recall games where he’s dropped back in the hole and helped us win, that’s what has built this reputation.

I’ve also seen games where he has tried to be a hero and made costly mistakes.

I think our close-game issue is less about ‘a losing culture’ and more about the young guys/bottom half of the team relying too heavily on our stars and our stars don’t have the greatest execution in crucial moments. You end up with too many ‘hero’ moments that occasionally come off but more often than not bring us down.

We need to better plan , coach and execute to plan across the team in those moments.

Fly has done that pretty well at Lolingwood.

Love Max but I think Demonland (and the footy world) overrate his impact in those close games, partly because some of his marks ‘look great’.

I can recall games where he’s dropped back in the hole and helped us win, that’s what has built this reputation.

I’ve also seen games where he has tried to be a hero and made costly mistakes.

I think our close-game issue is less about ‘a losing culture’ and more about the young guys/bottom half of the team relying too heavily on our stars and our stars don’t have the greatest execution in crucial moments. You end up with too many ‘hero’ moments that occasionally come off but more often than not bring us down.

We need to better plan , coach and execute to plan across the team in those moments.

Fly has done that pretty well at Lolingwood.

Winning close games is definitely the final piece of the puzzle (that is either missing or has been vacuumed up) that could see up return to the top 8 next year.

Definitely getting tired of the opposition's top 9 coach, such as Luke Beveridge, praise us as being highly competitive and being made to earn their wins. I want us next year to go from making contenders earn their wins against us to beating contenders and condemning them to disappointment rather than relief.

Having said, it's not the close losses to good teams that have disappointed me most this year. It's the losses to the North's, Essendon's, St Kilda's and Carlton's where our heads were not in the game.

So next year, we need to win (more than losing) the close games irrespective of the quality of teams, and we need to win all the games that we start $1.50 at against the mediocre sides.

32 minutes ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

Having said, it's not the close losses to good teams that have disappointed me most this year. It's the losses to the North's, Essendon's, St Kilda's and Carlton's where our heads were not in the game.

this. 6 games to teams around or below us. saints twice(!), port, blues, bombers and north. inexcuseable really.
as for our close games, we are apparently 1-10 in games decided by less than a goal since we beat brisbane 2 years ago. and that 1 was the north game when were 40 points up last year. gross.

5 hours ago, The Jackson FIX said:

I think our close-game issue is less about ‘a losing culture’ and more about the young guys/bottom half of the team relying too heavily on our stars and our stars don’t have the greatest execution in crucial moments. You end up with too many ‘hero’ moments that occasionally come off but more often than not bring us down.

Fair point.

It was telling that in the final centre bounce of the game with 50 secs left, we had the old firm in Gawn, Trac, Viney and Oliver and we couldn't get it done (albeit against a very good Dogs midfield).

This game, and the two previous GWS games where we had a centre bounce in the last minute and we didn't look remotely like winning the all important clearance, is disappointing by the leaders.

I feel like in recent times , to win a close one we need to be chasing down the lead. I knew we would lose at 3 qtr time. It’s what we do.

The core group of experience plus a blend of exciting young talent, I really thought we would make the 8 and why I woke up so bitter this morning. We still have what it takes to compete. That Port and St Kilda games especially where we just handed it to them, we win those and we snatch 3 of the aforementioned games above, we are still in contention for the 8. We weren’t beaten, we beat ourselves more often than not.

The North Melbourne game is whatever, they outplayed us, but asides from that and credit to them, but we really should have had a far greater win number.

I sincerely feel that at our optimum, we are right alongside the likes of the Dogs, GWS and even Collingwood.

As long as the next coach isn’t Ken Hinkley, I’m confident we can bounce back really quick. Maybe not a flag, but the top 6 should be a realistic goal.

Edited August 11Aug 11 by VNightCityLegend

So we're now 0-5 in games decided by less than 10 points this year (losses to GWS, Collingwood, Carlton, St Kilda and the Dogs).

We're now on an 0-7 streak in such games, 3-8 overall since the start of last year, and 3-11 since the Marchbank disaster.